61 replies to this topic

[Bruce Klein]

ImmInst member Gregory Bloom has posted an enlightening email exchange from Rep. Stump (Date Feb 23, 2004) to the ImmInst Legal Team - Public Forum:

Available Here.

[Bruce Klein]

HB 2637 support/opposition Scoreboard found here:
http://imminst.org/f...t=0

[Bruce Klein]

-----Original Message----- posted to CryoNet

Message #23488
From: "mike99" <mike99@lascruces.com>
Subject: Ariz. Rep Stump replies to my msg about the cryonics bill (HB 2637)
Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 17:50:12 -0700

RE: Keep Arizona free! Please do not snuff out cryonics!Cryonetters,
Here is Rep. Stump's reply (followed by my original message) regarding the
proposed Arizona legislation that could negatively impact Alcor.

If you are thinking of writing, or even testifying, you should consider what
he says here in order to address his points more effectively.
Regards,

Michael LaTorra

mike99@lascruces.com
mlatorra@nmsu.edu

"For any man to abdicate an interest in science is to walk with open eyes
towards slavery."
-- Jacob Bronowski

Member:
Extropy Institute: www.extropy.org
World Transhumanist Association: www.transhumanism.org
Alcor Life Extension Foundation: www.alcor.org
Society for Technical Communication: www.stc.org


-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Stump [mailto:bstump@azleg.state.az.us]
Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2004 9:24 PM
To: 'mike99'; Deb Gullett; Bob Stump; Philip J. Hanson; Bill Konopnicki;
Colette Rosati; Bill Arnold; Mark Thompson; Warde Nichols
Cc: Cheryl Chase; Phil Lopes; David T. Bradley; Linda Lopez;
'boxercourt@hotmail.com'; Pete Wertheim; Elizabeth Baskett;
'peter.corbett@arizonarepublic.com'; 'bbertolino@aztrib.com';
'ltemplar@aztrib.com'; 'priske@azcapitoltimes.org'
Subject: RE: Keep Arizona free! Please do not snuff out cryonics!


Mr. LaTorra:

Considering the alleged problems chronicled by the national media, not to
mention media in Arizona and California, what leads you to believe that
"Alcor already operates under the highest protocols for health and safety"?
How can we know this for a fact, since there is no oversight whatsoever of
cryonics facilities in Arizona?

You write that "no one has identified any public health or public safety
reason for this proposed legislation." To the contrary: The reasons are
clear and well-known. Are you unaware of them?

This bill will slowly wend its way through the legislative process. No one
is acting in haste; I have been working on this bill for five months. Please
note that in the Arizona Capitol Times (October 10, 2003), I said the
following: "I look forward to spending time with representatives of Alcor."
After months of news coverage in the Arizona Capitol Times, the Tribune, and
the Republic, Alcor contacted me at the 11th hour.

Alcor objected to having the Funeral Board provide oversight but offered no
concrete alternatives at a stakeholder meeting on January 21, saying they
hadn't had the time -- despite the fact that Alcor has known about work on
this bill since last October. We have had stakeholder meetings for many
weeks. It is now February 21, and Alcor has yet to offer any concrete,
workable solutions about how to provide oversight -- even though its
representatives simultaneously say Alcor is "not opposed to regulation."

Moreover, perhaps you are unaware that I delayed introducing this bill so
that members of Alcor and/or its representative, Barry Aarons, could meet
with me on several occasions.

You write that "this bill would have the likely effect of eliminating
Alcor's ability to continue performing cryopreservation procedures and
research in Arizona."

You are incorrect. The bill was drafted in such a way that this would not
occur, because that was never my intention and was, in fact, a concern of
mine. The bill does not cast judgment, pro or con, on cryonics. Nor does it
put anyone out of business.

All the best,

Representative Bob Stump
Arizona House of Representatives
District 9
1700 W. Washington
Phoenix, AZ 85007
Phone: (602) 542-5413
http://www.azleg.sta...sp?Member_ID=85

-----Original Message----- posted to CryoNet

From: mike99 [mailto:mike99@lascruces.com]
Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2004 5:01 PM
To: dgullett@azleg.state.az.us; bstump@azleg.state.az.us;
phanson@azleg.state.az.us; bkonopni@azleg.state.az.us;
crosati@azleg.state.az.us; barnold@azleg.state.az.us;
mthompso@azleg.state.az.us; wnichols@azleg.state.az.us
Cc: cchase@azleg.state.az.us; plopes@azleg.state.az.us;
dbradley@azleg.state.az.us; llopez@azleg.state.az.us
Subject: Keep Arizona free! Please do not snuff out cryonics!

