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My Nootropics Journey-- Brought me to a very high place, then shoved me far down. Huperzine A?

huperzine a nootropic focus formula burn out derealization brain fog chronic fatigue

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#1 FreelyFlourish

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 06:06 AM


I will try and keep this concise, yet detailed to paint you an accurate picture. Hello, first of all, my name is John. I first discovered the power of nootropics back last summer (summer of 2012.) I hadn't tried any yet, however. I transferred colleges and moved out to UT at chattanooga, and began taking something known as Windmill: Focus Formula. It contains Huperzine A and a myriad of others. I cannot post a link, as I am a new member, but am sure it won't be difficult to find with a quick google search. Prior to taking this, I was always quite average in reading, verbal fluency, motivation, etc. After a week or two of taking these, WOW! Things really took off for me. I was absolutely blown away by the results My verbal fluency increased tenfold, I was far more outgoing and sociable, my thought-action reportoire was more expansive than it ever had been, I was so incredibly motivated. I was doing well in school, and was EXTREMELY interested in everything.... almost too attentive and interested some days, if that makes sense. This went on for two wonderful months, and then one day, this focus formula began making me very, very tired. I stopped taking it around the end of October 2012. The overall fatigue grew worse, then it transformed into a remarkable brain fog and bizarre feeling of derealization. Intracranial pressure began occuring, complete lack of memory. I began doing things such as putting the box of cereal in the fridge, going to play a song in my car from my ipod that was already playing- It just didnt register to me. Those are very minor example, I just cannot remember anything right now. I had neurofeedback testing done that showed my beta waves were remarkably low. This brain fog and derealization grew much worse and very debilitating to the point I could no longer continue school. I did late withdrawals from a couple reading-intensive courses, finished out the other ones. I then subleased my apartment and moved back home in with my folks. I had to withdraw from University this semester, which is the last thing i ever planned on doing. Here it is, March, and all of these symptoms and still here and even more severe. In addtion to the chronic symptoms such as decreased thought-action reportiore, poor verbal fluency, very poor memory recall, intracranial pressure (usually made much worse with temperature shifts, such as the heater coming on in my car), I also have a very stiff neck all the time. (My regular chirporactor says there is no structual cause for it.) I've seen number of people, had numerous tests. The only abnormality found in the past 3-4 months of testing has been found last week and I am deficient in vitamin D (panel showed 27, with normal range 30-90.) MRI and EEG were normal. A couple months back I took up paleolithic diet, so I eat very well, and supplement with a number of things including ashwaganda, lions mane, multivitamin, probiotic, turmeric, oil of oregano, fish oil, magnesium/vitamin c, d3 drops, resveratrol, and b12. I did my best to not come to the forums and tried seeking help from "medical professionals" however everyone has told me there is nothing wrong with me. Sorry for the longwinded post, just figured I should explain a bit about the situaiton if I should hold any hopes of receiving sound advice. Here recently I have been considering trying some more nootropics, just to see if they will help, as I am about out of options. The majority of days I do not feel "in my head" enough to even drive, almost as if I feel really, really intoxicated. I thank you for whoever took the time to read this, and look forward to discussing with you all.
Kind Regards,
John Holloway
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#2 FreelyFlourish

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 06:20 AM

Also, for what it's worth- I've been considering getting a Lumbar Puncture at this point, to check my cerebrospinal fluid and make sure nothing is going on there. My neurologist said it's not necessary, and that it's all just anxiety and OCD. Go figure. The way my brain is functioning, and how desperately I just want to feel normal again, I don't know If I'm grasping at straws or if that would be an appropriate direction to take.
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#3 nightlight

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 02:14 PM

Looking at the ingredients I would say your main side effects match what I get from Alpha Lipoic Acid at 50-100mg/day dose (a zombie/derealization, brain fog). From my own experimentation, a combo of ALCAR (1000mg/day), Hup A (50mcg/day on alternate weeks), L-Tyrosine (500mg), Bacopa, Gingko, B12 methylcobalamin (sublingual, 1-3000mcg), DHEA (50mg/day) should put you back in action.

Edited by nightlight, 06 March 2013 - 02:16 PM.


