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Adderall, gift of the gods

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#61 Kewell357

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 02:05 AM

 

 

For what it's worth, I hurt my ankle from running too much 2 days ago. I took the day off yesterday from the usual 10km/6mile multi-session jog and the Adderall just didn't hit like it usually does. None of the usual mild-euphoria, intellectual endurance, cleaning fanaticism... it's as if the 'tolerance' woes that many of you speak of hit me like a ton of bricks. 

Today on the other hand, I hit the treadmill twice and bada-bing, bada-boom, the magic's back. Tolerance isn't inevitable. If you want the magic past the initial free-lunch period, you have to work for it to work.

If you want to keep your receptor sites sensitive and amp up your brain's dopamine, forget about the memantine/DXM/Selegiline... (or at least don't regard supplement X/Y/Z as the primary answer). 

Exercise, IS the ultimate nootropic. It has the power to do vastly more than pills and augment said pills tenfold in one fell swoop. It's the magic bullet that brings the Adderall magic day-in-day out without the need for taking any days off or elevating the dose.

If you want Adderall to work again like it used to, I challenge you to obtain a pedometer, ensure you get at least 10,000 steps a day with at least 2 sessions of fast walking/jogging/running, everyday for two weeks. 

If your Adderall doesn't kickass again, call me out. 

 

Is it because exercise upregulates dopamine receptors?

 

Well, :D I'm glad you asked. :D 

It does far far more than just up-regulating dopamine receptors.

(For a very eloquent synopsis of what exercise does for brain, the book Spark: The Revolutionary New Science of Exercise and the Brain can do a far better job than I at detailing the benefits. I highly recommend downloading the audiobook somewhere if you aren't the reader type.
http://www.amazon.co..._pr_product_top
)

  • Exercise boosts BDNF/IGF-1/Dopamine/Serotonin/Norepinephrine/'insert pretty much any positive brain chemical here' and it does so in a way that it's just the right amount in just the right place. 
     
  • It bulks up vascular infrastructure so more blood/nutrients/nootropics/drugs can reach more parts of the brain.
     
  • It's a good form of stressor for newly born neurons that gives them a resistance to stress later on. So not only are they more likely to mature and stick around but also, when under emotional/physical strain, they have a much higher stress threshold so they can work as expected.
     
  • Intense cardio releases endocannabinoids which is hypothesized to be what causes 'runners high'. So if you ever smoked pot in the past or currently do (not advisable), intense cardio can deliver similar feel good/mood effects.

Plus a whole lot more.

But back to your question and Adderall, yes, it up-regulates dopamine receptors and allows for even more of the drug to reach more parts of the brain... ;) This is relevant to any drug or nootropic too. So if racetam X or research chemical Y isn't performing, cardio will augment it as well as take away the ever prevalent 'irritability', 'brain fog',' short term memory impairment' that people report. 

 

 

So, what's the best form of exercise to get this? HIIT? Resistance training?



#62 TheBatman

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 02:25 AM

For what it's worth, I hurt my ankle from running too much 2 days ago. I took the day off yesterday from the usual 10km/6mile multi-session jog and the Adderall just didn't hit like it usually does. None of the usual mild-euphoria, intellectual endurance, cleaning fanaticism... it's as if the 'tolerance' woes that many of you speak of hit me like a ton of bricks. 

Today on the other hand, I hit the treadmill twice and bada-bing, bada-boom, the magic's back. Tolerance isn't inevitable. If you want the magic past the initial free-lunch period, you have to work for it to work.

If you want to keep your receptor sites sensitive and amp up your brain's dopamine, forget about the memantine/DXM/Selegiline... (or at least don't regard supplement X/Y/Z as the primary answer). 

Exercise, IS the ultimate nootropic. It has the power to do vastly more than pills and augment said pills tenfold in one fell swoop. It's the magic bullet that brings the Adderall magic day-in-day out without the need for taking any days off or elevating the dose.

If you want Adderall to work again like it used to, I challenge you to obtain a pedometer, ensure you get at least 10,000 steps a day with at least 2 sessions of fast walking/jogging/running, everyday for two weeks. 

If your Adderall doesn't kickass again, call me out. 

 

 

 

In my case exercise could make all the difference, you're right. 

 

I've actually been avoiding cardio on purpose lately. I'm trying to gain weight and it's counter productive. I'm almost where I want to be weight-wise and I'll give it a go when I need to burn off my excess fat. 

 

I've never read anything about adderall tolerance in relation to exercise though - it should be a no-brainer haha!


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#63 Glazing Agent

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 02:26 AM

 

 

 

For what it's worth, I hurt my ankle from running too much 2 days ago. I took the day off yesterday from the usual 10km/6mile multi-session jog and the Adderall just didn't hit like it usually does. None of the usual mild-euphoria, intellectual endurance, cleaning fanaticism... it's as if the 'tolerance' woes that many of you speak of hit me like a ton of bricks. 

Today on the other hand, I hit the treadmill twice and bada-bing, bada-boom, the magic's back. Tolerance isn't inevitable. If you want the magic past the initial free-lunch period, you have to work for it to work.

If you want to keep your receptor sites sensitive and amp up your brain's dopamine, forget about the memantine/DXM/Selegiline... (or at least don't regard supplement X/Y/Z as the primary answer). 

Exercise, IS the ultimate nootropic. It has the power to do vastly more than pills and augment said pills tenfold in one fell swoop. It's the magic bullet that brings the Adderall magic day-in-day out without the need for taking any days off or elevating the dose.

If you want Adderall to work again like it used to, I challenge you to obtain a pedometer, ensure you get at least 10,000 steps a day with at least 2 sessions of fast walking/jogging/running, everyday for two weeks. 

If your Adderall doesn't kickass again, call me out. 

 

Is it because exercise upregulates dopamine receptors?

 

Well, :D I'm glad you asked. :D 

It does far far more than just up-regulating dopamine receptors.

(For a very eloquent synopsis of what exercise does for brain, the book Spark: The Revolutionary New Science of Exercise and the Brain can do a far better job than I at detailing the benefits. I highly recommend downloading the audiobook somewhere if you aren't the reader type.
http://www.amazon.co..._pr_product_top
)

  • Exercise boosts BDNF/IGF-1/Dopamine/Serotonin/Norepinephrine/'insert pretty much any positive brain chemical here' and it does so in a way that it's just the right amount in just the right place. 
     
  • It bulks up vascular infrastructure so more blood/nutrients/nootropics/drugs can reach more parts of the brain.
     
  • It's a good form of stressor for newly born neurons that gives them a resistance to stress later on. So not only are they more likely to mature and stick around but also, when under emotional/physical strain, they have a much higher stress threshold so they can work as expected.
     
  • Intense cardio releases endocannabinoids which is hypothesized to be what causes 'runners high'. So if you ever smoked pot in the past or currently do (not advisable), intense cardio can deliver similar feel good/mood effects.

Plus a whole lot more.

But back to your question and Adderall, yes, it up-regulates dopamine receptors and allows for even more of the drug to reach more parts of the brain... ;) This is relevant to any drug or nootropic too. So if racetam X or research chemical Y isn't performing, cardio will augment it as well as take away the ever prevalent 'irritability', 'brain fog',' short term memory impairment' that people report. 

 

 

So, what's the best form of exercise to get this? HIIT? Resistance training?