Dear Legislators,
I am a client of Alcor, a cryonics organization that promises nothing more
than the opportunity to participate in a grand scientific experiment in
radical life extension via cryonic preservation. Alcor is neither a scam nor
a cult. Nor it is a funeral business.

I urge you to reconsider your support for HB 2637 (embalmers; funeral
establishments; storing remains) which inappropriately lumps cryonics into
the same category as the funeral business. Alcor already operates under the
highest protocols for health and safety. Burdening cryonics organizations
such as Alcor with regulations that are truly only appropriate for a funeral
business will do nothing to protect the people of Arizona.

The real danger here it for the legislature to act in haste before
considering all sides of this issue. Alcor was not invited to participate in
the dialogue about this proposal until the very last minute and it had
virtually no input into the development of this legislation. Given a normal
amount of time to prepare to present its case, I am confident that Alcor can
show you why HB 2637 would have many negative, and perhaps unintended,
consequences.

This bill is a solution without a problem. No one has identified any public
health or public safety reason for this proposed legislation.

This bill would have the likely effect of eliminating Alcor's ability to
continue performing cryopreservation procedures and research in Arizona.
This would be bad for the state, bad for the people such as myself who are
relying on Alcor, and bad for the business climate in one of the freest,
most desirable states in America for its it wonderful business climate.

Please vote against the bill.

Thank you for your time and consideration. I hope you have a good day.

Regards,
Michael LaTorra
mike99@lascruces.com

[thefirstimmortal]

This bill will slowly wend its way through the legislative process. No one
is acting in haste; I have been working on this bill for five months. Please
note that in the Arizona Capitol Times (October 10, 2003), I said the
following: "I look forward to spending time with representatives of Alcor."
After months of news coverage in the Arizona Capitol Times, the Tribune, and
the Republic, Alcor contacted me at the 11th hour.

Alcor objected to having the Funeral Board provide oversight but offered no
concrete alternatives at a stakeholder meeting on January 21, saying they
hadn't had the time -- despite the fact that Alcor has known about work on
this bill since last October. We have had stakeholder meetings for many
weeks. It is now February 21, and Alcor has yet to offer any concrete,
workable solutions about how to provide oversight -- even though its
representatives simultaneously say Alcor is "not opposed to regulation."

Moreover, perhaps you are unaware that I delayed introducing this bill so
that members of Alcor and/or its representative, Barry Aarons, could meet
with me on several occasions

This concerns me, are these claims valid? I don't like Mr. Stumps Bill, but if this claim has merit than we dropped the ball on this one, and dropped it in a big way.

[Bruce Klein]

I know.. it feels like we really overlooked this one. It seems we could have been contacting Rep's ago.

[Kallazze]

Let's kill this bill before it kills us! Let's get on with it! The bill is a [perverse] disgrace!! I'm not from Arizona (although I have visited it in 1996, even went to the Grand Canyon--Awesome(!)), but I still say we must kill the bill!

[thefirstimmortal]

I know.. it feels like we really overlooked this one.  It seems we could have been contacting Rep's ago.

I'm a little unclear as to who the "we" is on the overlooking part??? I mean, no one here at Imm knew anything about this until a few days ago, correct? I certainly owe Mr. Stump a big I'm sorry (although my legal arguments stand) for some of my actions. I certainly would not have pushed the whole press thing if I knew that Alcor was invited to sit at the table. The clear representation at this point in time is that the legislation was being slid in without anyone knowing. Am I wrong about this.

[thefirstimmortal]

Kallazze: Let's kill this bill before it kills us!  Let's get on with it!  The bill is a [perverse] disgrace!!  I'm not from Arizona (although I have visited it in 1996, even went to the Grand Canyon--Awesome(!)), but I still say we must kill the bill!

I still agree of course, that the bill needs to fall

[Bruce Klein]

Just heard Alcor is flying in Aubrey de Grey to attend the hearing.

[Bruce Klein]

I'm confounded also on the timing and sunset. However, Brian Wowk made it clear for me in that the language is directed against Alcor specifically.

