21 replies to this topic

[Will Werner]

I'm current working on a project called Rapid Muscle Recovery. It's an investigation into common and uncommon methods used to enhance muscle recovery between workouts/training.

The focus of the project rests on the shoulders of science, in that the findings must hold up against scientific studies and not just anedtodal evidence.

Longecity is all about extending the quality, and not just the quantity, of the years we have left and neglecting one's recovery from intense physical training can lead to increased risk of serious injury and potentially even keeping one from completing their everyday activities. Therefore, my projects goals are somewhat intertwined with Longecity's.

Of those who have any personal experience or scientific backgrounds in exercise physiology or a related field, what methods of enhancing workout recovery have worked for you or seem scientifically plausible?


Thanks,

Will Werner

[RJ23_1989]

Hello Will!

Probably the most cutting edge substance I have at the moment is Carbon 60 lipofullerene. Please see my review thread below. Unfortunately it's largely anecdotal as C60 use in humans has yet to be explored in this manner. I'd also like to touch on GHRH/GHRP peptide use as well as Thymosin Beta 4 when I have more time.

http://www.longecity...xercise,-and-Me

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Also, injecting L-carnitine in conjunction with elevated insulin levels and Dimethylglycine. For all except C60 I have a wealth of peer reviewed scientific studies.

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[Will Werner]

Thanks for the quick response, Patrick. Any other suggestions are always welcome. I'll look into L-carnitine very soon.

What sport is C60 most used by? Distance athletes?

[Mind]

Not the answer you were probably looking for - but - steroids, hormones, etc... are proven for recovery. They probably cannot be beaten for this purpose. Some risks involved, of course.

[zorba990]

Infrared Sauna http://blog.sunlight...-infrared-sauna is on my wish list...

[RJ23_1989]

Thanks for the quick response, Patrick. Any other suggestions are always welcome. I'll look into L-carnitine very soon.

What sport is C60 most used by? Distance athletes?

I'm not aware of its use being very prevalent at all outside of a few places on the Internet where its being discussed here and there on a few forums. If it is in use in athletics, its likely being kept quiet as I can't see how this wouldn't end up on the WADA list of banned substances. Its primary benefit I have found is delayed muscle fatigue, in some sort of way buffering the buildup of lactic acid/ROS, whatever.

I didn't find it much benefit in distance running where you're basically going full aerobic for the majority of the time. Something like this could have a huge impact on say a sprinter or some other related type of sport where you get a rapid buildup of anaerobic/hybrid muscle byproducts. It has a fantastic ability to scavenge these byproducts. That makes a lot of sense given the byproducts of pure aerobic energy expenditure are C02 and water and it has no effect in that area.

Anyhow, it also had a significant impact on recovery time. I found it cut my return to a rested state by at least a third after doing intense bouts of exercise.


On a side note disregard my suggestion on DMG. I've used it for a while now and find that while it is helpful somewhat in improving primarily aerobic performance, it is by no means a game changer.

Edited by PatrickM500, 07 November 2013 - 09:10 PM.

[nowayout]

I'm not aware of its use being very prevalent at all outside of a few places on the Internet where its being discussed here and there on a few forums. If it is in use in athletics, its likely being kept quiet as I can't see how this wouldn't end up on the WADA list of banned substances. Its primary benefit I have found is delayed muscle fatigue, in some sort of way buffering the buildup of lactic acid/ROS, whatever.

To say this as if it were fact, as opposed to speculation based on a small number of anecdotes, is misleading, especially when we are talking of subjective experiences of perceived effort and perceived fatigue that are highly subject to placebo effect. Many more positive anecdotes exist for, say, l-carnitine, or GHRPs, and are not being taken particularly seriously by most of us. Why should C60 be singled out?

I also think it borders on irresponsibility to promote something like this without at least pointing out that this is a substance that is possibly unsafe. If we are to admit anecdotes of benefit, then we must pay particular attention to the number of anecdotes, including in these forums, of side effects as well.

[RJ23_1989]

I guess you missed the part above where I said:

"Unfortunately it's largely anecdotal as C60 use in humans has yet to be explored in this manner."

No one is promoting anything here. In fact, I clearly state in my log on C60 the exact opposite of what you are implying. But whatever.

More to the point - Will asked, "What methods of enhancing workout recovery have worked for you or sound scientifically plausible?"

These are the answers.

Will is a big boy and I'm sure he can make his own decisions without you throwing in your own opinion (esp. on topics you have zero personal experience in). I don't recall this being about a debate on these topics and I'm not going to do that.

[chung_pao]

My rate of recovery has mainly been limited by these primary factors:
Growth factors (hormones), Nutrient availability, Insulin (nutrient retention rather than circulation in blood-stream) and Sleep.

I bet I could recover from any maximal effort in 48 hours, if that was really ALL I was doing.
You have the capacity to recover VERY quickly, if you decide to disregard many other aspects of health, such as wakefulness and mood.

If avoiding anabolic steroids and insulin injections, I'd aim at increasing intake of nutrient required for muscle synthesis: protein, cholesterol and fatty acids.
Additional supplementation with leucine might help with protein retention, milk-protein is a rich source.
I also think INFLAMMATION can be manipulated very effectively for anabolic purposes. For example post-workout arachidonic acid ingestion.

For example:
Pre-workout carbohydrates -> Forskolin and PDE-inhibition during workout (maximize cAMP) -> Postworkout: high intakes of arachidonic-acid rich organ meats (e.g. chicken heart) and massive amounts of milk-proteins.

The organs meat for maximal inflammation and recovery rate IN the stimulated tissues, and milk-proteins for maximal protein retention.

Edited by chung_pao, 02 December 2013 - 08:54 PM.

