60 replies to this topic

[rsnuk]

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Edited by rsnuk, 12 September 2007 - 11:40 PM.

[luv2increase]

This should be moved to the 'Brain Enhancers' forum.


rsnuk, I am curious as to what your story entails. Would you please share it with us? I agree that ritalin can be harsh stuff, but time should heal your F'ed uppedness.

[luv2increase]

I want to first say that your story is 'touching'. I feel sorry for all you've been through. I have a hard time coming to the conclusion that ritalin was the sole culprit to the above though. I do know the feeling of being intoxicated on ritalin though. It is what led me on a path to cocaine. They are both horrible substances that do ruin one's spirit and mind.

I would start to take an aggressive dosage of fish oil. I'd take between 5-10grams a day of that. A good quality one is Carlson's Fish oil. I'd also start taking a multi-vitamin formulated for men, usually all that means is iron-free, but there are other goodies in there. Meditation would probably be something to get into also. It will help you get in touch with you inner self again which will hopefully lead to increased emotion and having a sense of feeling again. As for the nootropics, piracetam and choline bitartrate along with some alpha lipoic acid and acetyl-l-carnitine would be good for a start. Also, most importantly, exercise and adequate sleep. Make sure you get some aerobic exercise in there and not just lifting weights for size. Lastly, a good diet and abstinence from further drug use, whether legal or illegal---> that goes for alcohol as well.


I would do these things for awhile. Give it time. Remember, you spent 6 years ruining (IYO) your brain, so it is only reasonable to assume that it will take time for it to return to normal. Your brain develops well into the early 20's for men. Concluding from this, I believe you will be alright.


Take care!

[luv2increase]

I'll reply another time, i'm too tired now, but i'm not the only one:

http://www.dangerous...in side effects

Why hard to believe?

Well, back in the day, I abused ritalin and most notably cocaine rather extensively. From my experience, the emotional blunt and other cognitive deficits lasted only briefly for 3-4 months at the most. I believe they are there and real, just not permanent.

[william7]

Can anyone propose a way to increase my mental function?

Try fasting. A lot of people report improved mental function from fasting. Checkout the book Fasting: The Ultimate Diet, at http://books.google....DmTOceQ#PPA1,M1. The first page lists 27 reasons to fast that make real good sense.

Well, back in the day, I abused ritalin and most notably cocaine rather extensively. From my experience, the emotional blunt and other cognitive deficits lasted only briefly for 3-4 months at the most. I believe they are there and real, just not permanent.

Looks like we got something in common. Lady cocaine and other amphetamine like drugs can really grab hold of the mind and bring a person down. Do you think fasting could really rejuvenate a person mentally and spiritually and put him or her on the path to a better life?

[luv2increase]

Do you think fasting could really rejuvenate a person mentally and spiritually and put him or her on the path to a better life?

I am a big proponent of fasting. I am actually planning on doing a 3 or 5 day juice fast in a few days. Autumn quarter of school is coming up, so it may give me that extra edge which I really don't need, but it is still beneficial in more ways than one.

I forgot to mention fasting. It will put you on the fast track to recovery rsnuk. Good thinking elijah!

[bob_d]

Can anyone propose a way to increase my mental function?

Training.

Replying to Ritalin Destroyed My Brain

I'm sorry for you. But unfortunately you are not alone with your experience, so try not to take it personal. Many peoples lives were ruined through medical therapy. Medicine is some sort of gamble because the decision about the method of treatment used in a patient is based on the average outcome doctors expect for that case after analysis of similar cases. You get treated with x if something like 95 out of 100 people with the same condition did better after x and only 5 got more sick. There is no guarantee that the treatment will not worsen your situation. At example the drug Vioxx that was recalled several years ago killed almost 30000 people, while helping others to lead a better life. Aspirin and Ibuprofen kill about 15000 users per year only in america. Millions around the world die every year of medical malpractice( wrong diagnosis...) or infections they picked up in hospitals. Considering that, ritalin is still pretty safe. If you compare it to strattera or pemolin or other drugs for adhd, it is pretty safe, too. And most important, there are people who need it and who benefit from it, which justifies its use imo.

[rsnuk]

I'll reply another time, i'm too tired now, but i'm not the only one:

http://www.dangerous...in side effects

Why hard to believe?

Well, back in the day, I abused ritalin and most notably cocaine rather extensively. From my experience, the emotional blunt and other cognitive deficits lasted only briefly for 3-4 months at the most. I believe they are there and real, just not permanent.

