• Log in with Facebook Log in with Twitter Log In with Google      Sign In    
  • Create Account
  LongeCity
              Advocacy & Research for Unlimited Lifespans

Photo
- - - - -

Rancid fishoil?


  • Please log in to reply
37 replies to this topic

#1 woly

  • Guest, F@H
  • 279 posts
  • 11

Posted 22 July 2007 - 01:35 PM


I recently bought a bottle of LEF Super omega 3. I have never taken fishoil before but ive been noticing that about an hour after ingestion i start to get some nasty fish burps. Now does this mean that its rancid or is it simply because i havnt had enough in my stomach at the time of ingestion (i usually have it with some food)? Inside the capsules there looks like there is some clear oil and then some dark oil. I figure that its just the different types of oil (super omega 3 has olive, sesame and rosmery oil in it too) but could this also be a sign of rancidity?

Thanks
woly

#2 nameless

  • Guest
  • 2,268 posts
  • 137

Posted 22 July 2007 - 04:13 PM

I don't believe fish burps in themselves imply rancidity, just that your body isn't used to eating (or drinking) fish oil. For some people it goes away... some always burp.

A test I use for rancidity is: break open a pill and taste it. If it tastes a bit fishy, but not awful, I consider it good. If it tastes like something out of a sewer, it's rancid. You'll know when you find a rancid one...

I've taken fish oil for a couple of years and have found two batches of bad fish oil. One was a store brand (Wild by Nature), the other was Bumblebee brand. I tried the Lef brand once... it didn't seem rancid to me, but it was slightly fishier than some other brands I've tried.

sponsored ad

  • Advert
Click HERE to rent this advertising spot for SUPPLEMENTS (in thread) to support LongeCity (this will replace the google ad above).

#3 niner

  • Guest
  • 16,276 posts
  • 1,999
  • Location:Philadelphia

Posted 23 July 2007 - 02:50 AM

Some people notice the fishy smell more than others; maybe a difference in odor receptors? Some people have fish burps even with non-rancid oil. Again, various genetic differences may be at play- we're all different. Fortunately, there's enteric coated fish oil. I've seen it at Costco. It cost a little bit more than regular gelcaps but wasn't that bad as I recall.

#4 trevyn

  • Guest
  • 87 posts
  • 43

Posted 23 July 2007 - 03:34 AM

I use Nordic Naturals ProOmega and am finishing some Costco gelcaps. Neither ever tastes the least bit fishy, even when chewing the pills, and I've never had a fishy burp. The Costco bottle itself smells a tiny bit fishy, the ProOmega never has.

FWIW, very fresh fish doesn't tend to smell fishy either, it's just when it starts to get old...

#5 david ellis

  • Guest
  • 1,014 posts
  • 79
  • Location:SanDiego
  • NO

Posted 23 July 2007 - 05:29 PM

From Barry Sears-link


For those affected by gastric distress - See "bold" lines near the bottom. The link also provides information on how to verify the quality of some fish oil's batch numbers. These batches are apparently 5-star Nutrasource.com fish oils. I haven't tried it so I don't know if it works.




The Different Grades of Fish Oil Available Today


It is important not to be misled by dramatic price differences among the various grades of fish oil products currently available. There is a vast range of both potency and purity not only between these grades, but also often between individual products within a particular grade.

"There are three grades of fish oil. The first is cod liver oil. The second is health-food grade fish oil. And finally there is ultra-refined fish oil. What distinguishes one from another is the purity and concentration of the long-chain omega-3 fatty acids. More importantly, the long-term use of any fish oil is compromised by its impact on the gastric system which ultimately determines the amounts that you can take. Each step in the refining process adds additional cost to the final product, but the increased purity justifies the cost and the benefits.
Cod Liver Oil

This is the lowest quality fish oil since it has a low concentration of long-chain omega-3 fatty acids and contains the highest levels of contaminants (organic mercury, PCB's, and DDT). In addition, high-dose usage of cod liver oil is not recommended due to the high levels of Vitamin A found in this form of fish oil. Typically, a tablespoon of cod liver oil contains approximately 2.5 grams of long-chain omega-3 fatty acids. Although this is the most inexpensive form of fish oil, long-term compliance is exceptionally poor because of its taste profile.
Health Food-Grade Fish Oils

