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FOXO4 D-Retro-Inverso peptide group buy

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#361 Vantika

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Posted 11 March 2018 - 03:34 AM

Tomorrow I will take 10mg together with D&Q and again the day after.

 

I wouldn't do that.  Quercetin would most likely diminish or negate the effects of FOXO4-DRI.
 
See my previous post[1] on the effects of rapamycin or other anti-inflammatory compounds in combination with FOXO4-DRI.
 
Now, addressing quercetin specifically:
 
From [2]:
Quercetin, a natural polyphenol flavonoid, is known to elicit anti-inflammatory ... activities.
...
In vitro, quercetin markedly diminished transcript levels of inflammatory receptors and activation of their signaling molecules (ERK, p38 MAPK, and NF-κB).
...
Together, these findings suggest that quercetin ... inhibit[s] inflammatory receptors and their signaling pathway.

→ source (external link)
 
From [3]:
[Quercetin] has ... antiinflammatory effects.
...
Quercetin suppressed protein levels of the key adipogenic factors C/EBPβ, C/EBPα, PPARγ and FABP4 and the TG-synthesis enzymes lipin1, DGAT1 and LPAATθ. Activation of m-TOR and p70S6K, which are related to insulin and adipogenesis, was down-regulated during adipogenesis in 3T3-L1 cells.
...
Our data showed that quercetin inhibited the MAPK signaling factors ERK1/2, JNK and p38MAPK and MCP-1 and TNF-α in adipocytes and macrophages. Quercetin also inhibited secretion of the inflammatory cytokines IL-1β and IL-6 and stimulated that of IL-10, an antiinflammatory cytokine.

→ source (external link)
 

From [4]:

Results indicated that quercetin was able to ameliorate all markers of inflammation and oxidative stress measured. Quercetin lowered levels of interleukin-1β, C-reactive protein, and monocyte chemotactic protein-1 
...
Finally, quercetin inhibited the 2-fold increase of NF-қB activity observed in lung, liver and joint after induction of arthritis.

→ source (external link)
 
Per all of the above, quercetin is inhibiting at least six different molecules involved in autocrine and/or paracrine signaling of SASP in various cell types.
 
Blocking the IL-1 receptor or inhibiting mTORC1 have already been directly empirically shown to negate senolytic activity of FOXO4-DRI. (See my previous post[1] for references.)
 
Inhibiting p38MAPK is known to shut down SASP, and would most likely have a similar effect[5][6][7][8].  I would expect the same with C/EBPβ[9].  And IL-6 is part of the SASP feedback loop as well[9].
 
And you're hitting all of these, either directly or indirectly with quercetin.  Even if most of the action is indirect (most likely), the fact that the particular combination of proteins/cytokines mentioned above is being inhibited only serves to demonstrate that in all likelihood quercetin is successfully disrupting the signaling loop underlying SASP.
 
SASP signal transduction:
1-s2.0-S135964461730017X-gr2.jpg

 

 

As for combining dasatinib, I'm not sure that's a good idea either.  There's some indication it could have similar effects, though it's not as clear in this case as it is with quercetin.  I see mentions of it reducing various cytokines in some circumstances[10][11][12].  And Src Tyrosine Kinase (which dasatinib inhibits) upregulates p38MAPK[13].
 
 

Just taken my first 5mg dose. Only observation so far is that the injection site hurts which is probably a reaction between the FOXO and surrounding tissue.

 

Doubt it's a reaction to FOXO4-DRI. The peptide is in HCl salt form (once in solution, the HCl should dissociate nearly completely). What volume of PBS did you use to dilute this 5 mg of peptide?  I'm guessing you didn't use enough PBS to bring the solution close enough to neutral pH.
 

 After a week, I will start using Rapamycin again.

 

Smart. I think waiting the full week is best.
 
After reviewing at Figures 2N and 3H in the main FOXO4-DRI paper[14], it looks like quantity of phosphorylated p53 in the cytosol (for use in the intrinsic apoptotic pathway) doesn't really peak until 48 hours post-dose, and then caspase levels keep rising until 60 hours post-dose. So it would probably be wise to add some additional buffer time to the 96 hour minimum waiting period I previously suggested.  I would wait at least a week before resuming rapamycin use.
 
References:

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#362 meatsauce

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Posted 11 March 2018 - 10:31 PM

Just taken my first 5mg dose. Only observation so far is that the injection site hurts which is probably a reaction between the FOXO and surrounding tissue.