As i said, some will get off lightly others will not, i didn't.

For example, when i was 8 years old i was said to be a gifted a mathematics by my school, having ability "far far above my age".

At the age of 12 after 1 1/2 years on Ritalin, i had the sequencial memory of a 7 1/2 year old, i continued to take Ritalin for a further 4 years.

It's completely indescribable, how much it retarded me, i doubt anyone cna imagine, it retarded me so much, that i had little cance of figuring out i was addcited and had been retarded, but i still did by fluke chance of remember how i used to feel.

Cocaine is a very very weak drug, ritalin is like 10 times more potent.

How about if you took ritalin hour after hour after hour day after day after day week after week after week, month after mont, yer after year, making you slower and slower and more and more depressed?

I think it was the fact i literally spenmt every wkaing momnment of my life on Ritalin that has made it so particularily bad...

[rsnuk]

Training.

I'm sorry for you. But unfortunately you are not alone with your experience, so try not to take it personal. Many peoples lives were ruined through medical therapy. Medicine is some sort of gamble because the decision about the method of treatment used in a patient is based on the average outcome doctors expect for that case after analysis of similar cases. You get treated with x if something like 95 out of 100 people with the same condition did better after x and only 5 got more sick. There is no guarantee that the treatment will not worsen your situation. At example the drug Vioxx that was recalled several years ago killed almost 30000 people, while helping others to lead a better life. Aspirin and Ibuprofen kill about 15000 users per year only in america. Millions around the world die every year of medical malpractice( wrong diagnosis...) or infections they picked up in hospitals. Considering that, ritalin is still pretty safe. If you compare it to strattera or pemolin or other drugs for adhd, it is pretty safe, too. And most important, there are people who need it and who benefit from it, which justifies its use imo.

Modern medicine is B.S and i'd personally slaughter every unrepentant psychiatrist on earth if i had the chance.

What your not in on, is that modern medecine is designed to keep people as ill as possible and as dependant on drug companies as possible.

Ritalin is one of the most deadly and toxics substances on earth, here is but one study demomnstrating it's ability to decrease bloodflow to the brain, methamphetamine is known to cause brain atorphy and decrease bloodflow to the brain, if ritalin is confirmed to decrease bloodflow to the brain by 30%, so would it cause brain atorphy? Yes among many other horrible effects on developing minds.

http://www.osti.gov/...osti_id=5104681

[rsnuk]

I've already tried fasting and have been taking 5-10 grams of fishoil since the beginning of this year, alas no relieve of depression or increase in emotion, although possibly soem increase in mental function when one is not depressed, empty, foggy or scattered.

I've considered racetams as they increase bloodlfow to the brain, which might reerse soem of the mental atrophy and give me back some of my potensial cerebral mass.

I have considered focusing on the dopamine system for stimulation, dopamine is kind of a dirty pleasure to mymind, i cannot feel happiness anymore, but i can feel adranline and endorphin rushes, these can provide focus also.

However, these can make me quite selfish and domineering.

Regardless, a moab inhibitor such as selegeline(said to have neroportective properties) might be worth experimentation.

I just want a drug that will make me focused and not anxious, so i can i actually be in the zone again, have some kind of claritity and creativity, some of the things i've lost.

Also considering bromocriptine and mucuna pruiens(as it contain l-dopa and is suposedly not neurotoxic like synthetic l-dopa).

[ajnast4r]

exercise
meditation
ashwagandha

i also suggest you take a serious look at ayurvedic eating/lifestyle science

[bob_d]

Cocaine is a very very weak drug, ritalin is like 10 times more potent.

no.

Ritalin is one of the most deadly and toxics substances on earth, here is but one study demomnstrating it's ability to decrease bloodflow to the brain, methamphetamine is known to cause brain atorphy and decrease bloodflow to the brain, if ritalin is confirmed to decrease bloodflow to the brain by 30%, so would it cause brain atorphy? Yes among many other horrible effects on developing minds.

Methamphetamine=!Ritalin. Brain atrophy due to sensible use of ritalin is not proven and looks unlikely. I hope you don't drink coffee, because that decreases ~30% cbf, too. Normally your body adapts to the peripheral effects of stimulants and learns how to counter them so the dcrease in bloodflow should only be temporary. Furthermore it has been proven, that ritalin supports brain development in patients with adhd.

Regardless, a moab inhibitor such as selegeline(said to have neroportective properties) might be worth experimentation.

selegeline is among others metabolized to methamphetamine. so you do not want to take it, i guess.