The levels of contaminants in fish oils is often determined by the size of the fish and their relative rank in the food chain. Small fish (such as sardines and anchovies) are short-lived and therefore are less prone to accumulate environmental pollutants. On the other hand, larger fish such as salmon and mackerel are predatory species that are long-lived and therefore contain higher levels of pollutants. Most health-food grade fish oils are fish body oils extracted from the fish. If the label says it comes from a particular species of fish (i.e. salmon oil) then you know it is a health-food grade fish oil. These oils are only sold in soft gelatin capsules because they still have an extremely poor taste profile (to see why, simply bite into a capsule to release the oil). A slightly more purified type of health food grade fish oil includes those that have been subjected to a very limited amount of molecular distillation to remove some of the cholesterol in order to be labeled 'cholesterol-free'. A typical one-gram capsule of health-food grade fish oil contains approximately 300 mg. of long-chain omega-3 fatty acids. Another type of higher-grade health-food fish oil is known as "fish oil concentrate". This type of fish oil consists of ethyl esters of the fish oil that has been subjected to fractional cooling. The more saturated fats will solidify, leaving behind a more concentrated solution of long-chain omega-3 fatty acids. However, this fractional cooling does not remove the PCB's or the long-chain monoene fatty acids that give rise to significant gastric distress. A one-gram capsule of this thermally fractionated health-food grade fish oil will contain up to 500 mg. of long-chain omega-3 fatty acids.

Health-food grade fish oils are acceptable in small amounts (no more than 3-4 capsules per day) without inducing significant gastric problems. However, higher doses require a much more purified type of oil; ultra-refined fish oil.

Ultra-Refined Fish Oil

Ultra-refined fish oil starts with thermally fractionated health-food fish oil that is then distilled by highly complex refining technology into fractions rich in long-chain omega-3 fatty acids that are exceptionally low in the long-chain monoenes (that cause gastric distress) and pollutants such as PCB's and oxidized and polymerized lipids. The individual fractions are then combined to provide the most appropriate balance of EPA and DHA for the finished oil. The typical one-gram capsule of ultra-refined fish oil will have at least 600 mg. of long-chain omega-3 fatty acids. This may not seem a major concentration improvement compared to the health-food grade fish oils, however, the increase in the purity of the oil is why it costs nearly twice as much. This purity is also reflected in a dramatically improved taste profile.

Only ultra-refined fish oils enable you to consume the required daily intake of long-chain omega-3 fatty acids needed to alter eicosanoid synthesis without gastric distress or fear of accumulation of environmental pollutants.


Note: Vitamin E is often included in fish oils as a preservative. At low levels, approximately 5 I.U./gram of fish oil, it is protective. At higher levels, such as 20 I.U./gram of fish oil, it can actually speed up the oxidative process.

#6 luv2increase

  • Guest
  • 2,529 posts
  • 37
  • Location:Ohio

Posted 24 July 2007 - 01:54 AM

I've used Twinlab Cod Liver Oil (cherry flavored) and Carlson's Fish Oil. On both, I've never had a problem with fish burps or whatever. I think that it is your personal chemistry that is causing this nuisance. If you can't tolerate it, try just eating 2-3 servings of "non" farm-raised fish each week.

Good luck

#7 niner

  • Guest
  • 16,276 posts
  • 1,999
  • Location:Philadelphia

Posted 24 July 2007 - 02:19 AM

Ultra-refined fish oil starts with thermally fractionated health-food fish oil that is then distilled by highly complex refining technology into fractions rich in long-chain omega-3 fatty acids that are exceptionally low in the long-chain monoenes (that cause gastric distress) and pollutants such as PCB's and oxidized and polymerized lipids...

Umm, I'm a little dubious about this. It sounds like Sears is describing typical vacuum distillation. My impression is that all the major fish oil manufacturers are using this, so I'm not sure that Barry Sears' oil is all that different. He might be using a slightly higher purity fraction, but something tells me it's not better enough to justify paying ten times as much. Barry has a business going on his website where he sells all manner of fish oil for insanely high prices. He also has the usual MLM "affiliate" scheme. Jeez, I feel like he did a lot of good with his books, but this seems a bit scammish.