 

The best kind is the kind you can safely do on a regular basis and keep up with. :)

Resistance training does a whole lot of good with different benefits and a lot of overlap with cardio yet it falls short in what it can do for the brain exclusively when compared. HIIT has been found to be an efficient as regular cardio in terms of a workout but I have my doubts that it achieves the same brain effects.

The best overall form of exercise in my opinion is one where you have blood pounding through your brain non-stop and you're sweating profusely for a good half hour at a time. Then taking a rest for a few hours before doing it again.

HIIT and resistance, while at face-value may be just the same amount of work, more than likely isn't nearly the same duration of blood/hormones/chemicals bathing your brain. It's the blood coursing through your brain/almost out of breath state that you want to be in to maximize the returns and reach the pinnacle states of human experience. 

Personally, I go for a morning stroll around the neighborhood, do 2-3 half hour sessions of brisk walking-jogging on the treadmill that leave me drenched in sweat and hit the multi-gym for some resistance training. 

That said, I'm pretty confident in my recommendation of 10,000 steps a day for Adderall to be magical. (The two week minimum in place since it takes about that long for receptor up-regulation, brain growth etc. before the effects really stand out... even just one day of moderate exercise will have great benefits though)

 

TheBatMan: Myself, I'm an 'under weight' ectomorph. Believe it or not, I gain a lot more weight doing cardio everyday than if I don't. An intense cardio session can be offset almost entirely calorie-wise by eating a trail mix bar, couple pieces of bread or a handful of nuts. The exercise releases growth hormones that tell your body to make better use of the food you take in.

Being 'underweight' implies you don't have the genes to pack on fat like most the population does. Since your body has trouble storing fat, you need to help it out by both boosting your fat storing ability and gaining muscle. Both are done through exercise

Don't worry about losing weight doing cardio, the increased appetite afterwords and hormones will work their magic. If you do resistance training as well as cardio (doesn't have to be much at all as long as you're consistent), you may quickly discover that your body will perhaps for the first time, start packing proper mass.
 


Edited by Glazing Agent, 08 August 2014 - 02:50 AM.


#64 Duchykins

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 02:51 AM

You have to work for it to work ... okay I kind of get that, it does sound a little like inviting placebo effect ... but the whole of your argument is just exercise instead of using amphetamines. I'm only assuming you mean that to generally apply to everyone except perhaps those who have psychological issues.

#65 Kewell357

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 02:53 AM

 

 

 

 

For what it's worth, I hurt my ankle from running too much 2 days ago. I took the day off yesterday from the usual 10km/6mile multi-session jog and the Adderall just didn't hit like it usually does. None of the usual mild-euphoria, intellectual endurance, cleaning fanaticism... it's as if the 'tolerance' woes that many of you speak of hit me like a ton of bricks. 

Today on the other hand, I hit the treadmill twice and bada-bing, bada-boom, the magic's back. Tolerance isn't inevitable. If you want the magic past the initial free-lunch period, you have to work for it to work.

If you want to keep your receptor sites sensitive and amp up your brain's dopamine, forget about the memantine/DXM/Selegiline... (or at least don't regard supplement X/Y/Z as the primary answer). 

Exercise, IS the ultimate nootropic. It has the power to do vastly more than pills and augment said pills tenfold in one fell swoop. It's the magic bullet that brings the Adderall magic day-in-day out without the need for taking any days off or elevating the dose.

If you want Adderall to work again like it used to, I challenge you to obtain a pedometer, ensure you get at least 10,000 steps a day with at least 2 sessions of fast walking/jogging/running, everyday for two weeks. 

If your Adderall doesn't kickass again, call me out. 

 

Is it because exercise upregulates dopamine receptors?

 

Well, :D I'm glad you asked. :D 

It does far far more than just up-regulating dopamine receptors.

(For a very eloquent synopsis of what exercise does for brain, the book Spark: The Revolutionary New Science of Exercise and the Brain can do a far better job than I at detailing the benefits. I highly recommend downloading the audiobook somewhere if you aren't the reader type.
http://www.amazon.co..._pr_product_top
)

  • Exercise boosts BDNF/IGF-1/Dopamine/Serotonin/Norepinephrine/'insert pretty much any positive brain chemical here' and it does so in a way that it's just the right amount in just the right place. 
     
  • It bulks up vascular infrastructure so more blood/nutrients/nootropics/drugs can reach more parts of the brain.
     
  • It's a good form of stressor for newly born neurons that gives them a resistance to stress later on. So not only are they more likely to mature and stick around but also, when under emotional/physical strain, they have a much higher stress threshold so they can work as expected.
     
  • Intense cardio releases endocannabinoids which is hypothesized to be what causes 'runners high'. So if you ever smoked pot in the past or currently do (not advisable), intense cardio can deliver similar feel good/mood effects.

Plus a whole lot more.

But back to your question and Adderall, yes, it up-regulates dopamine receptors and allows for even more of the drug to reach more parts of the brain... ;) This is relevant to any drug or nootropic too. So if racetam X or research chemical Y isn't performing, cardio will augment it as well as take away the ever prevalent 'irritability', 'brain fog',' short term memory impairment' that people report. 

 

 

So, what's the best form of exercise to get this? HIIT? Resistance training?

 

The best kind is the kind you can safely do on a regular basis and keep up with. :)

Resistance training does a whole lot of good with different benefits and a lot of overlap with cardio yet it falls short in what it can do for the brain exclusively when compared. HIIT has been found to be an efficient as regular cardio in terms of a workout but I have my doubts that it achieves the same brain effects.

The best overall form of exercise in my opinion is one where you have blood pounding through your brain non-stop and you're sweating profusely for a good half hour at a time. Then taking a rest for a few hours before doing it again.

HIIT and resistance, while at face-value may be just the same amount of work, more than likely isn't nearly the same duration of blood/hormones/chemicals bathing your brain. It's the blood coursing through your brain/almost out of breath state that you want to be in to maximize the returns and reach the pinnacle states of human experience. 

Personally, I go for a morning stroll around the neighborhood, do 2-3 half hour sessions of brisk walking-jogging on the treadmill that leave me drenched in sweat and hit the multi-gym for some resistance training. 

That said, I'm pretty confident in my recommendation of 10,000 steps a day for Adderall to be magical. (The two week minimum in place since it takes about that long for receptor up-regulation, brain growth etc. before the effects really stand out... even just one day of moderate exercise will have great benefits though)

 

TheBatMan: Myself, I'm an 'under weight' ectomorph. Believe it or not, I gain a lot more weight doing cardio everyday than if I don't. An intense cardio session can be offset almost entirely calorie-wise by eating a trail mix bar, couple pieces of bread or a handful of nuts. The exercise releases growth hormones that tell your body to make better use of the food you take in.

Being 'underweight' implies you don't have the genes to pack on fat like most the population does. Since your body has trouble storing fat, you need to help it out by both boosting your fat storing ability and gaining muscle. Both are done through exercise

Don't worry about losing weight doing cardio, the increased appetite afterwords and hormones will work their magic. If you do resistance training as well as cardio (doesn't have to be much at all as long as you're consistent), you may quickly discover that your body will perhaps for the first time, start packing proper mass.
 

 

Will follow your advice and see how it goes. I ordered the book you recommended as well so will take a read of it. It looks interesting.

 

Why do you recommend the 10,000 steps though? Just curious.


