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what are some nootropics to avoid falling in love?

love oxytocin neurotransmitter nootropic

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#1 eon

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Posted 09 June 2015 - 08:19 AM


I know everyone wants to be in love (not me right now). I know for some it feels good to be in love but after it fizzles out, all the hurt in the world is NOTHING compared to getting your heart broken. I think oxytocin plays a role here when people fall in love. I'm more of a "lust" kind of guy, but sometimes I do get that feeling of love (maybe I'm whipped at times, honestly). But here's the story, a girl thinks I'm hot, I also think she is, this somehow make me feel good in a weird way (i.e. not a dopaminergic type of feel good but more oxytocin). My anticipation and eventual outcome out of all this "love" feelings (oxytocin) is that it's only a matter of time til I get crushed. This girl will play games with me. I know it already from experience. Fact is, when a man falls in love their testosterone levels drop while a woman's increases (when she knows she got you by the balls). I do not want to get held back and distracted by all this "love" thing (since I am more of a "lust" thing). Question is, how do I "block" this oxytocin release I've been having? How do I NOT fall in love to begin with? I'm simply not ready for it NOW. I'm not in a good position to be “in love” and I'm not in a good position to get crushed by it either so how do I get my self immune to this oxytocin release?
 
There was a talk on a forum that I read about that oxytocin can be problematic or if it's in excess (when people fall in love) as I think the crash and or depression is deeper when it all goes down the toilet as it will (no good thing lasts forever). Such oxytocin "crash" is different emotionally than a dopaminergic "crash" (if such thing exist) from amphetamine use. This is my assumption only and it's a very strong one. The talk in the forum I read about was I think from reddit, someone was asking about an oxytocin spray as nootropic and was told it's not necessary.

I can't remember right now exactly what the whole story is with oxytocin (a somewhat obscure neurotransmitter if you ask me). It's not as popular as dopamine or serotonin in other words. For some odd reason, I'm happier not to feel love but it does happen when one makes you feel it then you end up returning the favor. I'm actually happier lusting over someone and vice versa rather have having emotions involved. Oxytocin seem like a dark horse to me.


#2 fanta2y

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Posted 09 June 2015 - 10:11 PM

SSRIs


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#3 eon

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Posted 10 June 2015 - 11:32 AM

Cool.

 

SSRIs

 


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#4 Mind_Paralysis

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Posted 10 June 2015 - 11:49 AM

Can't think of any Nootropics - but I do know of a very powerful tool that helps with any sort of influx of emotion:

LITHIUM.

 

Take your pick between the various salts, but I would recommend the orotate-formulation, since you can use lower doses with that, and hence avoid toxicity to some degree.


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#5 eon

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Posted 10 June 2015 - 12:50 PM

i'm not bipolar. I tried a form of OTC lithium before but the heart rate wasn't good neither was my mood. Serotonin syndrome is a concern as well. From what I understand fish oils (prescription especially) stabilizes moods. But the fact that the girl is chasing me and makes me want to chase her back seem as if out of my control nor do I think there's even a drug for what I described about at the start of the thread. I'm sure ignoring someone is easy said than done. Maybe I need to up my dose of Vyvanse so I can be hyper focused and ignore ALL distractions surrounding me? I actually think my ADHD is at play here? I'm only on 30 mg Vyvanse.

 

I hope this thread isn't as stupid as the title sounds LOL but there's something about oxytocin that I do not like. People fall in and out of love and when one falls out of love, some people take YEARS to get over it and are sometimes scarred by it. Amygdala may be at play as well considering the emotions and memories it regulates.


Edited by eon, 10 June 2015 - 12:55 PM.


#6 Flex

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Posted 10 June 2015 - 06:36 PM

SSRi´s can cause perresitent sexual disorders aka PSSD.

You dont want that, believe me ! though it doesnt affekt everyone but it could affect You.

 

Serotonine is defineatly the Neurotransmitter which abolishes love, so I would use something OTC that raises Serotonine or Trycylics because the dont cause PSSD afaik.

5-htp also decreases via the 5-ht1a receptor oxitocin. However the effects of Oxi are sometimes overestimated and in some regards even contradictory..

 

Anyway, because of my Pot abuse when I was young(adolescence), I cant fall in love at all, so for 17 Years ! altough I´m able to feel emotions and weed dont change that.

but I´m not sure whether it would do something to You + the side effects like anxiety and perhaps OCD could make it too problematic.

 

Dont know, I would try to find another girl just for distraction i.e. to park Your feelings and desires elsewhere :happy: .

It helps me at least.


Edited by Flex, 10 June 2015 - 06:48 PM.

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#7 ironfistx

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Posted 10 June 2015 - 09:38 PM

This girl wants you to chase her, but if you do not, it will just make her chas eyou more.