#8 mike250

  • Guest
  • 981 posts
  • 9

Posted 24 July 2007 - 02:55 AM

I've used Twinlab Cod Liver Oil (cherry flavored) and Carlson's Fish Oil.  On both, I've never had a problem with fish burps or whatever.  I think that it is your personal chemistry that is causing this nuisance.  If you can't tolerate it, try just eating 2-3 servings of "non" farm-raised fish each week.

Good luck


I've used Carlson's fish oil and I get fish burps. its a good product but i think its overpriced. i'm gonna switch to softgels in the future or just try a different liquid product. I also think I have poor digestion.

#9 luminous

  • Guest
  • 269 posts
  • 2
  • Location:Suburban DFW

Posted 24 July 2007 - 03:02 AM

Has anyone here tried Coromega? It comes in little flavored (orange, lime, or orange-chocolate...there may be more) packets and has the consistency of and taste of orange yogurt. There's just over a teaspoon of the stuff in each packet.

http://www.coromega.com/

Anyway, it's GOOD tasting, no fishy taste AT ALL, no fishy aftertaste, no fishy burping. It's almost hard to believe that there's any fish oil in it. Yet it supposedly contains "pharmaceutical grade" fish oil. I bought it for my young daughter because there was no other way to get her to take fish oil. Then I tried it and haven't used anthything else since. Coromega is expensive, though. I hope it's everything it's cracked up to be. If so, then I'd highly recommend it.

Edit: One time I bought Kirkland brand fish oil capsules from Costco, and I couldn't even get past the rancid smell upon opening the bottle. I actually took it back to the store and got my money back. I went on to try another brand. It was only a little fishy, but it caused a bit of the unpleasant burping. After that, I took Carlson--which was basically fine, but I found excuses not to take it because I felt uneasy about even the possibility of the fishy factor. Coromega has been great.

#10 nameless

  • Guest
  • 2,268 posts
  • 137

Posted 24 July 2007 - 04:28 AM

I've tried Coromega before, and it does taste rather good. Sort of like orange pudding. Cheapest places to get it is iherb or vitacost, I think, at about $20/per 90 pack. Only hesitation I have with Coromega has to do with it containing sodium benzoate, and the recent article about it possibly causing harm. But I'm not sure if it's something to really be concerned about or not.

My favorite fish oil is Nordic Naturals, but they are rather expensive. I'm currently using Carlson's liquid, which tastes surprisingly decent. But being a liquid, it can be a tad messy. If getting fish burps, try a lemon or orange flavored gel (Nordic Naturals, Natrol, Barlean's). Worst case then, you get a lemon-flavored burp.

One interesting aspect of fish oils is the biovailabilty issue, and how not all fish oils are the same. Some are ethyl ester while some others are in the triglyceride form. I think two studies have stated that the triglyceride form is better absorbed, while two others state there is no difference.

Vectomega might be an interesting product, whenever it eventually is released. I believe it's using a phospholipid form, which should be better absorbed. It's due from New Chapter one of these days.

#11 eternaltraveler

  • Guest, Guardian
  • 6,471 posts
  • 155
  • Location:Silicon Valley, CA

Posted 24 July 2007 - 04:46 AM

I always buy nordic naturals. Not because I'm sure there isn't a cheaper option that is just as good, but because I think the time it would take me to research one is better spent elsewhere :))

#12 mike250

  • Guest
  • 981 posts
  • 9

Posted 24 July 2007 - 06:01 AM

I've tried Coromega before, and it does taste rather good. Sort of like orange pudding. Cheapest places to get it is iherb or vitacost, I think, at about $20/per 90 pack. Only hesitation I have with Coromega has to do with it containing sodium benzoate, and the recent article about it possibly causing harm. But I'm not sure if it's something to really be concerned about or not.

My favorite fish oil is Nordic Naturals, but they are rather expensive. I'm currently using Carlson's liquid, which tastes surprisingly decent. But being a liquid, it can be a tad messy. If getting fish burps, try a lemon or orange flavored gel (Nordic Naturals, Natrol, Barlean's). Worst case then, you get a lemon-flavored burp.

One interesting aspect of fish oils is the biovailabilty issue, and how not all fish oils are the same. Some are ethyl ester while some others are in the triglyceride form. I think two studies have stated that the triglyceride form is better absorbed, while two others state there is no difference.

Vectomega might be an interesting product, whenever it eventually is released. I believe it's using a phospholipid form, which should be better absorbed. It's due from New Chapter one of these days.


do the fish burps mean your body isn't making proper use of the oil or isn't absorbing it properly?