Thus, irregardless of timing, intentions are key:

A question was raised regarding the section of bill HB 2637 (the bill attacking Alcor) that reads:

Sec. 4. Title 36, chapter 7, article 3, Arizona Revised Statutes, is amended by adding section 36-851, to read:

36-851. Applicability; definition

A. THIS ARTICLE DOES NOT APPLY TO A PERSON OR ENTITY THAT CHARGES A FEE FOR THE STORAGE OF A DEAD HUMAN BODY OR REMAINS OF A DEAD HUMAN BODY FOR MORE THAN FIVE YEARS.

This bill adds and amends several parts of the Arizona Revised Statutes (laws of the State of Arizona). It does so in four parts. "Sec. 4" means the 4th action of the bill. This action refers to an amendment of "Title 26, chapter 7, article 3," which is the Arizona Anatomical Gift Act (AAGA). The AAGA is Arizona's particular implementation of the Uniform Anatomical Gift Act (UAGA) which is implemented in some form in almost all 50 states as a mechanism for people to donate their tissues, organs, or body for medical or scientific uses. Sec. 4 of this bill amends the AAGA to prevent Alcor from operating under it.

Alcor has used the UAGA and AAGA as the legal mechanism for taking posession of cryonics patients for decades. It completely bypasses funeral regulations, and has numerous other advantages, some of which are explained by Steve Bridge in his article

http://www.alcor.org...egalstatus.html

It is my understanding that one of the reasons why CI succumbed to funeral regulation in Michigan is that they were not using the UAGA to do cryonics.

Bill HB 2637's revocation of Alcor's ability to use the UAGA and AAGA shows what an insidious and concerted attack on cryonics this is.

---Brian Wowk

REF: http://imminst.org/f...t=0

[Bruce Klein]

Posted to Venturist List


Randolfe Wicker

From: randolfe wicker <rhwicker@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: Re: Alcor emergency legislative alert - How to help if out of state?

I certainly approve of the efforts of well meaning people to defeat the terrible proposed legislation in Arizona.

However, I think some are naive insofar as they actually believe what politicians tell them.

Politicians are two-faced liars. They tell everyone what they think that person wants to hear and then vote the way they choose.

The bottom line in this debate is that these "legislators" and the public in general think "those folks freezing people out there in the desert are a bunch of kooks".

They are not interested in rational discussion. They don't hear reasonable arguments. They essentially feel "we don't want those folks doing that kind of stuff around here" and that is the way they are goiing to vote.

Maybe if they saw an economic benefit, they might modify their view but last time I checked, Alcor was not a major employer in the area.

The reality is that they have moral objections, probably based on their religious backgrounds, to the idea of people trying to "play God" by suspending themselves in hopes of future resurrection.

I can hear the preachers thundering now about how it is "desecration of the body" and "an insult to the dignity of human beings" to freeze "those corpses" instead of letting them "find eternal rest". (Amen!)

The only way those who believe in cryonics will prevail is to establish themselves as a religious organization and win their right to practice their beliefs in the courts.

Politicians are light years away from dealing sensibly with cryonics. Just look at the stupidity they display regarding simple cloning.

The "talking points" in Alcor's letter are quite good. Perhaps we will get some sort of an intelligent discussion at some level of society. However, that is not going to happen in the
Republican dominated government of the State of Arizona.

Sad but true.

Cloningly yours,
Randolfe Wicker
Founder, Clone Rights United Front, www.clonerights.com
Spokesperson, Reproductive Cloning Network, www.reproductivecloning.net
Advisor, The Immortality Institute, www.imminst.org
email: rhwicker@optonline.net
phone: 201-656-3280

[Bruce Klein]

From: tim@fungible.com Subject: Re: Re: Alcor emergency legislative alert - How to help if out of state? From: David Brandt-Erichsen <davidbe@comcast.net>

>>The best thing you can do to help is contact the
>>Republican members of the Health Committee (the Democrats are all on our
>>side now) and express your concern, taking one or two ideas from the
>>talking points that you most relate to personally.


>From visiting http://www.azleg.sta...emberRoster.asp

The majority of the AZ house and the majority of the AZ senate
are Republican.

>From http://www.azleg.sta....ommittee_ID=73

4 of 12 members of the health committee are Democratic, 8 of 12 are
Republican.

