186 replies to this topic

[Mike M]

We all know the FDA is slow to actually move, even when the decision to move is made. Reminds me of the recent prohormone and 17a Hormone ban this year. We knew it was coming, but there was not imminent enough threat to actually stop producing. Then one day we woke up and it was over.

If I thought the FDA was planning on banning but had not yet made the step, I'd continue production. We have been suspecting the hormone ban in the bodybuilding community for over a year and even know which were to be banned. But as referenced it took a year to actually occur.

There are no such thing as legal hormones. People are just producing stuff till the FDA does something harsh enough to stop it. None of the hormones sold since the actual hormone ban back in the day have been legal. They are adultered drugs. People making them are just taking the crap shoot that they won't be the scape goat. One only has to look at the people that bought me out (1fast400/bulknutrition.com) to see what they can do. They raided those guys last year. Not over the stuff they made, but the stuff they sold. It has almost bankrupted the company in legal fee's fighting them. Realize, they weren't even manufacturing stuff. It's the same raid that went to bb.com.

The difference in this case is someone WANTS to make piracetam a drug here in the US. No company is attempting to turn these PH into scripts.

[synapse]

It's going to be a tough road getting piracetam alone to be a drug because there would be no patent protection. You might be able to get a specific use patent for let's say ADD or Alzheimer's or perhaps a new "medical condition", but the specific use patents can be relatively weak especially if the substance is readily available on the international market.

The FDA is going to have their hands full in the years to come due to the fact that many more new medicines will be hitting the international market coming from foreign biotechs, but their regulatory power may diminish as the market becomes more global in scope.

The US government will be scrambling to use any means possible to garner revenues and will likely continue to bow to their lobbyist supporters for desperate handouts. Companies, however, are the entities actually making money and if the US goes the direction of over taxation and over-regulation, companies will flee to more favorable conditions and the US govt. will be left bankrupt.

Edited by synapse, 30 August 2010 - 10:19 PM.

[health_nutty]

Ugh. Just when I was just figuring out my piracetam stack... :(

[kbtoy]

You are a supplier and stand to benefit from making up or exaggerating your story. You (and others) have often alluded to the risk of an imminent ban on piracetam, etc (IIRC) What is really going on? Why no official FDA statement?

Can you please post a scan of the letter?

Especially if his intention is to discontinue selling Piracetam anyway, it would be a great way to clear stock.

I don't understand this logic. Why would he want to discontinue one of his main products if hte FDA wasn't giving him crap about it? I'm gonna at least buy a half kg. And if it doesn't get banned big whoop I would have bought it eventually anyway. That way I'll be stocked up for a bit.

And yes I also believe the FDA is just a pawn for big Pharma. Oh let's ban piracetam b/c this drug company wants to make into a p[harmaceutical. I'm surprised they didn't try to ban Fish oil when they were making Lovaza. And it's done all in the guise of protecting the American people. What is the toxicity level of piracetam again? Oh yeah there is none. or so low as to be virtually nonexistant.

[Warrior]

We all know the FDA is slow to actually move, even when the decision to move is made. Reminds me of the recent prohormone and 17a Hormone ban this year. We knew it was coming, but there was not imminent enough threat to actually stop producing. Then one day we woke up and it was over.

If I thought the FDA was planning on banning but had not yet made the step, I'd continue production. We have been suspecting the hormone ban in the bodybuilding community for over a year and even know which were to be banned. But as referenced it took a year to actually occur.

There are no such thing as legal hormones. People are just producing stuff till the FDA does something harsh enough to stop it. None of the hormones sold since the actual hormone ban back in the day have been legal. They are adultered drugs. People making them are just taking the crap shoot that they won't be the scape goat. One only has to look at the people that bought me out (1fast400/bulknutrition.com) to see what they can do. They raided those guys last year. Not over the stuff they made, but the stuff they sold. It has almost bankrupted the company in legal fee's fighting them. Realize, they weren't even manufacturing stuff. It's the same raid that went to bb.com.

The difference in this case is someone WANTS to make piracetam a drug here in the US. No company is attempting to turn these PH into scripts.

a loophole but legal none the less. And a small alteration to structure has and does dramatically alter the effect. But I see your point.

[Mike M]

a loophole but legal none the less. And a small alteration to structure has and does dramatically alter the effect. But I see your point.

No the guys that make the stuff say there is a loophole when there isn't. There is nothing even close to being dshea compliant in regards to these hormones. Just how RPN got hit over Havoc, yet others that made it didn't. Just a matter of pot luck.

[synapse]

Big pharma and the AMA are consistently among the top lobbyist groups in the country. The laws of the FDA are up for sale. Get caught trying to sell heroine on the street and face years in jail. Spin opium into an oxycodone killer and make a billion dollar drug and become all the rage of wall street.

[Viscid]

Glad I stocked up early this year!

[nito]

Damn! Pira never worked for me anyway but i would like to try aniracetam. I' gonna have to stock up pretty quick!!

[synapse]

Soon even "thirst" will be a hot new medical condition, but the FDA won't let you drink water because there haven't been enough tests to show that water can treat it. Your doctor will prescribe something that looks and feels like water but has a big pharma stamp plastered on it.

[e Volution]

Soon even "thirst" will be a hot new medical condition, but the FDA won't let you drink water because there haven't been enough tests to show that water can treat it. Your doctor will prescribe something that looks and feels like water but has a big pharma stamp plastered on it.

Don't forget it will be less effective and have more side effects!

[synapse]

But of course... And God forbid it's natural and falling out of the sky!

