2 replies to this topic

[jroseland]

I'm doing a bit of an informal survey to determine a correlation between people who have a high Kratom tolerance and high alcohol tolerance.

 

I hypothesize that if your initial tolerance to Kratom was quite high so would your natural tolerance to alcohol because it's the same sort of liver enzymes and processes that metabolize these psycho-active compounds.

 

This is useful to figure out because if there's a clear correlation than we can look to the significant amount of research done on alcoholism to ascertain what would likely be effective cofactors of Kratom,,,

Which would help a lot to you lower your Kratom dosage and get whole lot better bang for your buck

 

Please respond below if you developed a high tolerance to Kratom (or alcohol) over time that's different than someone who naturally had a high tolerance from the beginning, so please mention that...

 

Thanks!

[nookoda]

Part of the psychoactive effect of alcohol is due to Salsolinol and similar metabolites, these being conjugates of alcohol + amino acids, creating psychoactives in the liver.  Salsolinol has been described as an "opioidopmainergic", and affects both of these systems quite potently.  Salsolinol was once considered an endogenous marker of addiction, and heightened levels of this compound are found in both drug users and alcoholics.  Regardless of this being a marker of addiction or not, the bio-synthesis of this compound is well understood, and its psychoactivity is as well.  Because of this, I also have hypothesized that kratom, and opioids, will lead to one becoming more tolerant to the effects of alcohol.  Sure enough, my own experiences match.  I am not a drinker, but after a month long kratom regimen, I was able to put down way more alcohol without much of an effort, or even a hangover like I would normally get.  Maybe my liver is working extra hard or something, but the connection has indeed been noticed.

[forensicyo]

My initial response was to say no, in that I may use 10g of kratom for several weeks and notice no cross-tolerance with alcohol.  However, I'm trying to think this through a little more carefully and there may be an effect where alcohol leaves me more tolerant of kratom and that's why I would need 10g to notice any effect from the kratom at all.

 

So, ~four out of seven days a week I have a relatively modest amount of alcohol, rarely more than two glasses of wine or two beers on any day when I do drink, and the effects or potency of the ETOH remained consistent, that is, the alcohol seemed to be as potent for a buzz or relaxation as it was before the kratom.  The difference however may be with the kratom itself, where more modest amounts of kratom 2g, 4g, and 6g, when tried, with different strains elicited little noticeable response.  9g to 12g a dose did elicit a nice and response of what kratom is famous for when it works well: clean stimulation that feels very natural (not hyper or excessive energy), definite motivation that is usually lacking with substances and that, for me, does not occur with traditional stimulants (dexedrine being the one that has helped me at times manage attentional difficulties, but leaves me feeling extra energy but without motivating effects), and mood benefits (not necessarily euphoria but certainly euthymia that is welcomed and a relief at times).  In the various fora it seems many get robust responses from more modest amounts of kratom and so I was puzzled why I required more when typically I stop drinking at two drinks because dysphoria accompanies alcohol intoxication that begins with sometimes three and definitely four drinks.  (When I say "drink" I am estimating an ounce of alcohol per drink.)  Anyway, I hope this thread gets more attention, I am interested in this question and hoping others speak to it too.  Thanks for asking!