387 replies to this topic

[Wu Hang]

I Will wait for your guys result before moving int this, seems a promising alternative to amphenamine though it is reported that the effect is not as potent despite the price tag, maybe its the best substitute for my stimulant, but nobody can be sure about that

[phil8462643]

i think its best if we stick to the original plan. given the value of this group buy its best not to put things through too many additional pairs of hands. not to say i dont trust any specific additional pairs of hands. I understand how things can take extra time and have never complained about time but lets try to keep the variables as few as possible on this one.

[shplongl]

I want in on this :(

Just started researching BPAP and it is fascinating! Let us know how it works out for everyone please.

Interesting paper on BPAP and deprenyl

http://dl.dropboxuse...prenyl BPAP.pdf

[sparkk51]

I Will wait for your guys result before moving int this, seems a promising alternative to amphenamine though it is reported that the effect is not as potent despite the price tag, maybe its the best substitute for my stimulant, but nobody can be sure about that

Each individual is getting several decades worth of BPAP... I think it'll be way more cost effective.

Edited by sparkk51, 21 September 2013 - 05:28 PM.

[xks201]

Thats all fine and dandy phil but if theres no one to ship the products then theres no one to ship the product. lol
The dilemma is apparently over us shipments on not aussie shipments.

[xks201]

If there is any way I can get in on this group buy please let me know.....

[Reformed-Redan]

I'm sorry but this group buy is closed.

[phil8462643]

no need to get sarcastic, xks, but you might want to read the threads you are posting in before you post. another word of advice; nobody on this site is going to trust you to arrange things due to the fact that you dont have a membership and you have not been on this site very long. so if you want to you can buy a membership or wait a few years, but i have seen you offer to arrange things before on other threads. and no i am not offering to arrange anything due to the fact that i am not a member and have not been on this site very long.

Edited by phil8462643, 23 September 2013 - 04:00 AM.

[xks201]

Phil...you don't even have 65 posts. Don't know if its really your place to be telling me what to read. I made a nice gesture to do the shipping and I'm leaving it at that. I'm in on two of the three group buys so its not like I randomly showed up and offered to do it. Thanks for your concern though.

And if somehow paying 30 dollars for a lifetime membership makes you feel better I'm happy to do that. Lol

[sparkk51]

has a U.S. organizer been established? I know it's out of our hands, but I'm really hoping to get this substance within the month. My classes are pretty demanding.

[xks201]

I offered to do it. I'm in the prl group buy. I said I'd do it for a sample...I'm in the us. You guys can have my address, ill become a premium member..or whatever is needed to ensure trust.

[Reformed-Redan]

No worries. All the shipping issues have been dealt with.

[lourdaud]

I got word from the supplier that a sample may be ready for dispatch in 7-10 days.

To keep everyone updated and calm, ScienceGuy will be doing testing of the product to check for authenticity and quality of product, both of which I don't doubt the supplier will deliver on. I really appreciate all of your patience. Thanks.

I've also been really busy with college and work; so, expect less frequent updates. I'm still going to see once PRL, BPAP, and ISRIB are acquired to then go with pitolisant, which is already in the works; but, too early to say anything definitive on.

Well this was one month ago. ScienceGuy just said he isn't updated on this group buy and you said he'd be testing the samples?
What's going on?

[Reformed-Redan]

I got word from the supplier that a sample may be ready for dispatch in 7-10 days.

To keep everyone updated and calm, ScienceGuy will be doing testing of the product to check for authenticity and quality of product, both of which I don't doubt the supplier will deliver on. I really appreciate all of your patience. Thanks.

I've also been really busy with college and work; so, expect less frequent updates. I'm still going to see once PRL, BPAP, and ISRIB are acquired to then go with pitolisant, which is already in the works; but, too early to say anything definitive on.

Well this was one month ago. ScienceGuy just said he isn't updated on this group buy and you said he'd be testing the samples?
What's going on?

What's going on is a sample has just been dispatched to ScienceGuy via EMS and he should be receiving the sample soon. Sorry for not keeping you updated lately. This was all a one man gig compared to 3 or 4 people with the PRL group buy. Obviously I didn't synthesize the compound and kudos to the supplier for being so patient and going through with it.

Edited by yadayada, 02 October 2013 - 02:27 PM.