 

Love is basically a drug addiction.  You need to have other things going on in your life dso you don't become completely dependent on her.  It's hard, because th emore you like someone the easier it is to get into that routine.  The way you can do this is to be with people that you're not really super interested in, but that seems like it wouldn't be what you really want.  I mean.  Most people want to be with someone they really like.  When the interaction with someone you like ends, it can be like stopping a drug, I'm told.  Withdrawal, etc.  The thing that is confusing to me is that I was fine for years by myself, then I got into a relationship with someone and when it ended and I wasn't happy and i really haven't been back to normal since.  I mean, you get with other people and it's all good, but that's like going from one substance to another.  In a description like that I feel good, I am social, motivated, I like doing hinsg.  Then if you have a bad breakup it sucks for a while.  You have to just kind of see how things are going, and don't let yourself become so attached to the other person that if you have to leave the relationship it will efaffect you that much.  I mean you will be in that situation if you liek soeoone, but don't let it get TOO much.  Plus, that kind of behavior ais something that you can feel and it can push the other person away.



#8 metanoia

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Posted 11 June 2015 - 04:00 AM

haven't tested this myself, but i've heard that naltrexone, the opiod antagonist, does this. it makes sense. it is easily available from the usual internet sources.


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#9 eon

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Posted 11 June 2015 - 07:35 AM

Problem here is I work with the girl. The scenario that could happen here is she'll play hook-up with another person at work to make me feel like shit. And when that works I'm the "powerless" one. It would be nice to have a super confidence without emotions. I think something like methamphetamine would make one this way. The German army were confident, didn't have emotions when they did all those horrible things (from my point of view that's confidence and lack of emotion). Sometimes this type of personality is what's needed in a cruel world. I still think my Vyvanse dose is too low to feel any confidence where I could easily ignore any background BS and be more self centered and all focus on me only.

 

Are you saying raising serotonin is what I'm looking for? I thought depletion is more like it?

 

Regarding SSRIs, I used to use Zoloft, but with Seroquel. I did feel some attachment when on the Zoloft SSRI so I don't get what you guys mean that serotonin is involved here. Maybe the Seroquel canceled out the SSRI effect of the Zoloft? Not that I would want any SSRIs nowadays. Is what you're saying is depletion of serotonin is what makes one NOT fall in love? If that's the case, I wonder if Ghandi's use of Reserpine to deplete serotonin may have something to do with him being the way he is and focused on the more important things, I don' believe he was ever married? I could be wrong. Not sure what Mother Theresa was on either. But as I mentioned at the start of the thread, it would be nice to have some compound to work its magic when needed, as needed. Right now, I have no time for that love thing. And if I ever fall for it and fall out of it, I want to make sure I'm ready and not be stuck for years into depression like in the past (think high school!). Ever wonder why those teenagers are depressed because there's too much emotions during those years and some never get over it and take their grudge for the rest of their lives without ever knowing how to deplete all those negative emotions from their minds.

 

What should I be looking for then? A serotonin antagonist? Considering it acts on the amygdala as well, maybe it can help with emotions and fear. See this quote about Lysine, a serotonin antagonist:

 

Lysine has a anxiolytic action through its effects on serotonin receptors in the intestinal tract, and is also hypothesized to reduce anxiety through serotonin regulation in the amygdala.[40] One study on rats[41] showed that overstimulation of the 5-HT4 receptors in the gut are associated with anxiety-induced intestinal pathology. Lysine, acting as a serotonin antagonist and therefore reducing the overactivity of these receptors, reduced signs of anxiety and anxiety-induced diarrhea in the sample population. Another study showed that lysine deficiency leads to a pathological increase in serotonin in the amygdala, a brain structure that is involved in emotional regulation and the stress response.[40]Human studies have also shown correlations between reduced lysine intake and anxiety. A population-based study in Syria included 93 families whose diet is primarily grain-based and therefore likely to be deficient in lysine. Fortification of grains with lysine was shown to reduce markers of anxiety, including cortisol levels; Smiriga and colleagues hypothesized that anxiety reduction from lysine occurs through mechanism of serotonin alterations in the central amygdala; older primary research reports hypothesized lysine to reduce anxiety through the potentiation of benzodiazepine receptors (common targets of anxiolytic drugs such as Xanax and Ativan).[42] (Note that all of these studies were funded by Ajinomoto, Co. Inc., an industrial manufacturer of lysine.)

 

SSRi´s can cause perresitent sexual disorders aka PSSD.

You dont want that, believe me ! though it doesnt affekt everyone but it could affect You.

 

Serotonine is defineatly the Neurotransmitter which abolishes love, so I would use something OTC that raises Serotonine or Trycylics because the dont cause PSSD afaik.

5-htp also decreases via the 5-ht1a receptor oxitocin. However the effects of Oxi are sometimes overestimated and in some regards even contradictory..

 

Anyway, because of my Pot abuse when I was young(adolescence), I cant fall in love at all, so for 17 Years ! altough I´m able to feel emotions and weed dont change that.

but I´m not sure whether it would do something to You + the side effects like anxiety and perhaps OCD could make it too problematic.

 

Dont know, I would try to find another girl just for distraction i.e. to park Your feelings and desires elsewhere :happy: .

It helps me at least.

