9 replies to this topic

[explorer.]

Hi all, 

 

This is my first post here and I desperately need a good advice since Dr didn't have any sound advice regarding combining supplements with Wellbutrin.

 

So I started stack of supplements listed below about 5 months ago since I noticed a lot of (negative) changes in my cognition and mood over the past year to the point that I felt that my life is completely dysfunctional. I am 35 years old. I wanted to try with supplements first before starting real meds for the first time in my life. Dr suggested to start with Lexapro, but after a little bit of research I've found that Wellbutrin XL may be a better choice and Dr agreed.

 

Supplements did help, but not to the point that I can honestly say that I'm okay again, so I'm finally going to start meds and see how it goes. :(

 

My supplement stack for the last 5 months is

Morning 9am

Curcumin Longvida 400mg

Huperzine A 100mg

Vinpocetine 10ug

Pycnogenol 100mg

L-Arginine 3g

Alpha GPC 300mg

Gingo 120mg

5-HTP 100mg

DHA & EPA 1g

Vit C 500mg

Vit D3 5000IU

B12 Methylcobalamin 1000ug

Theanine 200mg (with 2 shot espresso around 10am) 

 

Afternoon 5pm

Huperzine A 100mg

Vinpocetine 10ug

Alpha GPC 300mg

Gingo 120mg

5-HTP 100mg

Vit C 500mg

 

Evening before sleep

5-HTP 100mg

Pycnogenol 100mg

L-Arginine 3g

B6 100mg

Zinc 50mg

Mg Citrate 400-500mg

 

With all this I got a tangible improvement in my mood, memory, brain fog, sleep and depression with literally no side effects except really bad nightmares for the first week.

 

Moving forward and introducing Wellbutrin XL I'm thinking to ditch Huperzine A, Vinpocetine, Gingo and to decrease the dose of Alpha GPC, so my new supplement & med stack would be:

 

Morning 9am

Wellbutrin XL 150mg

Curcumin Longvida 400mg

Pycnogenol 100mg

L-Arginine 3g

5-HTP 100mg

DHA & EPA 1g

Vit C 500mg

Vit D3 5000IU (every other day)

B12 Methylcobalamin 1000ug (every other day)

Theanine 200mg (with 2 shot espresso a bit later like 10am) 

 

Afternoon 5pm

Alpha GPC 300mg

5-HTP 100mg

Vit C 500mg

 

Evening before sleep

5-HTP 100mg

Pycnogenol 100mg

L-Arginine 3g

B6 50mg

Zinc 50mg

Mg Citrate 400-500mg

 

If you need more info from me, please let me know!

Edited by explorer., 30 June 2016 - 02:33 PM.

[thedevinroy]

You have to get the brand name and start off at the most half the max dose. You want to avoid anticholinergic side effects, and though they are slight in some areas, they are potent in others. Tinnitus being a side effect that if you notice, you have to stop immediately. Vertigo is annoying, but it is not a deal breaker. When you get it, if you do, it's time for bed.

Second, know the metabolism of the things you take. The CYP enzymes are induced and inhibited by different molecules. Find out which do what. For instance, modafinil induced the enzyme that metabolizes bupropion (Wellbutrin) but is not metabolized by that same enzyme. Drugs like that will mess your metabolism up for the whole day, maybe more. In my experience, Wellbutrin never kicked in until the day after I stopped modafinil.

Curcumin is kind of one of those drugs, but on the other side of things. If it enhances the properties too much, you will have to stop taking it

Edited by devinthayer, 30 June 2016 - 04:41 PM.

[Keizo]

I'd halve the dose of zinc unless there is any particular reason you would need it. I take less than that though since I most likely get several tens of milligrams every day from food. I see no reason to risk (even if a small one) causing problems with mineral balances, especially since I don't take blood samples to check the levels. 

[explorer.]

@devinthayer thank you for the reply, I'm really appreciate it. 

 

@Keizo There is no special reason for the zinc dosage, in fact I was taking 25mg and just recently increased to 50 to see if a higher dose would make any difference.

