34 replies to this topic

[Reeve Treaty]

If you look hard enough, there is already research and experiments proving that the human mind goes far beyond the mere limits of being a simple organ like the brain. There are Qigong masters who can produce intense heat and electricity with their chi, and even affect other people's bodies with their thoughts. There are casinos who actually have a rule about kicking people out of the building for hovering their hands next to the slot machines because genuine psychics have been known to occasionally come in and "feel" which machines are ready to pay out. There are experiments where people in completely isolated rooms affect each others dreams based on what they are thinking at the time. There are experiments that prove people can react to burns faster than electrical signals travel to the brain and back. There are experiments that prove molecules and atoms change their pattern of behavior based on the emotions and personality of the people near them or observing them. There are a million people who will tell you that sometimes they know who is going to call them on their cell phone before it starts ringing. Seriously, this isn't just religion or superstition anymore. This is reality. There are people trying to form actual scientific theories to explain the handful of genuine supernatural phenomena. My favorite is the theory of extra-dimensional consciousness. It goes like this: The mind/soul exists on a wider set of dimensions than the four which our physical body is limited to, and the soul/mind is attached or anchored to the human body by the attractive energy constantly flowing through the nervous system and brain. People who discover and practice supernatural abilities such as precognition or pyrokinesis are expanding and exploring capabilities of their consciousness and its connection to the physical dimensions which have otherwise been largely ignored and dormant in most other human beings.

So basically what I'm saying is this: As far as I'm concerned, you don't have a soul, You ARE a soul. And if the soul/mind exists on more dimensions than those of space and time, then I assume it doesn't have an expiration date like our petty bodies do. I assume we reincarnate and our instincts evolve with each lifetime based on our experiences just as organisms evolve with each generation. That might also explain why instincts change just as fast as our bodies do during a sudden evolutionary leap when our environment so drastically shifts. Anyway, its time to face the truth Immortality Institute. You are not bodies. You are minds. The mind goes beyond the body. Therefore you are already immortal. PLEASE go do something more productive for humanity. Your brilliant minds are far above this pathetic and foolish dream of organic immortality. Seriously, what the $%&#? Go look at the research. Its all out there if you look hard enough. There IS genuine supernatural phenomena out there. Its not dogma anymore. Wake up! Look within! Do whatever you need to do to realize your current dream is both impossible and ridiculous. If you are really interested in immortality, then go read a book called, "The Holographic Universe." Go search for, research, and study genuine accounts of the afterlife and past lives. Seriously, stop playing doctor and start being a TRUE modern and revolutionary intellectual. We don't have time for stuff like Immortality Institutes, Religions, Scientific Dogma, and all these Bullshit Cults anymore. We need truth. We need enlightenment. So go get it already. Before your time in this particular lifetime runs out. And believe me, it will.

[Ayron Elijah]

If you look hard enough, there is already research and experiments proving that the human mind goes far beyond the mere limits of being a simple organ like the brain. There are Qigong masters who can produce intense heat and electricity with their chi, and even affect other people's bodies with their thoughts. There are casinos who actually have a rule about kicking people out of the building for hovering their hands next to the slot machines because genuine psychics have been known to occasionally come in and "feel" which machines are ready to pay out. There are experiments where people in completely isolated rooms affect each others dreams based on what they are thinking at the time. There are experiments that prove people can react to burns faster than electrical signals travel to the brain and back. There are experiments that prove molecules and atoms change their pattern of behavior based on the emotions and personality of the people near them or observing them. There are a million people who will tell you that sometimes they know who is going to call them on their cell phone before it starts ringing. Seriously, this isn't just religion or superstition anymore. This is reality. There are people trying to form actual scientific theories to explain the handful of genuine supernatural phenomena. My favorite is the theory of extra-dimensional consciousness. It goes like this: The mind/soul exists on a wider set of dimensions than the four which our physical body is limited to, and the soul/mind is attached or anchored to the human body by the attractive energy constantly flowing through the nervous system and brain. People who discover and practice supernatural abilities such as precognition or pyrokinesis are expanding and exploring capabilities of their consciousness and its connection to the physical dimensions which have otherwise been largely ignored and dormant in most other human beings.