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#4 prunk

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 02:50 PM

Looking at the ingredients I would say your main side effects match what I get from Alpha Lipoic Acid at 50-100mg/day dose (a zombie/derealization, brain fog). From my own experimentation, a combo of ALCAR (1000mg/day), Hup A (50mcg/day on alternate weeks), L-Tyrosine (500mg), Bacopa, Gingko, B12 methylcobalamin (sublingual, 1-3000mcg), DHEA (50mg/day) should put you back in action.

Don't want to sound offensive, but that's impossible to say.

I'd advice to stop taking all the nootropics completely at least for 3-6 months and just maintain a healthy diet and lifestyle as much as possible. If the situation in few months is still what it is now, then obviously more medical examination is needed.

#5 nightlight

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 03:15 PM

I'd advice to stop taking all the nootropics completely at least for 3-6 months and just maintain a healthy diet and lifestyle as much as possible. If the situation in few months is still what it is now, then obviously more medical examination is needed.


He already did stop. Doctor's will have no clue what to do about it -- they'll just mechanically add some antipsychotics/antidepressants which will make it worse and turn him into a lifelong subscriber to their drugs & services.

ALA is known to cause derealisation and brain frog in some people (including myself), perhaps due to its chelating effects especially on heavy metals and different sensitivities to Hg, Cu and Pb getting moved around and deposited at wrong places as the ALA levels rise and fall (ALA has half life in humans of only 3 hours, and easily crosses BBB). Several years ago I was using a multivitamin which had 100mg/day of ALA and took a year of experimentation and research to pin the down the cause of the highly disruptive and unpleasant side effects. Since then I had changed my suplements approach to combining and testing individual components rather than taking ready made combination formulas.
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#6 boomer11

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 06:34 PM

If I were you I would start meditating. You have nothing to lose by trying it. Look into it, it has so many benefits I can't believe its not talked about more. I'm just getting into it now, and have no idea if it will help with your situation, but it definatly can't hurt, and worst case it will still improve some aspects of your life. Look into vipassana/mindfulness mediation, it seems to be the most basic kind. A book I read which is available for free on the internet is called minfulness in plain english.

Just did a quick google search and found some anecdotes that it worked for some people. Definately look into it and keep us updated on whether or not it works.

Good luck

Edited by boomer11, 06 March 2013 - 06:46 PM.

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#7 BLimitless

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 08:50 PM

Sounds like possible heavy metal poisoning from what has been released by the R-ALA?


Well, what you can do is start taking in copious amounts of the following food powders: wheatgrass, barleygrass, chlorella, spirulina. They are called superfoods, a single shot of them pretty much gives you your vitamins for the day. They are very good for heavy metal detox.


I'd recommend doing a fast and lots of saunas, IR saunas. You need to flush your body of whatever it is clogging your neurotransmission up. Some of the symptoms (e.g. putting creal in the fridge) remind me of when I was very acetylcholine deficient, here are the symptoms, see if you are like so: Acetylcholine Deficiency Symptoms


Acetylcholine deficiency

Acetylcholine deficiency signs/symptoms:
  • Difficulty remembering names and faces after meeting people
  • Difficulty remembering peoples birthdays and numbers
  • Difficulty remembering lists, directions or instructions
  • Forgetting common facts
  • Trouble understanding spoken or written language
  • Forget where I put things (e.g. keys)
  • Making simple mistakes at work
  • Slowed and/or confused thinking
  • Difficulty finding the right words before speaking
  • Disorientation
  • Prefer to do things alone than in groups / social withdrawal
  • Rarely feel passionate
  • Feel despair and lack joy
  • Lost some of my creativity / lack imagination
  • Dry mouth
Acetylcholine levels may be low due to a combination of genetic and acquired reasons. Acetylcholine can be raised effectively using either nutrient based therapies or medications.
Factors which reduce acetylcholine levels:
  • Choline (precursor) deficiency
  • B1 & B5 deficiency
  • Chronic stress
  • Inadequate sleep
  • Elevated blood sugar/insulin resistance
  • Mercury, lead, aluminium, PCB’s, fertilizers, pesticides and EMF exposure
  • Over-methylation

Edited by BLimitless, 06 March 2013 - 08:53 PM.