If the whole thing is along party lines, we lose.

The agenda for the 26th has two bills by Stump. HB2637 is probably
the one we should be watching:

http://www.azleg.sta...n...379.doc.htm
-- Tim Freeman

[thefirstimmortal]

I'm confounded also on the timing and sunset.  However, Brian Wowk make it clear for me in that the language is directed against Alcor spicifically:

Just so that I'm clear about this Bruce, the bill is clearly aimed at Alcor, and I in no way want to see it passed. My current problem with the timing and sunset issue is two fold. One, it gives credibility to Mr. Stumps claims that he has been unfairly demonized (and I'm one of the demonizers) and furthermore, it took away from all of us, the ability to effect the legislation, to work with as opposed to against the Arizona Legislator. Given the.......hold on, spilled water on the omputer, ab_d abdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyz.


The c on my comp is shot, thank god for cut and paste.


chance to divert a law or fight it, I

[Bruce Klein]

OK, so am I correct to assume there's a total of 60 state legislators (30 house/ 30 senate)

And reputed support from 50 legislators:

Although fifty legislators signed on as co-sponsors, we are finding as we contact them one by one that the support for this legislation may be a mile wide, but it is only an inch deep. Most of the co-sponsors with whom we've spoken are saying that they did it as a favor to the sponsor, Representative Stump, and would likely vote against it in its current form in committee or on the floor. We need your help to ensure this likelihood becomes reality.

not good, eh? if this passes HHS tomorrow.

[Bruce Klein]

Posted to Venturist Digest 76

Message: 1
Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 16:00:31 -0800
From: "David Pizer" davidpizer@cableone.net
Subject: Alcor & Arizona - Pizer's Take


David Pizer

When I first heard about cryonics, over 20 years ago, it was a result of a newspaper article that was intended to be negative or poke fun at cryonics. I was drinking coffee one morning, (before work), with several of my friends and one of them had a newspaper article that he read to us. It went something like this -- "People in California belong to an organization that freezes bodies of people when the are (legally) dead and stores them in hopes that scientists in the future can revive them and then they can live on." The others in my group laughed when they heard this and I was silent - so they all looked at me, the only one who was not laughing, and I just said in a very serious tone of voice, "Can I have that article, please."

A few days later I was signed up for cryonics.


What does this all mean? It means two things: Alcor is at some risk of a bad law being passed in Arizona right now; and it means that we in cryonics have yet another chance to be in the public eye and show the world what kind of people we really are, people who takes risks to choose life instead of death, people who are not afraid to stand up for their beliefs, we are serious and we will not stand for our rights to be trampled. But, we also respect the rights of those who do not understand or agree with us.

First let's talk about the risk to Alcor. At present this anti-cryonics bill is before the Arizona House (or in one of their committees). If it gets passed in the house, it will have to then be passed in the Senate, and then the Governor will have to sign it, before it becomes a law. There are several places where this terrible bill can be stopped. Even if it gets passed as a law, Alcor can then challenge it in the courts.

This bill is so bad, that I believe, it will be stopped somewhere along this chain of events. There will be costs to Alcor and its members to do this including money costs and manpower costs. We all have to be prepared to help out in any way that Alcor needs us.

Now let's talk about opportunity. This is a time when cryonics will be in the news, sandwiched between stories about some movie star or sports hero killing or raping some pool soul. Let's make sure that the public knows that we are in the news not for supporting some horrible thing that usually makes the headlines, but because we support the opportunity to extend life, and that reason alone intimidates some powerful people who don't understand us. This is a time when we cryonicists can show the world that we are regular people just like everyone else, with the exception that we will take heroic means to choose life over death. This is a time when your well-written letter to the editor, or letter to your elected official can do the cryonics movement some good. This is a good time to talk to your family, friends or loved ones about the possibility of their involvement.

Certainly, we are all angry at some politicians and news reporters for not understanding what we are about. We are angry if we think they are using their positions to harm those who hold opposite views to what they believe. But as long as we are polite and articulate in discussing cryonics we can use this chain of events to further the cryonics movement and help additional humans along the way.

I have confidence in the people running Alcor at the present time to protect us and capitalize on this opportunity to advance our goals, and we are grateful to their efforts to protect Alcor and move us forward.