So basically what I'm saying is this: As far as I'm concerned, you don't have a soul, You ARE a soul. And if the soul/mind exists on more dimensions than those of space and time, then I assume it doesn't have an expiration date like our petty bodies do. I assume we reincarnate and our instincts evolve with each lifetime based on our experiences just as organisms evolve with each generation. That might also explain why instincts change just as fast as our bodies do during a sudden evolutionary leap when our environment so drastically shifts. Anyway, its time to face the truth Immortality Institute. You are not bodies. You are minds. The mind goes beyond the body. Therefore you are already immortal. PLEASE go do something more productive for humanity. Your brilliant minds are far above this pathetic and foolish dream of organic immortality. Seriously, what the $%&#? Go look at the research. Its all out there if you look hard enough. There IS genuine supernatural phenomena out there. Its not dogma anymore. Wake up! Look within! Do whatever you need to do to realize your current dream is both impossible and ridiculous. If you are really interested in immortality, then go read a book called, "The Holographic Universe." Go search for, research, and study genuine accounts of the afterlife and past lives. Seriously, stop playing doctor and start being a TRUE modern and revolutionary intellectual. We don't have time for stuff like Immortality Institutes, Religions, Scientific Dogma, and all these Bullshit Cults anymore. We need truth. We need enlightenment. So go get it already. Before your time in this particular lifetime runs out. And believe me, it will.

There's quite a few assumptions in what you are saying, for instance you assume that we don't have an expiration date, you assume that we are reincarnated and our instincts evolve.
Having an institute that is researching into how we as humans can achieve immortality is a noble goal. It's a real pity and a sin if we were born just to live for 80 years and then just die. The time period in our human history which we call the enlightenment (1600's - 1800's) was a period in time when we took huge steps in adavancing science and technology. And it took 200 years for us to lay the foundations for the current generation. 200 years is a long time and during that time we have seen great inventors, artists, visionaries and leaders come and go. Imagine, if immortality was available to Leonardo da Vinci, what our world would be like now. He was an inventor, artist, visionary and all round genius. Life for humans would be so much better. Now that he is dead, there's not much that he can do for us. Same for Einstein and all the great scientists and inventors of our time. If we want truth and enlightenment it's going to take a long time to achieve it, and when it is achieved, you and I wouldn't be around to appreciate it if immortality is not achieved by then. Immortality isn't an impossible concept anymore, and I'm quite sure that even you would be tempted by the chance to be immortal, and the only reason for that I feel would be because of uncertainty. We can't be sure that there is an afterlife or if we would be reincarnated afterwards.

[Esoparagon]

Oh my Satan...

[Logan]

If you look hard enough, there is already research and experiments proving that the human mind goes far beyond the mere limits of being a simple organ like the brain. There are Qigong masters who can produce intense heat and electricity with their chi, and even affect other people's bodies with their thoughts. There are casinos who actually have a rule about kicking people out of the building for hovering their hands next to the slot machines because genuine psychics have been known to occasionally come in and "feel" which machines are ready to pay out. There are experiments where people in completely isolated rooms affect each others dreams based on what they are thinking at the time. There are experiments that prove people can react to burns faster than electrical signals travel to the brain and back. There are experiments that prove molecules and atoms change their pattern of behavior based on the emotions and personality of the people near them or observing them. There are a million people who will tell you that sometimes they know who is going to call them on their cell phone before it starts ringing. Seriously, this isn't just religion or superstition anymore. This is reality. There are people trying to form actual scientific theories to explain the handful of genuine supernatural phenomena. My favorite is the theory of extra-dimensional consciousness. It goes like this: The mind/soul exists on a wider set of dimensions than the four which our physical body is limited to, and the soul/mind is attached or anchored to the human body by the attractive energy constantly flowing through the nervous system and brain. People who discover and practice supernatural abilities such as precognition or pyrokinesis are expanding and exploring capabilities of their consciousness and its connection to the physical dimensions which have otherwise been largely ignored and dormant in most other human beings.