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#66 Duchykins

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 02:54 AM

That workout regimen ... you do it daily? That's a lot of hours exercising for someone who isn't a professional athlete.

#67 Karla Markovich

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 02:56 AM

Why would you abuse a controlled substance, yeah it's abuse without a script.


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#68 Glazing Agent

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 03:13 AM

 

That workout regimen ... you do it daily? That's a lot of hours exercising for someone who isn't a professional athlete.

10min walk in the morning, half hour jog mid morning, half hour jog around noon, as well as most days another half hour in the afternoon/evening. 10mins here and there total lifting weights. Total time: 1h50mins
A very good sacrifice of time in my opinion to have a kick ass productive day. ;) 
 

 

Will follow your advice and see how it goes. I ordered the book you recommended as well so will take a read of it. It looks interesting.

 

 

 

Why do you recommend the 10,000 steps though? Just curious.

 

 

Dude! That's awesome! :D It's a brilliant, life changing book. You will not be disappointed! Keep us posted how the exercise augments the Adderall and if/when it brings back the magic.

The 10,000 steps happened to be a round number that 2 sessions of light cardio + a morning walk came to. It also happens to be the point where the mild euphoria and thoughts of 'wow, the Adderall is really working now' start creeping into my head. 7000 steps and the Adderall doesn't quite feel as powerful as it should be.
 

You have to work for it to work ... okay I kind of get that, it does sound a little like inviting placebo effect ... but the whole of your argument is just exercise instead of using amphetamines. I'm only assuming you mean that to generally apply to everyone except perhaps those who have psychological issues.

Placebos are a wonderful thing... I'll gladly invite them ;) 

The science is pretty solid on exercise's brain building effects and it goes far beyond the realm of placebo. Don't get me wrong, exercise has very powerful nootropic effects on its own, but combining it with amphetamine takes the amphetamine up to 11. It's the two combined that bring the magic to the whole amphetamine experience.


Edited by Glazing Agent, 08 August 2014 - 03:19 AM.


#69 YOLF

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 03:26 AM

Google my threads nmda antagonists for tolerance a collection of the evidence and anecdotal reports, the bluelight thread has a shitload of anecdotes showing memantine works.

Indeed dont try it before exam time, the first week it makes you stupid, after that its actually been shown to improve some measures of cognition.

Is there anything to suggest that the memantine benefits come with a cost? Would someone be able to maintain the first time effects that was discussed a few posts back on a low dose if taking memantine with it?



#70 YOLF

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 03:31 AM

For what it's worth, I hurt my ankle from running too much 2 days ago. I took the day off yesterday from the usual 10km/6mile multi-session jog and the Adderall just didn't hit like it usually does. None of the usual mild-euphoria, intellectual endurance, cleaning fanaticism... it's as if the 'tolerance' woes that many of you speak of hit me like a ton of bricks. 

Today on the other hand, I hit the treadmill twice and bada-bing, bada-boom, the magic's back. Tolerance isn't inevitable. If you want the magic past the initial free-lunch period, you have to work for it to work.

If you want to keep your receptor sites sensitive and amp up your brain's dopamine, forget about the memantine/DXM/Selegiline... (or at least don't regard supplement X/Y/Z as the primary answer). 

Exercise, IS the ultimate nootropic. It has the power to do vastly more than pills and augment said pills tenfold in one fell swoop. It's the magic bullet that brings the Adderall magic day-in-day out without the need for taking any days off or elevating the dose.

If you want Adderall to work again like it used to, I challenge you to obtain a pedometer, ensure you get at least 10,000 steps a day with at least 2 sessions of fast walking/jogging/running, everyday for two weeks. 

If your Adderall doesn't kickass again, call me out. 

I imagine lisdexamphetamine or dexedrine (I'm going with mixed salts are a risk theory) could also be used to create good workout habits as well and effectively treat obesity in the long term?

 

You mentioned in a following post that cardio can increase the effectiveness and decrease resistance of racetams, I take it that would include phenylpiracetam? Can phenylpiracetam be used to reinforce habits as well? Though I'm thinking lisdex or dex would probably be cheaper anyways...


Edited by cryonicsculture, 08 August 2014 - 03:36 AM.


#71 YOLF

  • Location:Delaware Delawhere, Delahere, Delathere!

Posted 08 August 2014 - 03:42 AM

 

 

 

 

For what it's worth, I hurt my ankle from running too much 2 days ago. I took the day off yesterday from the usual 10km/6mile multi-session jog and the Adderall just didn't hit like it usually does. None of the usual mild-euphoria, intellectual endurance, cleaning fanaticism... it's as if the 'tolerance' woes that many of you speak of hit me like a ton of bricks. 

Today on the other hand, I hit the treadmill twice and bada-bing, bada-boom, the magic's back. Tolerance isn't inevitable. If you want the magic past the initial free-lunch period, you have to work for it to work.

If you want to keep your receptor sites sensitive and amp up your brain's dopamine, forget about the memantine/DXM/Selegiline... (or at least don't regard supplement X/Y/Z as the primary answer). 

Exercise, IS the ultimate nootropic. It has the power to do vastly more than pills and augment said pills tenfold in one fell swoop. It's the magic bullet that brings the Adderall magic day-in-day out without the need for taking any days off or elevating the dose.

If you want Adderall to work again like it used to, I challenge you to obtain a pedometer, ensure you get at least 10,000 steps a day with at least 2 sessions of fast walking/jogging/running, everyday for two weeks. 

If your Adderall doesn't kickass again, call me out. 

 

Is it because exercise upregulates dopamine receptors?

 

Well, :D I'm glad you asked. :D 

It does far far more than just up-regulating dopamine receptors.

(For a very eloquent synopsis of what exercise does for brain, the book Spark: The Revolutionary New Science of Exercise and the Brain can do a far better job than I at detailing the benefits. I highly recommend downloading the audiobook somewhere if you aren't the reader type.
http://www.amazon.co..._pr_product_top
)

  • Exercise boosts BDNF/IGF-1/Dopamine/Serotonin/Norepinephrine/'insert pretty much any positive brain chemical here' and it does so in a way that it's just the right amount in just the right place. 
     
  • It bulks up vascular infrastructure so more blood/nutrients/nootropics/drugs can reach more parts of the brain.
     
  • It's a good form of stressor for newly born neurons that gives them a resistance to stress later on. So not only are they more likely to mature and stick around but also, when under emotional/physical strain, they have a much higher stress threshold so they can work as expected.
     
  • Intense cardio releases endocannabinoids which is hypothesized to be what causes 'runners high'. So if you ever smoked pot in the past or currently do (not advisable), intense cardio can deliver similar feel good/mood effects.

Plus a whole lot more.

But back to your question and Adderall, yes, it up-regulates dopamine receptors and allows for even more of the drug to reach more parts of the brain... ;) This is relevant to any drug or nootropic too. So if racetam X or research chemical Y isn't performing, cardio will augment it as well as take away the ever prevalent 'irritability', 'brain fog',' short term memory impairment' that people report. 

 

 

So, what's the best form of exercise to get this? HIIT? Resistance training?

 

The best kind is the kind you can safely do on a regular basis and keep up with. :)

Resistance training does a whole lot of good with different benefits and a lot of overlap with cardio yet it falls short in what it can do for the brain exclusively when compared. HIIT has been found to be an efficient as regular cardio in terms of a workout but I have my doubts that it achieves the same brain effects.