 


Edited by eon, 11 June 2015 - 07:56 AM.


#10 eon

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Posted 11 June 2015 - 07:46 AM

I wonder if Tianeptine is what I'm looking for here? It does have actions on the opioid receptor and is a mild analgesic, it is also I think partially a tricyclic antidepressant (TCA). Considering someone here mentioned that TCAs could work on not falling into "love"?

 

haven't tested this myself, but i've heard that naltrexone, the opiod antagonist, does this. it makes sense. it is easily available from the usual internet sources.

 



#11 HappyShoe

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Posted 11 June 2015 - 08:36 AM

http://www.economist.com/node/2424049
Love is a few things, but it's essentially Hormones first, then Obsessive Compulsive disorder, then the reward circuitry of addiction. These correspond to the phases of love, 'love at first sight' or lust, followed by romantic love, followed by long term bonding which is similar to addiction.
This is all so complex, and would require so many different drugs, that it's pretty difficult to do, and even if you could, the health consequences would be pretty extreme. You wouldn't even be yourself anymore. You'd have to be on SSRIs long term, as well as anti-psychotics, and maybe some cannabis(tends to dampen emotions in many people-anecdotal). This wouldn't be worth it, and could have many consequences. For one thing, SSRIs can cause permanent impotence in men, even after discontinuation, as well as other 'great' side effects that you would just 'love'. (Love my puns!) lol

The most obvious thing to do would be just to use willpower, and compartmentalize your mind/emotions, and not care, maybe write down a mantra about what to do/think/feel to affirm your wishes to yourself every day around her. Limit touching. Cut out all non-essential interaction.

Really though, it's just a bad idea to get involved with someone if you don't plan on committing, and unless they agree with the situation, frankly it's kind of immoral.

As far as you worrying about the 'negative' effects about being in love/relationships; men in relationships live longer, experience less stress(which has other unique health benefits), are potentially happier, and regular sex(not just masturbation) raises testosterone levels. I'm pretty sure men's testosterone levels also only drop once they become fathers, or are in very long term relationships, and that might be a tainted sample since many married couples have less frequent sex than new/young couples.

So either establish firm boundaries and guidelines with her, and make sure you both keep it very casual, no flirting, spending time together, etc.
Or avoid the situation entirely.
Or suck it up, and let go of your preconceived negative perspective concerning her/love and embrace it.


Edited by HappyShoe, 11 June 2015 - 08:37 AM.

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#12 Ark

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Posted 11 June 2015 - 09:33 AM

My suggestion are only hypothetical in nature.

But I think, Naridal+ lithuim + NAC might shield you for a while. But overcoming love, is like attempting to stop sleeping.
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#13 Ark

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Posted 11 June 2015 - 09:35 AM

SSRIs


SSRIs I believe will make you fall more in love, similar to MDMA, I think your looking for SSRUs like Tianeptine.
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#14 eon

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Posted 11 June 2015 - 11:23 AM

My suggestion are only hypothetical in nature.

But I think, Naridal+ lithuim + NAC might shield you for a while. But overcoming love, is like attempting to stop sleeping.

 

But sleep is not exactly like love at all. LOL. I could sleep fine. I'd have to look into NAC, I only know that compound as for OCD, maybe the obsession part of OCD is where NAC helps.

 

 

SSRIs


SSRIs I believe will make you fall more in love, similar to MDMA, I think your looking for SSRUs like Tianeptine.

 

 

As I had mentioned already, I think Tianeptine has potential as well to what I was seeking out. Regarding SSRIs, I do agree that it may make one fall for another because it makes one vulnerable in my opinion. I think Zoloft brought some manic episodes which made me seek out attention as well or any attention given to me I was open to take it then when it's all over< i was back in a depressive state.



#15 eon

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Posted 11 June 2015 - 11:27 AM

The point I was making at the start of the thread was that when one falls in love, it feels good til someone drops the bomb on you and say it's all over. It happens. How does one deal with the depression that's to come after one is done "loving"? Another point I was making was that I am not in a position to be in love which is why I must avoid it. Therefore, I was looking into an oxytocin blocker if such thing exists. So that way , any love thrown at me, it won't be "stored" into my mind so that when it becomes over, it WON"T be a downward spiral from there on considering I had no attachment.

 

 

http://www.economist.com/node/2424049
Love is a few things, but it's essentially Hormones first, then Obsessive Compulsive disorder, then the reward circuitry of addiction. These correspond to the phases of love, 'love at first sight' or lust, followed by romantic love, followed by long term bonding which is similar to addiction.
This is all so complex, and would require so many different drugs, that it's pretty difficult to do, and even if you could, the health consequences would be pretty extreme. You wouldn't even be yourself anymore. You'd have to be on SSRIs long term, as well as anti-psychotics, and maybe some cannabis(tends to dampen emotions in many people-anecdotal). This wouldn't be worth it, and could have many consequences. For one thing, SSRIs can cause permanent impotence in men, even after discontinuation, as well as other 'great' side effects that you would just 'love'. (Love my puns!) lol

The most obvious thing to do would be just to use willpower, and compartmentalize your mind/emotions, and not care, maybe write down a mantra about what to do/think/feel to affirm your wishes to yourself every day around her. Limit touching. Cut out all non-essential interaction.