So basically what I'm saying is this: As far as I'm concerned, you don't have a soul, You ARE a soul. And if the soul/mind exists on more dimensions than those of space and time, then I assume it doesn't have an expiration date like our petty bodies do. I assume we reincarnate and our instincts evolve with each lifetime based on our experiences just as organisms evolve with each generation. That might also explain why instincts change just as fast as our bodies do during a sudden evolutionary leap when our environment so drastically shifts. Anyway, its time to face the truth Immortality Institute. You are not bodies. You are minds. The mind goes beyond the body. Therefore you are already immortal. PLEASE go do something more productive for humanity. Your brilliant minds are far above this pathetic and foolish dream of organic immortality. Seriously, what the $%&#? Go look at the research. Its all out there if you look hard enough. There IS genuine supernatural phenomena out there. Its not dogma anymore. Wake up! Look within! Do whatever you need to do to realize your current dream is both impossible and ridiculous. If you are really interested in immortality, then go read a book called, "The Holographic Universe." Go search for, research, and study genuine accounts of the afterlife and past lives. Seriously, stop playing doctor and start being a TRUE modern and revolutionary intellectual. We don't have time for stuff like Immortality Institutes, Religions, Scientific Dogma, and all these Bullshit Cults anymore. We need truth. We need enlightenment. So go get it already. Before your time in this particular lifetime runs out. And believe me, it will.

Where is the evidence of supernatural phenomena? I am talking about legitimate evidence not some white area on a photograph.

Why would you have a problem with extending life since the goal of extending life would require eliminating diseases that cause suffering?

You may be right that we will never be able to be immortal in this organic form. You can't deny though that at some point the human race will figure out how to extend life and youth for a very very long time.

I think you will find that many believe that we as humans can do more with our minds than what we typically consider to be normal. Yes, maybe there is a possibility that paranormal activity exists within the boundaries of new scientific theories.
I do not see how it is possible to prove that our conscious mind will exist beyond this life. We developed that mind, it was not just planted inside of us by some god. Just look at how a child develops from day one.

So if we have a soul and our mind is part of it, does this mean that we take our intelligence with us after we die. Or, are we just in a state of forever bliss, minus any real ability to think deeply? Or, do we travel back to earth, another planet, or another dimension where our soul takes on another life in a new body?

Can you answer all of these questions with all of the scientific evidence that you say exists?

[rollo]

If you look hard enough, there is already research and experiments proving that the human mind goes far beyond the mere limits of being a simple organ like the brain. There are Qigong masters who can produce intense heat and electricity with their chi, and even affect other people's bodies with their thoughts. There are casinos who actually have a rule about kicking people out of the building for hovering their hands next to the slot machines because genuine psychics have been known to occasionally come in and "feel" which machines are ready to pay out. There are experiments where people in completely isolated rooms affect each others dreams based on what they are thinking at the time. There are experiments that prove people can react to burns faster than electrical signals travel to the brain and back. There are experiments that prove molecules and atoms change their pattern of behavior based on the emotions and personality of the people near them or observing them. There are a million people who will tell you that sometimes they know who is going to call them on their cell phone before it starts ringing. Seriously, this isn't just religion or superstition anymore. This is reality. There are people trying to form actual scientific theories to explain the handful of genuine supernatural phenomena. My favorite is the theory of extra-dimensional consciousness. It goes like this: The mind/soul exists on a wider set of dimensions than the four which our physical body is limited to, and the soul/mind is attached or anchored to the human body by the attractive energy constantly flowing through the nervous system and brain. People who discover and practice supernatural abilities such as precognition or pyrokinesis are expanding and exploring capabilities of their consciousness and its connection to the physical dimensions which have otherwise been largely ignored and dormant in most other human beings.

So basically what I'm saying is this: As far as I'm concerned, you don't have a soul, You ARE a soul. And if the soul/mind exists on more dimensions than those of space and time, then I assume it doesn't have an expiration date like our petty bodies do. I assume we reincarnate and our instincts evolve with each lifetime based on our experiences just as organisms evolve with each generation. That might also explain why instincts change just as fast as our bodies do during a sudden evolutionary leap when our environment so drastically shifts. Anyway, its time to face the truth Immortality Institute. You are not bodies. You are minds. The mind goes beyond the body. Therefore you are already immortal. PLEASE go do something more productive for humanity. Your brilliant minds are far above this pathetic and foolish dream of organic immortality. Seriously, what the $%&#? Go look at the research. Its all out there if you look hard enough. There IS genuine supernatural phenomena out there. Its not dogma anymore. Wake up! Look within! Do whatever you need to do to realize your current dream is both impossible and ridiculous. If you are really interested in immortality, then go read a book called, "The Holographic Universe." Go search for, research, and study genuine accounts of the afterlife and past lives. Seriously, stop playing doctor and start being a TRUE modern and revolutionary intellectual. We don't have time for stuff like Immortality Institutes, Religions, Scientific Dogma, and all these Bullshit Cults anymore. We need truth. We need enlightenment. So go get it already. Before your time in this particular lifetime runs out. And believe me, it will.