[ScienceGuy]

To keep everyone updated and calm, ScienceGuy will be doing testing of the product to check for authenticity and quality of product, both of which the supplier will deliver on. I really appreciate all of your patience... What's going on is a sample has just been dispatched to ScienceGuy via EMS and he should be receiving the sample soon...

Hi everyone,

Please kindly note the following:

1) YADAYADA should be applauded for devoting his valuable free time to organizing this group buy of BPAP;

2) I was brought in on this particular group buy lately and have had very little involvement; however I did agree to check out a BPAP sample for YADAYADA; however

3) I regret to inform everyone that the respective package my research company received by EMS Courier contained nothing but an EMPTY 5ML AMBER GLASS VIAL; wherein, it even had this written on the customs declaration paperwork... hence it can be deduced that whoever sent it cannot be trusted and should be avoided at all costs;

4) I strongly advise extreme caution with regards to dealing with CHINESE chemical synthesis companies... whilst there is the odd exception, the vast majority quite simply cannot be trusted... you will either receive something that is entirely different (e.g. ZINC OXIDE powder) or if the product is indeed what it should be, then it is exceedingly likely that it will NOT meet the PURITY specified and almost always the COA will be faked.

I have lost count how many times I have come across this. I used to own a company that manufactured HEALTH and SPORTS SUPPLEMENTS and I oversaw the purchasing department who imported nutritional ingredients from all over the world; wherein, we came up against precisely the same issues with respect to NUTRITIONAL INGREDIENTS offered by CHINESE suppliers... so much so that we adopted a company policy that NONE of our ingredients would have COUNTRY OF ORIGIN as being CHINA.

Seriously, it is NOT worth taking the risk people... Even if the product is (mostly) what it claims to be, then typically it will contain significant levels of IMPURITIES which could include TOXIC REAGENTS

There is a reason that the prices are a lot cheaper from CHINESE suppliers... wherein, this is one of those instances where you most certainly get what you pay for... and counterwise, you DON'T get what you DON'T pay for...

I should add that reputable CHINESE COMPANIES do exist, but due to the considerable number of untrustworthy ones it is a sad fact that they are akin to a diamond in a sea of zircons... My advice is to only deal with said companies that have already an established proven track record on being bona fide and on the level.

5) I would urge caution regards rushing forward with too many GROUP BUYS at once... For a variety of reasons, including my limited available free time, I can only be involved with one GROUP BUY at a time... wherein, whilst the enthusiasm and excitement is all well and good, there have been a number of instances wherein individuals have commenced GROUP BUYS without my involvement wherein I have later been asked to become involved and to assist due to matters going a tad off the rails or problems arising etc... as such I am finding myself being sucked into multiple group buys at once which cannot continue to occur... I have become personally involved with regards to the PRL-5-83, ISRIB, and BPAP group buys in this manner... my point is that if anyone commences further GROUP BUYS without my involvement from the start I may have to decline to come to their aid in the event that similar problems arise... I feel the need to mention this in advance with the hope that such an occurrence will be avoided.

Edited by ScienceGuy, 08 October 2013 - 06:35 AM.

[xks201]

Yikes, hopefully this isn't the same supplier making the PRL.

[meatsauce]

So if I am to understand correctly, the BPAP supplier is bogus and there is no BPAP? Bummer.

[Reformed-Redan]

K, so I got up at 6 just to get word from the supplier that the sample was in liquid form and was send under that name so customs would not seize the package. The supplier has offered to send out another sample in HCL form. I don't know if ScienceGuy is willing to test this now; since, it seems that he has already made up his mind about the supplier. If not, then can you point out an independent third party that could test this sample for us. Thank you for not making this harder than it already is!

[ScienceGuy]

Yikes, hopefully this isn't the same supplier making the PRL.

It isn't. I am personally managing the synthesis of the PRL-5-83 which is being manufactured by the same EUROPEAN LAB that previously made the COLURACETAM for me.

So if I am to understand correctly, the BPAP supplier is bogus and there is no BPAP? Bummer.

You are correct that the existing supplier being considered has not checked out; however, this does not necessarily mean the end of the GROUP BUY, but merely that another, more reputable supplier needs to be sourced.

This should not be perceived as a failure but in fact a success in that the QUALITY CONTROL PROCESS that YADAYADA has implemented has exposed this particular supplier as being bogus, so to speak... this is in fact a good thing, since by implementing such quality control precautions everyone can be reassured that the material eventually synthesized will be the real deal and of decent purity.