Also considering bromocriptine

you mean the heart valve fibrosis bromocriptine?

and mucuna pruiens(as it contain l-dopa and is suposedly not neurotoxic like synthetic l-dopa).

Same chemical but different source doesn't mean different effects....

I've considered racetams as they increase bloodlfow to the brain, which might reerse soem of the mental atrophy and give me back some of my potensial cerebral mass.

Then choose piracetam which is well studied and considered save.

I think it was the fact i literally spenmt every wkaing momnment of my life on Ritalin that has made it so particularily bad...
It's completely indescribable, how much it retarded me, i doubt anyone cna imagine, it retarded me so much, that i had little cance of figuring out i was addcited and had been retarded, but i still did by fluke chance of remember how i used to feel.

Cocaine is a very very weak drug, ritalin is like 10 times more potent.

How about if you took ritalin hour after hour after hour day after day after day week after week after week, month after mont, yer after year, making you slower and slower and more and more depressed?

If you did not react positively to stimulant treatment why have you been medicated with ritalin for so long? Didn't our parents notice that the pills make you sick? Did they believe more in ( the blatantly wrong) decisions of your doctor than in their own common sense? Why did your doctor stick to his treatment plan? Didn't he examine you regularly? Hopefully he wasn't one of those "oh i'll just file a prescription" guys...

[rsnuk]

no.

Ritalin is one of the most deadly and toxics substances on earth, here is but one study demomnstrating it's ability to decrease bloodflow to the brain, methamphetamine is known to cause brain atorphy and decrease bloodflow to the brain, if ritalin is confirmed to decrease bloodflow to the brain by 30%, so would it cause brain atorphy? Yes among many other horrible effects on developing minds.

Methamphetamine=!Ritalin. Brain atrophy due to sensible use of ritalin is not proven and looks unlikely. I hope you don't drink coffee, because that decreases ~30% cbf, too. Normally your body adapts to the peripheral effects of stimulants and learns how to counter them so the dcrease in bloodflow should only be temporary. Furthermore it has been proven, that ritalin supports brain development in patients with adhd.

All that research is B.S mate, there is an agenda to destroy kids IMO.

selegeline is among others metabolized to methamphetamine. so you do not want to take it, i guess.

Well aware that it metabolises in levo-methamphetamine. This is a major reservation i have about selegeline and something i am planning to investigate, hence why i posted about my interest, i'm glad you are aware, you seem educated, perhaps you can offer some insight...

you mean the heart valve fibrosis bromocriptine?

Again i am aware too of ergoline derivatives potensial to cause heart valve firbrosis, again this is a another reservation, but my damn back is aginast the wall here, i can't keep living like this, it seems that my life is over before i even got chance to live, i may opt for a live fast die young philosophy if i can't find a way to stabaly lift my depression and potensiate my mental function.

Same chemical but different source doesn't mean different effects....

Indeed, but is selegelines primary mechaism of action occuring through it's metabolism into amphetamine compounds? does it metabolise greatly into methamphetamine does it go so far as to metabolise primarily into methamphetamine?

I'm under the general impression methamphetamine greatly reduces life expectancy, so how is it that selegeline is said to extend it?

I've considered racetams as they increase bloodlfow to the brain, which might reerse soem of the mental atrophy and give me back some of my potensial cerebral mass.

Then choose piracetam which is well studied and considered save.

Okay, maybe i will, but my situation is ridiculously complicated and my level of self-awareness does not make it any easier.

I think it was the fact i literally spenmt every wkaing momnment of my life on Ritalin that has made it so particularily bad...
It's completely indescribable, how much it retarded me, i doubt anyone cna imagine, it retarded me so much, that i had little cance of figuring out i was addcited and had been retarded, but i still did by fluke chance of remember how i used to feel.

Cocaine is a very very weak drug, ritalin is like 10 times more potent.

How about if you took ritalin hour after hour after hour day after day after day week after week after week, month after mont, yer after year, making you slower and slower and more and more depressed?

If you did not react positively to stimulant treatment why have you been medicated with ritalin for so long? Didn't our parents notice that the pills make you sick? Did they believe more in ( the blatantly wrong) decisions of your doctor than in their own common sense? Why did your doctor stick to his treatment plan? Didn't he examine you regularly? Hopefully he wasn't one of those "oh i'll just file a prescription" guys...