I hear you bro. Not saying that I agree with everything that you're saying but I like your train of thought and at least you're thinking out of the box.

I fear your thoughts are too abstract for this forum. People here are all about powders and pills; everything in their world is tangible. I remember reading a thread on here where people talking about how jelous they get when they see a young person because this young person will live longer than they, it was very scary.

Good luck.

[castrensis]

There are Qigong masters who can produce intense heat and electricity with their chi, and even affect other people's bodies with their thoughts.

Source? All that I've ever seen to confirm these powerful abilities are presentations on stage. Prestidigitation isn't proof of the paranormal, just as John Edward's cold reading doesn't prove the existence of an afterlife.

There are casinos who actually have a rule about kicking people out of the building for hovering their hands next to the slot machines because genuine psychics have been known to occasionally come in and "feel" which machines are ready to pay out.

& there are people who avoid walking under ladders or opening umbrellas inside, just because people believe in superstitious nonsense & act on that belief doesn't mean that it is proof positive of the paranormal. Plus, if we're a soul in a body why the heck would a "genuine psychic" need to use a hovering hand? Shouldn't they have some lovecraftian spirit tentacles that could snake out to all the machines & pinpoint the one that'll win? After all, the physical world is merely an illusion, right? What's distance to the infinite power of the spirit?

There are experiments where people in completely isolated rooms affect each others dreams based on what they are thinking at the time.

Cite your sources, please! This smells like bullshit & I'd need a big can of Scientific Method™ Institutional Air Freshener to clear the smell out of the room.

There are experiments that prove people can react to burns faster than electrical signals travel to the brain and back.

This is called Reflex Arc, specifically the withdrawal reflex, & doesn't require a signal to travel to the brain. The signals are transmitted directly the spinal cord & initiates a reaction without sending the message to the brain.

There are experiments that prove molecules and atoms change their pattern of behavior based on the emotions and personality of the people near them or observing them.

You're referring to the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle, which states that we cannot know both the position & the velocity of a microscopic particle at the same time. If we try to measure the position then we can't measure the velocity. If we try to measure the velocity then we can't measure the position. This is a curious phenomenon because it appears to demonstrate that physical properties of microscopic particles are depend on our perception of those molecules. However, too many self-ordained gurus take this to mean that "perception is reality" & that if we believe hard enough then actual physical reality will change - something akin to magic, but dressed up in a lab coat. The obvious proof against this ridiculous assertion is the patient with psychotic symptoms &/or strong delusions who actually believe that they are god or that they can fly or that there are spiders on the wall, &c. People who believe they can fly & jump off buildings turn all ruby-red & confetti-like on impact just as effectively as those who don't.

There are a million people who will tell you that sometimes they know who is going to call them on their cell phone before it starts ringing.

& I'm sure there just as many old ladies in bingo halls across the nation that believe that ringing a bell & rubbing their troll doll's belly gets them the winning number. This is a result of confirmation bias. Please read. You may learn something other than fairy tales & superstition. & hell, who needs this psychic power when you have caller ID?

Seriously, this isn't just religion or superstition anymore.

Oh, yes. Yes it is. Just because repeating "I think I can, I think I can" worked for the _Little Engine that Could_ doesn't mean it works in real life. It's time to put away childish things.

There are people trying to form actual scientific theories to explain the handful of genuine supernatural phenomena.

Right. Like intelligent design...which, oddly enough, isn't very intelligent.

My favorite is the theory of extra-dimensional consciousness. It goes like this: The mind/soul exists on a wider set of dimensions than the four which our physical body is limited to, and the soul/mind is attached or anchored to the human body by the attractive energy constantly flowing through the nervous system and brain. People who discover and practice supernatural abilities such as precognition or pyrokinesis are expanding and exploring capabilities of their consciousness and its connection to the physical dimensions which have otherwise been largely ignored and dormant in most other human beings.

WoooOOOOoooOOOooo! It's kinda like the theory that 75 million years ago Xenu, the dictator of the galactic confederacy, brought billions of people to earth & stacked them around volcanoes & then blew them up with hydrogen bombs. They're similar in that both have no evidence to validate them, they're different in that the scientologist Xenu myth is about 10^42 more crazy than your idea, but that's neither here nor there.