 

Will keep observing and reporting. Tomorrow I will take 10mg together with D&Q and again the day after. After a week, I will start using Rapamycin again. Hopefully I get a clean out of some senescent cells and some noticeable health effects. Is anyone else taking it yet?

You should be reconstituting with sterile  phosphate buffered saline without sodium azide which can be found here:

 

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00RKPGHUU/

 

The pain is probably being caused by the solution being too acidic. 


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#363 PWAIN

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Posted 12 March 2018 - 06:17 AM

 

Just taken my first 5mg dose. Only observation so far is that the injection site hurts which is probably a reaction between the FOXO and surrounding tissue.

 

Will keep observing and reporting. Tomorrow I will take 10mg together with D&Q and again the day after. After a week, I will start using Rapamycin again. Hopefully I get a clean out of some senescent cells and some noticeable health effects. Is anyone else taking it yet?

You should be reconstituting with sterile  phosphate buffered saline without sodium azide which can be found here:

 

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00RKPGHUU/

 

The pain is probably being caused by the solution being too acidic. 

 

 

That is probably it, I am using bacteriostatic water so probably not ideal. Only 1 dose to go (and want to do today) so I'll live with the pain for now and do it right in future . Anyone else out there, I recommend you follow meatsauces advice or it will sting a fair bit for a few days.

 

Not really much to report in terms of effects, will have a better idea in a few days I hope.

 


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#364 aribadabar

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Posted 12 March 2018 - 10:37 PM

You should be reconstituting with sterile  phosphate buffered saline without sodium azide which can be found here:

 

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00RKPGHUU/

 

The pain is probably being caused by the solution being too acidic. 

 

 

Is this the best solvent for reconstituting any and all popular peptides (e.g. Epitalon, BPC157, TB500 etc.) or for FOXO4-DRI only?



#365 extendcel

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Posted 16 March 2018 - 07:30 AM

 

You should be reconstituting with sterile  phosphate buffered saline without sodium azide which can be found here:

 

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00RKPGHUU/

 

The pain is probably being caused by the solution being too acidic. 

 

 

Is this the best solvent for reconstituting any and all popular peptides (e.g. Epitalon, BPC157, TB500 etc.) or for FOXO4-DRI only?

 

 

All those popular peptides should be reconstituted with bacteriostatic water. Only exception I've seen is IGF-1 being reconstituted with 0.6% acetic acid sterile water, though I haven't looked into it.
 


Edited by extendcel, 16 March 2018 - 07:31 AM.


#366 tintinet

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Posted 16 March 2018 - 08:08 PM

 

 

You should be reconstituting with sterile  phosphate buffered saline without sodium azide which can be found here:

 

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00RKPGHUU/

 

The pain is probably being caused by the solution being too acidic. 

 

 

Is this the best solvent for reconstituting any and all popular peptides (e.g. Epitalon, BPC157, TB500 etc.) or for FOXO4-DRI only?

 

 

All those popular peptides should be reconstituted with bacteriostatic water. Only exception I've seen is IGF-1 being reconstituted with 0.6% acetic acid sterile water, though I haven't looked into it.
 

 

So which is preferred for FOXO-DRI?

 

 

 

 



#367 meatsauce

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Posted 16 March 2018 - 08:26 PM

 

 

 

 

So which is preferred for FOXO-DRI?

 

 

 

 

 

Sterile  phosphate buffered saline without sodium azide only.


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#368 TaiChiKid

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Posted 16 March 2018 - 08:45 PM

Thanks for the helpful information!

 

Tomorrow I will take 10mg together with D&Q and again the day after.

 

I wouldn't do that.  Quercetin would most likely diminish or negate the effects of FOXO4-DRI.
 
See my previous post[1] on the effects of rapamycin or other anti-inflammatory compounds in combination with FOXO4-DRI.
 
Now, addressing quercetin specifically:
 
From [2]:
Quercetin, a natural polyphenol flavonoid, is known to elicit anti-inflammatory ... activities.
...
In vitro, quercetin markedly diminished transcript levels of inflammatory receptors and activation of their signaling molecules (ERK, p38 MAPK, and NF-κB).
...
Together, these findings suggest that quercetin ... inhibit[s] inflammatory receptors and their signaling pathway.