#13 nameless

  • Guest
  • 2,268 posts
  • 137

Posted 24 July 2007 - 06:21 AM

I'm not entirely sure why some people burp with fish oil, and others don't. It could be related to the quality of the oil, I suppose, but I never burped when taking rancid oil (only found out after opening a capsule and tasting it). I think I read somewhere that people burp because their body isn't used to digesting fish, but after a while their body will get used to it.

I don't know how burps relate to absorption issues, but I'd suggest just sticking with it for a while, and see if the burps go away. Choose a good brand, and eat them directly after (or with) a meal. You could go the enteric-coated route, which would solve the burp problem, but you can't as easily tell if the oil is rancid (as it's coated... no taste). If sodium benzoate doesn't bother you, the fish puddings should also solve the problem. Krill oil would be an alternative too, but there are less studies on it as compared to fish oils (it's a bit expensive too).

#14 mike250

  • Guest
  • 981 posts
  • 9

Posted 24 July 2007 - 06:24 AM

yah I use Carlson's fish oil. still get fish burps but maybe coz I take 3g at once. don't seem to have that problem with one teaspoon (1.8g)

#15 david ellis

  • Guest
  • 1,014 posts
  • 79
  • Location:SanDiego
  • NO

Posted 24 July 2007 - 04:55 PM

QUOTE
Ultra-refined fish oil starts with thermally fractionated health-food fish oil that is then distilled by highly complex refining technology into fractions rich in long-chain omega-3 fatty acids that are exceptionally low in the long-chain monoenes (that cause gastric distress) and pollutants such as PCB's and oxidized and polymerized lipids...




-niner
Umm, I'm a little dubious about this. It sounds like Sears is describing typical vacuum distillation. My impression is that all the major fish oil manufacturers are using this, so I'm not sure that Barry Sears' oil is all that different. He might be using a slightly higher purity fraction, but something tells me it's not better enough to justify paying ten times as much. Barry has a business going on his website where he sells all manner of fish oil for insanely high prices. He also has the usual MLM "affiliate" scheme. Jeez, I feel like he did a lot of good with his books, but this seems a bit scammish.


I quoted from Barry because it was a nice summary of the processes required for different fish oil certification standards. These standards of fish oil (IFOS - International Fish Oil Standards) are set and maintained by an independent third party. (nutrasource.ca)

What is being described in the paragraph quoted from Barry is the processing required for a 5-star fish oil. (Very few fish oil brands are five star.) One standard mentioned in the paragraph is that a 5 star fish oil is distilled to 60% EPA/DHA. This 60% standard is what makes niner's statement untrue that all "major fish oil manufacturers are using this". Another standard mentioned is the distillation is extensive enough to remove most moneones (the cause of gastric distress).

So are Coromega and Carlson's 5 star fish oils? Not unless they are distilled to a 60% level, they are not 5 star-fish oils. And because they are not 5 star fish oils it is not surprising that some folks experience the "burps" caused by moneones. Coromega and Carlson's are very good fish oils - but they are very far from being the best. (The fish oils I found on their web-site ranged from 28% to far less than 60%).

If you check you will find exactly how the 5 star rating system works.

It is my understanding that IFOS standards are used to grade commercial fish oil. So if commercial disputes about quality arise, everybody has a uniform standard to measure to.

#16 david ellis

  • Guest
  • 1,014 posts
  • 79
  • Location:SanDiego
  • NO

Posted 24 July 2007 - 05:12 PM

Here is a link to another post I have made on fish oil.

#17 wayside

  • Guest
  • 344 posts
  • -1

Posted 24 July 2007 - 05:18 PM

Vectomega might be an interesting product, whenever it eventually is released. I believe it's using a phospholipid form, which should be better absorbed. It's due from New Chapter one of these days.


You can get a phospholipid form of omega-3 now, in krill oil. It's substantially more expensive though, and I haven't seen any definitive studies showing it has higher bioavailability. Mercola claims 10x, but he doesn't back it up.

Not unless they are distilled to a 60% level, they are not 5 star-fish oils. And because they are not 5 star fish oils it is not surprising that some folks experience the "burps" caused by moneones.