#8 prunk

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 11:06 AM

Ashwagandha, Lion's mane, Resveratrol and Turmeric are nootropics and they can be very powerful for some. Also fish oil can cause depressive symptons, as well as high doses of B-vitamines.

#9 BioFreak

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 12:27 PM

why don't you do the braverman test and report back?

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#10 FreelyFlourish

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 11:43 PM

To the one who posted about mindfullness meditation-- I actually have been practicing this for the past few months. It is one of the only things that helps me cope. I am going to purchase some Choline today to add to my regimine. I added rhodiola yesterday, which might be helping, too early to tell though.
I will do the braverman test tonight and post results as well. I do a very good job of getting all my nutrients-- I work at an Urban Fare grocery store and take daily wheatgrass shots, pure green vegetable juices, etc. And as I said earlier, I am on the paleolithic diet. All I want is some sort of direction. In my Multivitamin, there exists all my b vitamins in high quantities-- That being said, is it still possible I could have an acetylcholine deficiency? My doctor I currently see does hormone testing, would this be a logical step to take? In other words, would this hormone testing pick up brain hormones and all?
Thank you all so much for the thought out responses... If you need any information about my situation simply ask and I will tell you. I want nothing more than to feel normal again.

#11 prunk

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Posted 08 March 2013 - 12:24 AM

I want nothing more than to feel normal again.

When was the last time you felt normal?

#12 FreelyFlourish

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Posted 08 March 2013 - 02:03 AM

Well, the last time I felt normal was probably right before I stopped taking the Focus Formula and all the symptoms began occuring and growing worse in severity, with new neurological ones popping up as time progressed. I've told you all the specific symptoms, so to put it differently and simply... My head just feels unbelievably foreign and quite unsafe. Often I feel as if I am upside down and all the blood has rushed to my head-- I feel that sensation quite often, for hours on end.

#13 abelard lindsay

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Posted 09 March 2013 - 04:01 AM

Well the neck ache sounds like high ACH, IMHO.

You might want to look at this thread: http://www.longecity...ylcholine-ouch/

How many of the symptoms below do you have?

http://mindrenewal.us/page13.html

Symptoms of High Acetylcholine

Subdued or depressed mood
Anhedonia (inability to experience pleasure)
Difficulty concentrating
Difficulty with higher-order or complex thought processes
Mental fatigue
Mental confusion
Memory problems
Decreased motivation
Feeling overly sleepy or tired (particularly in the evening), despite adequate sleep and rest
Difficulty understanding or performing tasks
Pessimistic, negative ideation or rumination
Feelings of helplessnes and hopelessness
Fretfulness
Irritability or anger
Emotional heightening and lability
Sadness, tearfulness
Blurred vision
Headache
Dry mouth
Altered sense of smell; heighted sensitivity to odors; olfactory delusions
Stomach pain or discomfort
Intestinal gas or bloating
Diarrhea or constipation
Nausea, dizziness, and vomiting
Muscle pain or discomfort
Joint pain, discomfort, or swelling
Tooth or jaw pain or discomfort
Tingling or numbness in arms or legs
Muscle weakness
Increased urinary frequency or problems with bladder control
Flu or cold-like symptoms
Weakening of immune system and increased susceptibility to illness
Cough
Nasal discharge
Chills or sensation of cold
Cold feet, hands
Sleep disturbance
Introversion
Anxiety
More and vivid dreaming, and higher incidence of nightmares
Decreased levels in the brain of the neurotransmitters, serotonin, norepinephrine, and dopamine
Interference with the release of the above brain transmitters, because of higher inhibition


Edited by abelard lindsay, 09 March 2013 - 04:04 AM.

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#14 FreelyFlourish

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Posted 09 March 2013 - 06:21 PM

Yes the excess ACH is what I theorized when It first started happening! Because the Huperzine A Inhibits the uptake of acetylcholine, allowing it to build up-- And I took the 100mcg of huperzine a daily for months. IF THIS WERE fhe issue, which is very well may be, what would be the best way to bring my acetylcholine levels down? Because I also read, in addition ot my other symptoms, that stiff neck and the neurological symptoms are found in excessive ach. Should I begin using piracetam to bring the ACH levels down until I feel normal (I hope) and thne begin supplementing with choline if I continue the piracetam?