Really though, it's just a bad idea to get involved with someone if you don't plan on committing, and unless they agree with the situation, frankly it's kind of immoral.

As far as you worrying about the 'negative' effects about being in love/relationships; men in relationships live longer, experience less stress(which has other unique health benefits), are potentially happier, and regular sex(not just masturbation) raises testosterone levels. I'm pretty sure men's testosterone levels also only drop once they become fathers, or are in very long term relationships, and that might be a tainted sample since many married couples have less frequent sex than new/young couples.

So either establish firm boundaries and guidelines with her, and make sure you both keep it very casual, no flirting, spending time together, etc.
Or avoid the situation entirely.
Or suck it up, and let go of your preconceived negative perspective concerning her/love and embrace it.

 


Edited by eon, 11 June 2015 - 11:30 AM.


#16 TrippyUniverse

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Posted 11 June 2015 - 12:39 PM

Hey man, going through the same shit atm,my primitive brain falls in love with a girl, and it doesn't work out. And then the shit storm in my brain starts, every few seconds a random thought appears combined with a "stab in the heart" because of the hormones. Its hard and annoying, and if you have no self-awareness you get depressed. This life is a fucking war against our primitive brain, with the power of knowledge and mindfullness meditiation, we shall win! Honestly tho, i think the more you meditate,the easier you can handle  these kind of "brain problems". Its the frontal cortex against everyone,the more you train it, the stronger it will become. sorry for my bad inglysh



#17 sthira

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Posted 11 June 2015 - 01:12 PM

Yeah, I get where you're coming from, too. I'd been in a really sweet, wonderful relationship for nearly three years when suddenly she dropped the bomb on me in February. It fucking sucks, man, all the stabbing wounds and depression. It very much is like a drug addiction, love: sigh. But I really don't think you're going to have much success popping substances to thwart your biological calling to couple up, mate, procreate. SSRIs will kill your libido, but not so much your desire to love and connect. Meditation is a great idea, and part of the solution, which I think will require a multi-pronged strategy that's very personal to you. Avoid her. She may chase you even more, though. Wish I could help more -- I'm still going through the after effects of a broken love affair, and have few answers. Time helps wound the broken heart. Sorta. But avoiding the broken heart altogether? Well... Live in a cave maybe? Hermit?
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#18 Flex

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Posted 11 June 2015 - 06:23 PM

Meth could do it but the cruelity by the soldiers wasnt entirely related to it. think of the bosnian- or other wars, they do it without drugs..

I would look into other receptors and path ways.

 

Ok I said it wrong, SSRI could increase(?) Your emotions but it will prevent to fall in love per se.

I can have strong emotions and attachment which is similair with OCD but its not the Love who I flet when I was 13. Nowadays it just dissapears after a few weeks.

 

References:

 

Scientists are closing in on a cure for love, but should they go ahead with it?

http://www.independe...t-10037161.html

 

If I Could Just Stop Loving You: Anti-Love Biotechnology and the Ethics of a Chemical Breakup

In their study, participants who had recently fallen in love—still in the intense first stage of a relationship, but prior to intercourse—showed levels of the platelet 5-HT transporter similar to those of a sample of OCD patients, with both groups showing lower levels than healthy controls. As the authors concluded, “It would suggest that being in love literally induces a state which is not normal” (743). Indeed, retesting the lovers at 12–18 months revealed that serotonin levels had returned to baseline—at which point their “obsessive ideation regarding the partner” had disappeared as well

http://www.ncbi.nlm....les/PMC3898540/

 

As Happyshoe said, dopamine antagonists and maybe 5-ht2b antagonists (who I believe to dull emotions, has an impact on the amygdala but therefore also cause fear and dampens esteem) could help. Cyproheptadine, Mianserine and perhaps agomelatine could do this.

 

Role of serotonin via 5-HT2B receptors in the reinforcing effects of MDMA in mice.

These results underpin the importance of 5-HT(2B) receptors in the reinforcing properties of MDMA and illustrate the importance of dose-dependent effects of MDMA on serotonin/dopamine interactions.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/19956756

 

but

 

Activation of 5-HT2B Receptors in the Medial Amygdala causes Anxiolysis in the Social Interaction Test in the Rat

http://www.sciencedi...028390897000427

 

I for my self didnt experienced any great anxiety on Cyprohepatdine but Mianserine was awful.

 

My opinion is that Youre predisposed to stronger feelings. Now, why are You wired that way i.e. beeing prone in terms of rejection, emotional dependence & etc. ?

In this case could be a psychological attempt helpful.

 

I had some bad experiences with girls and 2 of them had sociophatic / narcisstic tendencies. The one was absolutely depend on confirmation like an addict. The situation was weird, I´m akward and a looser to her, in addition she needed someone to look up and who leads her. So I wasnt appropiate at all but I was somewhat handsome and had strong feelings to her which gave her something, so she did many things to get me run after her.