→ source (external link)
 
From [3]:
[Quercetin] has ... antiinflammatory effects.
...
Quercetin suppressed protein levels of the key adipogenic factors C/EBPβ, C/EBPα, PPARγ and FABP4 and the TG-synthesis enzymes lipin1, DGAT1 and LPAATθ. Activation of m-TOR and p70S6K, which are related to insulin and adipogenesis, was down-regulated during adipogenesis in 3T3-L1 cells.
...
Our data showed that quercetin inhibited the MAPK signaling factors ERK1/2, JNK and p38MAPK and MCP-1 and TNF-α in adipocytes and macrophages. Quercetin also inhibited secretion of the inflammatory cytokines IL-1β and IL-6 and stimulated that of IL-10, an antiinflammatory cytokine.

→ source (external link)
 

From [4]:

Results indicated that quercetin was able to ameliorate all markers of inflammation and oxidative stress measured. Quercetin lowered levels of interleukin-1β, C-reactive protein, and monocyte chemotactic protein-1 
...
Finally, quercetin inhibited the 2-fold increase of NF-қB activity observed in lung, liver and joint after induction of arthritis.

→ source (external link)
 
Per all of the above, quercetin is inhibiting at least six different molecules involved in autocrine and/or paracrine signaling of SASP in various cell types.
 
Blocking the IL-1 receptor or inhibiting mTORC1 have already been directly empirically shown to negate senolytic activity of FOXO4-DRI. (See my previous post[1] for references.)
 
Inhibiting p38MAPK is known to shut down SASP, and would most likely have a similar effect[5][6][7][8].  I would expect the same with C/EBPβ[9].  And IL-6 is part of the SASP feedback loop as well[9].
 
And you're hitting all of these, either directly or indirectly with quercetin.  Even if most of the action is indirect (most likely), the fact that the particular combination of proteins/cytokines mentioned above is being inhibited only serves to demonstrate that in all likelihood quercetin is successfully disrupting the signaling loop underlying SASP.
 
SASP signal transduction:
1-s2.0-S135964461730017X-gr2.jpg

 

 

As for combining dasatinib, I'm not sure that's a good idea either.  There's some indication it could have similar effects, though it's not as clear in this case as it is with quercetin.  I see mentions of it reducing various cytokines in some circumstances[10][11][12].  And Src Tyrosine Kinase (which dasatinib inhibits) upregulates p38MAPK[13].
 
 

Just taken my first 5mg dose. Only observation so far is that the injection site hurts which is probably a reaction between the FOXO and surrounding tissue.

 

Doubt it's a reaction to FOXO4-DRI. The peptide is in HCl salt form (once in solution, the HCl should dissociate nearly completely). What volume of PBS did you use to dilute this 5 mg of peptide?  I'm guessing you didn't use enough PBS to bring the solution close enough to neutral pH.
 

 After a week, I will start using Rapamycin again.

 

Smart. I think waiting the full week is best.
 
After reviewing at Figures 2N and 3H in the main FOXO4-DRI paper[14], it looks like quantity of phosphorylated p53 in the cytosol (for use in the intrinsic apoptotic pathway) doesn't really peak until 48 hours post-dose, and then caspase levels keep rising until 60 hours post-dose. So it would probably be wise to add some additional buffer time to the 96 hour minimum waiting period I previously suggested.  I would wait at least a week before resuming rapamycin use.
 
References:

 

 



#369 Vantika

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Posted 16 March 2018 - 09:16 PM

So which is preferred for FOXO-DRI?

 

This batch of FOXO4-DRI is in HCl salt form.  TFA is used during synthesis.  Some other acid has to be used to replace TFA.

 

It will be fairly acidic without a buffer solution (e.g. PBS), as meatsauce and I have already mentioned.  Pretty sure meatsauce has already informed everyone participating in the buy of this.  (Read your PMs, people!)

 

I have both done the chemistry math and actually empirically measured its pH to verify this.  I understated my level of certainty on this earlier, as is a habit of mine.  I probably should have been more forceful in making the point earlier.

 

My understanding is that future batches will be in acetate salt form, which should mitigate the issue (weaker acid, doesn't fully dissociate), but you should still use PBS.  The solution will probably still be uncomfortably acidic without it (I have done the chem math).  Use the link meatsauce provided, or buy another sterile PBS without sodium azide (without any form of azide, for that matter).