So basically what I'm saying is this: As far as I'm concerned, you don't have a soul, You ARE a soul. And if the soul/mind exists on more dimensions than those of space and time, then I assume it doesn't have an expiration date like our petty bodies do...Therefore you are already immortal. PLEASE go do something more productive for humanity. Before your time in this particular lifetime runs out. And believe me, it will.

So let me get this straight. Doing research & developing applied technologies to make people's lives better, decrease the crippling age-related diseases & helping to end aging-relating suffering isn't productive for humanity? & what is productive is hovering your hands over slot machines & honing your ability to blurt out who is calling you before your pick up the phone? Phew. I guess I need to get my priorities straight

[kismet]

Don't be so hard on him, Cast. If I've figured out one thing (and I've figured it out the hard way), it is not to mess with people who practise pyrokinesis. The day may come when he turns your home into a deadly inferno. If I were you, tonight I'd sleep close to the fire extinguisher.

Edited by kismet, 06 October 2009 - 08:40 PM.

[fatboy]

After several decades of introspection, in addition to compelling empirical evidence, I'm pretty sure that I am a body which happens to have a mind.

[hotamali]

After several decades of introspection, in addition to compelling empirical evidence, I'm pretty sure that I am a body which happens to have a mind.

Ditto.

[Owen Mac]

@Castrensis

Great reply!

[mdma]

PLEASE go do something more productive for humanity.

Yeah...often i just wake up and say to myself: Well, well...dont you think today would be a proper day to actually do something really great for humanity? Hmmmmm? And then, before i even have the chance to get going with my genius humanity saving plan, i have to shovel 25 min just to get in my car, im stuck 45 min in the traffic, so usually thats when i say ok humanity can wait i guessand then i go out and do nothing useful for humanity except this shitty reply of mine im sorry

Edited by mdma, 15 February 2010 - 03:47 AM.

[mentatpsi]

Castrensis, in regard to your response of it being the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle, I believe he's more referring to "What the bleep do we know" advertised in regards to the structure of water crystals based on the emotion of the words uttered [Source].

Anyways, Reeves, you're just arguing for dualism which has its own extent of errors. To me it is more along the lines that there is no manner of proving it empirically. As you are demonstrating yourself, all one has are thought experiments. Even if the Qi Gong masters can control processes that normal people can't, it doesn't demonstrate a complete abortion of science or monism/materialism, but rather a facet we haven't looked at. There are some experiments showing an increase of certain brain activity at the moment of these "acts". Look up 40 hz for instance, also on youtube. So even then one can localize these abilities to the brain. There in lies the issue with dualism. What you have demonstrated, however, is the ability to use willpower to control what are usually background processes, which don't get me wrong, is still interesting.

[SpawnMoreOverlords]

I've seen some references to the phenomena of emotions of nearby persons affecting water-crystal patterns as well a while ago in the russian literature. merely skimmed hence I'm so vague.

Also what about subsets of the human population who pretty much devote their entire lives to training of the mind, such as yogi and Zen monks ? Some of them are truly extraordinary. Was recently listening to the first part of "Science of Enlightenment" audiobook by Shinzen Young(in fact had re-listened about 5-6 just to integrate it fully). The guy is a beast by the way... PhD in Buddhist Studies, master of 3 Buddhist disciplines(lived in Japan/China) and also a Mathematician and a Physicist. A truly fascinating listen by the way, very down to earth yet profound at the same time + cool mathematical analogies as a bonus lol. Anyway at some point(on CD1) he talks about about how being in the meditative state(not only when sitting with your legs crossed as it is portrayed in the mass media, but after enough training to be able to maintain it in day-to-day activities) reduces your metabolic needs(oxygen hunger especially) - in a medium state they only breathe just 3-4 times a minute, in deep one it seems as one does not breathe at all. He mentions this very outstanding character at the chinese buddhist temple he lived that, this really eccentric guy(cant get a proper grasp on his name from audo) who apparently rode a motorcycle, which is unheard of chinese buddhist monks but also was a real master among them. When he got back from his doctor appointment he joked that he shouldn't be alive at all according to his doctor, his vital signs(frequency of breathing and heartbeat) were almost non-existant compared a normal person. Few are at his level though, apparently he never slept - lied down for 4 hours a day instead and managed to maintain deep meditative state permanently. He(Shinzen) also did some studies one of the US universities he collaborated at, on empirically measuring the states of meditation, essentially quantifying some parts of the whole experience, I should look into that.