 

Also I forgot to mention when I started my stack 5 months ago I was taking L-Tyrosine for about two months and then I stop taking it. When I started the whole stack I noticed straight away that my appetite is 1/3 of what it used to be and that my mood is much better, but I thought it's 5-HTP. Now I'm thinking that stopping L-Tyrosine wasn't the best idea since I lost those positive changes in the meantime. 

[thedevinroy]

I agree that L Tyrosine is one hell of a drug. When you are feeling unproductive, pop a capsule open over your mouth and pour it in. Chew on it for a bit, doesn't taste like much, and notice the slight boost you get from it sublingually.

It's subtle, but real.


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[jcalderaio]

Make sure you ask your dr to write "BRAND NAME MEDICALLY NECESSARY" on your Wellbutrin XL prescription, or your insurance may not cover it. Actually, my insurance originally wouldn't even pay for the brand name. I got a new prescription from my dr that said "medically necessary" and called my insurance. After I explained to the prescription department of my insurance that Wellbutrin was a drug that varied greatly in they brand vs generic, they pay 100% for my brand name. 

[jcalderaio]

BTW, I combined a shit-ton of supplements AND meds with my Wellbutrin, and I was fine. Wellbutrin has the notoriety of being extremely safe when combined with other meds. The only thing you have to watch out for, is that it lowers the seizure thresh hold. I stopped Wellbutrin because it gave me too much anxiety. Even 150 XL (the lowest XL dose) gave me a lot of anxiety. I don't want to bother with the non-extended release versions because I dont feel like taking it multiple times per day :/

[explorer.]

Thanks @jcalderaio, it will be a brand product (by Valeant) but at this point in time I pay the full cost; I don't have patience to deal with insurance and papers right now, will do it later if the drug works for me and if a longer treatment is necessary 

 

[explorer.]

@devinthayer

 

Can you give me some perspective in regard to Wellbutrin & Modafinil, you said that "Wellbutrin never kicked in until the day after I stopped modafinil" so what are pros and cons being on one drug compared to another?

[thedevinroy]

@devinthayer

 

Can you give me some perspective in regard to Wellbutrin & Modafinil, you said that "Wellbutrin never kicked in until the day after I stopped modafinil" so what are pros and cons being on one drug compared to another?

 

Modafinil increased wakefulness and things associated with it like speed of thought same as sitting as standing, the day dragged a little less, there was no 3pm crash, etc.  However, it gave me the worst tooth pain in the world.  I was suffering from a really bad cavity, and no matter how much anti-inflammatory herbs I took, Modafinil just ate right through it in a matter of hours.  Was it good for mood and ADHD?  In a sense, yes, since there were no ups an downs in a day, but it didn't have a lot of the norepinephrine promoting effects of other ADHD treatments: methylphenidate, atomoxetine, even buproprion.  So essentially, it was useless to me until I found something a bit stronger to increase my mental capacity and increase planned focus (as opposed to the locomotion effect of amphetamines).

 

Wellbutrin XR, on the other hand, made me angry.  I remember waking up from a nap and planning the "break up" with my best friend.  He was a leach to my finances and a drain on my energy, so it wasn't a regretful decision.  I just scared the crap out of myself.  I had to do it to feel at peace.  This was the day after stopping Modafinil.  Once I did that, I shut off my phone for 3 days.  Never have I acted so cold in all my days.  I wouldn't have had the balls to do it without Wellbutrin, not the forethought to do all the planning.  Sure it gave me anxiety, but in a way that was productive, not OCD.  I stopped taking it due to the vertigo and potential tinnitus, but I just told my doctor it wasn't working.  Technically it was true, since at the time, it didn't work since I was taking the rest of the Modafinil.

 

The upside is that in the three days it did work, once the Modafinil was out of my system, it made a hell of an impact on my life - just not one I'm willing to repeat due to the anti-social nature of it all.  So did Wellbutrin turn me into a sociapath?  I didn't really stick around to find out.  Acetylcholine functions in the temporal lobes are extremely important, and perhaps blocking some of those receptors caused some social disconnect.  I didn't want to mess with it, since ADHD already has the effect of poor circulation in temporal lobes.

 

Anyway, your brain might soak it up and feel like you're taking an NZT-48 pill.  Never know until you try.  This kind of alchemy is an art as much as it is a science.

Edited by devinthayer, 07 July 2016 - 11:17 AM.