 

FWIW, PBS is what was used in vivo in the FOXO4-DRI experiments, for similar reasons, I would think.


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#370 Rocket

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Posted 17 March 2018 - 12:43 AM

This has been in peoples hands for a while. No one is using it?
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#371 Vantika

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Posted 17 March 2018 - 01:27 AM

This has been in peoples hands for a while. No one is using it?

 

PWAIN is using it.  I think everyone else is still washing out their anti-inflammatory supplements and maybe waiting for their PBS to arrive.  A few people had been taking rapamycin.

 

Have you read the thread?

 

If you are so eager to see results, why didn't you buy some to try it yourself? :)


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#372 Rocket

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Posted 18 March 2018 - 01:06 AM

This has been in peoples hands for a while. No one is using it?


PWAIN is using it. I think everyone else is still washing out their anti-inflammatory supplements and maybe waiting for their PBS to arrive. A few people had been taking rapamycin.

Have you read the thread?

If you are so eager to see results, why didn't you buy some to try it yourself? :)

It doesn't take *this* long to clear out whatever anti-inflammatory supplements someone is taking.

And I did not ask about rapamycin so I don't know what your point is...

I don't know how people are storing their peptides all this time, but I doubt it is being stored as well as it would be in a lab. Home refrigerators and fragile peptides are not ideal.

Anytime i buy a peptide, I use it relatively fast while its still good because of issues with home refrigeration.
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#373 Moondancer

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Posted 18 March 2018 - 03:13 AM

Any thoughs on if and how Foxo4-d-retro-inverso may potentially affect an inflammatory disease like Rheumatoid Arthritis?



#374 helix66

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Posted 18 March 2018 - 12:23 PM

This has been in peoples hands for a while. No one is using it?

 

I'm still waiting on my supply, meatsauce has contacted me and is trying to rectify the situation.


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#375 Vantika

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Posted 18 March 2018 - 11:04 PM

Rocket, my last post was written in a hurry and probably came off as more abrasive than intended.  Sorry for any ruffled feathers.
 

It doesn't take *this* long to clear out whatever anti-inflammatory supplements someone is taking.


And I did not ask about rapamycin so I don't know what your point is...

 

Rapamycin and other SASP suppressors have been directly tested and shown to almost entirely negate the effects of FOXO4-DRI.
 
The broad range SASP inhibitors Cortisol and Rapamycin and an antibody against IL-1α reduce the effectiveness of FOXO4 DRI in lowering senescent cell viability, while the general inflammation enhancer Lipopolysaccharide (LPS) improves it. Together these two panels demonstrate FOXO4 DRI specifically targets those senescent cells which express high SASP

→ source (external link)
 
Moreover, it takes three weeks for these SASP-suppressing -- and thus FOXO4-DRI-negating -- effects of rapamycin to fully dissipate.  And that's after its serum concentrations reach zero. 
 
Rapamycin has a half-life of ~60 hours in humans.  Therefore, additionally, it should take another two weeks to get its serum concentrations reasonably low.
 
One week of metabolism isn't enough: 2^-(7/(60/24)) = 0.1436, thus ~14% of your original dose would still be present.  Different cell types have different sensitivities to mTOR inhibition and thus different therapeutic levels, due to variations in drug transport rates across the cellular membrane, transcription, translation and proteasomal/lysosomal degradation of relevant proteins, etc.  The bottom line being that 14% of your original rapamycin dose could easily still be suppressing SASP in a wide range of cell types.  Two weeks of metabolizing will get that down to around 2%: 2^-(14/(60/24)) = 0.0206, which is probably good enough.
 
Therefore, a total of about five weeks is a reasonable wash-out period for rapamycin.  That's 2 weeks of metabolizing rapamycin followed by 3 weeks of SASP reestablishment thereafter.  So, yes, it does in fact take that long.
 
This was discussed in detail in the previous page of this thread,
References are provided there.
 
Based on the dates when various people people asked about mistakenly combining rapamycin with FOXO4-DRI or about how long to wait after cessation of rapamycin before using FOXO4-DRI, they apparently are still well within this 5 week period (it hasn't even been three), and thus could not possibly have started their FOXO4-DRI session yet without greatly diminishing its effects.  I'm assuming this is why they're not using it yet.  That was the point I intended to make and why I asked if you had read the thread, since this had mostly already been explained.
 
