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When Should I Start Supplementing Vitamin K2 To Strengthen Bones And Prevent Arterial Calcification?

vitamin k2 bones supplement calcification arterial calcification

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#1 Exception

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Posted 14 May 2017 - 09:54 AM


I'm 24 now.

 

Is it never too early to start? Or should I wait until I'm 40 or 50?


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#2 PeaceAndProsperity

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Posted 14 May 2017 - 04:52 PM

40 and up.


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#3 Exception

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Posted 14 May 2017 - 05:31 PM

Thanks.


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#4 rwac

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Posted 15 May 2017 - 09:18 AM

Vitamin K2 is great for bones. I don't think there's any negative effects for low doses.


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#5 PeaceAndProsperity

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Posted 15 May 2017 - 09:51 AM

Vitamin K2 is great for bones. I don't think there's any negative effects for low doses.

I disagree, I've experienced plenty of side-effects from it. I don't think it's so mild as people claim it is.

 


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#6 rwac

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Posted 15 May 2017 - 10:01 AM

 

Vitamin K2 is great for bones. I don't think there's any negative effects for low doses.

I disagree, I've experienced plenty of side-effects from it. I don't think it's so mild as people claim it is.

 

 

Oh? Tell me more.



#7 PeaceAndProsperity

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Posted 15 May 2017 - 11:27 AM

Lack of feeling in fingers and hand. Tight feeling in legs (every time). Difficulty and painful breathing in one lung (went to emergency room). Fatigue. Weird feeling in head (similar to toluene, possibly inflammation). My old relative has gotten permanent swelling in legs ever since he took vitamin k2-mk7 once.


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#8 maxwatt

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Posted 15 May 2017 - 11:52 AM

Lack of feeling in fingers and hand. Tight feeling in legs (every time). Difficulty and painful breathing in one lung (went to emergency room). Fatigue. Weird feeling in head (similar to toluene, possibly inflammation). My old relative has gotten permanent swelling in legs ever since he took vitamin k2-mk7 once.

 

Sounds like overdosing.  High doses are known to cause these side effects*.  Maximum dose of MK-7 should not be over 100 mcg.  MK-4 is not toxic at higher doses, and is used at high doses to treat osteoporosis in Korea.. 5 mg tablets are available.

 

How much were you taking?
 

 

*Coagulation problems.  10 years ago, vitamin K3 was shown to have toxic side effects.  It was thought that MK-7 would have similar effects, but studies since then have not shown this to be so.


Edited by maxwatt, 15 May 2017 - 02:40 PM.

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#9 pamojja

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Posted 15 May 2017 - 12:52 PM

High doses are known to cause these side effects.

 

K2-m4 is used in 45 mg/d doses in Japan for Osteoporosis.

 

I took in average 3.5mg K1, 13mg K2-mk4 and 0.35 mg of K2-mk7 daily during the last 8 years. No side-effects at all. Except, that I got a 60% walking-disability revoked (due to a 80% stenosis at my abdominal aorta).

 

Do you have a reference that high doses could cause these side effect?

 

Loads of references to the opposite on that side:

 

http://www.k-vitamins.com/
 

By the way, the owner of that side took up to 10mg K1, 100mg K2-mk4 and 10mg of K2-mk7, and continually reversed his CAC score over many years. Such continual high doses haven't even been studied yet, yet even at such astronomic doses still no side-effects.


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#10 PeaceAndProsperity

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Posted 15 May 2017 - 01:35 PM

 

Lack of feeling in fingers and hand. Tight feeling in legs (every time). Difficulty and painful breathing in one lung (went to emergency room). Fatigue. Weird feeling in head (similar to toluene, possibly inflammation). My old relative has gotten permanent swelling in legs ever since he took vitamin k2-mk7 once.

 

Sounds like overdosing.  High doses are known to cause these side effects.  Maximum dose of MK-7 should not be over 100 mcg.  MK-4 is not toxic at higher doses, and is used at high doses to treat osteoporosis in Korea.. 5 mg tablets are available.