Edited by SpawnMoreOverlords, 20 February 2010 - 08:26 PM.

[mentatpsi]

Interesting,

I've a blog entry on meditation with references and the like if you're interested:

Ripples from the Botanical Garden: Meditation Entry

[russianBEAR]

If you look hard enough, there is already research and experiments proving that the human mind goes far beyond the mere limits of being a simple organ like the brain. There are Qigong masters who can produce intense heat and electricity with their chi, and even affect other people's bodies with their thoughts. There are casinos who actually have a rule about kicking people out of the building for hovering their hands next to the slot machines because genuine psychics have been known to occasionally come in and "feel" which machines are ready to pay out. There are experiments where people in completely isolated rooms affect each others dreams based on what they are thinking at the time. There are experiments that prove people can react to burns faster than electrical signals travel to the brain and back. There are experiments that prove molecules and atoms change their pattern of behavior based on the emotions and personality of the people near them or observing them. There are a million people who will tell you that sometimes they know who is going to call them on their cell phone before it starts ringing. Seriously, this isn't just religion or superstition anymore. This is reality. There are people trying to form actual scientific theories to explain the handful of genuine supernatural phenomena. My favorite is the theory of extra-dimensional consciousness. It goes like this: The mind/soul exists on a wider set of dimensions than the four which our physical body is limited to, and the soul/mind is attached or anchored to the human body by the attractive energy constantly flowing through the nervous system and brain. People who discover and practice supernatural abilities such as precognition or pyrokinesis are expanding and exploring capabilities of their consciousness and its connection to the physical dimensions which have otherwise been largely ignored and dormant in most other human beings.

So basically what I'm saying is this: As far as I'm concerned, you don't have a soul, You ARE a soul. And if the soul/mind exists on more dimensions than those of space and time, then I assume it doesn't have an expiration date like our petty bodies do. I assume we reincarnate and our instincts evolve with each lifetime based on our experiences just as organisms evolve with each generation. That might also explain why instincts change just as fast as our bodies do during a sudden evolutionary leap when our environment so drastically shifts. Anyway, its time to face the truth Immortality Institute. You are not bodies. You are minds. The mind goes beyond the body. Therefore you are already immortal. PLEASE go do something more productive for humanity. Your brilliant minds are far above this pathetic and foolish dream of organic immortality. Seriously, what the $%&#? Go look at the research. Its all out there if you look hard enough. There IS genuine supernatural phenomena out there. Its not dogma anymore. Wake up! Look within! Do whatever you need to do to realize your current dream is both impossible and ridiculous. If you are really interested in immortality, then go read a book called, "The Holographic Universe." Go search for, research, and study genuine accounts of the afterlife and past lives. Seriously, stop playing doctor and start being a TRUE modern and revolutionary intellectual. We don't have time for stuff like Immortality Institutes, Religions, Scientific Dogma, and all these Bullshit Cults anymore. We need truth. We need enlightenment. So go get it already. Before your time in this particular lifetime runs out. And believe me, it will.

Yeah I get what you're talking about sometimes, like with the cell phone, or anticipating a situation right before it happens, etc...started happening to me after extensive psychedelic use, but it's hard to discern between your assumptions and you thinkin you're anticipating something, and the real thing...The real thing always sneaks up on you...

Gotta watch out for those chi masters in a dark alley though, they'll really light you up haha.

[ramon25]

You cannot separate your mind from your body nor you body from your mind. they entangled to a point beyond distinction. The Ideas that the original poster is referring to have quite a bit of backing by a lot of physicist. Does that mean they are all right? No. It does mean that at the very least many at the forefront of physics believe its possible or true. Many are unaware of the fact but PSI abilities have been PROVEN to exist beyond doubt. Also castrensis, I think you have good BOOK knowledge on physics but bad Interpretation. He was referring to the Observer Effect not the uncertainty principle. On that note an insane person has no control over there own mind let alone the particles which create reality. Does that automatically mean that A person under certain circumstances cannot alter the fabric of reality? No and really I there is no law in quantum mechanics which prohibits it either (does not mean that you CAN do it either.) Physics are black and white, if there is no law against it then there is a possibility. Too much materialistic reductionist philosophy here and thought process. That is not a statement to induce a blind hysteria of abstract non linear thought. But is anything proven by physics or biology is that you cannot separate mind and matter.