I hope that clarifies things for you.
 

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#376 Vantika

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Posted 18 March 2018 - 11:58 PM

I don't know how people are storing their peptides all this time, but I doubt it is being stored as well as it would be in a lab. Home refrigerators and fragile peptides are not ideal.


Anytime i buy a peptide, I use it relatively fast while its still good because of issues with home refrigeration.

 

That's a good point. I'm glad you mentioned it.
 
This peptide is/was provided by the supplier in freeze-dried form (not already in solution), in sealed vials filled entirely with dry, (inert) argon gas (to prevent degradation from either water or oxidation).  (Source: the supplier's website repeatedly states that all their peptides are packaged this way.)  From what I understand, this is pretty standard for wholesalers doing custom peptide synthesis.
 
Peptides in this freeze-dried form should be stored in your freezer, not in your refrigerator.  (In fairness to Rocket, this may have been what he actually meant, though he wrote "refrigerator", which has the potential to cause confusion.)
 
Most peptide storage and handling documents (out of roughly the dozen or so I've read) recommend storing your freeze-dried peptides at -20°C (-4°F) for medium-term storage (anything longer than a couple weeks), which supposedly will confer stability from somewhere between two months to a year, depending on the source of the information (most guides actually claim stability for a year at this temp).  My freezer reaches this temperature without an issue at its coldest setting (I keep a thermometer inside; it actually goes down to about -30°C) , so something near this temperature ostensibly is achievable with a normal, household freezer.
 
I don't know whether the peptides you're buying from (vendors who are, I'm guessing) secondary, non-OEM resellers have already been reconstituted or not.  If they have been, you're right that refrigeration is best, and of course you're also right that most peptides are fairly unstable once reconstituted into solution, which dramatically reduces their shelf-life down to a matter of hours/days.  There are also so-called "adsorption" issues once reconstituted into liquid, where some quantity of peptide is lost due to it adhering to the walls of the container it's stored in.

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#377 recon

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 12:17 AM

I wonder if inflammation increases the activity of FOXO4-DRI, or if anti-inflammatories decrease it, it’s because the inflammation is making more senescent cells or somehow worsen the senescence.

What if it is analogous to FOXO4-DRI being the firefighters and the senescent cells being the fires? Maybe there are more activities to the firefighters are because we are igniting more flames. Then that loses the point.

I mean, the study shows that anti-inflammatories decrease the activity of but doesn’t really dive into the effectiveness of. It’d be counterproductive if it turns out that we are making more senescent cells in order to see more activity from FOXO4-DRI.

Just a thought. May be hugely wrong.

#378 meatsauce

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 09:07 PM

I got this testimonial from an experimenter:

 

"Coincidentally, about a week after the experimental procedures, I noticed my constant nagging low back pain is gone, both moving and at rest.  Thirty-year-old grinding noises and pain in my cervical spine from a martial arts injury is reduced about 90%.  The twice-weekly headaches went with it.  I'm a programmer, and the continuous dull ache in my right wrist, forearm and fingers that has been building for the past 15 years from mouse-usage RSI is also about 90% gone.  I'm sleeping better, deeper; waking without the fatigue, stiffness, head and body aches that used to greet every sunrise.  My lungs and sinuses are clear, clogged ears unblocked.  Breathing deeply is much easier, and a gentle, stimulating pleasure again.  A cough I've had most of a year is almost entirely gone."


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#379 The Capybara

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 09:39 PM

Nice to hear some feedback beginning to trickle in.
It might be better if we knew the basics of the protocol you're following when posting any progress reports or updates.
Maybe something like:

Last Dosage Taken

Route of Administration

Previous Dosages and Corresponding Route(s) of Administration

Source of Material (ex: Meatsauce group buy)

(Please include actual dates for administration and whenever appropriate elsewhere)

I think this will help everyone interested, now and in the future.

Edited by The Capybara, 19 March 2018 - 09:46 PM.

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#380 NotHenghisHapthorn

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 10:39 PM

Once again, for reference, "How to ... Single Person Trial of Senolytic Peptide FOXO4-DRI": https://www.fightagi...ptide-foxo4-dri


Edited by NotHenghisHapthorn, 19 March 2018 - 10:43 PM.