[Reformed-Redan]

ScienceGuy, I sent a request to the supplier to send another sample to you in HCL form. Most likely this will happen since I have known this supplier for quite a while now and the custom synthesis lab is located in Hong Kong. It is an insult to generalize and then stereotype then all into bad and untrustworthy CHINESE suppliers, if I should point this out to you. If for however reason you are absolutely certain about your presumptions about my suppliers and ALL CHINESE suppliers, then please point out another independent third party lab that will be able to do this for us.

I'd also like to point out that ScienceGuy and Googletarian have become quite comfortable with each other so it might be the case that he has material interested vested in having a monopoly on custom synthesis group buys; but, this is only my assumption.

Yikes, hopefully this isn't the same supplier making the PRL.

It isn't. I am personally managing the synthesis of the PRL-5-83 which is being manufactured by the same EUROPEAN LAB that previously made the COLURACETAM for me.

So if I am to understand correctly, the BPAP supplier is bogus and there is no BPAP? Bummer.

You are correct that the existing supplier being considered has not checked out; however, this does not necessarily mean the end of the GROUP BUY, but merely that another, more reputable supplier needs to be sourced.

This should not be perceived as a failure but in fact a success in that the QUALITY CONTROL PROCESS that YADAYADA has implemented has exposed this particular supplier as being bogus, so to speak... this is in fact a good thing, since by implementing such quality control precautions everyone can be reassured that the material eventually synthesized will be the real deal and of decent purity.

Aha, I saw this coming. So you would like GOOGLETARIAN to be the new supplier? Lets slow down here. I have had nothing; but, good experiences with this supplier and for this reason have left him anonymous. Like I said he is willing to send out another sample in HCL form to you free of any charge. Are you willing to accept this?

[ScienceGuy]

K, so I got up at 6 just to get word from the supplier that the sample was in liquid form and was send under that name so customs would not seize the package. The supplier has offered to send out another sample in HCL form. I don't know if ScienceGuy is willing to test this now; since, it seems that he has already made up his mind about the supplier. If not, then can you point out an independent third party that could test this sample for us. Thank you for not making this harder than it already is!

We received delivery of a singular 5ML AMBER GLASS VIAL that was EMPTY... there was nothing contained therein... i.e. NO LIQUID...

I have not already made up my mind about anything... I am simply stating the facts as they have transpired... and I am actually trying to be helpful... with respect NO LAB can test an EMPTY CONTAINER... If I receive material I will have it tested and report back.

Please kindly note that it is quite possible that CUSTOMS opened the package and saw the vial with CUSTOMS DECLARATION as "5ML EMPTY GLASS VIAL" in fact contained liquid, so emptied it to test the liquid and then shipped on the package now containing the empty vial... but this is of course pure speculation... even though unlikely, it is possible.

YADAYADA this is your party, so the way forward is up to you... I am still very happy to help out as per previously offered, but I need actual material to do this... also please note that if you want it tested properly I would need a minimum of 1 GRAM quantity.

[Reformed-Redan]

K, so I got up at 6 just to get word from the supplier that the sample was in liquid form and was send under that name so customs would not seize the package. The supplier has offered to send out another sample in HCL form. I don't know if ScienceGuy is willing to test this now; since, it seems that he has already made up his mind about the supplier. If not, then can you point out an independent third party that could test this sample for us. Thank you for not making this harder than it already is!

We received delivery of a singular 5ML AMBER GLASS VIAL that was EMPTY... there was nothing contained therein... i.e. NO LIQUID...

I have not already made up my mind about anything... I am simply stating the facts as they have transpired... and I am actually trying to be helpful... with respect NO LAB can test an EMPTY CONTAINER... If I receive material I will have it tested and report back.

Please kindly note that it is quite possible that CUSTOMS opened the package and saw the vial with CUSTOMS DECLARATION as "5ML EMPTY GLASS VIAL" in fact contained liquid, so emptied it to test the liquid and then shipped on the package now containing the empty vial... but this is of course pure speculation... even though unlikely, it is possible.

YADAYADA this is your party, so the way forward is up to you... I am still very happy to help out as per previously offered, but I need actual material to do this... also please note that if you want it tested properly I would need a minimum of 1 GRAM quantity.

OK, I will try and arrange 1 gram to you. Please list everything you want listed on the package to ensure that you actually get what you want to test. Thank you.