At first i reacted great, everyone prasing it as a "wonder drug", even though under the sruface, my soul was getting eaten up, then i started asking for more, telling them it wasn't working, i became tired, then depressed, crying almost continually in agonsy all the time, the thought makes me cry now, i din't know i couldn't have known why it was happening, everyone told me the drugs were good for me, i liked them, they made me feel good, they made me better, but all they were doing was damaging me.

They played god with my mind, no-one should have right to interfere with my mind, i was a little kid, now i'm trying to be a man, but i'm scarred sitll and broken and i don't know what will happen to me...

My doctors consciously lied to my parents, despite my obvious addiction, they took advantage of my parent gulibility, they told my parents the drugs could not make me depressed, that i knew my own rhythm with ritalin(condoning self medication).


It's like i was in my own littel world with Ritalin, the doctors pushing it on my and unfortunate curcumstance, allowing it to continue.

The doctors were definitely very disturbed by my case, how frequently i wanted to take command of my dosage, requesting increases decreases and splits, it really is horrifically unlucky, i'm astonished such a thing could happen, it's so so cikening looking back.

I was blind everyone was blind, now i'm not blind, but everyone else still is...

[rsnuk]

exercise
meditation
ashwagandha

i also suggest you take a serious look at ayurvedic eating/lifestyle science

Thanks, i've been expliring spiritualilty and philosphy alot since i figured out what had happened, exploration of altetnative lifestyles and diets followed from that, right now i feel my depression is crippling me too much.

I've tried healthy eating and omega oils and fasting, had no results, so it looks like if i want a profound impact on my psychology that's going to give me the fredom to pursue a real path in this world, i'm going to have to turn to medication.

I was very anti-drug, i'm certainly anti-drugging children, now i see this worlds far too messed up to deny oneself the option of potent relief, this systems too hard, we need aids, drugs aren't the answer, maybe oneday society will evolve to a point it will no longer see that drugs are needed, until then...

I've got a choice between becoming a loving freidnly bubly person, with serotonetics.

Or, using selective dopamine drugs, which will likely make me more of a predatory person, probably have the effect of making me more driven and focused, but i don't want anxiety issue like with ritalin.

Both should relieve my depression, although i imagine i would be more content with the serotonin based medication.

Anyway.. once the depression is lifted to some degree i should be able to gain back more funcitonaility, so then i've got decide whether i can expect a normal fulfilling lifr with everything that's happened or not or if i should just depeneding on srt or dpa, follow my spiritual purusit or live fast, die young.

And that will be my life, unless some of this scifi stuff comes true...

[rsnuk]

Okay here it is again, but i don't like putting my stuff up on the internet, i'll beg you not to quote any of it, so that once it's been read i can remove it...

Thank, here it is:

Hello first post, i am a 17 year old male from the united kingdom.

I was treated with Ritalin(Methylphenidate) from the age of 10 to 16. My case is actually quite sickening, whilst most(not all) psychiartric drugs have some degree of damaging effect on the brain, the amphetamine; Amphetamine, Methylphenidate and Methamphetamine(all used to treat ADHD(not a real abnoramility) aka boyhood), these drugs are quite possibly the most deadly to the mind, body and spirit on earth.

Ok that's my opinion on amphetamines, i'll debate that if you want, if there's any life extensionalist here who would advovate the use of amphetamines however i'd be surprised, i'm quite sure alot of the potensially damaging physiological effects amphetamines won't need to be debated.

As i said i think my case was quite sickening, though the whole ADHD thing is sickening enough. I don't know whether people here will share the same view as me on what ADHD is, but here's my view.

ADHD characterised by inattension and hyperactivity, if a child is innatentive and hyperactive, they have ADHD and need treatment.

Or to put that another way:

If a child is innatentive and hyperactive, they are innatentive and hyperactive and need treatment.

Funny how the acronym ADHD makes it sound like there is a real conidtion there, that aspects of a persons being, their mind could require treatment with toxic stimulants.

In 1998 the National Institute of Health in the United States held a conference, to settle the controversy over the issue of whether ADHD is a real brain disorder or not, at the end of the conference they made this statement:

"...we do not have an independent, valid test for ADHD, and there are no data to indicate that ADHD is due to a brain malfunction"

To this day, there has never been established, a comfirmable objective abnormality within the brain that innatension and hyperactivity could be attributable to.

Let's be real, innattension and hyperactivity are just part of the human condition and are partitculiry prevelant character traits of young boys and men.