 

How much were you taking?
 

 

My relative took 50mcg of mk7 and so did I. I immediately experienced side-effects at 50mcg.

Months later I then said to myself that it's probably because of the long half-life, so I should use the weak mk4 instead. I took mk4 at 300-500mcg I believe and almost immediately I began feeling tightness in my legs, transient numbness, an overall heavy feeling, tiredness and more.

Mk4 felt more like overcoagulation (heavy and tired feeling) whereas mk7 felt oddly different, less heavy and tired but difficulty breathing in the one lung (which lasted for days) and such. This would make sense of course since mk4 releases immediately and mk7 releases over days, the pro-clotting factors and what have you.


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#11 rwac

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Posted 15 May 2017 - 01:40 PM

My relative took 50mcg of mk7 and so did I. I immediately experienced side-effects at 50mcg.
Months later I then said to myself that it's probably because of the long half-life, so I should use the weak mk4 instead. I took mk4 at 300-500mcg I believe and almost immediately I began feeling tightness in my legs, transient numbness, an overall heavy feeling, tiredness and more.
Mk4 felt more like overcoagulation (heavy and tired feeling) whereas mk7 felt oddly different, less heavy and tired but difficulty breathing in the one lung (which lasted for days) and such. This would make sense of course since mk4 releases immediately and mk7 releases over days, the pro-clotting factors and what have you.

Mk4 is known to reduce serum calcium. I suspect your serum calcium is high, and that calcium drop can cause a tired feeling. Have you had your serum calcium, vit D and Parathyroid Hormone(PTH) checked?



#12 PeaceAndProsperity

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Posted 15 May 2017 - 01:45 PM

 

My relative took 50mcg of mk7 and so did I. I immediately experienced side-effects at 50mcg.
Months later I then said to myself that it's probably because of the long half-life, so I should use the weak mk4 instead. I took mk4 at 300-500mcg I believe and almost immediately I began feeling tightness in my legs, transient numbness, an overall heavy feeling, tiredness and more.
Mk4 felt more like overcoagulation (heavy and tired feeling) whereas mk7 felt oddly different, less heavy and tired but difficulty breathing in the one lung (which lasted for days) and such. This would make sense of course since mk4 releases immediately and mk7 releases over days, the pro-clotting factors and what have you.

Mk4 is known to reduce serum calcium. I suspect your serum calcium is high, and that calcium drop can cause a tired feeling. Have you had your serum calcium, vit D and Parathyroid Hormone(PTH) checked?

 

The tired feeling was the exact same that I got overdosing on clomiphene and getting a very high pulse. I even had irregular heart rhythm on mk4 if I remember right (or was that mk7? hmm).

 


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#13 rwac

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Posted 15 May 2017 - 04:26 PM

 

 

My relative took 50mcg of mk7 and so did I. I immediately experienced side-effects at 50mcg.
Months later I then said to myself that it's probably because of the long half-life, so I should use the weak mk4 instead. I took mk4 at 300-500mcg I believe and almost immediately I began feeling tightness in my legs, transient numbness, an overall heavy feeling, tiredness and more.
Mk4 felt more like overcoagulation (heavy and tired feeling) whereas mk7 felt oddly different, less heavy and tired but difficulty breathing in the one lung (which lasted for days) and such. This would make sense of course since mk4 releases immediately and mk7 releases over days, the pro-clotting factors and what have you.

Mk4 is known to reduce serum calcium. I suspect your serum calcium is high, and that calcium drop can cause a tired feeling. Have you had your serum calcium, vit D and Parathyroid Hormone(PTH) checked?

 

The tired feeling was the exact same that I got overdosing on clomiphene and getting a very high pulse. I even had irregular heart rhythm on mk4 if I remember right (or was that mk7? hmm).