You can send a PM to me with exact instructions on the declaration at customs and what labels you want listed. Please kindly note that the actual structure of BPAP could be sketchy to some customs, as I've had other custom synthesis labs refuse to synthesize this compound due to its tryptamine backbone.

[ScienceGuy]

... It is an insult to generalize and then stereotype then all into bad and untrustworthy CHINESE suppliers, if I should point this out to you. If for however reason you are absolutely certain about your presumptions about my suppliers and ALL CHINESE suppliers, then please point out another independent third party lab that will be able to do this for us.

I'd also like to point out that ScienceGuy and Googletarian have become quite comfortable with each other so it might be the case that he has material interested vested in having a monopoly on custom synthesis group buys...

...Aha, I saw this coming. So you would like GOOGLETARIAN to be the new supplier?

Firstly please re-read my previous posts wherein I make very clear that there are indeed some reputable CHINESE suppliers... I simply correctly advised that they are few and far between... and recommended dealing with only those already proven to be bona fide...

Secondly, regarding your outragious accusation that I am seeking to attain a "monopoly on Group Buys" by being in cahoots with GOOGOLTARIAN please kindly note that I have not profited in any regard from any of the Group Buys that I have been involved in... and this includes those also involving GOOGOLTARIAN; wherein, with respect to COLURACETAM I in fact gave away the individual quantities FOR FREE...

So count me OUT.

When I get back home later I will post details of a reputable third party lab who carries out the sort of third party analysis you require.

Edited by ScienceGuy, 08 October 2013 - 02:21 PM.

[Reformed-Redan]

... It is an insult to generalize and then stereotype then all into bad and untrustworthy CHINESE suppliers, if I should point this out to you. If for however reason you are absolutely certain about your presumptions about my suppliers and ALL CHINESE suppliers, then please point out another independent third party lab that will be able to do this for us.

I'd also like to point out that ScienceGuy and Googletarian have become quite comfortable with each other so it might be the case that he has material interested vested in having a monopoly on custom synthesis group buys...

...Aha, I saw this coming. So you would like GOOGLETARIAN to be the new supplier?

Firstly please re-read my previous posts wherein I make very clear that there are indeed some reputable CHINESE suppliers... I simply correctly advised that they are few and far between... and recommended dealing with only those already proven to be bona fide...

Secondly, regarding your outragious accusation that I am seeking to attain a "monopoly on Group Buys" by being in cahoots with GOOGOLTARIAN please kindly note that I have not profited in any regard from any of the Group Buys that I have been involved in... and this includes those also involving GOOGOLTARIAN; wherein, with respect to COLURACETAM I in fact gave away the individual quantities FOR FREE...

Well, he only seems to reply to YOUR inquiries. It was only natural for me to look elsewhere since he completely disregarded my inquiries a couple of times.

So count me OUT.

When I get back home later I will post details of a reputable third party lab who carries out the sort of third party analysis you require.

Your avatar seems to serve you well. *shakes hands*

I need to know if you haven't taken this too personally, since the ISRIB group buy is still pending. What do you want me to do with the funds? Transfer them all to you will the shipping address. I collected at no profit for ISRIB at all. Actually I might have to take it out of pocket for ISRIB.

Edited by yadayada, 08 October 2013 - 02:32 PM.

[Reformed-Redan]

Can anyone from the EU/UK, in this group buy, handle shipping, since our UK re-distributor seems to have abandoned us.

[Reformed-Redan]

I do not know for what particular reason; but, I would like to dispel this PREJUDICE that is being perpetuated by ScienceGuy in regards to CHINESE suppliers.

It might be the case that he has had really bad experiences with them, which, is entirely possible; but, it is certainly not true that most of them are bad or out to cheat you. If that had been the case, then MrHappy and other members I have organized the uridine group buy with wouldn't have gotten their uridine or most of the supplements you get off ebay and Amazon wouldn't be authentic.

However, this is clearly not the case.

Though things certainly can go horribly wrong (look at CH.)

Edited by yadayada, 08 October 2013 - 03:00 PM.

[Godof Smallthings]

Ok, I am not even part of this group buy so probably should stay out... but still, it seems to me all you two guys need to do is step back for 15 minutes, breathe, try to look objectively at the situation, perhaps offer apologies (even if you think you did not do anything wrong, maybe you can still allow for the fact that we all are sensitive to different triggers, and in the heat of the moment it is easy to miscommunicate, especially since we are just doing so in writing...) and then get back to business.

Surely this does not need to turn sour?