The LEF fish oil I take is 60%, and it occasionally gives me burps. It seems to be related to whether I have eaten anything (no food == greater chance of burps) and how much liquid I take with them (less liquid == greater chance of burps).

#18 david ellis

  • Guest
  • 1,014 posts
  • 79
  • Location:SanDiego
  • NO

Posted 24 July 2007 - 05:30 PM

About krill oil, I experimented with it, using changes in CRP (inflammation) to measure effectiveness. Unfortunately, I had a spike IN CRP and the results were not as clear as hoped. But, 4 days after stopping the krill part of the krill oil/fish oil combination my CRP went sharply back up. That indicates effectiveness of krill oil on top of 3 grams of EPA/DHA.

10 times effective is a bold claim, the green lipped mussle oil folks claim 100 times and their oil is the same price as Neptune Krill oil. So I am planning on running another test this year.

#19 david ellis

  • Guest
  • 1,014 posts
  • 79
  • Location:SanDiego
  • NO

Posted 24 July 2007 - 05:49 PM

-Wayside

The LEF fish oil I take is 60%, and it occasionally gives me burps.


Wayside, when I looked closer, I discovered that 60% EPA/DHA gets you to a 2 Star. So 60% EPA/DHA is a requirement for a 5 star, but does not necessarily indicate enough processing to reduce moneones. This is a new area of knowledge for me, so I expect many more discoveries.

#20 wayside

  • Guest
  • 344 posts
  • -1

Posted 24 July 2007 - 06:04 PM

-Wayside

The LEF fish oil I take is 60%, and it occasionally gives me burps.


Wayside, when I looked closer, I discovered that 60% EPA/DHA gets you to a 2 Star. So 60% EPA/DHA is a requirement for a 5 star, but does not necessarily indicate enough processing to reduce moneones. This is a new area of knowledge for me, so I expect many more discoveries.


Earlier in the other thread where you posted about 5 star ratings, someone posted a list of 5-star oils, and the LEF super-3 was on it. So I feel pretty good that the stuff I take is high quality, and I still occasionally will burp.

#21 krillin

  • Guest
  • 1,516 posts
  • 60
  • Location:USA

Posted 24 July 2007 - 06:39 PM

About krill oil, I experimented with it, using changes in CRP (inflammation) to measure effectiveness.  Unfortunately, I had a spike IN CRP and the results were not as clear as hoped.  But, 4 days after stopping the krill part of the krill oil/fish oil combination my CRP went sharply back up.  That indicates effectiveness of krill oil on top of 3 grams of EPA/DHA.

10 times effective is a bold claim, the green lipped mussle oil folks claim 100 times and their oil is the same price as Neptune Krill oil.  So I am planning on running another test this year.


Is it the astaxanthin that gives krill oil the boost over fish oil? If so, it would be a lot cheaper to take astaxanthin plus fish oil, since krill oil has only about 1.5 mg astaxanthin/g.

2 g krill oil ~ $33/month
2 g LEF fishoil + 4 mg astaxanthin ~ $15/month

No krill for Krillin.

PS Do you have any trials with sesamin?

#22 nameless

  • Guest
  • 2,268 posts
  • 137

Posted 25 July 2007 - 12:10 AM

I think the combination of being in a phospholipid form along with the astaxanthin is what supposedly makes krill more effective. Price-wise, it's probably cheaper just to buy astaxanthin separately, and use larger doses of fish oil, like you stated, unless krill has something else going for it that I'm not aware of.

Anyone out there get improvements on their lipids using Krill? Neptune ran 2 studies, I believe, showing rather large improvements in HDL using 1 gram or so of their oil. According to their studies, it was even better than high dose niacin.

But... the studies were manufacturer-backed and I'm not aware of any independent studies confirming these results. I haven't even heard of anecdotal reports from users regarding HDL improvements.

The omega content of Krill is on the low side, which is why a fish oil product (vectomega), using a phospholipd form with more Omega3/serving, from salmon (so it has some astaxanthin), could theoretically be much better than regular fish oil. We shall see...

#23 david ellis

  • Guest
  • 1,014 posts
  • 79
  • Location:SanDiego
  • NO

Posted 25 July 2007 - 01:25 AM

Krillin,

Why would astaxathin, a carotenoid anti-oxidant, reduce inflammation as much as Omega 3(DHA/EPA) oils. My understanding is that DHA/EPA promotes the release of anit-inflammatory eicosanoids.. Wouldn't the anti-inflammatory actions of eicosanoids be more powerful than the anti-inflammatory actions of an carotenoid anti-oxidant.

