4 replies to this topic

[RYAN474]

Anyone tried "wake therapy" (Sleep Deprivation) or related techniques for Depression, SAD, ADHD? What are your experiences? I would be interested in connecting with anyone who has ever tried it, formally or not.

Here is a free excerpt from the book that describes the full protocol of Wake Therapy + Light Therapy + Sleep Phase Advance, which is what i'm attempting recently :http://content.karge....Chrono_004.pdf

My Story with Sleep Deprevation for ADHD-PI, Depression, SAD, & CFS..
I originally 'experimented' with wake therapy after coming across medical journal articles online, about 10 years ago. That was in high school- when my undiagnosed combination of ADHD-PI, depression (esp seasonal), and food allergies, combined with a drive for high achievement-- pushed me to procrastinate and end up staying up all night quite a few times, in order to finish basic homework and projects.

After noticing a *complete and profound positive change in mood, mental clarity / brain fog, focus, social abilities, and energy (but not manic or even hypomanic) * for 1-3 days after a full night of sleep deprivation, I began investigating this phenomenon online and started compiling articles. I actually felt "normal" after sleep deprivation, and was so hopeful that I would fine a way to feel like this more often than just 1 day here and there. However, at the time-- it was known that the often 100% relief from depression using wake therapy was short-lived. As soon as you got "recovery sleep", the depression would return to some extent. This was true for me. I tried to piece it all together and find out how to sustain the benefits, but gave it only a half hearted effort because there wasn't any consensus on how to do it or others who had done it. (Now there is a way!- see book link below).

Nevertheless, I used sleep deprivation as a tool periodically and halfheartedly over the last 10 years with some success. If there was ever a time I needed to be a my peak mental performance (i.e. a presentation or competition, or big project requiring clarity & focus), I would use wake therapy to get that 24+ hours of clarity. Whats amazing, is I believe this is among the top few *KEY REASONS* I made progress in my life and work, and was perceived as a highly successful person (in school and then as an entrepreneur). However, I got caught up exploring and implementing hundreds of other techniques, remedies and cocktails for my set of symptoms, eventually helping enough to make me satisfied and distract me from wake therapy/ light therapy. But none of them were ever as profound as wake therapy. Now, I use them ALL in combination for even more profound results. (i.e. cfs hormonal treatments, adhd meds, supplements, meditation, strict hypoallergenic diet, etc etc).

When thinking back and analyzing symptom journals of my ebbs and flows in depression, adhd, general productivity, clarity, etc-- periodic sleep deprivation was always in play during times where I felt my best!

Now, I am trying wake therapy (+ light therapy + sleep phase advance) more formally and aggressively. I purchased this book a couple of months ago and have been working on implementing it ever since. Its very straightforward and pretty simple, even though it’s a "physicians manual" . I strongly recommend checking it out. They also are coming out with a version for the layperson - in Nov 2012 I think.

http://content.karge....oduktNr=244116

Here is a free excerpt from the book that describes the full protocol of Wake Therapy + Light Therapy + Sleep Phase Advance, which is what i'm attempting recently :http://content.karge....Chrono_004.pdf

Except I go one step further as described later in the boom, using triple wake therapy (3 alternating nights of sleep deprevation & sleep phase advance + light therapy)


In that book and other related resources, they say there is a chronobiological component to many disease processes, and implementing chronobiological principles and techniques/treatments has been found helpful for many different conditions. Including Parkinsons, ADHD, PMS, etc.

I found out about the book from www.cet.org. That site has a lot of great tools- including a MEQ questionnaire/assessment to help you determine your natural melatonin onset time and how you should time your sleep for optimal results of light therapy. And a great Q & A with doctors for light therapy treatment.

There is also a clinic that opened recently, for anyone interested:
First U.S. Overnight Chronotherapy Clinic Opens Chicago, October, 2010. A boon for patients with bipolar disorder, the first U.S. clinic offering supervised "triple chronotherapy" (wake therapy, light therapy, sleep phase advance) has opened in Chicago under the directorship of John F. Gottlieb, M.D., in collaboration with CET's Chronotherapeutics Consultants. Referrals from around the country are invited for the several-day protocol. Visit the clinic's website. http://www.chicagochronotherapy.org/

==
Here is my original thread and some additional replies on this over in adhd forums http://www.addforums...ad.php?t=117934

SO, anyone tried wake therapy (sleep deprivation) / sleep phase advance (alogn with bright light therapy) for any of their conditions? Your experiences? Ideas/Musings? Resources/Links?

Edited by ryan474, 12 October 2012 - 12:21 PM.

[stablemind]

One user on this forum has had success with it, you might want to do a search for bright light therapy. From what I understand it works well if you adapt to it, and if you can get yourself to wake up that early in the morning every time. This is used more for Bipolar/Depression/mood disorders than ADHD from what I understand.

Edited by stablemind, 12 October 2012 - 06:12 PM.

[Logic]

I have a completely home brewed, unbaked theory the wake therapy works because one cannot have un-rembered bad dreams/nightmares while awake.
These bad dreams are what make one depro upon waking???

[protoject]

Holy crap, this is excellent, I am going to look into all of the information you provided. I am highly interested in artificially tweaking my sleep patterns and my state of being using methods similar to these. I started using bright light therapy a few weeks ago for both sleep rhythm and depression /anxiety and it is very interesting.

My experience with sleep deprivation is that yes it does in fact make you less depressed. However, in an individual like myself it causes more problems than it is worth and it seems to aggravate or even cause psychotic problems, as I am an insomniac and when my sleep deprivation builds up it actually makes me far worse off. physically and mentally I have a theory, and, it isn't a sound theory or anything and I'm not a professional, but I believe that more sleep is healthier for a person [ie i feel much physically healthier with up to 8 hrs of sleep rather than less than 6], BUT that in individuals like ourselves with depression, it causes depression because we are not going through the appropriate stages of sleep. Also i find that more sleep "sets me up for sleep" and less sleep "sets me up for waking up"... and there's a fine balance that you have to strike between the two. Which is why your links intrigue me so much, because I think sleep deprivation mixed WITH bright light therapy may be a very good way to reset the circadian rhythm

But I have to note another problem I've had with sleep deprivation. When I was younger I used to stay up literally all night because I couldnt sleep so I would go and do something else. And most people would expect that this would make you sleep the next night. However going along with my "waking up sets me for waking up" statement, sleep deprivation for me seems to cause more sleep deprivation in the end, because my body is trying to adapt to the condition by forcing my body into an awake state. Awake doesn't mean , refreshed, energized or anythign liek that. Actually I can be quite exhausted during this time It's just that the biological thing that causes "sleep" disappears and my body goes into an over-stimulated burnt out state that keeps getting worse.

I think also that how many times you sleep really matters and how long you are in bed. And again this goes along with More sleep=more , less sleep=less. For example if I go to bed and wake up anywhere between 2-6 hours later, i wake up energized. But the energy isnt necessarily good. Sometimes it's after getting only 3-5 hrs a sleep a night for 3 nights, so it's like, this unnatrual energy. As if it's wake up time . however I actually feel much better having these shorter 4 hour sleeps but having them more than once. however if they are close together its like it signals my body to start shutting down again. and thats when the depression sets in more. it's like the brain is arguing with itself on whether it's going into sleep mode or wake mode. and I think this has a lot to do with circadian rhythm.


Anyway sorry if my ideas are kinda disorganized and a bit to handle but I hope these ideas were thought provoking anyway.

[Galaxyshock]

Sleep is the enemy