#15 abelard lindsay

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Posted 09 March 2013 - 07:24 PM

Yes the excess ACH is what I theorized when It first started happening! Because the Huperzine A Inhibits the uptake of acetylcholine, allowing it to build up-- And I took the 100mcg of huperzine a daily for months. IF THIS WERE fhe issue, which is very well may be, what would be the best way to bring my acetylcholine levels down? Because I also read, in addition ot my other symptoms, that stiff neck and the neurological symptoms are found in excessive ach. Should I begin using piracetam to bring the ACH levels down until I feel normal (I hope) and thne begin supplementing with choline if I continue the piracetam?


When my ACH levels got to high when taking Coluracetam I found that taking 1 pill of benadryl, which is a common over the counter anti-allergy medication and anti-cholinergic helped me immensely. I personally would not exceed one pill.

#16 FreelyFlourish

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Posted 10 March 2013 - 07:20 PM

Do you think its been excessive ACH levels this whole time? Considering I stopped taking the nootropics months ago, around 5 months maybe, would this not have sorted itself out? All my symptoms are quite severe, cognitively blunting and debilitating in daily talks. It is possible the Hup A downregulated my ach receptors?

#17 Sasha_

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Posted 10 March 2013 - 07:54 PM

Downregulation of your Ach receptors, most likely I'd say, by the way, in my opinion and experience it is a bad idea to ingest Hup A on a daily basis, especially if you are healthy,
it is also not recommended to take both vinpocetine and ginkgo together.
I noticed what would bring me back to normal after a bit of abuse of noots, is to firstly stopping taking any supps, and take L-theanine. I don't know how to explain but it seems to "reset" my brain. Try also acupuncture to relieve any stress or blockages in your body, that might help with your neck.

#18 FreelyFlourish

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Posted 10 March 2013 - 08:14 PM

I've been avoiding most noots except for the essential brain health ones such as Omegas and what is listed above for quite some time. I have L-Theanine and take it night time when the sleep disturbances come on, but it doesn't seem to have a profound impact on my state. Why should one not take vimpocetine and ginkgo together? At this point, considering I HAVE to go back to school in the fall or else I will lose all my scholarships permanently- I am desperate to have my brain back and would try anything. I just took my first dose of 1g piracetam to potentially upregulate the each receptors-- if that is even the issue.
But I've gone through and been "treated for" so many theories for why I'm like this. Ranging from Thyroid dysfunction, adrenal exhaustion, Lyme Disease, etc. But the source of the problem happened at the end of taking the Focus Formula, so there HAS to be a correlation- somehting happened in my brain that I have to fix, as every other doctor says there is nothing wrong with me. But I mean, hey, I'm not going to leave my girlfriend, drop out of college, move back to my parent's city and work full time for treatment money just for anxiety. I know something is going on.

#19 abelard lindsay

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Posted 10 March 2013 - 09:15 PM

I've been avoiding most noots except for the essential brain health ones such as Omegas and what is listed above for quite some time. I have L-Theanine and take it night time when the sleep disturbances come on, but it doesn't seem to have a profound impact on my state. Why should one not take vimpocetine and ginkgo together? At this point, considering I HAVE to go back to school in the fall or else I will lose all my scholarships permanently- I am desperate to have my brain back and would try anything. I just took my first dose of 1g piracetam to potentially upregulate the each receptors-- if that is even the issue.
But I've gone through and been "treated for" so many theories for why I'm like this. Ranging from Thyroid dysfunction, adrenal exhaustion, Lyme Disease, etc. But the source of the problem happened at the end of taking the Focus Formula, so there HAS to be a correlation- somehting happened in my brain that I have to fix, as every other doctor says there is nothing wrong with me. But I mean, hey, I'm not going to leave my girlfriend, drop out of college, move back to my parent's city and work full time for treatment money just for anxiety. I know something is going on.


A stiff neck and gastrointestinal distress would be things that point to high ACH as these are not things that occur with low ACH. High ACH also creates a general feeling of malaise , depression and dread. I couldn't find anything conclusive as to whether hup a is fat soluble or not, thought this study points in that direction (http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/22583846) showing that it can bind with lipids and release slowly into the body.