 

Anyway, I looked into the internet and found out the narcissitc link and the possible causes. It is rooted in the childhood and related to rigirous parents who dont appreciate and love their child, so she was compensating this with attention.

In this case it was like a drug, she needed it daily ( I could punish her easily just by dont noticing her) . Up to that point where she tried coke to get a "chemical confirmation".

 

I´m telling You that because You might also compensate something and this could be something different than You tought

or its just that You didnt had a good relationship for a long time, dont know.

 

You could also try to understand the girl better and what she likes on You and then maybe interrupt her interrests to You by doing the opposite.

Provided this thinking about it dosesnt cause any OCD, like it was in my case..


Edited by Flex, 11 June 2015 - 06:29 PM.


#19 HappyShoe

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Posted 11 June 2015 - 08:46 PM

http://www.wired.com...ntidepressants/

https://www.psycholo...-love-and-ssris

http://www.ted.com/c...depressant.html

SSRIs treat OCD, love/romance is obsession and is nearly identical to the brain. There have been specific studies on this, one of which I posted a few posts above.
You can't compare MDMA to SSRIs just because MDMA is known for being a serotonin releasing agent, because it also directly increases Oxytocin, as well as Dopamine and Norepinephrine to the same extent.
That perception comes from people's limited understanding of neurotransmitters, and of the actions of MDMA.

You guys are suggesting drugs like Tianeptine, which as a supposed 'SSRE' would decrease serotonin, and increase dopamine. This would worsen OCD, and thereby exacerbate 'love'. Not only that, but any increase in dopamine, is going to increase cravings and addictive tendencies, because dopamine release makes our brain realize what is making it experience pleasure, so it wants more, hence why drugs like cocaine cause binging and repeated dosing.

You can not take SSRIs(in fact, I wouldn't), but taking things with opposite actions is just wrong, since you're doing it with no scientific evidence to support your decision.

Don't take Meth, to do so is incredibly dangerous, EXTREMELY unhealthy, and is going to ruin your life. Meth causes Olney's lesions which eats holes in your brain due to glutamate excitotoxicity. It will also, like I mentioned just a few sentences ago, will increase addictive tendencies and cravings, although that will be the least of your problems.



#20 Ark

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Posted 12 June 2015 - 02:38 AM

http://www.wired.com...ntidepressants/

https://www.psycholo...-love-and-ssris

http://www.ted.com/c...depressant.html

SSRIs treat OCD, love/romance is obsession and is nearly identical to the brain. There have been specific studies on this, one of which I posted a few posts above.
You can't compare MDMA to SSRIs just because MDMA is known for being a serotonin releasing agent, because it also directly increases Oxytocin, as well as Dopamine and Norepinephrine to the same extent.
That perception comes from people's limited understanding of neurotransmitters, and of the actions of MDMA.

You guys are suggesting drugs like Tianeptine, which as a supposed 'SSRE' would decrease serotonin, and increase dopamine. This would worsen OCD, and thereby exacerbate 'love'. Not only that, but any increase in dopamine, is going to increase cravings and addictive tendencies, because dopamine release makes our brain realize what is making it experience pleasure, so it wants more, hence why drugs like cocaine cause binging and repeated dosing.

You can not take SSRIs(in fact, I wouldn't), but taking things with opposite actions is just wrong, since you're doing it with no scientific evidence to support your decision.

Don't take Meth, to do so is incredibly dangerous, EXTREMELY unhealthy, and is going to ruin your life. Meth causes Olney's lesions which eats holes in your brain due to glutamate excitotoxicity. It will also, like I mentioned just a few sentences ago, will increase addictive tendencies and cravings, although that will be the least of your problems.



I was speaking from personal experience, outside of that decreasing serotonin on Tianeptine will work if you take other OCD blockers. MDMA and SSRI's prevent the reuptake along with other things. Presumably both have capability to cause someone to falling much deeper in love by exacerbating the psychological changes present during true love. (Note the similarities end there) A potential alternative is Naridil, would you agree?
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#21 normalizing

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Posted 12 June 2015 - 07:42 AM

effexor worked for me. made me so numb, i actually started getting irritated around the person i was obsessed with wow so fucked up. anyway, long term use of that shit is detrimental, i suggest take it just 2 weeks and dump. very likely love wears off with it by 2 weeks end.


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#22 eon

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Posted 12 June 2015 - 08:07 AM

To be honest I do not know how she is feeling, but me ignoring her seem to be punishing her, which I don't intend. This seem to be hurting her and it's not my intent. But if I give her all my attention that means she got me. This is where the confusion starts. Why can't we just like each other is what I'm all for but she want to make it to be that I LIKE HER MORE THAN SHE LIKES ME. This is a narcissistic move on her part.
 