 

 

 

Effects of the antiestrogens tamoxifen and clomiphene on bone resorption in vitro.
The in vitro effect of the nonsteroidal antiestrogens tamoxifen (TAM) and clomiphene (CLO) on bone resorption was investigated. TAM (100 microM) and CLO (100 microM) completely blocked PTH (2 nM)-induced resorption;
...
 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.../pubmed/3455681

 

However there's some evidence to the contrary as well. You might want to get those things tested anyway.


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#14 PeaceAndProsperity

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Posted 15 May 2017 - 06:53 PM

Not sure what that study is supposed to indicate of relevance to me but clomiphene does cause blood coagulation and it's known to cause blood clots in the lungs which I was fortunate enough to not have.


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#15 pamojja

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Posted 15 May 2017 - 07:52 PM

 

 

Lack of feeling in fingers and hand. Tight feeling in legs (every time). Difficulty and painful breathing in one lung (went to emergency room). Fatigue. Weird feeling in head (similar to toluene, possibly inflammation). My old relative has gotten permanent swelling in legs ever since he took vitamin k2-mk7 once.

 
How much were you taking?
 
My relative took 50mcg of mk7 and so did I. I immediately experienced side-effects at 50mcg.
Months later I then said to myself that it's probably because of the long half-life, so I should use the weak mk4 instead. I took mk4 at 300-500mcg I believe and almost immediately I began feeling tightness in my legs, transient numbness, an overall heavy feeling, tiredness and more.
Mk4 felt more like overcoagulation (heavy and tired feeling) whereas mk7 felt oddly different, less heavy and tired but difficulty breathing in the one lung (which lasted for days) and such. This would make sense of course since mk4 releases immediately and mk7 releases over days, the pro-clotting factors and what have you.

 

Not sure what that study is supposed to indicate of relevance to me but clomiphene does cause blood coagulation and it's known to cause blood clots in the lungs which I was fortunate enough to not have.

 

Your symptoms to speak of coagulation difficulties. Also you experienced difficulties in the lungs. Did you take clomiphene all the time?

 

I'm asking, because I take almost every natural anticoagulant available on earth in high doses without any difficulty. However, if I only add a tiny baby aspirin to the mix I immediately do get bloody stools. I think it would be wrong in such a case to blame all the natural anticoagulants, although I probably wouldn't have that dramatic effect from the baby aspirin alone. I rather do without the aspirin.

 

Similarly, you're adding a natural coagulant to a usually much less predictive synthetic coagulant. I would rather blame the latter for the cumulative effects you're experiencing with this unstudied combination. You could always try vitamin K2 by first getting off clomiphene for some time to verify.

 

Otherwise your claims on side-effects on K2 are just too unreliable, due to your polypharmacology.

 

 

PS: Since you so often claim so many never-heard-of side-effects from harmless supplements, it would really be helpful, if you disclosed all pharmaceutical you take at what doses.


Edited by pamojja, 15 May 2017 - 08:01 PM.

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#16 PeaceAndProsperity

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Posted 15 May 2017 - 08:08 PM

Need-less-to-say, there was obviously a large break between each supplement. Obviously. The one month the one thing for a day, next month or year another thing for a day. Needlesstosay.


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#17 pamojja

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Posted 15 May 2017 - 08:51 PM

Need-less-to-say, there was obviously a large break between each supplement. Obviously. The one month the one thing for a day, next month or year another thing for a day. Needlesstosay.

 

Interesting approach. Because though I do take a slow approach in introducing and increasing a new supplement. Now after 8 years of starting I take all vitamins, most minerals and amino acids, numerous plant extracts and powders, all the time simultaneously. And many of the essentials at pharmacological doses.

 

But then it really helped in my case. And I must say almost exclusively. With the single exception of zinc above 60 mg/d, which gives me headaches. But then I'm still deficient in zinc. You must be really disappointed. Because in my experience vitamins can't help taking one only a month or a year. Much less so because taking one usually increases certain metabolic pathways, increasing the need for all vitamins involved in that pathway. Which otherwise get depleted. With less than advantageous effects.