Just being real, if you can't use objective testing to confirm the existance of something then it can't be said to objectively exist.

Only subjectively, which is why i'm fed up of this stupid argument i get off my doctor:

Ofcourse ADHD is real, look the boys innatentive and hyperactive, so obviously ADHD is real.

To reword again this argument:

Ofcourse innattentiveness and hyperactiveness are real, look people are innatentive and hyperactive, so obviously, innatentivity and hyperactivity are real.

Well duh! Innatnetivity andf hyperactivity are real, but that doesn't mean that there is an objective abnormaility within the brain and that doctors should be allowed to play god with kids mind, on such a wim as there may(but most likley isn't) be something wrong.

Damn is this shit infuriating, but to get to my next point, for me this is not infuritating, because emotion as you and any healthy individual would define it is missing for me.

I'm left with what could be comparable to no emotion, but there is still some, very little, i'll say 1/10th to 1/100th of what i used to feel.

It's all subjective and relative however, so i can't really make a definite statement, i know however, i have suffered massive amounts of mental damage, i'll never know how much, most probably, how can one even meausre a loss so great as would be thought to of been inflicted by 6 years of constant additive, agonising, depressive, torturous use of a compound such as Ritalin.

Some might not think Methylphenidate to be that much of a damaging compound, but i can assure you it's crazily more potent than cocaine, dramatically more potent than amphetamine and a bit shy of methamphetamines potency.

I can also say with confidence, the above mentioned stimulants with all decrease cerebral bloodflow, enducing brain atrophy, alongside many more central nervous system mutilating effects.

I'm expecting i'm going to need to back up some of this with clinical data, so for starters here's a study showing a 30%decrease in CBF after administration of MPH:

http://www.osti.gov/...osti_id=5104681

Just the tip of the iceberg sadly... Anyway...

Some kids are going to get off lightly with this whole mass drugging thing, others aren't, i didn't.

I can't say this for definite, i can only say this with hindsight, i think i was likley born gifted and born also quite assertive, so at times a tad egocentric.

Now people say to me, how can you claim your brain is damaged, your smarter than me, well intelligence is a complicated thing to measure, a persons intelligence in a certain field, art or skill, is largely going to determined by natrual aptitude and interest.

So i say, i'm not smarter than you because i can't readily apply my intellect to what i want to, due to crippling depression, fatigue and emptiness, mayeb if i had a little bit more emotion, just a little bit more a tiny bit more focus, i could make things happen, but no i'm so strciken.

So i say also, i was born smart, so i say it like this, take a pig and human, if a human loses 20 I.Q points, he's still going to be smarter than a pig. Forgive the slightly egotisical analogy, runs in the family, along with addictive personailities which plays a part in this.

That's another thing why i think my case is so tragic, i was born really smart, as i said egocentric also, people used to say i was a born leader and things like that, while alot of that assertiveness i keep i'm still so crippled that i can't break through this surpression.

So why i feel bad for myself is that, to use another pig analogy, if a pig get's their brain damaged, sure maybe it's sad, it's nothing compared to a human getting their brain damaged.

Yes it's an extreme analogy, just to make clear, pigs= average people human = me.

So the egotism runs in the family, but drugs like meth, amp, mph, all can induce egotistical bevhaiours, the most extreme form being psychosis, so now i'mleft wondering how much of my personaility to i attribute to me and the drugs.

It's a big mess, my mind is, always trying to reason with it, never having sufficent answers to make progress.

So the story goes:

When i was 10, my borther was diagnosed with ADD and he made the judgment that there must be genetic link! and so asked to see me. When he did, he decided to give my MPH to "see if it would help" me. (didn't matter that i was completely fine already)

Ritalin convinced me i was super human, i still find it hard to get over that i am not haha lol, although my emotion is limited and so my memories of emotions are supressed too, i still feel something strong when thinking back, when there's such a feeling attached to thoughts, it's hard to surpress the as i say egotisical thinking(a scar on my psychology).

The dreams it gave me psychotic nightmares, now consider i was never allowed to watch, sex or violence on Tv, or play computer games with violence, dreams of power madness and blood lust, i'm so ashamed my mind was capable of generating such things, i don't know where they came from.

So this went on infrequently over the 6 months, over which time i requested a higher and more frequent dose several times, with which i was provided. So bascially i was being given away to addiction.


I'm getting increasingly tired now, so i'll keep the rest short...