The more I see her at work , the more her lifestory comes out. She is a bit of a sociopath in that she cares less if she hurts a person's feelings, in fact this is a turn on for her. One day she came in with really short shorts one is not supposed to wear at work. She wore it on the day she knew I would be there because she knew I would be off work the next 2 days. Her body language tells all her story. I've seen her mother and she looks like a former and or current drug abuser. I know that look. In my town, cocaine and heroin are popular, her face tells me she is into coke. I have dated coke fiends before so I KNOW! Her mother came in to work and there was some awkwardness between them too (think Jerry Springer type of people). 
 
I know I am not the problem here. If she could agree to want to see me on the down low, I'd be hers by now, the problem is she want to make a scene and be the center of attention.
 
Today she came in to work, when it's her day off. Got on her uniform then a few hours later went into the bathroom all dressed up and make-up on. She is friendly with the manager which is why she could just do stuff like this. I've dealt with this type of girls before that's why I know the behavior pattern. I don't know if THEY see something in me that they think could get their "fix" on like a drug. Do they see me as vulnerable? I wish I could get in their heads to find out what these types of girls see in me that they feel or think could satisfy their narcissism. 
 
I don't want to brag, but people view me as good looking. The girl think so as well, I think she is as well but for whatever reason there seem to be an ego on her part. I'm thinking that she's thinking I already have another girlfriend and somehow this makes her confused? There's a saying out there that 2 good looking people shouldn't mix, because they will fight over the mirror. LOL. Usually girls prefer their guys not as good looking as them otherwise there's a clash. I like pretty girls but I actually had better relationships with girls that do not look as good as "the pretty girl". The not so good looking girls tend to appreciate me that I am with them (no ego intended here just facts), and I appreciated them for actually being there for me. There is a saying in Chinese that "an ugly wife is a treasure at home" (or somewhere a long those lines).
 
In all honestly, I rarely see 2 good looking people together. It's usually pretty girl with average joe types so that way SHE can look down on him, while HE admires her. It's like seeing a tall girl with a shorter guy, IT'S VERY RARE AND AWKWARD! True story here, a girl dumped me because I was better looking than her! As expected they would never admit it because it is a psychological defeat to her!  

 

 

Meth could do it but the cruelity by the soldiers wasnt entirely related to it. think of the bosnian- or other wars, they do it without drugs..

I would look into other receptors and path ways.

 

Ok I said it wrong, SSRI could increase(?) Your emotions but it will prevent to fall in love per se.

I can have strong emotions and attachment which is similair with OCD but its not the Love who I flet when I was 13. Nowadays it just dissapears after a few weeks.

 

References:

 

Scientists are closing in on a cure for love, but should they go ahead with it?

http://www.independe...t-10037161.html

 

If I Could Just Stop Loving You: Anti-Love Biotechnology and the Ethics of a Chemical Breakup

In their study, participants who had recently fallen in love—still in the intense first stage of a relationship, but prior to intercourse—showed levels of the platelet 5-HT transporter similar to those of a sample of OCD patients, with both groups showing lower levels than healthy controls. As the authors concluded, “It would suggest that being in love literally induces a state which is not normal” (743). Indeed, retesting the lovers at 12–18 months revealed that serotonin levels had returned to baseline—at which point their “obsessive ideation regarding the partner” had disappeared as well

http://www.ncbi.nlm....les/PMC3898540/

 

As Happyshoe said, dopamine antagonists and maybe 5-ht2b antagonists (who I believe to dull emotions, has an impact on the amygdala but therefore also cause fear and dampens esteem) could help. Cyproheptadine, Mianserine and perhaps agomelatine could do this.

 

Role of serotonin via 5-HT2B receptors in the reinforcing effects of MDMA in mice.

These results underpin the importance of 5-HT(2B) receptors in the reinforcing properties of MDMA and illustrate the importance of dose-dependent effects of MDMA on serotonin/dopamine interactions.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/19956756

 

but

 

Activation of 5-HT2B Receptors in the Medial Amygdala causes Anxiolysis in the Social Interaction Test in the Rat

http://www.sciencedi...028390897000427

 

I for my self didnt experienced any great anxiety on Cyprohepatdine but Mianserine was awful.

 

My opinion is that Youre predisposed to stronger feelings. Now, why are You wired that way i.e. beeing prone in terms of rejection, emotional dependence & etc. ?

In this case could be a psychological attempt helpful.

 

I had some bad experiences with girls and 2 of them had sociophatic / narcisstic tendencies. The one was absolutely depend on confirmation like an addict. The situation was weird, I´m akward and a looser to her, in addition she needed someone to look up and who leads her. So I wasnt appropiate at all but I was somewhat handsome and had strong feelings to her which gave her something, so she did many things to get me run after her.

 

Anyway, I looked into the internet and found out the narcissitc link and the possible causes. It is rooted in the childhood and related to rigirous parents who dont appreciate and love their child, so she was compensating this with attention.

In this case it was like a drug, she needed it daily ( I could punish her easily just by dont noticing her) . Up to that point where she tried coke to get a "chemical confirmation".