The best overall form of exercise in my opinion is one where you have blood pounding through your brain non-stop and you're sweating profusely for a good half hour at a time. Then taking a rest for a few hours before doing it again.

HIIT and resistance, while at face-value may be just the same amount of work, more than likely isn't nearly the same duration of blood/hormones/chemicals bathing your brain. It's the blood coursing through your brain/almost out of breath state that you want to be in to maximize the returns and reach the pinnacle states of human experience. 

Personally, I go for a morning stroll around the neighborhood, do 2-3 half hour sessions of brisk walking-jogging on the treadmill that leave me drenched in sweat and hit the multi-gym for some resistance training. 

That said, I'm pretty confident in my recommendation of 10,000 steps a day for Adderall to be magical. (The two week minimum in place since it takes about that long for receptor up-regulation, brain growth etc. before the effects really stand out... even just one day of moderate exercise will have great benefits though)

 

TheBatMan: Myself, I'm an 'under weight' ectomorph. Believe it or not, I gain a lot more weight doing cardio everyday than if I don't. An intense cardio session can be offset almost entirely calorie-wise by eating a trail mix bar, couple pieces of bread or a handful of nuts. The exercise releases growth hormones that tell your body to make better use of the food you take in.

Being 'underweight' implies you don't have the genes to pack on fat like most the population does. Since your body has trouble storing fat, you need to help it out by both boosting your fat storing ability and gaining muscle. Both are done through exercise

Don't worry about losing weight doing cardio, the increased appetite afterwords and hormones will work their magic. If you do resistance training as well as cardio (doesn't have to be much at all as long as you're consistent), you may quickly discover that your body will perhaps for the first time, start packing proper mass.
 

 

No one starves these days, if you don't have the fat storage gene, why would you want it? What good would it do you?



#72 Glazing Agent

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 03:45 AM

 

For what it's worth, I hurt my ankle from running too much 2 days ago. I took the day off yesterday from the usual 10km/6mile multi-session jog and the Adderall just didn't hit like it usually does. None of the usual mild-euphoria, intellectual endurance, cleaning fanaticism... it's as if the 'tolerance' woes that many of you speak of hit me like a ton of bricks. 

Today on the other hand, I hit the treadmill twice and bada-bing, bada-boom, the magic's back. Tolerance isn't inevitable. If you want the magic past the initial free-lunch period, you have to work for it to work.

If you want to keep your receptor sites sensitive and amp up your brain's dopamine, forget about the memantine/DXM/Selegiline... (or at least don't regard supplement X/Y/Z as the primary answer). 

Exercise, IS the ultimate nootropic. It has the power to do vastly more than pills and augment said pills tenfold in one fell swoop. It's the magic bullet that brings the Adderall magic day-in-day out without the need for taking any days off or elevating the dose.

If you want Adderall to work again like it used to, I challenge you to obtain a pedometer, ensure you get at least 10,000 steps a day with at least 2 sessions of fast walking/jogging/running, everyday for two weeks. 

If your Adderall doesn't kickass again, call me out. 

I imagine lisdexamphetamine or dexedrine (I'm going with mixed salts are a risk theory) could also be used to create good workout habits as well and effectively treat obesity in the long term?

 

Certainly could! I should really issue a strong caution on this matter though. Anyone that's going to be starting a workout regime for the first time should take it really really easy at first. I only take 10mg Adderall... and I'm in good shape. But heart palpitations, strokes, heart attacks are a very real danger if you exert yourself too much when not used to it.

Also, if you take a relatively high dose and don't get much from it, exercise has the potential to make it really hit hard and if your body isn't used to that, it could be problematic.

So please, if anyone reading this is a little out of shape or takes a hardy dose of Adderall this could be a very dangerous thing to do so ease into it.
 
On the point of developing good workout habits, Cryonics, there is huge potential in using these drugs to treat obesity longterm. The thing is, stimulants and exercise have this virtuous cycle. They both meld they're addictive properties together when you combine them. It does take a little while of real effort to reach a state where you start craving exercise but it does happen which is all-round the best form of addiction imo. 

 

Edit: on the point about fat storage, Cry, there is a healthy level of fat. It may be hard to imagine someone wanting fat, but for bony ectomorphs a healthy layer of fat is a good thing and is often desired.


Edited by Glazing Agent, 08 August 2014 - 03:49 AM.

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#73 YOLF

  • Location:Delaware Delawhere, Delahere, Delathere!

Posted 08 August 2014 - 03:45 AM

Why would you abuse a controlled substance, yeah it's abuse without a script.

I think the OP said something about it being stigmatized among scribers and/or patients where he's from. 



#74 ModaMinds

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 03:48 AM

 

 

Gift of the gods? It's an addictive, neurotoxic amphetamine that provides benefits that could be found in other safer substances.

 

I really would like to try amphetamine in the form of adderall. I'm not aware that there are any significant alternatives that can quite replicate its known effect in terms of dopamine release.

 

Methamphetamine is WAY too STRONG, plus is illegal and more neurotoxic, half life too long.

 

Ritalin operates on a whole different mechanism,

 

modafinil is NOT amphetamine, its not a cognitive enhancer in the adhd sense.

 

Caffeine, Ginkgo,Other Prework supplements  (such as fat loss, usually similiar mechanism as amphetamine) don't come close. Most of these have short half lives too.

 

Nicotine? Cancerous, and tolerance/addiction develops even faster than adderall, plus Nicotine is actually lethal ruling high dose usage out.

 

Parkinson medicines? lets not even go into the side effect of that.

 

Nootropics enhance brain function, not executive focus and energy.

 

You completely nailed it head on, Major.

ModaMinds, if there was a safer substance (not to say I believe low dose adderall to be inherently unsafe) that produced the same ADHD-symptom-eradicating effects, I'd be taking it. Prior to being diagnosed, I tried 10's of various nootropics and supplements to no significant effect. After diagnosis, I tried Ritalin and was on 20mg IR and 72mg Concerta which produced only marginal relief with a lot of side effects.

The only substance that comes close, in my view, is coffee. But only on the very first day when you haven't had it in months and then, still, only for the initial few hours.

Low dose Adderall + a healthy life style is like an all day coffee with no come down. 

Medicineman, it sounds like you're really cramming hard lately. It is possible that your brain reached a saturation point and you need either more rest, more exercise or perhaps better nutrition to ensure your brain can keep up with all you've been learning.

Could it be that the Adderall is still just as effective but you've been red-lining your brain a little too much? Also, some days are going to naturally be a 60 whereas others are closer to 80's or 90's+ that's just human nature.

 

 

I never said Adderall doesn't hold some purpose. I said it shouldn't be touted as some "gift of the gods" or holy grail of medicine when it certainly has its negativities. For example, we even have people in this thread saying things like meth and other amphetamines can happily be used by all as long as you measure it properly, which is downright irresponsible. To not take into account biological diversity and adverse reactions but instead only hype the positives is setting someone up for failure or worse when they find this thread and think Adderall and other drugs are going to solve all their issues.
 


Edited by ModaMinds, 08 August 2014 - 03:57 AM.

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#75 YOLF

  • Location:Delaware Delawhere, Delahere, Delathere!

