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COVID vaccine outcomes

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#241 Ames

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Posted 04 August 2021 - 05:16 AM

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Edited by Ames, 04 August 2021 - 05:18 AM.

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#242 Hip

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Posted 04 August 2021 - 02:41 PM

Ames, you seem to be someone who has developed a lot of distrust in what you read about the pandemic. I don't blame you, because there is a lot of misinformation out there, and unless you have a hard science background, it can be difficult to decide what is true and what is false. 

 
I studied science to post-graduate level, so fortunately for me, I am in a position where I believe I can make reasonable judgement calls on pandemic issues, and I feel I can make the right decisions for myself, and for my family.
 
I did not have any medical background (I studied mathematics and physics for my first degree), but because I have been unable to work due to illness for 15 years, I have spent a lot of time reading about medical science, and especially about viruses, as a virus caused my illness.
 
So I feel reasonably confident that I can make good judgement calls on all the issues which come up in the pandemic. 
 
However, since you seem to distrust everything that is being written about the pandemic, I don't think there is anything I can say that will get through that fog of online misinformation and distrust that we are living in.
 
So I will not try to argue with issues you have brought up, because it is not going to change your mind, and so it will waste your time, as well as mine.
 
It is sad that we live in a time of such distrust and misinformation, but that's the way the world is going.  

Edited by Hip, 04 August 2021 - 03:24 PM.

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#243 Hip

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Posted 04 August 2021 - 09:25 PM

These things are true:
 
The vaccine prevents illness in the vaccinated, to a degree.
The vaccinated can carry and transmit full virus loads.
The virus is more likely to mutate in the vaccinated, given current available vaccines.
The virus isn't going away.

 

 

These things are more accurate:

 

A single dose of the AstraZeneca vaccine reduces the risk of death with COVID-19 by approximately 80% – and two doses of Pfizer cut it by 97% — reference here.

 

Vaccinated people who do get infected are up to 78% less likely to spread the virus to household members, compared to unvaccinated people — reference here. So the vaccinated are less of a danger to other people than the non-vaccinated. 

Most epidemiologists believe that low vaccination rates will make it more likely for vaccine resistant mutations to appear — reference here

 

The virus might be abolished if we reach herd immunity, but that is now looking unlikely because of: (1) vaccine hesitancy, (2) the emergence of new variants, and (3) the delayed arrival of vaccinations for children — reference here.

 

Edited by Hip, 04 August 2021 - 09:31 PM.

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#244 Heisok

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Posted 05 August 2021 - 12:36 AM

From the link above.

 

"Confounding factor of Delta"

 

"But studies on Alpha and other variants cannot be easily generalized to Delta, says Steven Riley, an infectious-diseases researcher at Imperial College London.

So far, there are no published data on how vaccines affect infections and infectiousness with Delta, but a UK study5 published on 21 July shows that the Pfizer–BioNTech and Oxford–AstraZeneca vaccines both protect slightly less well against symptomatic disease caused by Delta than against that caused by Alpha. This could also mean a drop in how well they protect against transmission of Delta, but there is still a lot of uncertainty, says Dean.

 

 

Unpublished preliminary data from Israel’s Ministry of Health show that Delta could chip away at some of the reduction in transmission provided by the Pfizer–BioNTech vaccine. And case numbers have risen sharply in Israel following Delta’s arrival, despite more than 60% of the population being fully vaccinated. This hints at what might happen elsewhere, say researchers.

 

Even if vaccines are just as effective at preventing infections with Delta as with earlier variants, if Delta is more infectious, transmission in households could still increase, says Dean.

A study6 from China, posted as a preprint on 12 July, found that the concentration of viral particles — a proxy for infectiousness — in people infected with Delta was roughly 1,000 times that in people infected with the original strain of SARS-CoV-2.

Delta’s increased infectiousness could mean that the proportion of people in a population who need to be vaccinated to bring the pandemic under control will be larger than would have been required with earlier variants."


Edited by Heisok, 05 August 2021 - 12:37 AM.

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#245 Hip

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Posted 05 August 2021 - 01:59 AM

Delta is the variant of concern at the moment, but new vaccine booster shots from Pfizer are coming out in Sept which specifically targets delta, and so should help strengthen immunity to it. 

 

Pfizer is an mRNA vaccine, and these can be quite easily adapted to target new variants just by changing the RNA sequence. Vector vaccines like the AstraZeneca are more difficult to adapt. 

 

 

New on the horizon is the lambda variant, which first was detected in Peru, but is already in the US and the UK. Preliminary observations indicate lambda is a bit more resistant to vaccines, and there are some indications it may be more transmissible. It is thought it may become the dominant strain in the US soon, and may create a new wave of the pandemic in around 6 months time, as it hits its peak.

 

 


Edited by Hip, 05 August 2021 - 02:50 AM.

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#246 Ames

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Posted 05 August 2021 - 02:13 AM

 

Ames, you seem to be someone who has developed a lot of distrust in what you read about the pandemic. I don't blame you, because there is a lot of misinformation out there, and unless you have a hard science background, it can be difficult to decide what is true and what is false. 

 
I studied science to post-graduate level, so fortunately for me, I am in a position where I believe I can make reasonable judgement calls on pandemic issues, and I feel I can make the right decisions for myself, and for my family.
 
I did not have any medical background (I studied mathematics and physics for my first degree), but because I have been unable to work due to illness for 15 years, I have spent a lot of time reading about medical science, and especially about viruses, as a virus caused my illness.
 
So I feel reasonably confident that I can make good judgement calls on all the issues which come up in the pandemic. 
 
However, since you seem to distrust everything that is being written about the pandemic, I don't think there is anything I can say that will get through that fog of online misinformation and distrust that we are living in.
 