 

However, I understand why you don't want to disclose your medications. Just understand that in that circumstance your reports of side-effects have unknown variables.
 


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#18 naturalmatters

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Posted 17 May 2017 - 05:02 AM

1. There are plenty of placebo controlled studies showing no serious side effects.

2. It's been studied for up to 4 years with no meaningful side effects.

3. It's been studied as young as prepubertal children without any reported side effects.

4. A dose of 5 mg for 4 years produced no concerning side effects.

 

 

Source Pubmed: https://www.ncbi.nlm...quinone placebo


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#19 PeaceAndProsperity

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Posted 17 May 2017 - 01:34 PM

Lots of studies test the wrong chemical (how incompetent can people be?) when testing the safety of a drug. Lots of studies arrive at conclusions that simply are not true, or show results that simply don't make sense.

Lot of things are regarded as safe but in actuality are not. Lots of studies would claim that melatonin has no side-effects but as a matter of fact it does have side-effects like paranoia (not only in susceptible individuals).

 

LOTS of people respond poorly to vitamin K2 in any of the forms and can't tolerate taking it. It's a matter of fact, amply go read online, search Google for "Vitamin K2 tight legs" or "fatigue" or whatever else.

"placebo" is a poor excuse. Placebos don't produce these results. Saying that a powerful response is placebo is make-belief in of itself because the world just doesn't work like that.


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#20 pamojja

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Posted 17 May 2017 - 05:54 PM

And lots of Internet reports of side-effects of supplements are confounded by preconditions, not declared description drug use, or other illegal chemicals. Which understandably don't get that easily admitted.

 

Attached File  EU_Bubbles_Graph_2012_9_July_01.jpg   154.15KB   1 downloads

 

Attached File  UK_Relative_Risks_2D_2012_9_July_01.jpg   113.39KB   1 downloads

 

The real risks of even death comparing supplements to drugs, is about 1 to 62.000. But what's the ratio of reported adverse events reported for example on longecity alone?

 

That gives about an idea how much over-reported supplements are, while quite a few here use just as much drugs. You're the best example.


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#21 naturalmatters

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Posted 18 May 2017 - 02:24 AM

Lots of studies test the wrong chemical (how incompetent can people be?) when testing the safety of a drug. Lots of studies arrive at conclusions that simply are not true, or show results that simply don't make sense.

Lot of things are regarded as safe but in actuality are not. Lots of studies would claim that melatonin has no side-effects but as a matter of fact it does have side-effects like paranoia (not only in susceptible individuals).

 

LOTS of people respond poorly to vitamin K2 in any of the forms and can't tolerate taking it. It's a matter of fact, amply go read online, search Google for "Vitamin K2 tight legs" or "fatigue" or whatever else.

"placebo" is a poor excuse. Placebos don't produce these results. Saying that a powerful response is placebo is make-belief in of itself because the world just doesn't work like that.

 

Generalizing based on...no facts does not replace the results of several short and long term placebo controlled studies.

 

Anecdotal evidence is not proof of anything.

 

You exhibit some type of cognitive disorder and I suggest a neuropsychological assessment.


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#22 pamojja

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Posted 18 May 2017 - 10:46 AM

You exhibit some type of cognitive disorder and I suggest a neuropsychological assessment.

 
Though it wasn't me tagging you for that with 'unfriendly'. I consider such advises highly problematic too.
 
Just had a first neuro-psychiatric assessment myself, after having overcome intermittent claudication from a PAD with 60% government-certified disability thereby revoked, by using Orthomolecular medicine consistently over 8 years. But still strong symptoms of CFS/ME remaining (PEM [post excertional malaise] with back pains till a full day of rest).
 
It was a disaster! And I must assume cognitive disorder by that neurologist/psychiatrist herself. First she right away accused me of drug abuse. Where I replied, that I had eliminated even any alcohol at age 20 already. Which she in turn took as admission, that I indeed had an alcohol problem in my youth (nothing further from the truth). Then she refused to take a look at any of my numerous medical reports from Internists, Cardiologists, Endicinologists, etc.. Made an EKG, ordered an MRI, and only took a standard neurological examination. I had misgiving already at the beginning, because she made an even more exhausted first impression, than for which I took this examination.
 
