41 replies to this topic

[scottl]

"I am always amazed at the reasons my mind/ego will come up with to avoid this kind of exercise"

The mind...if one can...create an identity for it...HATES this kind of action. Why? Because the mind has an iron grip on our every action.

The mind is a very useful thing to have if one wishes to do one's taxes. But if one wishes to enjoy e.g. a sunset, the mind and its incessant thoughts is...in the way, a hinderance. Doing some kinds of meditation are the beginning of the end of the tyrany the mind has over us. And the mind at some level knows this.

There is more info about this here, and PSimon an exercise you may find more powerful then what you are presently doing. Try the exercise here for 4 or 5 minutes even once a day and compare the results to those you are presently getting.

http://www.thewayofs...meditation.html

This is what is imporatant--the results i.e. how your life changes or does not change as a result of doing the exercise. What you THINK of the exercise, the person who created it, the color of the web page, are all totall irelevant.

[geigertube]

[b]Tentative conclusion]

Unless some guys can show me how meditation has produced a better mouse trap,
Susma

Susma,


One way of looking at meditation is as a form of mental exercise. It's about developing a certain degree of control over your mind. Through it, you can develop more patience, and an enhanced ability to deal with stressful situations, where our minds are inclined to freak out and run away uncontrolled.

It's not going to make you get better scores on IQ test, or turn you into a buddha.

It is hard work, but so are most things worth doing.

Your Mileage May Vary,

Steven

[susmariosep]

Some qualifications.


ABout meditation, from what I have read about meditation as represented by that of religious schools such as Buddhism and those originating from gurus sourced from India, I don't think if any benefits it achieves, such benefits are not available more easily, faster, and even of more lasting duration in learning how to relax in body, heart, and mind, like for example lying comfortably in bed, or doing a car wash and waxing, or taking up some one player game like playing tennis by oneself against the wall, or visiting the museum, strolling in the park.

About the intake of drugs for enhancing mental and emotional functions and moods, I tend to agree that there are relevant ones, which work on the same basis as drugs used to control or regulate blood sugar and blood pressure, for the reason that all the human entity and its operations and conditions are physiologically founded, and thus susceptible to pharmaceutical influences.

But I still have to witness scientific discoveries or inventions as The Theory of Relativity by Einstein and the design of levitation train, owing their comeuppance from drug intakes by their authors.


Just my man in the street opinion.


Susma

[ima_tes]

any one travelling with amanita muscarita?

tes

[scottl]

"About meditation, from what I have read....I don't think"

You can think anything you wish (people used to think the world was flat). However you refuse to even spend literally 2 minutes trying it to see if what you think is correct.

This is why people do not find discussions with you...[shrugs shoulders]

Edited by scottl, 19 February 2005 - 12:27 PM.

[jubai]

[quote][quote]Indeed.

For the serious mental explorer: (in order of strength)

LSD
DMT
Salvia
5-Meo-DMT

Put that Salvia up , if you buy 10x extract it's really stronger then LSD or mescaline.[/quote]


Exactly. I was sorting them in ascending order

[zg00]

What inventions and findings of science can be traced to heightened thinking owing to drug ingestion?

Paul Erdos was an interesting example. He is famously quoted as saying (after abstaining after a bet from stimulants for a month): "Before, when I looked at a piece of blank paper my mind was filled with ideas. Now all I see is a blank piece of paper."

http://amphetamines....paul-erdos.html

Oreilly has a short interesting article entitled Mind Hacks which takes a look at stimulants and the reward system.

http://hacks.oreilly.com/pub/h/2859

I don't advocate the use of habit forming drugs, in fact the only caffeine I take myself is through decaffeinated teas or coffee (with the occasional green tea).

But people of prominence certainly have used chemicals throughout history. Some with seemly better effect then others.

http://www.thegooddr...s/famous_users/

One thing always worth keeping in mind is often the desired effects of most habit forming drugs 'poop out', leaving craving and a side-effect profile that increases as you increase the drug to get the desired effects.

[stillbeing]

well these days its mostly just zazen for me . with rather fine effects, BUT neurontin gabapentin , ...or MDMA mixed with crystal meth, ... or MDMA taken with LSD, have gotten me into mental where I can be vastly more aware of the world , and solve problems (such as hand-held puzzles ) which i was unable to do without the drugs, some of the ability has stayed with me long after the use of the drugs. another one DXM( I made a few of my best drawings on DXM, I would post some here, but this is not about drawing) , has allowed me to solve puzzles and accomplish tasks and understand things which I couldn't otherwise and some of its effects (good ones which I welcome ) have remained permanent. overuse of any of the above , of course , backfired , resulting in No great discoveries, , no great drawings , no enlightenment(s) , but instead panicky feelings and procrastinations !

[susmariosep]

From hindsight of other people and myself.


I had done a lot of meditation of all kinds when I was in college run by a religious society, which is one of the most obsessed with meditation.

In fact now that I look back, the people I know to be most brilliant and productive in this order can if asked honestly, tell you that meditation which they do everyday several hours a day, did not contribute anything to their understanding and discovery of intellectual and scientific issues and concepts.


I had myself also toyed a bit in college with Buddhist and other kinds of meditation from the ethnic gurus of Hindu India, giving them much more than just 120 seconds. No, it was not worth the discomfort and time and loss of occupation otherwise better spent in good reading.


We have in today's world many almost perfect gentlemen of the most cordial heart and mind, with records of enviable achievements in the arts, humanities, sciences, and also involved in altruistic undertakings, who do not engage in meditation, not the kind advocated in religions, and certainly not in religious systems like Buddhism from Hindu India. And some of them are possessed of the most pure of religion -- if you ask me.

I have a very strong temptation to think that if they had cultivated and engaged in meditation as a daily part of their life, they would not have turned out to be such gentlemen of such learning, discovery, invention, and service to their neighbors.


Try this exercise, employ your kind of meditation and see if you can come to any solution to the ESP experiment, a hoax certainly, of Dr. Clifford A. Pickover. (Aside: looks like a plugging, hehehe.)


Susma

"About meditation, from what I have read....I don't think"

You can think anything you wish (people used to think the world was flat).  However you refuse to even spend literally 2 minutes trying it to see if what you think is correct.

This is why people do not find discussions with you...[shrugs shoulders]

[pSimonKey]

I have recently had (another) Magick musroom experience which always seems to be very appropriate when it actually happens. I find that it has helped me to "tidy" up my "mental desk" and "re-file" things with greater clarity. I also find that after a "tidying" there is more energy and centredness for me to address present tasks. Maybe sometimes I need to have a different perspective on things to gain an additional, usefull understanding and Magick mushrooms does this for me. I have had "bad trips" which when addressing the "bad" part, have actually turned out to be the most rewarding and so not "bad" at all, but areas that I was just reluctant to address.

[pSimonKey]

scotti. I have tried and am still trying the http://www.thewayofs...meditation.html Thank you, it has been and is rather a usefull stepping stone/s of nowness in my day. Breathing can become quite addictive ;- )

[pSimonKey]

I think, maybe, we think, one thinks too much about meditation, possibly!?