Edited by ramon25, 24 March 2010 - 06:15 PM.

[shifter]

Yes, I want to know why it is if I think of the most random 'The Simpsons' episode for no reason, THAT EPISODE COMES ON TV THAT NIGHT. (and I dont read tv guides or anything that could have given me any clue). And I know I am not the only person this happens to.

[full_circle]

there is this very unscientific-sound scientific phenomenon called quantum entanglement (if you never heard of it, plz look it up. it is worth of your time)
and yes, i believe there is this mysterious connection between all of us.
the universe is stranger than our imagination.

* btw i would choose the word "will" in place of "mind".

Edited by full_circle, 24 March 2010 - 11:25 PM.

[spaceistheplace]

[Connor MacLeod]

I've a blog entry on meditation with references and the like if you're interested:

Ripples from the Botanical Garden: Meditation Entry

For many centuries the gnostic and agnostic man alike have found shelter from chaos in the embrace of a constant hum.

Om Mani Padme Hum

[phetryamine]

If you look hard enough, there is already research and experiments proving that the human mind goes far beyond the mere limits of being a simple organ like the brain. There are Qigong masters who can produce intense heat and electricity with their chi, and even affect other people's bodies with their thoughts. There are casinos who actually have a rule about kicking people out of the building for hovering their hands next to the slot machines because genuine psychics have been known to occasionally come in and "feel" which machines are ready to pay out. There are experiments where people in completely isolated rooms affect each others dreams based on what they are thinking at the time. There are experiments that prove people can react to burns faster than electrical signals travel to the brain and back. There are experiments that prove molecules and atoms change their pattern of behavior based on the emotions and personality of the people near them or observing them. There are a million people who will tell you that sometimes they know who is going to call them on their cell phone before it starts ringing. Seriously, this isn't just religion or superstition anymore. This is reality. There are people trying to form actual scientific theories to explain the handful of genuine supernatural phenomena. My favorite is the theory of extra-dimensional consciousness. It goes like this: The mind/soul exists on a wider set of dimensions than the four which our physical body is limited to, and the soul/mind is attached or anchored to the human body by the attractive energy constantly flowing through the nervous system and brain. People who discover and practice supernatural abilities such as precognition or pyrokinesis are expanding and exploring capabilities of their consciousness and its connection to the physical dimensions which have otherwise been largely ignored and dormant in most other human beings.

So basically what I'm saying is this: As far as I'm concerned, you don't have a soul, You ARE a soul. And if the soul/mind exists on more dimensions than those of space and time, then I assume it doesn't have an expiration date like our petty bodies do. I assume we reincarnate and our instincts evolve with each lifetime based on our experiences just as organisms evolve with each generation. That might also explain why instincts change just as fast as our bodies do during a sudden evolutionary leap when our environment so drastically shifts. Anyway, its time to face the truth Immortality Institute. You are not bodies. You are minds. The mind goes beyond the body. Therefore you are already immortal. PLEASE go do something more productive for humanity. Your brilliant minds are far above this pathetic and foolish dream of organic immortality. Seriously, what the $%&#? Go look at the research. Its all out there if you look hard enough. There IS genuine supernatural phenomena out there. Its not dogma anymore. Wake up! Look within! Do whatever you need to do to realize your current dream is both impossible and ridiculous. If you are really interested in immortality, then go read a book called, "The Holographic Universe." Go search for, research, and study genuine accounts of the afterlife and past lives. Seriously, stop playing doctor and start being a TRUE modern and revolutionary intellectual. We don't have time for stuff like Immortality Institutes, Religions, Scientific Dogma, and all these Bullshit Cults anymore. We need truth. We need enlightenment. So go get it already. Before your time in this particular lifetime runs out. And believe me, it will.

Where is the evidence of supernatural phenomena? I am talking about legitimate evidence not some white area on a photograph.

Why would you have a problem with extending life since the goal of extending life would require eliminating diseases that cause suffering?

You may be right that we will never be able to be immortal in this organic form. You can't deny though that at some point the human race will figure out how to extend life and youth for a very very long time.