Her medical report really turned out a joke. She asserts therein, that I would have diagnosed and healed a PAD myself (despite all the medical diagnosis from cardiologist/internist she refused to read). And likewise would have self-diagnosed all my other conditions including CFS/ME. In fact, I argued with her that I actually very unlikely have real CFS/ME because that is actually an exclusion (idiopathic) diagnosis. In my case I would have enough other organic damages, which would sufficiently explain exhaustions enough each by themselves (PAD, COPD, T2D, spondiscscitis,...).
 
Though CFS/ME according to ICD-10 is classified as neurological disease, she ended her joke of a medical report with the words, from neurological side my symptoms couldn't be explained (while she even found an old infarction of the left cerebellum without any further explanation, I haven't even been aware of). And referred me on to a psychiatric/neurological hospital for further clarification.
 
I would everyone dis-advise from such consultations (at least those insurance paid. With paid out of pocket neurologist/psychiatrists - though not for myself but clients - my experiences have been good, not always though). Unless you want to experience a gross example of cognitive dissonance and want to become offended with unfounded accusations.

 

I do respect P&Ps wise decision not to disclose his medications publicly here. And an usual neurological/psychiatric consultation would probably be to his harm only. Because all they know of, is more medications. Like in my case, all they want to give is anti-depressants. While depression isn't even one of my complaints.

 

On the other hand I think it legitimate, that in this case he has to take reminders of unknown confounders with his supplement adverse-effects reports, and disbelieve. But no reason to become offensive on both sides.


Edited by pamojja, 18 May 2017 - 11:02 AM.

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#23 naturalmatters

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Posted 18 May 2017 - 11:51 PM

 

You exhibit some type of cognitive disorder and I suggest a neuropsychological assessment.

 
Though it wasn't me tagging you for that with 'unfriendly'. I consider such advises highly problematic too.
 
Just had a first neuro-psychiatric assessment myself, after having overcome intermittent claudication from a PAD with 60% government-certified disability thereby revoked, by using Orthomolecular medicine consistently over 8 years. But still strong symptoms of CFS/ME remaining (PEM [post excertional malaise] with back pains till a full day of rest).
 
It was a disaster! And I must assume cognitive disorder by that neurologist/psychiatrist herself. First she right away accused me of drug abuse. Where I replied, that I had eliminated even any alcohol at age 20 already. Which she in turn took as admission, that I indeed had an alcohol problem in my youth (nothing further from the truth). Then she refused to take a look at any of my numerous medical reports from Internists, Cardiologists, Endicinologists, etc.. Made an EKG, ordered an MRI, and only took a standard neurological examination. I had misgiving already at the beginning, because she made an even more exhausted first impression, than for which I took this examination.
 
Her medical report really turned out a joke. She asserts therein, that I would have diagnosed and healed a PAD myself (despite all the medical diagnosis from cardiologist/internist she refused to read). And likewise would have self-diagnosed all my other conditions including CFS/ME. In fact, I argued with her that I actually very unlikely have real CFS/ME because that is actually an exclusion (idiopathic) diagnosis. In my case I would have enough other organic damages, which would sufficiently explain exhaustions enough each by themselves (PAD, COPD, T2D, spondiscscitis,...).
 
Though CFS/ME according to ICD-10 is classified as neurological disease, she ended her joke of a medical report with the words, from neurological side my symptoms couldn't be explained (while she even found an old infarction of the left cerebellum without any further explanation, I haven't even been aware of). And referred me on to a psychiatric/neurological hospital for further clarification.
 
I would everyone dis-advise from such consultations (at least those insurance paid. With paid out of pocket neurologist/psychiatrists - though not for myself but clients - my experiences have been good, not always though). Unless you want to experience a gross example of cognitive dissonance and want to become offended with unfounded accusations.