After 1 year i was depressed, i told the doctors it wasn;t working anymore, they tried me on all kinds of cocktails opf drugs before i begged them to giveme back Ritalin, which i continued to take, despite the fact i could no longer feel anythign positive from it, just anxiety, depression and emptiness, conitnued to take until after a year of repeated suiside attempts and psychiatric hispitalisation, i said no to all drugs.

I forgot about Ritalin and turned my focus to exercising and slowly began to recognise alot of failing aspects of my mental and physical health, most notably, lack of energy and drive, physically and mentally a lack of drive and energy.

I was predicted to attain 10 A* grade GCSE's, but being far too f*ed up by the time i got to upper school to really learn anything, i did maintain a grades for maths and science however as i had learnt most of the ciriculum when i was 11, despite it being 4 years in advance of me. In the end i did not attain a single gcse qualification.

So how i figured it all out was that i had a memory of an emotion, a simple memory of running, on a field in my middle school, i don't know how it felt, i can't experience that kind of emotion, but i remember thinking at the exact second the emotion came over me, "this is how i used to feel".

Then i kind of woke me up somehow from zombiness and so i uncovered all i have about the world, worlds history, adhd, my past and how they all interelate into a sickening pattern of deception that has been my life up until now.

So i guess, i would like to discuss, how i can increase my mental function, gain back as much of my original potensial as possible.

This post i'm sure should open up some interesting sociological issues, while your all trying to attain an increase in the human lifespan, it's being shortened from the bottom up as an entire generation of kidsgrows up exposed to addictive stimulants.

Society is becoming more and more hedonistic, selfish and self-destructive, it's regression, each generation is taking a step backwards now, ironically, because the later generation has corrupted and degraded morally so far that it's taking advantage of the younger generation, capitalism is going to kill us.

So what kind of nootropics should i be considering?

I've actually wrote something like 100 small font pages of autobiography detailing the history of my mental development and consciousness, i don't think anyone should be doubting that Ritalin is capable of this, maybe it just took someone with a high level of self-awareness to stand up and raise concern and i'm not even alone.

[luv2increase]

If you're going to go back on the medication, try adderall. If that doesn't work for you, try dexedrine. Both of these options are, of course, only if you choose the chemical route.

You are still young man. Be persistent with what you are doing now. Try some piracetam along with meditation, good diet, sleep, friendships, exercise, & extra-curricular activities.

Time will heal young blood.

[rsnuk]

See i hate chemicals, but the cycle of dependance has began now, seriosuly i have realised that to attain what i want to in life, i have no choice...

Mmm... Amphetamine... or Dextroamphetamine... Why not Meth if that's how we're going about things...

I'm conmsidering deprynll, because it suposedly has neuroprotective qualities, unlike amphetamines.

Racetams would be something i would likely supplement over the course of my life along with other nootropics.

Right now i need focus and emotion, so that i can get a job begin a career and can them afford to self-enhance further.

Sadly i don't think time will heal in my case, i think i'm destined to deteriorate or simply remain crippled and empty for the rest of my existance without some kind of drmamatic intiative on my part.

Things that are neuroprotective are?

[luv2increase]

See i hate chemicals, but the cycle of dependance has began now, seriosuly i have realised that to attain what i want to in life, i have no choice...

You are screwed....

Mmm... Amphetamine... or Dextroamphetamine... Why not Meth if that's how we're going about things...

Hey mate, you're the one who mentioned that medication may be your only answer.

Sadly i don't think time will heal in my case, i think i'm destined to deteriorate or simply remain crippled and empty for the rest of my existance without some kind of drmamatic intiative on my part.

Have you ever heard of the placebo effect? Well, it can work against you as well. You keep telling yourself this, and you most certainly will not succeed in life or get your sanity back. It is time to stop moping around, be a man, think positive, and be the best you can be.

[rsnuk]

Oh thought i'd add, ritalin inhibits dopamine reuptake in vitro at (KI = 0.06 ìM)

cocaine inhibits dopamine reuptake at (KI = 0.33 ìM )

so 5 times, additionally ritalin has a halflife of 8 hours, yes the main metabolite of methlyphenidate detro-ritalinic acid remains biologically active for upwards of 8 hours

cocaine about an hour?

lets times 5 times the potency with 8 times the halflife and we get 40times more potent

Interestingly methamphetamine inhibits dat transport reuptake at KI values of 0.082 ìM, presenting evidence that atleast in ability to enduce dopamine reuptake methypehnidate is more potent than methmaphetamine.