I think you will find that many believe that we as humans can do more with our minds than what we typically consider to be normal. Yes, maybe there is a possibility that paranormal activity exists within the boundaries of new scientific theories.
I do not see how it is possible to prove that our conscious mind will exist beyond this life. We developed that mind, it was not just planted inside of us by some god. Just look at how a child develops from day one.

So if we have a soul and our mind is part of it, does this mean that we take our intelligence with us after we die. Or, are we just in a state of forever bliss, minus any real ability to think deeply? Or, do we travel back to earth, another planet, or another dimension where our soul takes on another life in a new body?

When we die we are the same person minus the physical body, but we still have an emotional (called sometimes astral) and a mental body. The emotional also dies when its desires have lost its energy, and then we live a period of time in the mental levels but this also disintegrates before the atraction of the physical plane bring us back into incarnation again, and we are born without remenbering what happened (because the memory is lost with the death of the emotional an mental bodies) but we are the same individualities.

I think we should seek to extend the time we live on the physical plane, but we are born with a time limit (just like we need to sleep after 16-18 hours), i think the natural lenght of a life is betwen 82-110 years (but this is very individual), but most of the people die before the natural time because they misuse the body.

The reason that we need to die is to have an oportunity to get rid of negative emotional reactions and mental fictions, it is just a clean up of of the contens of the consciousnes. We do this every night but it is only a partial clean up, esotericaly they call sleep "the little death" the only diference is that we are able to return to the same physical body after sleep.

[phetryamine]

There are Qigong masters who can produce intense heat and electricity with their chi, and even affect other people's bodies with their thoughts.

Source? All that I've ever seen to confirm these powerful abilities are presentations on stage. Prestidigitation isn't proof of the paranormal, just as John Edward's cold reading doesn't prove the existence of an afterlife.

http://www.ncbi.nlm..../pubmed/1353653

[Alex Libman]

The human mind is in possession of the body, and if multiple minds share a body then they share ownership of it proportionally to their intelligence, like shares in the corporation.

Edited by Alex Libman, 28 April 2010 - 09:01 AM.

[chrwe]

If the assumption of this thread were correct, please explain to me where the consciousness goes for people with severe dementia and/or brain damage

[Kolos]

Anyway isn't freedom from this never ending cycle of death and rebirth considered something possitive in eastern religions?

[chrwe]

Anyway isn't freedom from this never ending cycle of death and rebirth considered something possitive in eastern religions?

True, but I believe they (depending on the particular religion) either want to merge with the supreme consciousness=god or just fade away forever. The ones actually wanting oblivion have always been a total mystery to me. I know I won`t manage to go gently into that good night....

Whereas you and I and most of us Immortalists would very much prefer to end the debate by just staying alive

Edited by chrwe, 28 April 2010 - 11:15 AM.

[phetryamine]

If the assumption of this thread were correct, please explain to me where the consciousness goes for people with severe dementia and/or brain damage

It does not go to another "place" it only have dificulty to make contact with the physical plane, because of damage to the part of the brain that makes contact posible.

[phetryamine]

Anyway isn't freedom from this never ending cycle of death and rebirth considered something possitive in eastern religions?

It is a misconception that we stop to incarnate, it is only that we can choose when and were to manifest (incarnate). It is when we have mastered the physical, emotional and mental planes of existence that we end the automatic cicle of incarnations (what bring us to incarnation again and again, are unfullfilled desires and plans), and whe are free to incarnate or to remain on "higher levels" of existence.

[phetryamine]

Anyway isn't freedom from this never ending cycle of death and rebirth considered something possitive in eastern religions?

It is a misconception that we stop to incarnate, it is only that we can choose when and were to manifest (incarnate). It is when we have mastered the physical, emotional and mental planes of existence that we end the automatic cicle of incarnations (what bring us to incarnation again and again, are unfullfilled desires and plans), and whe are free to incarnate or to remain on "higher levels" of existence.

[chrwe]

So let me make this even more difficult for you: There is a region in our brain called the hippocampus. There exists a poor guy whose hippocampus is completely destroyed. He cannot store any memory for more than a few seconds. But his consciousness remains intact, so he is "there". Unfortunately he is eternally living in the moment, forgetting everything about the past again and again (he has been making notes into his diary "now I am awake" again...and again...and again...). For such a consciousness, contact is obviously possible, right? But the person cannot live properly anymore since he cannot store memories. How would this work without a brain at all?