 

I do respect P&Ps wise decision not to disclose his medications publicly here. And an usual neurological/psychiatric consultation would probably be to his harm only. Because all they know of, is more medications. Like in my case, all they want to give is anti-depressants. While depression isn't even one of my complaints.

 

On the other hand I think it legitimate, that in this case he has to take reminders of unknown confounders with his supplement adverse-effects reports, and disbelieve. But no reason to become offensive on both sides.

 

 

Everyone should consider a neuro-psychiatric assessment, as well as, IQ testing to establish a baseline of their cognitive and emotional levels for themselves. Like any doctor there can be a bias but the data produced from such standardized and clinically valid tests can be useful. If you feel the doctor in question had themselves an issue that could be true or indicative of someone having a paranoid disorder. So a second opinion can always be sought.
 


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#24 naturalmatters

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 12:05 AM

I'm 24 now.

 

Is it never too early to start? Or should I wait until I'm 40 or 50?

 

Based on limited clinical studies there's no reason you can't start now especially if there's a risk of Arterial Calcification in your family. Prevention is far more effective than treating a condition. I would suggest getting your blood tested for osteocalcin and review your diet to see how much Vitamin K you are currently consuming.

 

I would also suggest reviewing this article on the subject;

 

http://www.lifeexten...Disease/Page-01



#25 PeaceAndProsperity

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 09:37 AM

You keep talking about medication. The first user obviously used it as an insult (and he's a drug addict) but you didn't seem to get it. I have no medications prescribed for me other than an asthma inhaler.


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#26 pamojja

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 03:12 PM

Everyone should consider a neuro-psychiatric assessment, as well as, IQ testing to establish a baseline of their cognitive and emotional levels for themselves. Like any doctor there can be a bias but the data produced from such standardized and clinically valid tests can be useful. If you feel the doctor in question had themselves an issue that could be true or indicative of someone having a paranoid disorder. So a second opinion can always be sought.

 

I made throughout bad experiences with the IQ and 'emotional' levels of all specialists, which told nothing about me, but themself. One example just told on an other thread of an other forum about what has been the weirdest thing a MD ever said:

 

 

Once a cardiologist recommended the replacement of my whole abdominal aorta including arteries down the legs with a goretex-like tube. I asked why not use simple, tested and cheap balloon-angioplasty instead. And what would be the risks of each. He only answer was, that balloon-angioplasty wouldn't be done by any cardiologist of my country, and didn't knew of any risks. Therefore asked the maybe provocative question, how much would there be a difference in profit for the hospital with each of these procedures. Thereby he ended his counseling, by declaring he would have only helped out, but actually wouldn't be a cardiologist himself.

Half year later I tried again with the hope of a more reasonable cardiologist. Unluckily, met the same again. This time he was very resolute, that the last time he would have advised me more than enough, which he wont do now again. So I only asked why he had denied his credentials last time? Where he got fire-red in his face and shouted: My actual problem would be a personality disorder, and I better should seek psychiatric treatment.


PS: waited for another 4 hours till an other cardiologist had the time for a second opinion. Also he could only advise on acute risks (1 in 100 during operation). For long term risks Dr. Google finally could give me the answer: 1 in 10 of prosthesis have to be replaced already after 5 years.

After countless referrals, I have half a dozen diagnosis, for example: PAD, COPD, T2D, old infarction of cerebellum, spondilodiscitis, ... in fact 6 of the 10 most deatly diseases on this side:

 

http://www.worldlife...gs-total-deaths

 

..but still none from what I actually suffer the most (PEM, post exertional malaise), nor any intelligent treatment plan from side of any MDs. And a lot of personal offense from that very same MDs. Because I refused their rarely recommended treatments, which in average would only have 1% reduction in 5-year mortality.

 

You must have little disease and therefore no experience to have this opposing very high opinion of MDs. But with my experience I usually try to stay away, unless in the mood to get offended. :wacko:


Edited by pamojja, 19 May 2017 - 03:25 PM.