Posted 08 August 2014 - 03:50 AM

Has anyone combined an amphetamine with C60? I think I've definitely benefited from C60's joint improvements. I would normally swallow grams upon grams of glucosamine when I used my eliptical... It's out of commission and my glucosamine bottle is empty and I've been running on asphalt with no need for it. Hoping it's compatible or could be made so, though I really haven't taken the C60 for weeks and the improvements from it seem to have remained.



#76 YOLF

  • Location:Delaware Delawhere, Delahere, Delathere!

Posted 08 August 2014 - 04:02 AM

 

 

For what it's worth, I hurt my ankle from running too much 2 days ago. I took the day off yesterday from the usual 10km/6mile multi-session jog and the Adderall just didn't hit like it usually does. None of the usual mild-euphoria, intellectual endurance, cleaning fanaticism... it's as if the 'tolerance' woes that many of you speak of hit me like a ton of bricks. 

Today on the other hand, I hit the treadmill twice and bada-bing, bada-boom, the magic's back. Tolerance isn't inevitable. If you want the magic past the initial free-lunch period, you have to work for it to work.

If you want to keep your receptor sites sensitive and amp up your brain's dopamine, forget about the memantine/DXM/Selegiline... (or at least don't regard supplement X/Y/Z as the primary answer). 

Exercise, IS the ultimate nootropic. It has the power to do vastly more than pills and augment said pills tenfold in one fell swoop. It's the magic bullet that brings the Adderall magic day-in-day out without the need for taking any days off or elevating the dose.

If you want Adderall to work again like it used to, I challenge you to obtain a pedometer, ensure you get at least 10,000 steps a day with at least 2 sessions of fast walking/jogging/running, everyday for two weeks. 

If your Adderall doesn't kickass again, call me out. 

I imagine lisdexamphetamine or dexedrine (I'm going with mixed salts are a risk theory) could also be used to create good workout habits as well and effectively treat obesity in the long term?

 

Certainly could! I should really issue a strong caution on this matter though. Anyone that's going to be starting a workout regime for the first time should take it really really easy at first. I only take 10mg Adderall... and I'm in good shape. But heart palpitations, strokes, heart attacks are a very real danger if you exert yourself too much when not used to it.

Also, if you take a relatively high dose and don't get much from it, exercise has the potential to make it really hit hard and if your body isn't used to that, it could be problematic.

So please, if anyone reading this is a little out of shape or takes a hardy dose of Adderall this could be a very dangerous thing to do so ease into it.
 
On the point of developing good workout habits, Cryonics, there is huge potential in using these drugs to treat obesity longterm. The thing is, stimulants and exercise have this virtuous cycle. They both meld they're addictive properties together when you combine them. It does take a little while of real effort to reach a state where you start craving exercise but it does happen which is all-round the best form of addiction imo. 

 

Edit: on the point about fat storage, Cry, there is a healthy level of fat. It may be hard to imagine someone wanting fat, but for bony ectomorphs a healthy layer of fat is a good thing and is often desired.

 

I've tried to get addicted to cardio, but it never worked out for me... Here's hoping for the best ;)

 

I guess we always want the opposite of what we have... Having read up on ecto/meso/endomorphs, I definitely prefer ectos in the opposite sex and will probably order an ecto body to put my brain in post thaw. 


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#77 Glazing Agent

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 04:54 AM

You mentioned in a following post that cardio can increase the effectiveness and decrease resistance of racetams, I take it that would include phenylpiracetam? Can phenylpiracetam be used to reinforce habits as well? Though I'm thinking lisdex or dex would probably be cheaper anyways...

 

Well I can't speak to phenylpiracetam (thanks for reminding me... I have some kicking around that I haven't experimented with yet ;) )
I do on days when I take noopept and exercise, get a stronger sense of that enhanced visual perception that people often cite to it. Also, really vivid dreams. 

Based on the structural and chemical changes that cardio does to the brain, it would seem that all nootropics would be significantly more potent in the exercising brain. 

This is just a hunch, but based on some prior experience years ago and reading people's experiences with marijuana and nootropics combined (isochroma much?) I believe many nootropics are strongly influenced by the endocannabinoid system. (The body system involving the brains own THC, associated with regulating memory, mood, and response to stress among others). Often the types of people that preach how 'racetam X' gave them a blissful state of super rich sensory bliss also happen to be those that smoke weed. 

It just so happens that intense cardio floods the brain with endocannabinoids which could potentially be a very important, overlooked reason for getting nootropics to truly 'work'. This could be a safe, more natural/biological way than smoking some chemical laden herb to get to those blissful states that the odd pot-smoking-nootropics-enthusiast here raves about.

If anyone reading this that happens to be a runner and takes nootropics, please do pipe in and let us know if the 'runner's high' state combined with nootropics produces any profound states.


Edited by Glazing Agent, 08 August 2014 - 05:02 AM.


#78 TheBatman

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 05:45 AM

 

TheBatMan: Myself, I'm an 'under weight' ectomorph. Believe it or not, I gain a lot more weight doing cardio everyday than if I don't. An intense cardio session can be offset almost entirely calorie-wise by eating a trail mix bar, couple pieces of bread or a handful of nuts. The exercise releases growth hormones that tell your body to make better use of the food you take in.

Being 'underweight' implies you don't have the genes to pack on fat like most the population does. Since your body has trouble storing fat, you need to help it out by both boosting your fat storing ability and gaining muscle. Both are done through exercise

Don't worry about losing weight doing cardio, the increased appetite afterwords and hormones will work their magic. If you do resistance training as well as cardio (doesn't have to be much at all as long as you're consistent), you may quickly discover that your body will perhaps for the first time, start packing proper mass.
 

 

 

I am nearing the end of this "bulk" I suppose I have nothing to lose.

 

The increase in appetite is would be nice(almost forgotten what that feels like....), however I'll probably need to eat more than my current diet (3,200 cal. a day) to make up for it. It would be nice first thing in the morning seeing as how I usually wake up feeling full...



#79 TheBatman

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 06:04 AM

 

 

 

For what it's worth, I hurt my ankle from running too much 2 days ago. I took the day off yesterday from the usual 10km/6mile multi-session jog and the Adderall just didn't hit like it usually does. None of the usual mild-euphoria, intellectual endurance, cleaning fanaticism... it's as if the 'tolerance' woes that many of you speak of hit me like a ton of bricks. 

Today on the other hand, I hit the treadmill twice and bada-bing, bada-boom, the magic's back. Tolerance isn't inevitable. If you want the magic past the initial free-lunch period, you have to work for it to work.

If you want to keep your receptor sites sensitive and amp up your brain's dopamine, forget about the memantine/DXM/Selegiline... (or at least don't regard supplement X/Y/Z as the primary answer). 

Exercise, IS the ultimate nootropic. It has the power to do vastly more than pills and augment said pills tenfold in one fell swoop. It's the magic bullet that brings the Adderall magic day-in-day out without the need for taking any days off or elevating the dose.

If you want Adderall to work again like it used to, I challenge you to obtain a pedometer, ensure you get at least 10,000 steps a day with at least 2 sessions of fast walking/jogging/running, everyday for two weeks. 

If your Adderall doesn't kickass again, call me out. 

I imagine lisdexamphetamine or dexedrine (I'm going with mixed salts are a risk theory) could also be used to create good workout habits as well and effectively treat obesity in the long term?