If Piracetam helps, it's likely to be high ach. If choline supplements don't help or make things worse that's another indication it could be high ach. If Piracetam makes things worse and choline supplements make things better than it's more likely to be low ach or downregulated receptors.

Edited by abelard lindsay, 10 March 2013 - 09:18 PM.

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#20 FreelyFlourish

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Posted 10 March 2013 - 09:23 PM

I've been avoiding most noots except for the essential brain health ones such as Omegas and what is listed above for quite some time. I have L-Theanine and take it night time when the sleep disturbances come on, but it doesn't seem to have a profound impact on my state. Why should one not take vimpocetine and ginkgo together? At this point, considering I HAVE to go back to school in the fall or else I will lose all my scholarships permanently- I am desperate to have my brain back and would try anything. I just took my first dose of 1g piracetam to potentially upregulate the each receptors-- if that is even the issue.
But I've gone through and been "treated for" so many theories for why I'm like this. Ranging from Thyroid dysfunction, adrenal exhaustion, Lyme Disease, etc. But the source of the problem happened at the end of taking the Focus Formula, so there HAS to be a correlation- somehting happened in my brain that I have to fix, as every other doctor says there is nothing wrong with me. But I mean, hey, I'm not going to leave my girlfriend, drop out of college, move back to my parent's city and work full time for treatment money just for anxiety. I know something is going on.


A stiff neck and gastrointestinal distress would be things that point to high ACH as these are not things that occur with low ACH. High ACH also creates a general feeling of malaise , depression and dread. I couldn't find anything conclusive as to whether hup a is fat soluble or not, thought this study points in that direction (http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/22583846) showing that it can bind with lipids and release slowly into the body.

If Piracetam helps, it's likely to be high ach. If choline supplements don't help or make things worse that's another indication it could be high ach. If Piracetam makes things worse and choline supplements make things better than it's more likely to be low ach or downregulated receptors.



Considering the time-frame, it is possible that I've had high ACH levels for months and months causing these symptoms from the downregulation of ACH receptors? This wouldn't correct itself over time with proper diet and such?

#21 Sasha_

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Posted 10 March 2013 - 09:25 PM

since they both increase cranial blood flow, and vinpo being quite potent in itself, it is usually advised not to combine them, or any other coumpound having this property, but having said that I have no idea wether it is involved or not in your condition. What I was merely trying to say, is I don't think this combination you have been taking is actually a wise one.

#22 prunk

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Posted 10 March 2013 - 10:17 PM

No wonder you still feel like crap. That stuff you've been taking is (yet again) one bloody mishmash containing powerful ingredients.

If Piracetam helps, it's likely to be high ach. If choline supplements don't help or make things worse that's another indication it could be high ach. If Piracetam makes things worse and choline supplements make things better than it's more likely to be low ach or downregulated receptors.

Even though one of those options work, doesn't mean the problem is in ACh, although it can offer some (highly) speculative guidelines where the problem might be. It's important to be cautious with simplifications in situations where the cause and the effect are not clearly visible or/and understandable - especially when one's sanity might be at stake. That said, I'd think abelard might be on a right (very wide) track. The reason why I'm saying so is because of my personal experiences. So, it's an opinion. Hardly scientifical.

I still think you should give your brain a rest for a while and not consume any pills what so ever.

Edited by prunk, 10 March 2013 - 10:18 PM.


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#23 FreelyFlourish

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Posted 10 March 2013 - 10:55 PM

Well the thing is I understan there may be not one specific cause-- however I've done nearly every lab test under the sun it seems with all normal results... and yet many days I feel so whacked out and inebriated in my head I feel it unsafe to even drive a vehicle. I'm a cashier and find myself giving chance to the wrong customer, asking some if they want credit or debit when holding up a paper or plastic bag after they have already paid- it's as if half my brain is just asleep. Most signs point ot neurological Lyme disease, which is the reason I'm taking herbs such as eluthero, cats claw and others-- I did have a positive Lyme westerb blot a few months back when the symptoms began. I just had myself tested again last week and it came back negative, leaving me lost. I've done through periods in these months of not taking anything, trust me, things get bad quite quickly for my neurological symptoms. So, I'm just in dire need ot some assistance. I understand you all can't tell me what's wrong with me, but all I want is a direction. My cognitive funcitoning abilities seem to be declining quite rapidly, and no one can tell me why! I'm only 20 years old. Considering getting my hormones checked? Just don't know anymore...