[rsnuk]

See i hate chemicals, but the cycle of dependance has began now, seriosuly i have realised that to attain what i want to in life, i have no choice...

You are screwed....



Hey mate, you're the one who mentioned that medication may be your only answer.



Have you ever heard of the placebo effect? Well, it can work against you as well. You keep telling yourself this, and you most certainly will not succeed in life or get your sanity back. It is time to stop moping around, be a man, think positive, and be the best you can be.

Sorry brother, didn't mean to come across so negative, there's a fine line between pessemism, optimism and realism, i try to be realiastically optimistic, yet things still don't look good to me.

I'm not moping though, i searching for a solution and an answer, people really never want to hear it if your situations bad, i get that now, that's why i don't tlak about my problems on anywhere but the internet and yet even here, mayeb i'm just breeding what i should let die, i should just let go of what's happened to me...

See now i didn't even want to post up about ti to begin with.

As i said there's a fine line between pessimism, optimism and realism, seems if i'm being realistic i'm being pessimistic these days, but i strongly believe anything is possible, i could make a full mental physical recovery, but then again... but then again again... You can flip from either view point.

It's funny you mentioned the placebo effect, i think the human body has an incredible hidden power of self healing, it's been demonstrated enough, make someone believe in something enough so that they want something enough and somehow, they get rid of cancer or whatever other ailment.

Now seeing as i can't really believe in anything emotionally strongly and wouldn'teven be gulible to belief that a pill could give me everything i want, this will sound radical but...

How about hypnotising someone into believing a pill will cure them, then administering the pill?

[ziddy5]

That is an amazing story. I was recently prescribed Adderall for attentional problems, but I am quite concerned the effects of chronic usage. It'd be great if you could share some of that autobiography, but if you think it's too personal, then that's perfectly understandable.

[barcodes]

rsnuk, 'retarded' is the perfect expression for the way ritalin acts on a person... and I havent taken as much and as long as you have. Good luck sorting things out.

[stargazer]

I'm troubled over hearing your story as I just started with ritalin a little over a week ago. I don't consider it such a bad tradeoff since I was basically non-functioning at all before I started ritalin. Anyways my plan is not staying on ritalin chronically but rather during the use, create habits for which to function on. To me it's a life saver right now and I wouldn't trade it for the world. Hope you recover, cheers.

[rsnuk]

Oh i just posted in your thread, just be careful brother, i thought i was a wonder drug too, but if you begin to develop tolerance, stop the drug. Seriously, once your tolerant your already dependant to some degree, from there at best you'll remain dependant, but at worst the drugs can desotry everything about you.

I was too young to know these things and the people watching over me, were trying to cover their arses because they knew i shouldn't have been on the drugs in the first place.

Seriously look out for signs of tolerance, it is addictive, i may seem like a wonder drug, but it can destroy you, don't let the feelings hypnotise you, these things can be incredibly insideous...

[rsnuk]

Just went out to do something and did some thinking.

Well methylphenidate , besides the oxidative damage and elements of toxicity to other parts of my physiology, has mainly messed up my neuroendocrine regulation and monomine neurotramitter systems.

Neuroendocrine regulation has reduced my growth hormone production and increased my prolactin prudction, this is something i plan to combat with GH releasing peptides and the dopamine agonist bromocriptine.

I plan to begin taking anti-oxidants such as vitamin C and ALA regularily.

All this ties into my sexual dysfunction, which at 17 is f*ed up, i am rarely interested in sex, unless my partner initiates and even then i actually am bored whislt having sex sometimes(okay frequnetly) resulting in a loss of erection, or at other times(okay most times) it feels too nice and so i prematurely ejacualte despite my best effort to control this stopping and starting is very irritating, it's all f*ed up.

Okay so it would seem that the prematrue ejaculation is due to a serotnonin related problem and the erectile dynsfunction is caued due to a dopamine related problem, both combining to create a very f*ed up situation for myself.

I always thought explaining such problems as dysfunctions of neurotransmitter systems was too simplistic, i always thought the mind was more complex than this, but i'm starting to see that i was wrong somewhat, but this doesn't mean tyhat drugs are the answer, they really aren't, but i'm coming up short of alternatives.

Now when i recently tried ritalin, i didn't feel a thing, it just made me a bit anxious, i don't know what this means for the state of my neurotransmitter systems, but atleast i know my adrenals are okay, what i think i need to do is find a way to potently stimulate my serotonin and dopamine systems as safely as possible, minimally triggering a norepinephrine responce, as the negative effects of the anxiety make any increase in dopamineric or serotogenic activity unfeelable or noticable positvely.