 

Certainly could! I should really issue a strong caution on this matter though. Anyone that's going to be starting a workout regime for the first time should take it really really easy at first. I only take 10mg Adderall... and I'm in good shape. But heart palpitations, strokes, heart attacks are a very real danger if you exert yourself too much when not used to it.

Also, if you take a relatively high dose and don't get much from it, exercise has the potential to make it really hit hard and if your body isn't used to that, it could be problematic.

So please, if anyone reading this is a little out of shape or takes a hardy dose of Adderall this could be a very dangerous thing to do so ease into it.
 
On the point of developing good workout habits, Cryonics, there is huge potential in using these drugs to treat obesity longterm. The thing is, stimulants and exercise have this virtuous cycle. They both meld they're addictive properties together when you combine them. It does take a little while of real effort to reach a state where you start craving exercise but it does happen which is all-round the best form of addiction imo. 

 

Edit: on the point about fat storage, Cry, there is a healthy level of fat. It may be hard to imagine someone wanting fat, but for bony ectomorphs a healthy layer of fat is a good thing and is often desired.

 

I've tried to get addicted to cardio, but it never worked out for me... Here's hoping for the best ;)

 

I guess we always want the opposite of what we have... Having read up on ecto/meso/endomorphs, I definitely prefer ectos in the opposite sex and will probably order an ecto body to put my brain in post thaw. 

 

 

Cryonics -  I'd have to second the strong caution for newly prescribed adderall users exercising. 

 

I wasn't told about most of the side effects, like an increase heart rate, and I damn near blacked out the first time I dead lifted on adderall. My heart felt like it was vibrating.

 

adderall is more effective for weight loss than dexedrine, but they're similar. It will increase your metabolism and suppress your hunger. That combined with the kick in the ass to get up and work should shave off a lot of weight, both muscle and fat. I've read people's posts on bodybuilding that say they lost 40 lbs in a month taking it. It's not how I would recommend losing weight, but whatever works. 

 

Of course, you'll gain it all back when you have to stop taking it everyday...

 

Edit: Not sure if I would want to be an endo though... I like food way too much. 


Edited by TheBatman, 08 August 2014 - 06:08 AM.


#80 YOLF

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 06:27 AM

 

 

 

 

For what it's worth, I hurt my ankle from running too much 2 days ago. I took the day off yesterday from the usual 10km/6mile multi-session jog and the Adderall just didn't hit like it usually does. None of the usual mild-euphoria, intellectual endurance, cleaning fanaticism... it's as if the 'tolerance' woes that many of you speak of hit me like a ton of bricks. 

Today on the other hand, I hit the treadmill twice and bada-bing, bada-boom, the magic's back. Tolerance isn't inevitable. If you want the magic past the initial free-lunch period, you have to work for it to work.

If you want to keep your receptor sites sensitive and amp up your brain's dopamine, forget about the memantine/DXM/Selegiline... (or at least don't regard supplement X/Y/Z as the primary answer). 

Exercise, IS the ultimate nootropic. It has the power to do vastly more than pills and augment said pills tenfold in one fell swoop. It's the magic bullet that brings the Adderall magic day-in-day out without the need for taking any days off or elevating the dose.

If you want Adderall to work again like it used to, I challenge you to obtain a pedometer, ensure you get at least 10,000 steps a day with at least 2 sessions of fast walking/jogging/running, everyday for two weeks. 

If your Adderall doesn't kickass again, call me out. 

I imagine lisdexamphetamine or dexedrine (I'm going with mixed salts are a risk theory) could also be used to create good workout habits as well and effectively treat obesity in the long term?

 

Certainly could! I should really issue a strong caution on this matter though. Anyone that's going to be starting a workout regime for the first time should take it really really easy at first. I only take 10mg Adderall... and I'm in good shape. But heart palpitations, strokes, heart attacks are a very real danger if you exert yourself too much when not used to it.

Also, if you take a relatively high dose and don't get much from it, exercise has the potential to make it really hit hard and if your body isn't used to that, it could be problematic.

So please, if anyone reading this is a little out of shape or takes a hardy dose of Adderall this could be a very dangerous thing to do so ease into it.
 
On the point of developing good workout habits, Cryonics, there is huge potential in using these drugs to treat obesity longterm. The thing is, stimulants and exercise have this virtuous cycle. They both meld they're addictive properties together when you combine them. It does take a little while of real effort to reach a state where you start craving exercise but it does happen which is all-round the best form of addiction imo. 

 

Edit: on the point about fat storage, Cry, there is a healthy level of fat. It may be hard to imagine someone wanting fat, but for bony ectomorphs a healthy layer of fat is a good thing and is often desired.

 

I've tried to get addicted to cardio, but it never worked out for me... Here's hoping for the best ;)

 

I guess we always want the opposite of what we have... Having read up on ecto/meso/endomorphs, I definitely prefer ectos in the opposite sex and will probably order an ecto body to put my brain in post thaw. 

 

 

Cryonics -  I'd have to second the strong caution for newly prescribed adderall users exercising. 

 

I wasn't told about most of the side effects, like an increase heart rate, and I damn near blacked out the first time I dead lifted on adderall. My heart felt like it was vibrating.

 

adderall is more effective for weight loss than dexedrine, but they're similar. It will increase your metabolism and suppress your hunger. That combined with the kick in the ass to get up and work should shave off a lot of weight, both muscle and fat. I've read people's posts on bodybuilding that say they lost 40 lbs in a month taking it. It's not how I would recommend losing weight, but whatever works. 

 

Of course, you'll gain it all back when you have to stop taking it everyday...

 

Edit: Not sure if I would want to be an endo though... I like food way too much. 

 

So lisdex and dex still help with weight loss, just not as much as adderall? How much of a difference are we talking? It may be worth forming my own opinion on the danger of mixed salt amphets. 

 

I'm pretty good at moderating my workout. I've pushed my heart pretty hard in the past, but these days, I have heart rate to spare when I run and typically exhaust my leg muscles or lung capacity. In any case, I'll be sure to pay close attention and dig up my heart rate monitoring watch and take it easy. 

 

Should I get used to the amphets first and then resume running/working out? How long would that take?



#81 Glazing Agent

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 07:09 AM

 

 

 

 

 

For what it's worth, I hurt my ankle from running too much 2 days ago. I took the day off yesterday from the usual 10km/6mile multi-session jog and the Adderall just didn't hit like it usually does. None of the usual mild-euphoria, intellectual endurance, cleaning fanaticism... it's as if the 'tolerance' woes that many of you speak of hit me like a ton of bricks. 

Today on the other hand, I hit the treadmill twice and bada-bing, bada-boom, the magic's back. Tolerance isn't inevitable. If you want the magic past the initial free-lunch period, you have to work for it to work.

If you want to keep your receptor sites sensitive and amp up your brain's dopamine, forget about the memantine/DXM/Selegiline... (or at least don't regard supplement X/Y/Z as the primary answer). 

Exercise, IS the ultimate nootropic. It has the power to do vastly more than pills and augment said pills tenfold in one fell swoop. It's the magic bullet that brings the Adderall magic day-in-day out without the need for taking any days off or elevating the dose.

If you want Adderall to work again like it used to, I challenge you to obtain a pedometer, ensure you get at least 10,000 steps a day with at least 2 sessions of fast walking/jogging/running, everyday for two weeks. 