I wasn't clear about how much fish oil I take. I meant to say I take 3 grams of EPA/DHA(10 grams of fish oil) a day. And 2 grams of krill oil on top of that apparently cuts my remaining CRP in half. All I can say was that krill oil wasn't apparently a waste of money. It was a successful test because I am fairly confident that krill oil has an effect, so the $25/mo is not a complete waste of money. This is much more than I know for most of the supplements I take. Especially the ALCAR, NA-RALA, rigamarole. (Well, there is just one tiny benefit I know about NA-RALA. If I screw up my diet and eat sugar, I get sugar "effects"- weakness & sweating that NA-RALA knocks in the head quickly.)

No trials with sesamin.

#24 krillin

  • Guest
  • 1,516 posts
  • 60
  • Location:USA

Posted 25 July 2007 - 05:58 PM

Krillin,

Why would astaxathin, a carotenoid anti-oxidant, reduce inflammation as much as Omega 3(DHA/EPA) oils.  My understanding is that DHA/EPA promotes the release of anit-inflammatory eicosanoids..  Wouldn't the anti-inflammatory actions of eicosanoids be more powerful than the anti-inflammatory actions of an carotenoid anti-oxidant.


It's a 5-LOX inhibitor and inhibits other inflammatory pathways. I can't compare the magnitude of its effect with fish oil's.

Life Sci. 2006 Jun 6;79(2):162-74.
The effects of oral Cardax (disodium disuccinate astaxanthin) on multiple independent oxidative stress markers in a mouse peritoneal inflammation model: influence on 5-lipoxygenase in vitro and in vivo.
Lockwood SF, Penn MS, Hazen SL, Bikádi Z, Zsila F.
Hawaii Biotech, Inc., 99-193 Aiea Heights Drive, Suite 200, Aiea, Hawaii 96701, USA. slockwood@hibiotech.com

Disodium disuccinate astaxanthin ('rac'-dAST; Cardax) is a water-dispersible C40 carotenoid derivative under development for oral and parenteral administration for cardioprotection of the at-risk ischemic cardiovascular patient. In experimental infarction models in animals (rats, rabbits, and dogs), significant myocardial salvage has been obtained, up to 100% at the appropriate dose in dogs. The documented mechanism of action in vitro includes direct scavenging of biologically produced superoxide anion; in vivo in rabbits, modulation of the complement activity of serum has also been shown. A direct correlation between administration of the test compound in animals and reductions of multiple, independent markers of oxidative stress in serum was recently obtained in a rat experimental infarction model. For the current study, it was hypothesized that oral Cardax administration would inhibit oxidative damage of multiple relevant biological targets in a representative, well-characterized murine peritoneal inflammation model. A previously developed mass spectrometry-based (LC/ESI/MS/MS) approach was used to interrogate multiple distinct pathways of oxidation in a black mouse (C57/BL6) model system. In vivo markers of oxidant stress from peritoneal lavage samples (supernatants) were evaluated in mice on day eight (8) after treatment with either Cardax or vehicle (lipophilic emulsion without drug) orally by gavage at 500 mg/kg once per day for seven (7) days at five (5) time points: (1) baseline prior to treatment (t=0); (2) 16 h following intraperitoneal (i.p.) injection with thioglycollate to elicit a neutrophilic infiltrate; (3) 4 h following i.p. injection of yeast cell wall (zymosan; t=16 h/4 h thioglycollate+zymosan); (4) 72 h following i.p. injection with thioglycollate to elicit monocyte/macrophage infiltration; and (5) 72 h/4 h thioglycollate+zymosan. A statistically significant sparing effect on the arachidonic acid (AA) and linoleic acid (LA) substrates was observed at time points two and five. When normalized to the concentration of the oxidative substrates, statistically significant reductions of 8-isoprostane-F(2alpha) (8-iso-F(2alpha)) at time point three (maximal neutrophil recruitment/activation), and 5-HETE, 5-oxo-EET, 11-HETE, 9-HODE, and PGF(2alpha) at time point five (maximal monocyte/macrophage recruitment/activation) were observed. Subsequently, the direct interaction of the optically inactive stereoisomer of Cardax (meso-dAST) with human 5-lipoxygenase (5-LOX) was evaluated in vitro with circular dichroism (CD) and electronic absorption (UV/Vis) spectroscopy, and subsequent molecular docking calculations were made using mammalian 15-LOX as a surrogate (for which XRC data has been reported). The results suggested that the meso-compound was capable of interaction with, and binding to, the solvent-exposed surface of the enzyme. These preliminary studies provide the foundation for more detailed evaluation of the therapeutic effects of this compound on the 5-LOX enzyme, important in chronic diseases such as atherosclerosis, asthma, and prostate cancer in humans.