David Pizer

[thefirstimmortal]

OK, so am I correct to assume there's a total of 60 state legislators (30 house/ 30 senate)

Sorry for the delay, I had to get a hairdryer from my neighbor to get the water out of my keyboard.

I think that to be correct Bruce. I would be astonished to find that many co-sponsors bailing on Mr. Stump. I've never seen an about face like that in my life. Even assuming they did it as a favor, what could possibly make that many vote the other way. These were not just supporters, they were co-sponsors. Even the two pieces of krypotonite, Bad Press, and going against religion would be hard pressed to kill that level of support. Let's see what happens.

[treonsverdery]

I support cryonics.
Id like the voters of arizona to support the opponent of rep stump on the basis of this bill

I like his school voucher idea though.
I like the idea of Common Sense day

Treon

[Bruce Klein]

VOTE =

YES: 11
ABSENT: 1

Specifically: http://www.azleg.sta...7.hhealth.1.asp


Next Step:

1. Find out more about the bills implications
2. Let people know we have ILT (ImmInst Legal Team) for future situations.
3. Prepare for House Vote (if needed)

More Discussion On Feb 26 Hearing Found in ILT's Public Forum:
http://imminst.org/f...t=0

[Bruce Klein]

Next Steps:

David Pizer advises:

First let's talk about the risk to Alcor. At present this anti-cryonics bill is before the Arizona House (or in one of their committees). If it gets passed in the house, it will have to then be passed in the Senate, and then the Governor will have to sign it, before it becomes a law. There are several places where this terrible bill can be stopped. Even if it gets passed as a law, Alcor can then challenge it in the courts.

This bill is so bad, that I believe, it will be stopped somewhere along this chain of events. There will be costs to Alcor and its members to do this including money costs and manpower costs. We all have to be prepared to help out in any way that Alcor needs us.  REF

[thefirstimmortal]

I doubt theis bill is going to get stopped. I suggest Alcor start preparing their case.

[Bruce Klein]

Joseph A. Waynick, CEO and President Alcor
http://www.alcor.org...ff.html#waynick

Quote from Joe Waynick, Alcor President

"This is very good news" (re: HB 2637 results)

Details will be out very soon tonight in an email to the membership.

Source: ImmInst Chat Room
Feb. 26, 2004 - 7:00 Eastern
From: Stephen Van Sickle (sjvan),
Alcor Board Member & ImmInst Member

Steven Van Sickle says: "I am happy and relieved"

[Bruce Klein]

General manager of the Creekside Preserve Lodge and Advisor and Secretary for The Society for Venturism, ImmInst member John Grigg:


John Grigg

"Stump may not have realized the 'grassroots' power of Alcor so he relented by allowing the amendements to the bill"

Source: ImmInst Chat Room
Feb 26, 2004 7:10 PM Eastern
From: John Grigg

[sjvan]

From Joe Wanick
President/CEO
Alcor Foundation


To All Alcor Members;

I am happy and proud to say that Alcor, its members, and the state of Arizona have won a great victory today!

Early Wednesday morning, Barry Aarons, Tanya Jones, and I met with Representative Stump and several of his advisors for nearly forty-five minutes to discuss HB 2637. We were very pleasantly surprised at the openness and flexibility demonstrated by Mr. Stump in our sometimes frank discussions. During that meeting, we were able to successfully communicate to him the sincere concerns we had with his bill as originally proposed and why our membership was so strongly opposed its passage.

It is our opinion that prior to this meeting, Mr. Stump sincerely did not understand the unintended negative consequences his bill would have on Alcor, its members, and on the science of cryopreservation as a whole.

After patiently listening to our concerns Mr. Stump expressed a willingness to modify several key provisions of the bill as a show of good faith to the constituents of this legislation in exchange for a commitment from us to continue dialogue for appropriate oversight of cryonics as practiced in the state of Arizona.

Since representation at the negotiation table is what we’ve been requesting from the day Alcor first became engaged in the legislative process, we were of course elated at the opportunity to sit with representatives of the legislature and their advisors in a spirit of cooperation and craft legislation that will provide the level of oversight legitimately required by the state while simultaneously securing protection for patient privacy, guaranteeing the constitutional right of self-determination of our members, and establishment once and for all the legislative legitimacy of cryonics.