EDIT- For those who didn't read the part about me having ceased taking the focus formula (hup a, ginkgo, vincep, etc)-- I stopped taking it 6 months ago
My current regimine is Turmeric, Cat's Claw, Fish oil, Oil or Oregano, Multi Vit, Probiotic, D3(because im deficient) and b12, Liver supplement, just stared rhodiola for my chronic fatigue-- and just took piracetam for the first time today. I eat paleolithic diet and the only thing I drink is reverse osmosis water and freshly juiced vegetable juice

Edited by FreelyFlourish, 10 March 2013 - 11:04 PM.


#24 FreelyFlourish

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 01:05 AM

Also to add, the entire time I've had these symptoms random triggers throughout my days, EVERYDAY, have been allowing me to remember dreams from years and years ago- even ones I havent thought of since the sleep I had hem in. It's been pretty bizarre actually- As much memory impairment, brain fog, derealization I'm going through- I've been able to remember a myriad of dreams, new ones, daily, from years and years ago. Could this be related to high ACH and it's role in sleep?

ACh is involved in dreaming too, taking supplements that increase ACh or drugs that inhibit the breakdown of ACh gives more vivid dreams that often are remembered, and people who practice lucid dreaming often takes these kinds of supplements to increase the chance of having a lucid dream.

From http://subtlepangs.b...ulation-or.html

#25 renfr

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 02:06 AM

It could be ALA as it can move out mercury from certain parts of your body to the brain.

I don't think it's Ach downregulation, I've abused chominergics for more than 3 months to the point it was making me nervous and after immediate withdrawal I felt rather fine not braindead.
It's not impossible given the fact that huperzine A also function as a pesticide (though not being an organophosphorus compound).
Acetylcholinesterase inhibition is probably over now and should have returned to baseline.

Lookup for ALA mercury and the brain, you do not seem to be the only one who has this effect.

Do you have dental amalgams?
Were you drinking enough water when you took that supplement?

#26 renfr

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 02:11 AM

When you plan taking chelators, drinking water is a must to excrete the toxin or else it could lodge somewhere else including in the brain.
I remember having horrible headaches from MSM (another chelator) until I read that drinking water alleviate this, I drank sufficient amounts and it went away.
When you chelate the toxin goes everywhere in the bloodstream, if the chelator crosses the BBB then if there isn't enough circulation it can stay there.

#27 FreelyFlourish

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 02:33 AM

I wasn't drinking a lot of water, no. How can I cleanse the brain of the mercury if that it is the issue? I have some fillings, and a parmanent retainer on the back of my top and bottom row of teeth,

#28 renfr

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 03:45 AM

I wasn't drinking a lot of water, no. How can I cleanse the brain of the mercury if that it is the issue? I have some fillings, and a parmanent retainer on the back of my top and bottom row of teeth,

Knowing you have mercury fillings I do not know which method would apply best, MSM and NAC are good mercury excreting agents however they might not suit your needs.
They are sometimes criticized for not being that powerful but you still can give them a try, MSM and NAC are both cheap and sold OTC.
They're quite powerful in terms of detox and might cause an herxheimer reaction if you start with an high dose, that's why you should start with 200mg NAC first then wait some hours and start 250mg MSM if there is no side effect from the NAC.
Drink a lot of water, between 2-3L of pure water, this can be from tea but it cannot be water from soda or food, it's 2-3L from bottled water or tea (green or detox tea preferably).
The days after you can up NAC by 100-200mg and MSM by 250mg until you reach 800-1000 mg for NAC and 1500-3000mg for MSM.
It is important to add vitamin C (as sodium ascorbate) for synergistic effects, 1000-5000mg sodium ascorbate is recommended. (the more MSM and NAC you take the more sodium ascorbate you should take)
Benefits should show up in no more than one week and protocol can be continued for up to 2-4 weeks.
If you use blood thinning medication caution is advised with MSM.
If you are looking for stronger methods or if this one doesn't work then you would like to inform yourself about DMSA, it is a potent molecule but it has to be used in a specific protocol as it can deplete zinc or oxidize copper for example but as you have these fillings we don't know how risky this is.
The fact that your beta waves are reduced is a sign or heavy metal poisoning.
Be very careful anyway, chelation is dangerous if you have mercury fillings!
In fact most of people who get the terrible side effects from chelation therapy are the same who have mercury amalgams...
No wonder why ALA caused you such symptoms, it could have been worse.