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#27 pamojja

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 03:23 PM

You keep talking about medication. The first user obviously used it as an insult (and he's a drug addict) but you didn't seem to get it. I have no medications prescribed for me other than an asthma inhaler.

 

Well you did mentioned 1 other medication you used. And after asked for full disclosure for all medications you evaded that question, by talking about how you use supplements. Also don't forget one can easily google all your posts here, and thereby could find other mentions, if they exist.

 

However, from my side no accusations. Just disbelieve because of your own admittance and evasive answering behaviour. You're not guilty, and even if proven otherwise, it's none of our business.



#28 airplanepeanuts

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 07:43 PM

Vitamin k2 mk-7 gives me terrible insomnia. I really like K2 mk-4.


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#29 david ellis

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 11:51 PM

 

High doses are known to cause these side effects.

 

No side-effects at all. Except, that I got a 60% walking-disability revoked (due to a 80% stenosis at my abdominal aorta).

 

Do you have a reference that high doses could cause these side effect?

 

I do have a reference - " Recent scientific evidence, however, suggests that elevated consumption of calcium supplements may raise the risk for heart disease and can be connected with accelerated deposit of calcium in blood-vessel walls and soft tissues."   It seems you have to be female to benefit.   (https://www.ncbi.nlm...les/PMC4566462/)   My doctor  says my blood calcium deposits could cause future trouble.

 

 

 

 

 


Edited by david ellis, 19 May 2017 - 11:52 PM.


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#30 pamojja

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Posted 20 May 2017 - 11:28 AM

 

 

High doses are known to cause these side effects.

 

No side-effects at all. Except, that I got a 60% walking-disability revoked (due to a 80% stenosis at my abdominal aorta).

 

Do you have a reference that high doses could cause these side effect?

 

I do have a reference - " Recent scientific evidence, however, suggests that elevated consumption of calcium supplements may raise the risk for heart disease and can be connected with accelerated deposit of calcium in blood-vessel walls and soft tissues."   It seems you have to be female to benefit.   (https://www.ncbi.nlm...les/PMC4566462/)   My doctor  says my blood calcium deposits could cause future trouble.

 

A reference to a mere thesis that vitamin K2 in the presence of high calcium could mean a risk.

 

Not at all a reference for any observational, anecdotal, in-vitro, animal or RCT evidence that it ever did. A hypothesis isn't evidence.

 

 

It appears that suboptimal levels of vitamin K2 in the body may disadvantage the activation of specific proteins that are dependent on vitamin K2.35 If those proteins cannot perform their function in keeping calcium in the bones and preventing calcium deposits in soft tissues (eg, in arterial walls) during situations of increased calcium intake, then general health, and—in particular—cardiovascular health, may suffer due to an inefficient and misdirected use of calcium in the body.

 

The producer of KoncentratedK used up to 10mg of K1, 100mg of K2-mk4 and 10mg of K2-mk7 along undercarboxylated Osteocalcin as approximation marker (one of those vitamin K2 dependent proteins mentioned above - there isn't any lab test for K2 available) for his vitamin K status. Normal range is <1.5. However, he found out there isn't a possible high enough dose of K2 to bring this marker down to exactly zero.

 

I'm male, above guy is male, and through many years now has reduced his CAC score with high dose vitamin K2. You're totally on speculative grounds. This reference only raises concerns about high calcium, not vitamin K2.

 

On the contrary, it is about the risk everyone is taking with the usual high calcium intake without any supplemental vitamin K2. The real risk for example P&P is experiencing, because of not being able to differentiate preconditions and synergies, and thereby staying away from even tiny doses of vitamin K2. Which you are thereby supporting (don't think P&P can evaluate that study for himself, if even you failed).
 


Edited by pamojja, 20 May 2017 - 11:39 AM.

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Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: vitamin k2, bones, supplement, calcification, arterial calcification

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