14 replies to this topic

[yuriythebest]

Right, I recently saw an interview
http://c60.net/full-...r-fathi-moussa/

where the original "discoverer" of this effect claims that there are now several more trials - he mentioned the NIH/ITC - are these trials still ongoing? any info?

[niner]

I haven't seen that video, but I think the part about NIH/ITA (NIA/ITP??) trials was something that Moussa hoped would be run, or some such thing. I'm not aware of any formal trials that have started. Only small, informal experiments being run by AgeVivo and chook12, the results of which are posted in these fora. Crevetterebelle was about to start a relatively large controlled study when an infection swept through the animal colony, so now it's on hold.

[yuriythebest]

wait, so all of this enthusiasm is about:
1. one "actual" trial that is yet to be replicated
2. several amateur trials (that are still ongoing) with a much smaller sample size (several?)
3. anecdotal accounts
4. people testing it on themselves & recording their progress

Edited by yuriythebest, 30 May 2013 - 06:22 AM.

[Andey]

Yep, you are right, but dont forget that you are exactly at the enthusiast forum now )) I dont see much enthusiasm outside.
Plus you can add studies about HyFn C60 that have done by our fellow countryman Grigoriy Andrievsky.

[niner]

wait, so all of this enthusiasm is about:
1. one "actual" trial that is yet to be replicated
2. several amateur trials (that are still ongoing) with a much smaller sample size (several?)
3. anecdotal accounts
4. people testing it on themselves & recording their progress

Absolutely correct. Some things to consider: There is a literature record of work with fullerenes in a variety of species showing consistent results. Some of the people involved in this international experimentation and discussion are MDs and PhDs. We're the kind of people who conduct the trials and publish the papers that you would like to see more of. We'd like to see more as well, and I'm sure this will come with the fullness of time. Check back in a year.

[YOLF]

So no actual lab setting studies underway? How might we use LongeCity influence to see a bigger study? How much does it cost to hire a lab in developing nation to run a study for us? What kind of company would we be looking to contact?

[niner]

So no actual lab setting studies underway? How might we use LongeCity influence to see a bigger study? How much does it cost to hire a lab in developing nation to run a study for us? What kind of company would we be looking to contact?

Given the magnitude and uniformity of the effects that Baati saw, it shouldn't take a very large study in order to replicate it. Large studies are needed when effects are small and/or variable. I'd be the first to agree that "two mice" isn't sufficient, but it's not like we need a hundred mice. The experiment that we almost got off the ground had 30 rats, which would have been fine. It's really too bad we had that setback.

There are companies that do research for hire. They are called "contract research organizations". If you google that term, you could probably track down a bunch of them. A multi-year animal study will not be cheap.

At this moment, we don't know what's going on in academic (or other) labs around the world. Any studies that are looking at how this compound might give an edge to athletes or soldiers is unlikely to be publicized.

[BobSeitz]

Niner, this is exactly what I've been thinking. I can imagine universities or pharmaceutical companies opting to replicate the Baati experient on the sly until they can publish, or apply for patents (or both).

[Turnbuckle]

Niner, this is exactly what I've been thinking. I can imagine universities or pharmaceutical companies opting to replicate the Baati experient on the sly until they can publish, or apply for patents (or both).

No one will be able to get patents on the longevity work that has already been published, so drug manufactures will be looking for novel derivatives to patent.

[YOLF]

I don't think they could get a patent on C60OO. Given that it's already being distributed prior to any patent claim it's got to be public domain. It would be a real tragedy to see it patented and removed from public availability. Though I guess we could always just make our own. I imagine Sarah would fight any order to stop making it.

[YOLF]

So no actual lab setting studies underway? How might we use LongeCity influence to see a bigger study? How much does it cost to hire a lab in developing nation to run a study for us? What kind of company would we be looking to contact?

Given the magnitude and uniformity of the effects that Baati saw, it shouldn't take a very large study in order to replicate it. Large studies are needed when effects are small and/or variable. I'd be the first to agree that "two mice" isn't sufficient, but it's not like we need a hundred mice. The experiment that we almost got off the ground had 30 rats, which would have been fine. It's really too bad we had that setback.

There are companies that do research for hire. They are called "contract research organizations". If you google that term, you could probably track down a bunch of them. A multi-year animal study will not be cheap.

At this moment, we don't know what's going on in academic (or other) labs around the world. Any studies that are looking at how this compound might give an edge to athletes or soldiers is unlikely to be publicized.

Anything in particular that I could look for to turn up an offshore CRO? Not finding much with my first google.

[YOLF]

Nevermind, just found some. Contacted Shang Pharma and requested a quote.

[Andey]

I don't think they could get a patent on C60OO. Given that it's already being distributed prior to any patent claim it's got to be public domain. It would be a real tragedy to see it patented and removed from public availability. Though I guess we could always just make our own. I imagine Sarah would fight any order to stop making it.

Public domain is a two edged sword really. If pharma companies cant patent C60 solutions than dont expect that they will finance studies about it. Goverment and public funded studies are the slowest way possible to get product to the public.

[niner]

A pharmaceutical company could patent a method of production that resulted in a better product. When you mix c60 with olive oil, there are several different fatty acids in the mix, and a variety of compounds could form. You could have one, two, or possibly more fatty acids bound to a single c60, and the relative positions of these on the sphere could be different. It's likely that of the many isomers possible, one is optimal. If a drug company worked out which one it was, and developed a way to make it in pure form, I'd think they could patent it, run trials, get it approved, and sell it. At least that seems reasonable to me, but I'm not a lawyer. They could certainly get a process patent, and I'm pretty sure they could get it approved by the FDA. It could end up like fish oil, where there's a ridiculously expensive prescription version and cheap OTC versions at the same time. A drug company could certainly create an entirely different analog, although Luna Nanoworks may already have the patent space sewed up.

[Turnbuckle]

A drug company could certainly create an entirely different analog, although Luna Nanoworks may already have the patent space sewed up.

Luna has covered a lot of territory with their patent 8,241,648--

Described herein are synthetically modified fullerene molecules, wherein the fullerene is spheroid or ellipsoid in shape with an equatorial band and two opposing poles, comprising an adduct at the opposing poles, at least one adduct being a lipophilic chemical moiety.

http://patft.uspto.g...RS=PN/8,241,648