[kelka]

Although I started taking them for different reasons NAC and magnesium have both led to improvements in my recovery time and NAC an improvement in time to fatigue.

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[mrd1]

I do three workouts a day and seem to cover within 24 hours I take

140mcg of clenbuterol
aspirin 81mg
niacin 1000mg
creatine 5000mg
clomid 25 mg


Although, I should note I have extremely severe ADHD am a 18 y/0 old male and have test levels in the 1153mg/ml range (300-800 population range)


I do
blood deprivation legs workout for non mTOR dependent hypertrophy
upper or lower body workout for mTOR dependent hypertrophy (not to failure)
stretching 15 min/ muscle group for prostaglandin inhibihition mediated growth.

*** I take tenex and benadyrl at night to prevent tolerance and yohimbine and green tea fat burners and tumeric and green bean coffee extrack and fishoil. .

[Hebbeh]

I do three workouts a day and seem to cover within 24 hours

But you said...

http://www.longecity...eo/page__st__60

TBH, my diet is almost entirely supplements. I fast all day. Then eat like 2500-3000 calories of ok to pretty healthy food at night. And, I take clenbuterol everyday instead of doing much serious exercise. This is what not to do. However, I do feel totally blissed out. So, ill take chemicals over certain food anyday.

Which is it? I call BS....

[blood]

100 mg/day DHEA appeared to blunt muscle damage in young healthy men on a daily exercise regimen:
http://suppversity.b...ing-5-days.html

(apologies for the appallingly tortuous sentence construction - Suppversity is a pain to read, but the info is often good)

[BioFreak]

A fatigued CNS can make feel the muscles not only unrested, but also massively decrease performance. Maybe that should be part of the equation, too? In fact it is one of the the main factors for overtraining.

[mrd1]

Serious exercise as training to failure. I do mostly high reps 25-30, stretching, blood deprivation, and super slow sets. But, it doesn't matter anyway because I am not even close to natural.

[TSX TypeR]

For recovery, I've been using a machine called a Compex Sport Elite which is an electromyostimulation (ems) device. It also works for me for more than recovery. Research on this subject is hard to find, but it exists.

The effect of electrical stimulation on recovery from exercise-induced muscle damage

http://bjsm.bmj.com/.../A21.1.abstract


Edit: Added the research.

Edited by TSX TypeR, 03 February 2014 - 02:38 AM.

[jadamgo]

Enough whey protein to contain 3+g of leucine, taken ASAP after the workout, possibly with a fresh fruit too if I'm bulking instead of cutting or recomping. The evidence base for rapid protein supplementation containing leucine is very solid. (I'd take it even if cutting/recomping just for the recovery purposes alone.)

Also, and this is just anecdotal, a 30g casein shake and a big bowl of steel-cut oats with 1 tbsp of oat bran, right before bedtime. Bulk phases only, but personally I find it speeds recovery.

Back to empirically supported, for joint wear and tear, glucosamine/chondroitin/msm appears helpful. Also, the SARMs may be safer than the classical steroids, and certainly there's an evidence base for androgenics speeding recovery. I'll let everyone know how the current ostarine run goes.

[Will Werner]

Thank you all for the posts. Sorry for the late response. Had my hands full this past year. Haha.

 

 

Muscle recovery is a way an athlete can improve their ability to train harder more often, yet it is only part of the equation as BioFreak pointed out.

 

The ability to recovery effectively and efficiently relies on forcing the body to adapt in sport-specific ways (Ex: Powerlifters bodies need more strength, distance runners need more endurance). Project RMR is geared more to athletes who are incredibly serious about training. I believe athletes need to train very hard, very often. The training frequency must be very high to force the body into supercompensation, no matter what sport a person is involved in. With high training volume, recuperative abilities must be enhanced both for injury prevention and continually improving in any sport.

 

I will look into the above substances. A few of them I haven't heard of, possibly because I am not very familiar with distance athlete supplement regimens.

 

I think there is a lot of promise in preventing secondary muscle damage post-training, when some ROS can inflict unnecessary harm on adjacent healthy muscle fibers. I believe it is the ROS from neutrophils that is one of, if not the cause. 

 

Nutrition is key in this equation too. I believe a diet that is high and mainly focused on grass-fed beef, root vegetables, massive amounts of green veggies works well for anaerobic athletes. Thoughts?

[Multivitz]

Many, many, many factors will decide weather you can speed up the recovery of a muscle) or it's owners perception of said muscle cells.)
The fastest way, without beating around the bush without the many factor, the fastest way I have seen, the one way that has minimal side effects, the most natural substance that is safe, a substance that heals sprains (thats reattach the muscle to the bone)(overnight) is...........

[Multivitz]

DMSO 90%, can give garlic breath in some cases. Healing can be slow if there is a deficiency of something that matters. Muscle soreness is a sign of overtraining/damage/acid buildup. DMSO opens the cells pores and energises the insides!

[Multivitz]

Trying DMSO is believing imho. I was sceptical at first, you can eat it, or use it externally, either way garlic breath is a risk for some lol
There is scientific research and solid theory to it, but you know the establishment by now, if it ain't going to be patentable they will protect their intrest through idiots that are good at parroting. There's probably other substances like D-Ribose and Liposomals but DMSO makes it difficult to overdo by way of it's nature.

[kurdishfella]

pure glocuse in form of dextrose change to other types . body stores 400g in body and more if you workout in muscle cells. So sugar can help muscles. Also stored fat like oils omega 3, vitamin a , e etc fatty acids and amino acids. it might take a few to see results if low. glucose also affects your body smell odour for the better sweeter way etc

Edited by kurdishfella, 17 February 2022 - 10:46 AM.