 

I´m telling You that because You might also compensate something and this could be something different than You tought

or its just that You didnt had a good relationship for a long time, dont know.

 

You could also try to understand the girl better and what she likes on You and then maybe interrupt her interrests to You by doing the opposite.

Provided this thinking about it dosesnt cause any OCD, like it was in my case..

 


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#23 eon

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Posted 12 June 2015 - 08:23 AM

A few disagreements here. I was on an SSRI before, it did not treat OCD, made it worst. From what I've research OCD is not linked with serotonin but more GABA and or glutamate. My OCD vanished with gabaergics, not serotonergics.
 
I don't believe an increase in dopamine will make OCD worst. Regarding the craving tendencies; not sure if my use of Vyvanse somehow made me"crave" the fact that the girl likes me? I was fine had she not open her mouth about it and then started playing games the next day. As if she opened a can of worms here. I was expecting Vyvanse to make me undistractable considering it's a focus drug (amphetamine). Is my dose low (30 mg?). It would be nice to feel like a God and ignore everyone at the same time.
 
Regarding the meth talk. I was speaking of prescription meth called Desoxyn. Also, if it is so dangerous why is it only schedule 2 and not 1? Also, the NAZIs who took them a lot of them lived close to or over 100 years old. I think LOVE would kill you first and or make you do stupid things that will get you killed before meth does. I think Adolf Hitler's "love" for his wife/niece/mistress/etc. had something to do with his suicide, not meth. I think meth made him smart enough that he didn't want to be captured so he checked out.
 
I only mentioned Meth because I feel that this could boost my confidence to God-levels and with it, any game playing coming from her ends up meaning nothing. Maybe her power seeking, narcissistic ways gets in check?
 

http://www.wired.com...ntidepressants/

https://www.psycholo...-love-and-ssris

http://www.ted.com/c...depressant.html

SSRIs treat OCD, love/romance is obsession and is nearly identical to the brain. There have been specific studies on this, one of which I posted a few posts above.
You can't compare MDMA to SSRIs just because MDMA is known for being a serotonin releasing agent, because it also directly increases Oxytocin, as well as Dopamine and Norepinephrine to the same extent.
That perception comes from people's limited understanding of neurotransmitters, and of the actions of MDMA.

You guys are suggesting drugs like Tianeptine, which as a supposed 'SSRE' would decrease serotonin, and increase dopamine. This would worsen OCD, and thereby exacerbate 'love'. Not only that, but any increase in dopamine, is going to increase cravings and addictive tendencies, because dopamine release makes our brain realize what is making it experience pleasure, so it wants more, hence why drugs like cocaine cause binging and repeated dosing.

You can not take SSRIs(in fact, I wouldn't), but taking things with opposite actions is just wrong, since you're doing it with no scientific evidence to support your decision.

Don't take Meth, to do so is incredibly dangerous, EXTREMELY unhealthy, and is going to ruin your life. Meth causes Olney's lesions which eats holes in your brain due to glutamate excitotoxicity. It will also, like I mentioned just a few sentences ago, will increase addictive tendencies and cravings, although that will be the least of your problems.

 


Edited by eon, 12 June 2015 - 08:33 AM.


#24 eon

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Posted 12 June 2015 - 08:51 AM

I believe I came across an article or a research before that when boys fall in love it's different than girls. With boys there seem to be more of a "womb attachment", I'm not sure if that's what I read or if that makes sense here. Boys are "closer" with their mothers (i.e. we want to be closer with the girls) whereas the girls are more distant which is why I think the daughters tend to be the more resentful ones towards their mothers. There's a reason us boys would be the one to touch the girl first and not the other way around. The boys want to be "closer" while the girls that pushes us away (playful or not) are just distant. Considering the issue here tend to lean on opposite sex, I do not know what the girls "connection" is with their fathers. Seems as if the girls want to be treated by boys the way their fathers treat them? I don't know. But daughters also came out of the womb but I'm not sure why they are distant. I think it has something to do with the fact that they are of the same sex as their mothers. There's just no yin and yang, or balance (girl comes out of another woman lacks the yin and yang whereas boys coming out of a woman seem to have created such "balance" and connection and not "distance" and or wanting "separation" or "womb detachment" (which is possibly the reason why most of the time, the girls do the breaking up, not the boys, and divorce rates filed by women first are way more higher than men filing for divorce, I think 3/4 or 75%). They just want to be distant or detached from something I don't know, which is why I think the reason that once men becomes "attached" to the woman, she "detaches" her self from you as if she is owed an apology. I swear I have read an article somewhere that sounds like what I'm describing and I'm just adding my own twist to it.


Edited by eon, 12 June 2015 - 09:15 AM.

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#25 eon

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Posted 12 June 2015 - 11:15 AM

You think Ketamine would help then?