So so sad all this is, i feel bad for me, ever since i became depressed 6 years ago i've been searching for an answer to it, at first i thought the ritalin stopped working, then i kept on trying to convince myself i would be fine again soon and i did this for 4 years until i had really forgotten what happiness was, then i stopped taking the drugs and i through if i exercised in would get better, then i thought there was something wrong with my hormones, which there was(elevated PRL), but using steroids(testosterone) did cure my sexual dysfunction or relieve my depression fatigue, then i remember an emotion, figured out ritalin was responsible and have slowly linked everything together, so that i know how and why it cuased whatever problem i have suffered since taking it.

It seemed so pointless, my life destoryed over a little white pill, a little white pill almost killing an entire being, my being, now it might be too late... Blah...

Here's a Thomas Edison quote:

The doctor of the future will give no medicine, but will interest her or his patients in the care of the human frame, in a proper diet, and in the cause and prevention of disease.

Psychiartry is a step backwards, it causes problems and makes people dependant on treatment,

I believe all forms of severe biologically mediated depression are caued by substance abuse and other forms of depression can be cured with lifestyle changes, drugs just aren't the answer.

Any thoughts?

[luv2increase]

You used steroids? Did you use a proper PCT (post cycle therapy), such as HCG, clomid, or nolvadex?

If you didn't, that may explain the reason you are the way you are. You may have screwed up your endocrine system from the steroids! That would explain every one of your symptoms.

[rsnuk]

You used steroids?  Did you use a proper PCT (post cycle therapy), such as HCG, clomid, or nolvadex?

If you didn't, that may explain the reason you are the way you are.  You may have screwed up your endocrine system from the steroids!  That would explain every one of your symptoms.

I had all of my problems well before my use of steroids, i used 250 mg of test e(that's a hrt(hormone replacement thrapy) dose), for 8 weeks, i wasn't using them for muscle gain so i was not weight training, i followed up with 8 weeks of nolva 40mg ed for PCT, had blood tests since the showing my test in the 20-30 range, which is normal.

Steroids have had zero effect on my situation, it's something i tried because i was mentally damaged from ritalin and suffering from sexual dynsfunction, fatigue etc...

[rsnuk]

And no that would not explain my symptoms, like how i used to starve mysefl on ritalin remarkably finding intence physical activvity on an empty stomach a rush.

Or how it gave me insonuia, or how the withdrawls form ritalin at night in my bedroom put me in crippling emotional agony so bad that i would call for help but find myself breathless, because my stomach contracted so hard from the waves of emotional pain that felt my plexus.

Mate i'm the one whose gone through this, i'm the one with all the memories of what ritalin made me feel and think, i think i should know whether my problems are attributable to it or not, i have 7 years worth of memories, when i think about it, it's like watching a train wreck in slow motion and i can zoom in on any facet of it.

[luv2increase]

How long have you been sober from ritalin?

[rsnuk]

1 3/4 years, but for the year before that i massively reduced how frequnetly i took ritalin i kept leaving it for months then trying it for a week and realising it still wasn't going to "work", so i might say 2 3/4 years it was early 2005 when i really stopped tkaing ritalin as they wanted me to take anti-depressants.

Mate as much as this might shatter your view on how these medications work and their safety, it's very likely i have suffered a permanent breakdown of my pleasure pathways and suffered considerable mental damage, as would be seen from heavy methamphetamine abuse, from taking methylphenidate, probably due to some kind of supersensitivity to it's neurotoxic effects.

As i have stated in other threads on these forums, the drugs are potensially neurotoxic, but some people can be very tolerant to the neurotoxic effects and other can be very sensitive to them, some people can get away with using them, others can't.

They certainly should not be given to kids, no drugs should be given to kids, they aren'teven mentally mature or consciously developed enough to understand what drugs are to a degree that they can make an informed descision to take them.

It's just wrong, very wrong, what's more wrong is the huge risk of neurotoxic "side" effects.

Seriously, i wish i had had some emotion return to me, but i literally feel next to nothing, when ever it feels mlike i should be having some kind of emotion, if often amnifests as a headahce, fatigue stres, cloudiness and scatteredness, all i'm hoping for is an increased ability to resist this stress which i feel in place of emotion, so that i'm less diabled, but for me, unless i find soemthing radical, it's a life of limited emotion and ritalin has caused this.