PMID: 16466747

Exp Eye Res. 2006 Feb;82(2):275-81.
Suppressive effects of astaxanthin against rat endotoxin-induced uveitis by inhibiting the NF-kappaB signaling pathway.
Suzuki Y, Ohgami K, Shiratori K, Jin XH, Ilieva I, Koyama Y, Yazawa K, Yoshida K, Kase S, Ohno S.
Department of Ophthalmology and Visual Sciences, Hokkaido University Graduate School of Medicine, N15 W7, Sapporo 060-8638, Japan.

We investigated the effects of astaxanthin (AST), a carotenoid, on endotoxin-induced uveitis (EIU), and over the course of the disease measured the expression of inflammatory cytokines and chemokines in the presence or absence of AST. EIU was induced in male Lewis rats by footpad injection of lipopolysaccharide (LPS). The animals were randomly divided to 12 groups with eight animals in each. Immediately after the inoculation, AST (1, 10, or 100 mg kg(-1)) was injected intravenously. Aqueous humour was collected at 6, 12 and 24 hr after LPS inoculation and the number of infiltrating cells in the anterior chamber was counted. In addition, we assayed the concentration of protein, nitric oxide (NO), tumour necrosis factor-alpha (TNF-alpha) and prostaglandin E2 (PGE2). Immunohistochemical staining with a monoclonal antibody against activated NF-kappaB was performed in order to evaluate the effects of AST on NF-kappaB activation. Rats injected with AST showed a significant decrease in the number of infiltrating cells in the anterior chamber and additionally there was a significantly lower concentration of protein, NO, TNF-alpha and PGE2 in the aqueous humour. Moreover, even early stages of EIU were suppressed by injection of AST. The number of activated NF-kappaB-positive cells was lower in iris-ciliary bodies treated with 10 or 100 mg kg(-1) AST at 3 hr after LPS injection. These results suggest that AST reduces ocular inflammation in eyes with EIU by downregulating proinflammatory factors and by inhibiting the NF-kappaB-dependent signaling pathway.

PMID: 16126197

#25 jagged

  • Guest
  • 17 posts
  • 0

Posted 25 July 2007 - 07:51 PM

-Wayside

The LEF fish oil I take is 60%, and it occasionally gives me burps.


Wayside, when I looked closer, I discovered that 60% EPA/DHA gets you to a 2 Star. So 60% EPA/DHA is a requirement for a 5 star, but does not necessarily indicate enough processing to reduce moneones. This is a new area of knowledge for me, so I expect many more discoveries.


Earlier in the other thread where you posted about 5 star ratings, someone posted a list of 5-star oils, and the LEF super-3 was on it. So I feel pretty good that the stuff I take is high quality, and I still occasionally will burp.


My experience is some people burp, some don't. I believe it has more to do with taking oil based supplements than anything else. The benefits of fish oil far outweigh the cons of burping :)

#26 mike250

  • Guest
  • 981 posts
  • 9

Posted 25 July 2007 - 07:56 PM

yah but the question remains does the burping indicate any sort of mal-absorption by the body.

#27 niner

  • Guest
  • 16,276 posts
  • 1,999
  • Location:Philadelphia

Posted 26 July 2007 - 04:17 AM

Umm, I'm a little dubious about this. It sounds like Sears is describing typical vacuum distillation. My impression is that all the major fish oil manufacturers are using this, so I'm not sure that Barry Sears' oil is all that different. He might be using a slightly higher purity fraction, but something tells me it's not better enough to justify paying ten times as much. Barry has a business going on his website where he sells all manner of fish oil for insanely high prices. He also has the usual MLM "affiliate" scheme. Jeez, I feel like he did a lot of good with his books, but this seems a bit scammish.