 

 

Study suggests region of prefrontal cortex impacted by ketamine

 

http://medicalxpress...d-ketamine.html

 

Hey man, going through the same shit atm,my primitive brain falls in love with a girl, and it doesn't work out. And then the shit storm in my brain starts, every few seconds a random thought appears combined with a "stab in the heart" because of the hormones. Its hard and annoying, and if you have no self-awareness you get depressed. This life is a fucking war against our primitive brain, with the power of knowledge and mindfullness meditiation, we shall win! Honestly tho, i think the more you meditate,the easier you can handle  these kind of "brain problems". Its the frontal cortex against everyone,the more you train it, the stronger it will become. sorry for my bad inglysh

 



#26 Flex

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Posted 12 June 2015 - 06:10 PM

Please try to avoid Meth and Drugs. This was my idea 3 Years ago when the desperation due to the 1st Girl started..

I wanted to be less emphatic like her and the people arround me, stupid idea..

Now I have to run arround to reverse this besides the Cannabis alterations, the Ethylpheidate caused depression, slight PSSD and the inherent satae who I believe to be caused by a short Serotonine transporter allele

( i.e. too much serotonine) which causes pro-social behavior, lack of affect, anhedonia, anxiety ..

The alterations by stimulants and hard drugs are diverse and hard to tackle e.g. through DeltafosB, epigenetic alterations & etc.

 

http://www.longecity...eversal-thread/

 

I believe that this was one of my main sources in regards to narcissistic personality disorder:

 

http://www.medicinen...nality_disorder

https://www.bpdcentr...llmarks-of-npd/

 

will add further infos today

 



#27 OneScrewLoose

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Posted 13 June 2015 - 06:12 AM

Honestly, the real solution is meditation and bit-by-bit learning to control and master these emotions. The idea of taking drugs for this seems a bit ludicrous to me. But if you insist, your best but is a mood-stabilizer that is specifically a sodium channel blocker. They are used in bipolar to treat mania, to bring the person to a normal level of functioning instead of a constant high. A significant dose of one of these, like Depakote, Lamictal Oxcarbazepine, and others, will numb those without the mania.

 

Your best bet is Lamictal. it's an anti-depressant itself, which will help the situation in general, and above 50mg in a non-bipolar person (it's used at 25-50mg for unipolar depression), it will probably numb a bit of what you are feeling, and then you could adjust the dose as necessary. This is the only 'sure-thing' I could think of for this.

 

But this whole route seems ridiculous.


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#28 normalizing

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Posted 13 June 2015 - 08:16 AM

effexor helped with this but people here have no experience as to associate and recomend


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#29 eon

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Posted 13 June 2015 - 08:49 AM

Not sure what an anticonvulsant drug like lamictal could do but I was almost prescribed it as the doctor mentioned it for mood stabilizer. It is prescribed off label for bipolar as well. I told him I am not bipolar nor moody. I think the doc was just following what he thought he knew and was following "standard practice. I told him up front I wont get on any of those types of meds and SSRIs. I know my drugs.

 

Honestly, the real solution is meditation and bit-by-bit learning to control and master these emotions. The idea of taking drugs for this seems a bit ludicrous to me. But if you insist, your best but is a mood-stabilizer that is specifically a sodium channel blocker. They are used in bipolar to treat mania, to bring the person to a normal level of functioning instead of a constant high. A significant dose of one of these, like Depakote, Lamictal Oxcarbazepine, and others, will numb those without the mania.

 

Your best bet is Lamictal. it's an anti-depressant itself, which will help the situation in general, and above 50mg in a non-bipolar person (it's used at 25-50mg for unipolar depression), it will probably numb a bit of what you are feeling, and then you could adjust the dose as necessary. This is the only 'sure-thing' I could think of for this.

 

But this whole route seems ridiculous.

 


I've heard of people's use of effexor to great effect but for short term. I don't have the link or references but I read about it from someone on reddit.

 

effexor helped with this but people here have no experience as to associate and recomend

 


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#30 eon

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Posted 13 June 2015 - 08:53 AM

First of all, ethylphenidate and methylphenidate (Ritalin) are NOT amphetamines!  :) Ritalin is close to being cocaine! Ritalin causes serotonin syndrome so does cocaine! The amphetamine Vyvanse surprisingly calms me down when the paradoxical other name for amphetamine is "speed". I think Ritalin is SPEEDIER than any of the amphetamines, though I have never tried Ritalin.

 

Please try to avoid Meth and Drugs. This was my idea 3 Years ago when the desperation due to the 1st Girl started..

I wanted to be less emphatic like her and the people arround me, stupid idea..

Now I have to run arround to reverse this besides the Cannabis alterations, the Ethylpheidate caused depression, slight PSSD and the inherent satae who I believe to be caused by a short Serotonine transporter allele

( i.e. too much serotonine) which causes pro-social behavior, lack of affect, anhedonia, anxiety ..

The alterations by stimulants and hard drugs are diverse and hard to tackle e.g. through DeltafosB, epigenetic alterations & etc.

 

http://www.longecity...eversal-thread/

 

I believe that this was one of my main sources in regards to narcissistic personality disorder:

 

http://www.medicinen...nality_disorder

https://www.bpdcentr...llmarks-of-npd/

 

will add further infos today

 


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