At the conclusion of that meeting, Representative Stump demonstrated outstanding leadership and courage by agreeing in principle to consider amendments to his bill that would eliminate some of the most serious concerns of Alcor and its membership in a show of good faith. We were most impressed.

Today, literally an hour before the hearing was to begin, we received word that amendments had been filed and that Representative Stump was receptive to hearing the balance of our concerns that blocked agreement to a bill. After reviewing the amendments and exchanging negotiating points with Representative Stump that outlined some of our remaining issues we were able to secure the following understanding:

1. Alcor’s ability to utilize the UAGA was restored via amendment;

2. The requirement for an embalmer to store our patients or participate in our procedures was struck from the bill via amendment;

3. In addition, we committed to meet with all interested parties and seek agreement upon the following:

a. Expand the Funeral Board by up to two members to include experts in the field of cryopreservation or change the composition of the existing board to include up to two experts in the field of cryopreservation;

b. Require a cryopreservation expert on the staff of the Funeral Board to execute oversight;

c. To establish the statutory legitimacy of cryonics through a legislated definition of cryopreservation;

d. Define the scope of the oversight through legislation and not left singularly up to a rules committee;

e. To extend the effective date of the bill to September 1, 2005 to leave open our option of legislative redress in the unlikely event that appropriate rules cannot be agreed upon between Alcor and the Funeral Board.

Due to the good faith agreements obtained prior to the committee hearing in conjunction with the proposed amendments, Alcor reduced its opposition to passage of HB 2637 on the condition that agreement can be reached on the verbal understandings listed above.

It should be noted that several members of the Health Committee expressed reservations about having Alcor overseen by the Funeral Board, but conceded that if legislation were necessary, it would be placed there but reserve the right to find a more appropriate place to house cryonics oversight in the future. Moreover, many of the committee members reserved the right to change their vote when the bill is presented on the House floor if agreements cannot be reached on the aforementioned items. Our heartfelt gratitude, respect and admiration go out to the courageous Representatives who agreed to support our cause.

After the hearing, I had the opportunity to have some very constructive dialogue with Randy Bunker and Rudy Thomas who both enthusiastically looked forward to engaging Alcor and finalizing the framework of the proposed oversight.

The progress of today’s hearing would not have been possible without the tireless efforts of a number of good people, including Barry Aarons, David Brandt-Erichsen, Saul Kent, Tanya Jones, Aubrey de Grey, and Steve Rude. In addition, we must thank all the brave souls who traveled to Phoenix to testify but were unable to do so due to legislative time constraints including Steve Harris, Mark and Judy Muhlestein, Ted and Bobby Kraver, Jim Lewis, and two organ preservation scientists who wish to remain anonymous.

We must also thank those members who attended the hearing as a public show of support for Alcor. Lastly, but certainly not least, we must thank all of the members who took time away from their busy schedules to eMail, fax, and call Arizona state legislators, urging them to oppose this bill. When they revealed to us that they were receiving from 150-200 eMails per day we realized that you all really made a difference! Thank you!!!

Joe Waynick
CEO/President
Alcor Life Extension Foundation

[Bruce Klein]

PRESS:


Arizona Bill to Regulate Cryonics Advances
Source: http://www.ajc.com/s...ating-Cryo.html

PHOENIX (AP)--A cryonics firm where baseball legend Ted Williams' frozen remains are said to be stored would be regulated by the state funeral board under a revised bill advancing in the Arizona House.

The House Health Committee Thursday unanimously voted for the bill, which would require state licensing for people or organizations that store dead bodies or remains for more than five years for a fee.

The committee approved the bill after making changes negotiated between the sponsor and Scottsdale-based Alcor Life Extension Foundation.

Alcor drew national attention last year over its handling of frozen remains of Williams. The last major-leaguer to bat over .400 in a season, Williams died July 5, 2002.

Alcor has not confirmed that Williams is among those preserved at Alcor, but his presence at the facility was revealed in court documents when Williams's oldest daughter challenged her half-brother's decision to bring the body there.

The matter was settled in December, when the daughter dropped her objections.

Alcor places bodies or severed heads in frozen nitrogen, in hopes that future technological and medical advances will allow the person to be revived and restored to health.
--

[bacopa]

whoo hooo!