[Werper]

I agree Godof. Yada, I honestly think you owe Scienceguy an apology.

[Q did it!]

Please listen to the words of ^God^

Edited by Q did it!, 08 October 2013 - 03:53 PM.

[Reformed-Redan]

I agree Godof. Yada, I honestly think you owe Scienceguy an apology.

Why should I apologize? Here is what we know:

1.ScienceGuy recieved a empty vial.
2.My supplier sent a vial with liquid in it; yet, the label was "empty 5ml amber vial."

Here is what we don't know:
What happened between 2 and 1. Did customs throw away the liquid? Did it spontaneously evaporate? Did the supplier even ship the liquid even though they went through the hassle to send a package to an address I personally provided to them?

We don't know.

Here is what we do know.

ScienceGuy's reaction to state of affairs #1:

4) I strongly advise extreme caution with regards to dealing with CHINESE chemical synthesis companies...

He states his prejudice. Watch out for the CHINESE!

[...]whilst there is the odd exception, the vast majority quite simply cannot be trusted...

Now, this sounds like the plot for a spy story. Are you paranoid against the CHINESE, ScienceGuy?

continuing

[...]you will either receive something that is entirely different (e.g. ZINC OXIDE powder) or if the product is indeed what it should be, then it is exceedingly likely that it will NOT meet the PURITY specified and almost always the COA will be faked.

This might be the case; HOWEVER; the overwhelming amount of goods on our markets, surprisingly, originate from China, so I don't get how the above could be true under "exceedingly likely" circumstances.

[...]I have lost count how many times I have come across this. I used to own a company that manufactured HEALTH and SPORTS SUPPLEMENTS and I oversaw the purchasing department who imported nutritional ingredients from all over the world; wherein, we came up against precisely the same issues with respect to NUTRITIONAL INGREDIENTS offered by CHINESE suppliers... so much so that we adopted a company policy that NONE of our ingredients would have COUNTRY OF ORIGIN as being CHINA.

It seems that ScienceGuy is not being dishonest here; but, I must point out that you might have the most stringent rigor when it comes to purity (ehem, that is why Chinese suppliers are cheaper, economics...) which seems to be to the point of being some sort of neurotic obsession.

[...]Seriously, it is NOT worth taking the risk people... Even if the product is (mostly) what it claims to be, then typically it will contain significant levels of IMPURITIES which could include TOXIC REAGENTS

Well, whoopty-do. That is why I requested that you take part in the analysis of the product.

[...]There is a reason that the prices are a lot cheaper from CHINESE suppliers... wherein, this is one of those instances where you most certainly get what you pay for... and counterwise, you DON'T get what you DON'T pay for...

I'm beginning to suspect that you did receive the product; but, were so unhappy with its purity that you made the false claim that you received nothing. What purity will satisfy you Sir? I was told by the supplier that the product would be in free form at 95% and the HCL that everyone should get is 98%+. Let me just remind that the compound is active in the microscale, unlike the large doses of Piracetam people digest. I'm hopping your piracetam is 99.99999% pure since you're taking 5g+ doses every day!

[...]I should add that reputable CHINESE COMPANIES do exist, but due to the considerable number of untrustworthy ones it is a sad fact that they are akin to a diamond in a sea of zircons... My advice is to only deal with said companies that have already an established proven track record on being bona fide and on the level.

This is more generalization.

[...]5) I would urge caution regards rushing forward with too many GROUP BUYS at once... For a variety of reasons, including my limited available free time, I can only be involved with one GROUP BUY at a time... wherein, whilst the enthusiasm and excitement is all well and good, there have been a number of instances wherein individuals have commenced GROUP BUYS without my involvement wherein I have later been asked to become involved and to assist due to matters going a tad off the rails or problems arising etc... as such I am finding myself being sucked into multiple group buys at once which cannot continue to occur... I have become personally involved with regards to the PRL-5-83, ISRIB, and BPAP group buys in this manner... my point is that if anyone commences further GROUP BUYS without my involvement from the start I may have to decline to come to their aid in the event that similar problems arise... I feel the need to mention this in advance with the hope that such an occurrence will be avoided.

You know, you must think very highly of yourself to think that we SHOULDN'T do group buys without YOUR CONTROL. While your stress for cation and safety is well received in this case it is becoming a nuisance. Nothing personal. I hope you don't change your mind now about ISRIB.

Please listen to the words of ^God^

lol, haven't seen you around. Must be very busy?