[rwac]

Soon even "thirst" will be a hot new medical condition, but the FDA won't let you drink water because there haven't been enough tests to show that water can treat it. Your doctor will prescribe something that looks and feels like water but has a big pharma stamp plastered on it.

Brawndo, The Thirst Mutilator.

[John Barleycorn]

Piracetam is a derivative of the amino acid GABA and should not be considered a "drug".

A bit like GHB really. Actually, my forecast is that GABA itself may eventually receive unwelcome attention as a precursor.

Prescription-only piracetam isn't exactly "banned", but it's certainly a nanny-state gesture, and an inconsistent one at that. Welcome to what the rest of us are already enduring!

And for all of those dumping on Mike, you're looking just a little bit ignorant from where I sit ...

Edited by John Barleycorn, 31 August 2010 - 04:04 AM.

[Introspecta]

We should be thanking this guy for letting us know rather than being suspicious. I'm still hoping that this doesn't officially go down. Maybe they are making the threat to see how the people will respond. I don't know much about this stuff. What i do know is. I'm stocking up, and losing more, and more respect for my country each and every day. Hopefully within a year i will go all natural, and buy only organic foods and supplements, quit smoking and do nothing whatsover to help feed this shitty ass government money. All the problems in the world are from our governments greed. People dieing, poor, hunger, cancer cure(we know there is one), etc etc. Sorry for rambling but i'm pissed.

[NR2(x)]

Over here is New Zealand we have already banned GABA, crazy eh? By weight Im 2.5% a restricted class 2 drug, and not even high, lol. Im guessing the states will get similar treatment

[tlm884]

is shipping free on the piracetam or is the website just acting wonky?

[nito]

tml884 what website you using?

Edited by nito, 31 August 2010 - 07:25 AM.

[tlm884]

tml884 what website you using?

www.smartpowders.com. When I go to check out it calculates the shipping, gives me a choice, then doesn't apply it to the final cost.

[kbal]

Well, I think we all saw this coming. They only care about money. But do not worry, you will still be able to get piracetam from your local drug dealer, along with some crack and heroin.

I hope you will fight this Mike. More we let them get away with, easier it is for them. And further they will push :(

[Pike]

GABA? i thought piracetam was a derivative of pyroglutamic acid. well, that or their structures are remarkably similar.

either way, if this ban does actually go through, which it will in all likelihood, i'm grateful that you sold piracetam for so long to us nootropers.

[JLL]

Well this is only in the US so meh, there are plenty of European suppliers.

For how long?

Where are all the people now who still think FDA is a good organization? Kismet & niner, you still fans?

[Animal]

Well this is only in the US so meh, there are plenty of European suppliers.

For how long?

For as long as you want, I know of plenty of sites where you can acquire india/china manufactured Piracetam, albeit in capsule form.

If you really want it, piracetam will still be available, even if it's a bit more expensive.

There are plenty of FDA regulated substances still available in the rest of the world without prescription. It's not the crisis many of you are making it out to be, unless you live in the US of course.

[Introspecta]

Yeah going from paying 100 bucks for 3 kilos, to paying 20 bucks for 50 grams will suck. Shit my dosing on this stuff is about 12-20 grams a day. Doesn't work anymore in lower doses.

Edited by joelski28, 31 August 2010 - 02:49 PM.

[kbtoy]

Soon even "thirst" will be a hot new medical condition, but the FDA won't let you drink water because there haven't been enough tests to show that water can treat it. Your doctor will prescribe something that looks and feels like water but has a big pharma stamp plastered on it.

Brawndo, The Thirst Mutilator.

You beat me to it.
Brawndo it's got what plants crave.

Well this is only in the US so meh, there are plenty of European suppliers.

For how long?

For as long as you want, I know of plenty of sites where you can acquire india/china manufactured Piracetam, albeit in capsule form.

If you really want it, piracetam will still be available, even if it's a bit more expensive.

There are plenty of FDA regulated substances still available in the rest of the world without prescription. It's not the crisis many of you are making it out to be, unless you live in the US of course.

And that's really the issue at hand so why are you even commenting if you're not affected by this. It's bad enough that the euro is dominating the US dollar and then the price increase that's going to take place on top of that when and if the FDA bans piracetam will really make it unfeasible to continue to take pira. I'm taking upwards of 7grams a day of pira how much would that cost for pharmaceutical pira or even from a European source. My only other source would be to get it directly from China and then I have to wonder if I'm getting what I pay for and no way to test it.

[FunkOdyssey]

BTW, Kismet, Animal, whoever is else suspected Mike was lying about this, you are wrong. Other retailers of piracetam have received the same attention from the FDA recently on this matter. The era of easily obtained Piracetam in the United States is over.

[synapse]

Could you be more specific? What other retailers?

[FunkOdyssey]

Could you be more specific? What other retailers?

Actually I might be wrong about that. I knew I'd seen reports of this everywhere on the internet recently but when I just looked into it, it turns out to be Mike M posting the same thing on many different forums with different account names.

I'm still confident he's telling the truth but maybe this is not as widepsread as I thought.

Edited by FunkOdyssey, 31 August 2010 - 04:32 PM.

[synapse]

We have not received anything regarding piracetam at Cerebral Health (they have hounded us about marketing language but nothing on the racetams). Hopefully, a case can be made if it comes down to it regarding the amino acid connection and possible grandfather status.

[synapse]

Incidentally, I do think the FDA can be a force for good (despite my ramblings yesterday). I recently had to take an exam on sanitation as required by the state of florida. Our inspector has actually been pretty cool and has actually helped the business. In many cases, the regulators can help tighten things up a bit to improve quality standards and facility sanitation.