If your Adderall doesn't kickass again, call me out. 

I imagine lisdexamphetamine or dexedrine (I'm going with mixed salts are a risk theory) could also be used to create good workout habits as well and effectively treat obesity in the long term?

 

Certainly could! I should really issue a strong caution on this matter though. Anyone that's going to be starting a workout regime for the first time should take it really really easy at first. I only take 10mg Adderall... and I'm in good shape. But heart palpitations, strokes, heart attacks are a very real danger if you exert yourself too much when not used to it.

Also, if you take a relatively high dose and don't get much from it, exercise has the potential to make it really hit hard and if your body isn't used to that, it could be problematic.

So please, if anyone reading this is a little out of shape or takes a hardy dose of Adderall this could be a very dangerous thing to do so ease into it.
 
On the point of developing good workout habits, Cryonics, there is huge potential in using these drugs to treat obesity longterm. The thing is, stimulants and exercise have this virtuous cycle. They both meld they're addictive properties together when you combine them. It does take a little while of real effort to reach a state where you start craving exercise but it does happen which is all-round the best form of addiction imo. 

 

Edit: on the point about fat storage, Cry, there is a healthy level of fat. It may be hard to imagine someone wanting fat, but for bony ectomorphs a healthy layer of fat is a good thing and is often desired.

 

I've tried to get addicted to cardio, but it never worked out for me... Here's hoping for the best ;)

 

I guess we always want the opposite of what we have... Having read up on ecto/meso/endomorphs, I definitely prefer ectos in the opposite sex and will probably order an ecto body to put my brain in post thaw. 

 

 

Cryonics -  I'd have to second the strong caution for newly prescribed adderall users exercising. 

 

I wasn't told about most of the side effects, like an increase heart rate, and I damn near blacked out the first time I dead lifted on adderall. My heart felt like it was vibrating.

 

adderall is more effective for weight loss than dexedrine, but they're similar. It will increase your metabolism and suppress your hunger. That combined with the kick in the ass to get up and work should shave off a lot of weight, both muscle and fat. I've read people's posts on bodybuilding that say they lost 40 lbs in a month taking it. It's not how I would recommend losing weight, but whatever works. 

 

Of course, you'll gain it all back when you have to stop taking it everyday...

 

Edit: Not sure if I would want to be an endo though... I like food way too much. 

 

So lisdex and dex still help with weight loss, just not as much as adderall? How much of a difference are we talking? It may be worth forming my own opinion on the danger of mixed salt amphets. 

 

I'm pretty good at moderating my workout. I've pushed my heart pretty hard in the past, but these days, I have heart rate to spare when I run and typically exhaust my leg muscles or lung capacity. In any case, I'll be sure to pay close attention and dig up my heart rate monitoring watch and take it easy. 

 

Should I get used to the amphets first and then resume running/working out? How long would that take?

 

From my understanding, there are two levels that stimulants work on when it comes to weight loss. There's the primary appetite suppression level due to the adrenaline release and then there's the controlling impulse side. If Adderall works better for the impulse control than dex or lisdex, then that could be a reason for it. Dex/lisdex could be the better choice for you. Everyones physiology reacts differently. I'd imagine the impulse control aspect is where most the weight loss effects come in to play for people so it's a little more/different than just making you not hungry. Being able to more easily keep oneself from going out for junkfood/resisting snackfood is an effect that I think all psychostimulants will exhibit. (provided they are in full effect a la regular exercise ;)

If you're already moderately active, you keep an eye on your heart rate and you don't have any existing heart problems, sounds like you'd be totally fine.

Get used to them to the point where you know they aren't dangerously increasing your heart rate/blood pressure. Then maybe try a brisk walk, stop and assess and then maybe do a little more. Baby steps though, just in case. 

Obligatory: I'm just some random dude on the internet. If you need medical advise, your doctor is far more qualified and aware of your medical status than me.


Edited by Glazing Agent, 08 August 2014 - 07:21 AM.


#82 TheBatman

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 07:44 AM

 

 

 

 

 

 

For what it's worth, I hurt my ankle from running too much 2 days ago. I took the day off yesterday from the usual 10km/6mile multi-session jog and the Adderall just didn't hit like it usually does. None of the usual mild-euphoria, intellectual endurance, cleaning fanaticism... it's as if the 'tolerance' woes that many of you speak of hit me like a ton of bricks. 

Today on the other hand, I hit the treadmill twice and bada-bing, bada-boom, the magic's back. Tolerance isn't inevitable. If you want the magic past the initial free-lunch period, you have to work for it to work.

If you want to keep your receptor sites sensitive and amp up your brain's dopamine, forget about the memantine/DXM/Selegiline... (or at least don't regard supplement X/Y/Z as the primary answer). 

Exercise, IS the ultimate nootropic. It has the power to do vastly more than pills and augment said pills tenfold in one fell swoop. It's the magic bullet that brings the Adderall magic day-in-day out without the need for taking any days off or elevating the dose.

If you want Adderall to work again like it used to, I challenge you to obtain a pedometer, ensure you get at least 10,000 steps a day with at least 2 sessions of fast walking/jogging/running, everyday for two weeks. 

If your Adderall doesn't kickass again, call me out. 

I imagine lisdexamphetamine or dexedrine (I'm going with mixed salts are a risk theory) could also be used to create good workout habits as well and effectively treat obesity in the long term?

 

Certainly could! I should really issue a strong caution on this matter though. Anyone that's going to be starting a workout regime for the first time should take it really really easy at first. I only take 10mg Adderall... and I'm in good shape. But heart palpitations, strokes, heart attacks are a very real danger if you exert yourself too much when not used to it.

Also, if you take a relatively high dose and don't get much from it, exercise has the potential to make it really hit hard and if your body isn't used to that, it could be problematic.

So please, if anyone reading this is a little out of shape or takes a hardy dose of Adderall this could be a very dangerous thing to do so ease into it.
 
On the point of developing good workout habits, Cryonics, there is huge potential in using these drugs to treat obesity longterm. The thing is, stimulants and exercise have this virtuous cycle. They both meld they're addictive properties together when you combine them. It does take a little while of real effort to reach a state where you start craving exercise but it does happen which is all-round the best form of addiction imo. 

 

Edit: on the point about fat storage, Cry, there is a healthy level of fat. It may be hard to imagine someone wanting fat, but for bony ectomorphs a healthy layer of fat is a good thing and is often desired.

 

I've tried to get addicted to cardio, but it never worked out for me... Here's hoping for the best ;)

 

I guess we always want the opposite of what we have... Having read up on ecto/meso/endomorphs, I definitely prefer ectos in the opposite sex and will probably order an ecto body to put my brain in post thaw. 

 

 

Cryonics -  I'd have to second the strong caution for newly prescribed adderall users exercising. 

 

I wasn't told about most of the side effects, like an increase heart rate, and I damn near blacked out the first time I dead lifted on adderall. My heart felt like it was vibrating.

 

adderall is more effective for weight loss than dexedrine, but they're similar. It will increase your metabolism and suppress your hunger. That combined with the kick in the ass to get up and work should shave off a lot of weight, both muscle and fat. I've read people's posts on bodybuilding that say they lost 40 lbs in a month taking it. It's not how I would recommend losing weight, but whatever works. 

 

Of course, you'll gain it all back when you have to stop taking it everyday...