[Bruce Klein]

A few of the emails posted here for archive:
(posted by Joeseph Bloch to wta-talk)

Dear Representative «Last_Name»,

I am currently in the process of becoming a client of the Alcor Life
Extension Foundation of Scottsdale, AZ. As an informed consumer, I have
thoroughly investigated Alcor’s claims, procedures, and facilities and
have found them to be among the finest and most reputable in the
cryonics industry.

It has come to my attention that HB 2637, which is due to come up for a
vote in the House Health Committee tomorrow morning, would place Alcor
under the authority of Arizona’s Funeral Board, eliminating its access
to the Uniform Anatomical Gift Act. In essence, this would place Alcor,
which is engaged in a medically-based business of tissue preservation,
under the regulatory authority of an industry to which it has only the
most superficial resemblance, and which has, in the past, expressed
unfettered hostility to its procedures. (Arizona Funeral Board Director
Rudy Thomas was quoted by author Richard Sandomir as saying, "These
companies [i.e., companies in the field of cryonics] need to be
regulated or deregulated out of business." --New York Times, 14 Oct
2003.) This would effectively destroy Alcor’s ability to operate in
Arizona.

The cryonics industry as a whole, and Alcor in particular, is not
against regulation. It is merely against being regulated out of
business, which is, I hope you’ll agree, a perfectly reasonable
position.

I would urge you not to support HB 2637. Let Alcor, and any other
companies in Arizona that wish to do so, continue to operate what is a
wholly up-front, albeit admittedly controversial, service for those
individuals such as myself who make the conscious choice to undergo
cryonic suspension after death.

Thank you for your time.

Joseph Bloch

[Bruce Klein]

Dear [representative]

Thank you for taking the time to read my letter. My name is Chris Rasch. I have a B.S. degree in biology from Stanford University, and I worked for several years in organ banking research, first at the Naval Medical Research Institute in Bethesda, MD and then for 21st Century Medicine, a biotech startup outside of Los Angeles. Throughout that time, I did research into the long term, low temperature storage of whole organs, such as the liver, kidney, and heart. (I'm no longer doing research, but I still follow the field closely).

I'm writing to express my strong opposition to HB 2637, which was recently introduced by Representative Robert Stump. This bill appears to be intended to specifically bring the Alcor Life Extension Foundation, a cryonics firm based in Scottsdale, AZ, under the regulatory control of the Funeral and Embalmer's Board, and to strip Alcor of the protections of the Uniform Anatomical Gift Act (which is the regulatory apparatus under which cryonics patients are currently governed).

HB 2637, if passed in its current form, will have several severe negative consequences for both Alcor and for the citizens of Arizona. Some of the most important consequences are as follows:

* Alcor's goal is to cryopreserve human patients in the best manner possible, in the hopes that future technology will be able to revive them. Cryonics companies use similar techniques to those used for organ transplantation and storage. Such techniques, at the highest level of care, require training and equipment as sophisticated as that required by transplant surgeons.

Embalmers, on the other hand, are primarily concerned with preserving the cosmetic appearance of life for a few days until a funeral can be performed. Embalming requires very different chemicals, tools, techniques, and standards of care from those required by cryonics patients. No attempt is made to preserve the tissue for future revival, and embalming procedures, by design, result in the immediate death of any living tissue that might remain.

Given the vastly differing requirements, the Embalming and Funeral Board is just as inappropriate a regulatory body for cryonics companies as it would be for transplant surgeons.





* New technologies often raise novel regulatory issues, and it's important that new regulations be carefully crafted to avoid stifling innovation. Ideally, all parties most affected by new legislation will be consulted. Unfortunately, although the apparent target of HB 2637, Alcor was not notified of stakeholder meetings, nor had any input into the drafting of this amendment.

Many of Alcor's members are scientists, doctors, programmers, engineers, and are graduates of top research universities (Caltech, MIT, Stanford, etc.) Many members work for biotech or high-tech companies. When considering whether or not to locate in Arizona, these companies are going to carefully examine how the Arizona legislature reacts when new technologies are introduced. If they see that new regulations are applied inappropriately and without consultation of the regulated companies, they will be less likely to locate to Arizona.

* Although Alcor promises to do the best they can to revive their patients, everyone who signs up for cryopreservation (or their legal guardians) must read and sign detailed documents that explain the risks involved, and make it very clear that there is no guarantee that any patient will ever be revived.