I quoted from Barry because it was a nice summary of the processes required for different fish oil certification standards. These standards of fish oil (IFOS - International Fish Oil Standards) are set and maintained by an independent third party. (nutrasource.ca)

What is being described in the paragraph quoted from Barry is the processing required for a 5-star fish oil. (Very few fish oil brands are five star.) One standard mentioned in the paragraph is that a 5 star fish oil is distilled to 60% EPA/DHA. This 60% standard is what makes niner's statement untrue that all "major fish oil manufacturers are using this". Another standard mentioned is the distillation is extensive enough to remove most moneones (the cause of gastric distress).


I stand by the statement that vacuum distillation is in widespread use. As you later noted, the 60% standard is just one of the five criteria IFOS uses for star assignment, so a 2 star oil could still hit it. As I mentioned above, it appears that Barry is using a slightly higher purity fraction. The question is, is it worth ten times as much money? The IFOS stars are given for going beyond the CRN/WHO standards, but those standards were presumably designed to protect human health; are they inadequate? It would be interesting if we could compare the COAs for various fish oils. The IFOS has COAs in graphical form, but only for a handful of brands. I'm all for minimizing exposure to toxins, but if the toxin level in a cheap fish oil is vastly exceeded by one's normal environmental exposure to that toxin, then paying a lot more to eliminate a tiny fraction of your total exposure is not a good investment. If lower cost fish oils are in fact presenting us with a significant toxin load, then Barry has a point.
(ps: it's mono-enes, as in one alkenic functionality in the lipid chain.)

#28 shadowrun

  • Guest
  • 327 posts
  • 2
  • Location:Stamford, CT

Posted 26 July 2007 - 03:30 PM

Any opinions on a high quality reasonably priced brand of fish oil?

#29 david ellis

  • Guest
  • 1,014 posts
  • 79
  • Location:SanDiego
  • NO

Posted 26 July 2007 - 04:31 PM

niner

I stand by the statement that vacuum distillation is in widespread use. As you later noted, the 60% standard is just one of the five criteria IFOS uses for star assignment, so a 2 star oil could still hit it. As I mentioned above, it appears that Barry is using a slightly higher purity fraction. The question is, is it worth ten times as much money? The IFOS stars are given for going beyond the CRN/WHO standards, but those standards were presumably designed to protect human health; are they inadequate? It would be interesting if we could compare the COAs for various fish oils. The IFOS has COAs in graphical form, but only for a handful of brands. I'm all for minimizing exposure to toxins, but if the toxin level in a cheap fish oil is vastly exceeded by one's normal environmental exposure to that toxin, then paying a lot more to eliminate a tiny fraction of your total exposure is not a good investment. If lower cost fish oils are in fact presenting us with a significant toxin load, then Barry has a point.
(ps: it's mono-enes, as in one alkenic functionality in the lipid chain.)



Hey, I agree with you. I only linked because Barry had the first/best description I had seen of the processes involved in making the various grades of fish oils. You have a good point about what is sufficient in terms on contaminant reduction. I am happy with Nature's Answer "Liquid Omega-3". This is not a one-star, it is just plain inexpensive orange flavored 60% EPA/DHA fish oil. Soon, I will verify my confidence by measuring my CRP. I do believe though, that most fish oil has an unacceptable level to me of oxidation. This is not scientific, just the fact that the fish oil smells fishier than I want.

sponsored ad

  • Advert
Click HERE to rent this advertising spot for SUPPLEMENTS (in thread) to support LongeCity (this will replace the google ad above).

#30 Matt

  • Guest
  • 2,862 posts
  • 149
  • Location:United Kingdom
  • NO

Posted 26 July 2007 - 08:20 PM

This is the one I have always used and its good quality. It is a blend of cod liver oil and fish oil, so the amount of Vitamin A is reduced (which will help save those bones!)

http://www.twoscompa...hscloLiquid.htm

Nutrition Information
(Average Value) Per 10 ml
Seven Seas Triomega®
Cod Liver Oil Blend 9.2g

Providing Omega-3 nutrients 2450mg
EPA & DHA 1900mg
Vitamin A 800µg
Vitamin D 5µg
Vitamin E 10mg
Energy (kcal) 82.8
Protein 0
Carbohydrate 0
Fat 9.2 g




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users