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#381 aribadabar

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 11:34 PM

I got this testimonial from an experimenter:

 

"Coincidentally, about a week after the experimental procedures, I noticed my constant nagging low back pain is gone, both moving and at rest.  Thirty-year-old grinding noises and pain in my cervical spine from a martial arts injury is reduced about 90%.  The twice-weekly headaches went with it.  I'm a programmer, and the continuous dull ache in my right wrist, forearm and fingers that has been building for the past 15 years from mouse-usage RSI is also about 90% gone.  I'm sleeping better, deeper; waking without the fatigue, stiffness, head and body aches that used to greet every sunrise.  My lungs and sinuses are clear, clogged ears unblocked.  Breathing deeply is much easier, and a gentle, stimulating pleasure again.  A cough I've had most of a year is almost entirely gone."

 

And that's after only 3x33mg every other day as recommended?

Also, what is the age of this person?



#382 Moondancer

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Posted 20 March 2018 - 02:04 AM

What is now the consensus on when to stop using anti-inflammatory supplements such as Curcumin/Ginger?

Is stopping 2 weeks prior to and after administering Foxo4-DRI sufficient?

What about regular vitamins/minerals/essental trace elements?

And NR?

 

I have Rheumatoid Arthritis and I get steroid shots in joints every now and then: could that interfere with Foxo4-DRI? If so, how long should I wait after a steroid shot before I can start a course of Foxo4-DRI?

Thanks! 



#383 Rocket

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Posted 20 March 2018 - 04:55 PM

What is now the consensus on when to stop using anti-inflammatory supplements such as Curcumin/Ginger?

Is stopping 2 weeks prior to and after administering Foxo4-DRI sufficient?

What about regular vitamins/minerals/essental trace elements?

And NR?

 

I have Rheumatoid Arthritis and I get steroid shots in joints every now and then: could that interfere with Foxo4-DRI? If so, how long should I wait after a steroid shot before I can start a course of Foxo4-DRI?

Thanks! 

 

Honestly, sir, no one here knows. It's all speculation. I seriously doubt it takes 2 weeks for curcumin to clear out of your system.... Look at the half life. Do you think anyone here has done a study on steroid injections and FOXO4? No!

 

This site is ALL 100% broscience.

 

You have people like Nate running around claiming he knows how to cure erectile dysfunction. And then you have 30yo's injecting FOXO4 to clear out senescent cells when they don't have any to clear out and all they are getting is the negative side effects of taking cancer medication without any benefits.

 

There are VERY few people here who know anything at all.


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#384 OP2040

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Posted 22 March 2018 - 03:52 AM

 

What is now the consensus on when to stop using anti-inflammatory supplements such as Curcumin/Ginger?

Is stopping 2 weeks prior to and after administering Foxo4-DRI sufficient?

What about regular vitamins/minerals/essental trace elements?

And NR?

 

I have Rheumatoid Arthritis and I get steroid shots in joints every now and then: could that interfere with Foxo4-DRI? If so, how long should I wait after a steroid shot before I can start a course of Foxo4-DRI?

Thanks! 

 

Honestly, sir, no one here knows. It's all speculation. I seriously doubt it takes 2 weeks for curcumin to clear out of your system.... Look at the half life. Do you think anyone here has done a study on steroid injections and FOXO4? No!

 

This site is ALL 100% broscience.

 

You have people like Nate running around claiming he knows how to cure erectile dysfunction. And then you have 30yo's injecting FOXO4 to clear out senescent cells when they don't have any to clear out and all they are getting is the negative side effects of taking cancer medication without any benefits.

 

There are VERY few people here who know anything at all.

 

 

This site can be frustrating, and I'll be the first to admit that I'm going to fall into the "broscience" category because I just don't have the background, or possibly the intelligence, to keep up with some of the more technical discussions.

 

Having said that, I don't see how eliminating senescent cells is akin to taking cancer meds.  There likely won't be many negative side effects from FOX04-dri.  The side effects from something like rapamycin are from it's immune compromising effects and not the senolytic action, or so I thought.

 

The super-healthy 20-30 year old neurotics on here are a huge distraction though.  Good for them for being preventative I guess, but it doesn't offer much value to the discussion. 

 

Also, I hope there's another group buy coming up because I'm in!

 


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#385 William Sterog

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Posted 22 March 2018 - 09:50 AM

We are all in the same boat, I have 25 and I'm interested in anything that could possibly improve and prolong my life, it is better to start soon, I believe. I have smoked and drunk since 13 to 19, I also did a lot of drugs back in those days. I have been trying to reverse the damage I infringed to my mind and body.