Alcor abides by all state and federal regulations governing research facilities, and has successfully passed all inspections by OSHA, USDA, EPA, and other regulatory bodies. No complaints have ever been raised by Alcor's neighbors, nor does Alcor impose risks on the community any greater than those imposed by other biomedical research facilities. Alcor is very open about their procedures (consistent with maintaining the privacy of its members), and I'm sure Alcor staff would be happy to provide a tour of the facility to any legislator with any remaining concerns.

Since Alcor patients voluntarily and with informed consent take upon themselves the risks involved, and since Alcor poses no special risks to the community, there is no pressing public need that would demand the hasty implementation of flawed regulation.

In closing, cryonics is still a very experimental procedure and to implement inappropriate regulations prematurely may do more harm than good. HB 2637 would severely harm Alcor's present and future patients, give pause to bio/high-tech companies considering locating in Arizona, and would limit the fundamental freedom of Arizona citizens to determine what will be done with their own bodies. Therefore, I would encourage you to vote no on HB 2637, and postpone future regulations until it is clearly demonstrated that such regulations are warranted.

Thanks again for taking the time to read my letter. If you have any further questions, please do not hesitate to call me at (919) 395 0856, or email me at crasch@openknowledge.org.

Respectfully yours,

Christopher M. Rasch

[Bruce Klein]

EMAIL - From David (former Alcor VP) & Trudy Pizer to AZ Reps.

Dear ____

We are writing to ask you to put a stop to HB 2637 for the following reasons:

1. It will cause problems, not solve them. To date, there has not been even one complaint by an Arizona resident of any nature, about the way his or her relatives or loved ones were treated by the cryonics industry in this state. This is true, even though cryonics was originally started in Arizona (and a few other states) and the first person ever frozen was stored here almost 40 years ago. (He is still here, by the way, and in the same good shape he was in when first placed in cryonic suspension, with no damage over the 40 year haul). The first capsules to store patients were made in Arizona about 40 years ago.

The way HB 2637 is worded, it will cause problems by forcing the Arizona cryonics service providers to have to "dumb-down" the way they presently do cryonics. The service providers will have to replace highly trained medical personnel with embalmers or their trainees, cutting edge procedures that keep cells alive with stone age procedures that cause cells to die.

2. The purposes of cryonics are 180 degrees opposite to the purposes of funeral service providers. We can't think of any other type of service that is more opposite to cryonics than the funeral industry. Funeral service providers help provide their customers with a permanent end to life. They take steps to insure that legally dead bodies, that still contain some living cells, continue the dying process so that those individual cells will continue to die, until such a time that all the cells in the body are dead and have rotted away.

Cryonics service providers, on the other hand, take steps to insure that legally dead bodies, full of living cells, stay that way. The practices of cryonics keep the cells alive, at liquid nitrogen temperatures they can be kept alive for centuries. The practice of mortuary science causes the cells to die. Forcing cryonics service providers to adopt funeral standards would force cryonics to do the opposite of what it intends to do. You would be forcing the very problems into the cryonics industry that you are trying to avoid by forcing cell-killing techniques to be used in an industry who's goal is to keep cells alive.

Please respect our rights as citizens of Arizona to have the cryonics process that we opt for to be done in the best possible manner, and HB 2637 does just the opposite of this. Please don't legislate incompetence and mediocrity on us. This is a very complicated practice that deserves better than to be shuffled into the closest pigeon hole. Cryonics is concerned with trying to save the lives of people, our mothers and fathers, our siblings and our children. We can understand how cryonics might be hard to understand with only the brief exposure you probably have had to it. Please allow us more time to bring you up to speed to the very complicated science of cryonics and cryobiology.

In conclusion:
1. The default position should be that if you don't completely understand HB 2637 and what the ramifications of it are, then don't let it become law.

2. I can see no compelling reason, no urgency, why a bad bill like this should be rushed into law, when taking time to better understand this new science would help you to write a truly good law, instead.

Thank you.

David & Trudy Pizer
(We have lived here in Arizona for over 60 years).


David Pizer

[Bruce Klein]

Mar 14 @ 8 PM Eastern - Alcor & AZ Cryonics Regulation
ImmInst members discuss HB 2637 & Alcor's

Chat Room: http://www.imminst.org/chat

TOPIC MOVED HERE:
http://www.imminst.o...st=0#entry27997

[thefirstimmortal]

Any from Alcor gonna show