Anything that excrete heavy metals or chelates then can potentially cause brain damage if you have fluid retention and cannot eliminate the toxins from your system as they will travel in your bloodstream and lodge somewhere else.
Drinking water is essential for this, even vitamin C can cause brain fog if you don't take enough fluids to flush it out.

Edited by renfr, 11 March 2013 - 04:35 AM.


#29 FreelyFlourish

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 08:30 AM

I wasn't drinking a lot of water, no. How can I cleanse the brain of the mercury if that it is the issue? I have some fillings, and a parmanent retainer on the back of my top and bottom row of teeth,

Knowing you have mercury fillings I do not know which method would apply best, MSM and NAC are good mercury excreting agents however they might not suit your needs.
They are sometimes criticized for not being that powerful but you still can give them a try, MSM and NAC are both cheap and sold OTC.
They're quite powerful in terms of detox and might cause an herxheimer reaction if you start with an high dose, that's why you should start with 200mg NAC first then wait some hours and start 250mg MSM if there is no side effect from the NAC.
Drink a lot of water, between 2-3L of pure water, this can be from tea but it cannot be water from soda or food, it's 2-3L from bottled water or tea (green or detox tea preferably).
The days after you can up NAC by 100-200mg and MSM by 250mg until you reach 800-1000 mg for NAC and 1500-3000mg for MSM.
It is important to add vitamin C (as sodium ascorbate) for synergistic effects, 1000-5000mg sodium ascorbate is recommended. (the more MSM and NAC you take the more sodium ascorbate you should take)
Benefits should show up in no more than one week and protocol can be continued for up to 2-4 weeks.
If you use blood thinning medication caution is advised with MSM.
If you are looking for stronger methods or if this one doesn't work then you would like to inform yourself about DMSA, it is a potent molecule but it has to be used in a specific protocol as it can deplete zinc or oxidize copper for example but as you have these fillings we don't know how risky this is.
The fact that your beta waves are reduced is a sign or heavy metal poisoning.
Be very careful anyway, chelation is dangerous if you have mercury fillings!
In fact most of people who get the terrible side effects from chelation therapy are the same who have mercury amalgams...
No wonder why ALA caused you such symptoms, it could have been worse.

Anything that excrete heavy metals or chelates then can potentially cause brain damage if you have fluid retention and cannot eliminate the toxins from your system as they will travel in your bloodstream and lodge somewhere else.
Drinking water is essential for this, even vitamin C can cause brain fog if you don't take enough fluids to flush it out.


So your recommendations are to drink plenty of waterm and begin supplementing with MSM and NAC? For what it's worth, I guinea pig'd myself last week and took the focus formula again for my radio broadcast- It hit me really quick, really quick- I was up there and functioning at top knotch... Then 2 hours later I was the sleepiest I could even remember being. So unbelievable tred, when the focus formula used to keep me up for 10+ solid hours.

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#30 renfr

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 10:34 AM

So you're saying that you tried this during 2 months and it gave you great effects then it didn't effect anymore and you started being braindead, as a consequence you wore off and in 6 months of abstinence your braindeadness didn't resolve right? And you took it last week and started feeling good effects until it wore off?
Well it could be the mercury moving in and out of your brain, the ALA could have moved it again it's possible that this happened...
You could try the NAC + MSM + Vit C formula with lots of water for one week and report, that will help flushing out the toxin and rule out the problem that is "is it the mercury or something else in the formula".
After that we'll see, I'll give you other solutions if that doesn't work.





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