We all want the same, we can help each other, don't underestimate the young ones, many of us have researched a lot of topics and we can help to the common cause. We are very few the ones interested in this, creating division is going to work against all of us.

Sorry for the off-topic.
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#386 recon

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Posted 22 March 2018 - 11:01 AM

We are all in the same boat, I have 25 and I'm interested in anything that could possibly improve and prolong my life, it is better to start soon, I believe. I have smoked and drunk since 13 to 19, I also did a lot of drugs back in those days. I have been trying to reverse the damage I infringed to my mind and body.

We all want the same, we can help each other, don't underestimate the young ones, many of us have researched a lot of topics and we can help to the common cause. We are very few the ones interested in this, creating division is going to work against all of us.

Sorry for the off-topic.

Don’t worry. We ought to believe that senescent cells just appear en masse at a specific cutoff age around 55. Also, make it that telomeres just shortens straight up by half before that age, and AGEs just clog en masse.
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#387 stefan_001

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Posted 22 March 2018 - 11:22 AM

 


This site can be frustrating, and I'll be the first to admit that I'm going to fall into the "broscience" category because I just don't have the background, or possibly the intelligence, to keep up with some of the more technical discussions.

 

Having said that, I don't see how eliminating senescent cells is akin to taking cancer meds.  There likely won't be many negative side effects from FOX04-dri.  The side effects from something like rapamycin are from it's immune compromising effects and not the senolytic action, or so I thought.

 

The super-healthy 20-30 year old neurotics on here are a huge distraction though.  Good for them for being preventative I guess, but it doesn't offer much value to the discussion. 

 

Also, I hope there's another group buy coming up because I'm in!

 

 

 

why do you think there will not be likely side effects and various types of normal cells are left alone?

 


Edited by stefan_001, 22 March 2018 - 11:24 AM.


#388 OP2040

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Posted 22 March 2018 - 02:16 PM

We are all in the same boat, I have 25 and I'm interested in anything that could possibly improve and prolong my life, it is better to start soon, I believe. I have smoked and drunk since 13 to 19, I also did a lot of drugs back in those days. I have been trying to reverse the damage I infringed to my mind and body.

We all want the same, we can help each other, don't underestimate the young ones, many of us have researched a lot of topics and we can help to the common cause. We are very few the ones interested in this, creating division is going to work against all of us.

Sorry for the off-topic.


You’re right that was much too harsh. I’m just excited to see results. I definitely embrace an “all in” attitude when it comes to anti-aging. Meaning that no one should be left behind, including the very old and very poor.

#389 OP2040

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Posted 22 March 2018 - 02:24 PM

[quote name="stefan_001" post="844319" timestamp="1521717777"]

Well, we don’t really know at this point, there has to be an element of educated guessing. But the study indicated all the reasons why it should be very specific and targeted. It specifically targets only SASP secreting cells. Biology being what it is, there certainly could be some collateral danage. But I’d be most disappointed if it did nothing at all. If it works, alongside some setbacks or concerns, at least we can be sure we’re inching closer to a good therapy for this particular hallmark.



This site can be frustrating, and I'll be the first to admit that I'm going to fall into the "broscience" category because I just don't have the background, or possibly the intelligence, to keep up with some of the more technical discussions.

Having said that, I don't see how eliminating senescent cells is akin to taking cancer meds. There likely won't be many negative side effects from FOX04-dri. The side effects from something like rapamycin are from it's immune compromising effects and not the senolytic action, or so I thought.

The super-healthy 20-30 year old neurotics on here are a huge distraction though. Good for them for being preventative I guess, but it doesn't offer much value to the discussion.

Also, I hope there's another group buy coming up because I'm in!


[/quote]

why do you think there will not be likely side effects and various types of normal cells are left alone?

[/quote]

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#390 jdlancaster519

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Posted 22 March 2018 - 03:31 PM

I would disagree that the young taking the medicine has no value. Any of the negative side effects would be easier to see in someone younger and in better health. This is what is often done in Phase 1 clinical trials. Sure, it is a risk... but I thank them for it. It's good for us.

 

On a personal note, I'm hoping a "young"(30-45) person with a history of joint injuries/surgery might try it out. I hope to try it in a few months, but I'll wait until after my shoulder surgery and recovery.


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