 

Edit: Not sure if I would want to be an endo though... I like food way too much. 

 

So lisdex and dex still help with weight loss, just not as much as adderall? How much of a difference are we talking? It may be worth forming my own opinion on the danger of mixed salt amphets. 

 

I'm pretty good at moderating my workout. I've pushed my heart pretty hard in the past, but these days, I have heart rate to spare when I run and typically exhaust my leg muscles or lung capacity. In any case, I'll be sure to pay close attention and dig up my heart rate monitoring watch and take it easy. 

 

Should I get used to the amphets first and then resume running/working out? How long would that take?

 

From my understanding, there are two levels that stimulants work on when it comes to weight loss. There's the primary appetite suppression level due to the adrenaline release and then there's the controlling impulse side. If Adderall works better for the impulse control than dex or lisdex, then that could be a reason for it. Dex/lisdex could be the better choice for you. Everyones physiology reacts differently. I'd imagine the impulse control aspect is where most the weight loss effects come in to play for people so it's a little more/different than just making you not hungry. Being able to more easily keep oneself from going out for junkfood/resisting snackfood is an effect that I think all psychostimulants will exhibit. (provided they are in full effect a la regular exercise ;)

If you're already moderately active, you keep an eye on your heart rate and you don't have any existing heart problems, sounds like you'd be totally fine.

Get used to them to the point where you know they aren't dangerously increasing your heart rate/blood pressure. Then maybe try a brisk walk, stop and assess and then maybe do a little more. Baby steps though, just in case. 

Obligatory: I'm just some random dude on the internet. If you need medical advise, your doctor is far more qualified and aware of your medical status then I.

 

cryonics - Well I can't calculate any numbers for you :) but Adderall is made up of both L amphetamine and D amphetamine. The main difference between the two is that L amp. releases much more NE than D amp. NE is tied to weight loss therefore Adderall is more likely to cause the most weight loss. How much more would vary on the individual.

 

Here's an excellent thread comparing dexadrine to adderall over at mind and muscle: http://www.mindandmu...ut-experiences 

 

Glazing - I ate far worse on adderall because I had no appetite for anything that wasn't sweet! Hell I would forget about lunch all the time.

 

 

 

 



#83 YOLF

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 06:09 PM

Ok, so given that adderall gives you a sweet tooth and I already have one, I better stick to dex/lisdex? Maybe I'll try each one for a month an see which one helps me the most.



#84 medicineman

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 06:27 PM

I thought the main difference was the ability to cross the bbb. l-amphetamine doesn't cross the bbb so well, and thus it's effects are predominantly peripheral. d-amp on the other hand does. am I correct?

#85 YOLF

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 06:54 PM

IME peripheral isn't necessarily bad. We can take things that don't cross the BBB and because they are metabolized by the periphery nervous system they are able to have in impact on one's neurochemistry. It could be that the periphery effects in combination with the direct central effects create more positive activity and more dispersed toxicity (if any) which could be safer... We need to do another study :) I guess these conversations always go in this direction...



#86 TheBatman

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Posted 09 August 2014 - 12:47 AM

Ok, so given that adderall gives you a sweet tooth and I already have one, I better stick to dex/lisdex? Maybe I'll try each one for a month an see which one helps me the most.

 

They both suppress hunger, but yes I would try each one of them for a month to see which one you like. I tend to prefer adderall because it has more of a nootropic effect than dexadrine. However I would go with dexedrine first if you can. It would be better if you could get away with it because it has a smaller side effect profile. 

 

If you want to accurately compare the two though, you have to get the dose right. Adderall is roughly made up of 75% D amphetamine 25% L amphetamine. Most people would assume taking 20 mg of adderall would be the same as 15 mg dexedrine, but due to the salts being heavier in adderall it actually comes closer to 65% of a D amphetamine base in one dose. This is part of a post by ExDubio from mind and muscle that goes into detail about what i'm talking about: "Amphetamine's molecular weight is 135.2 daltons. The weight of the sulfate ion is 96 daltons. The weight of the aspartate ion is 133.1 dalts. And the weight of the saccharate ion is 210.14 daltons. 

Dexedrine 10mg thus contains (135.2)/(135.2+96)*(10mg) = 5.85mg d-amphetamine base.

Adderall 10mg is 3/8 d-amphetamine sulfate, 1/4 d-amphetamine saccharate, 1/8 d-amphetamine aspartate, 1/8 l-amphetamine aspartate, and 1/8 l-amphetamine sulfate.

Adderall 10mg thus contains (135.2)/(135.2+96)*(3/8)*(10mg) + (135.2)/(135.2+210.14)*(1/4)*(10mg) + (135.2)/(135.2+133.1)*(1/8)*(10mg) = 3.8mg d-amphetamine base. 

Adderall 10mg also contains (135.2)/(135.2+96)*(1/8)*(10mg) + (135.2)/(135.2+133.1)*(1/8)*(10mg) = 1.36mg l-amphetamine base.

The point here is that although Adderall is "3/4 d-amphetamine" (75%), it actually has only 65% of the d-amphetamine base as a corresponding dose of Dexedrine. This may seem like a small difference, but consider that 60mg Adderall contains 22.8mg d-amphetamine base, whereas 60mg Dexedrine contains 35.1mg d-amphetamine base. That's an enormous difference, and so you need to adjust dosing appropriately.
"

 

I thought the main difference was the ability to cross the bbb. l-amphetamine doesn't cross the bbb so well, and thus it's effects are predominantly peripheral. d-amp on the other hand does. am I correct?

 

Nope they both do. They both also have significant peripheral effects

 

IME peripheral isn't necessarily bad. We can take things that don't cross the BBB and because they are metabolized by the periphery nervous system they are able to have in impact on one's neurochemistry. It could be that the periphery effects in combination with the direct central effects create more positive activity and more dispersed toxicity (if any) which could be safer... We need to do another study :) I guess these conversations always go in this direction...

 

It's never easy is it? :)


Edited by TheBatman, 09 August 2014 - 01:00 AM.


#87 YOLF

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Posted 09 August 2014 - 01:25 AM

Never! Not once! Not ever! lol :)


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#88 Kewell357

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 04:04 AM

Any update?



#89 YOLF

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Posted 06 January 2015 - 12:34 AM

I've had 3 scripts for it so far... but it's $300+  and my present insurance doesn't want to cover it due to my previously having side effects due to high anxiety levels which wisdom has since remedied... I haven't had a chance to get on top of all the details yet, but my current job contract ends at the end of this month so I'll have some time to get it all figured out during business hours if I don't immediately have another job. Just switched providers too, so this could take some time.., I'll see what I can do when I get a chance to get another script for it.

 

In the mean time, I'm still finding significant attention related benefits from supplement combinations. I've been keeping track of it here and have more updates to post as I continue to experiment.


Edited by PerC, 06 January 2015 - 12:35 AM.


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#90 NeuroGeneration

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Posted 01 September 2015 - 03:39 PM

MedicineMan & GlazingAgent – Its been a year since your initial posts about the splendors of Adderall. Can you report back, for the community's benefit?

 

•Was tolerance kept at bay?

 

•Did you experience any negative effects?

 

•If you came off of it for a substantial amount of time, did you experience any negatives?

 

•If you're still taking it, can you describe how it affects you and the dosage?

 

Thanks!







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