3 replies to this topic

[Diego55]

Does anyone have any experience with neuroptimal in case of anxiety related issues ? I am currently  deciding between Neuroptimal rental system for 30 days or TAGsync protocol. With TAGsnyc I will have to buy whole EEG equipment and I will also need to learn how to operate it since I am lay user and beginner in this field.

 

I suffering from social anxiety-phobia with GAD and depression. Which option would you recommend me ?

 

Thanks

[macropsia]

Try a few sessions from a provider before you think about buying neuroptimal. I think it is great in some ways, but there are some definite problems with Zengar's approach business-wise that makes me question their intentions. If you opt for the q wiz, there is a learning curve, but it can run many protocols besides TAG. I feel it is only a matter of time before someone else learns the 'neat trick' Val came across developing NO, thereby allowing the masses to play with it and develop something better and configurable. (Hint: auto-wiggling thresholds that stop music playback for 32 ms per. Everything else about NO is disappointingly by-the-book alpha-theta, SMR and synchrony, run through the unique threshold system).

[umop 3pisdn]

I haven't used Neuroptimal, but training Entropy might be kind of similar. I remember that Neuroptimal has to do with alerting you to 'turbulence' so you can smooth it out. Entropy training reduces variance in the EEG and is associated with increasing one's cortical microstates (which is basically a sort of indeterminate/undeployed state of deeply relaxed 'readiness'), and training involves intentionally disengaging from distracting thoughts and volitional formations, and cultivating a sense of mental quietude. I'm not saying that the mechanisms are necessarily anything alike, but they do sound kind of similar. And I really like Entropy training. I have no clue how Neuroptimal works (which is kind of the problem I have with giving them any of my money), but Entropy might fill a similar training niche, and you can get some Bioexplorer designs from NorthStar Neurofeedback for pretty cheap.

 

Entropy training is also extremely synergistic with TAGsync. In some ways they're functionally opposite, since TAGsync might be interpreted as a form of amplitude training, and Entropy training decreases amplitude, but they actually go very well together, they probably train two different kinds of mental flexibility and there is a degree of useful skill transfer (doing a session of Entropy training first lets me have a quiet mind so I can get into the TAGsync 'state' with less distraction, for example).

Edited by umop 3pisdn, 11 February 2015 - 07:54 AM.

[Diego55]

thanks for informations and advice, I appreciate it.

 

no, I do not have any option to try neuroptimal for a few sessions with a provider. I am from Europe and there are not any neuroptimal providers in my country neither in  neighbourning countries. I can only take opportunity of renting neuroptimal for 30 days.

 

Anyway, I would rather try some professional trainers supervision first. Today I was calling with a EEG trainer from my area and i could possibly try 10-20 sessions with their eeg biofeedback in their centre (they also doing beginning diagnostic-assessment, that is probably essential as i read ). After initial training I may rent their equipment for a month with online support and consultation during that period. But on the other hand, i still do know nothing about their reputation and it is rather a private provider than specialized clinic in NFB field with psychologists and other staffs . I know they only use equipment from a czech company alien.cz with software - Brainfeedback2. It should look like as showen below:

https://translate.go...t-text=&act=url

 

http://amber.feld.cv...infeedback2.png

 

... so I assume it wont be so powerful as for example TAGsync or neuroptimal system are (but i can be wrong about this). It will cost me only around 200 dollars for a month with unlimited number of sessions.

 

What do you think about this option? According to you, will it be waste of time ? I would rather invest my money (though a lot more) to something what is proven to work than something that "looks like" it could help and I have not found any review, feedback about it yet.

 

What is your opinion ?  thanks.