So I will not try to argue with issues you have brought up, because it is not going to change your mind, and so it will waste your time, as well as mine.
 
It is sad that we live in a time of such distrust and misinformation, but that's the way the world is going.  

 

 

Hip, I do have a post-graduate medical background. Stated, given your rhetorical degeneration toward an appeal to authority.

 

You do not write like you have a science background. You write like you either think imprecisely or willfully distort in order to make points. 

 

See above:

 

You state that I "have a lot of distrust in what I read". The reality is that you do not know what I trust or what I do not in total, and you do not know why that is (reading or other). You proceed to falsely assume that any mistrust comes from misinformation.

 

You do this so that you can dishonestly elevate yourself as a more worthy authority, through a false contrast between your science background and what you assume of mine.

 

This impoverished style of argument is not indicative of someone with a science background. 

 

All of this pointless dishonest exercise is to attempt a run-around of any actual communication. By declaring yourself the better authority, through your non-medical education. 

 

You imply that what you state is "not misinformation", to be as contrasted with "misinformation" that is what disagrees. That's an intellectually sad way to argue, for a scientist. In reality, your information has been repeatedly been shown to be inaccurate. That's between the archaic and illiberal morality. 

 

This is either a poorly educated or sociopathic pattern of communication.  


Edited by Ames, 05 August 2021 - 02:29 AM.

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#247 Advocatus Diaboli

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Posted 05 August 2021 - 02:35 AM

"Delta is the variant of concern at the moment, but new vaccine booster shots from Pfizer are coming out in Sept which specifically target delta, and so should help strengthen immunity to it."

 

Pfizer Is Rushing A New Booster Shot, But Some Experts Are Skeptical

 

"But many medical professionals are questioning the company’s decision to go forward with a third-vaccination shot development. “There’s really no indication for a third booster or a third dose of an mRNA vaccine, given the variants that we have circulating at this time,” Dr. Céline Gounder, an infectious disease specialist at Bellevue Hospital Center in New York, told The Times in the same report. “In fact, many of us question whether you will ever need boosters.” One June 2021 study found that both the Pfizer and the Moderna vaccines may protect a person from coronavirus for years.
 
The World Health Organization (WHO), like Gounder, also disagrees with Pfizer’s bid for a booster. In a statement to CNN, WHO said, “We don’t know whether booster vaccines will be needed to maintain protection against COVID-19 until additional data is collected.” The organization added that there’s “limited data available on how long the protection from current doses lasts and whether an additional booster dose would be beneficial and for whom.”
 
It would be nice if posters did a modicum of science-based research before posting their propaganda. One-sided analysis isn't analysis at all.
 
Note: Patients are asked to consult a doctor.

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#248 Hip

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Posted 05 August 2021 - 03:02 AM

Hip, I do have a post-graduate medical background. Stated, given your rhetorical degeneration toward an appeal to authority.

 
That I find hard to believe. Usually it is only the unscientific hippies who have anti-pharma and anti-vax sentiments like yours. 

 

Or sometimes you find old retired dotard scientists turning anti-pharma, in their twilight years when their mental health is poor.

 
What area of medical science did you study? Did you do a PhD? 
 
I have no appeal to authority; rather I am attracted to high quality science. Sometimes I disagree with authority. For example, I disagreed with the WHO's stance on face masks, when in the early pandemic they refused to recommend that people wear them. 
 
 
 

In reality, your information has been repeatedly been shown to be inaccurate.

 
Can you give a single example? 
 
Certainly you have already given me an example of your own errors on this forum: where you claimed long-term coronavirus immunity was a fact, before it had been proven. 
 
Plus you made errors in this earlier post, when you said:

 

The vaccinated are as much a danger to anyone as the unvaccinated. There is zero logical reason for vaccine passports or social exclusion.

 
Vaccinations have been shown to reduce viral transmission, as the link I posted above indicates. There may be some question marks over the delta variant, but those issues may be addressed with a new vaccine targeted at delta. 

 
And for your information, the reason for vaccine passports is less to do with keeping the unvaccinated out of airports, sports events, bars and restaurants, and more to do with simply encouraging people to get vaccinated. If people find they are unable to engage in normal life without a vaccine passport, they will start thinking about getting vaccinated. 

 

In our selfish "me, me, me" society, you cannot expect people to do anything to benefit the community as a whole; people are only out for themselves. So vaccine passports are designed to work with our "me, me, me" culture. 

 

In the more communitarian societies, people get vaccinated because they know it is the right thing to do for their community. The communitarian countries have handled the pandemic much better, because they have a cooperative populace.

 

 

 

The World Health Organization (WHO), like Gounder, also disagrees with Pfizer’s bid for a booster. In a statement to CNN, WHO said, “We don’t know whether booster vaccines will be needed to maintain protection against COVID-19 until additional data is collected.” The organization added that there’s “limited data available on how long the protection from current doses lasts and whether an additional booster dose would be beneficial and for whom.”


I'd rather have the pharma companies taking pro-active action to create a new vaccine now, rather than wait for the slow-to-respond WHO to tell us when to do it. We waste valuable time if we wait for the WHO. Kudos on the pharma companies, who did an astounding job creating these COVID vaccines in such a short timescale.

 

The WHO have been rather slow throughout the whole pandemic.

 

The WHO were very slow to tell us to use face masks, but finally they reversed their policy. The WHO also said right at the beginning of the pandemic that Trump was wrong to shut down travel from China, but it turned out that Trump was right in that instance. 

 


Edited by Hip, 05 August 2021 - 03:15 AM.

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#249 Ames

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Posted 05 August 2021 - 03:58 AM

 
That I find hard to believe. Usually it is only the unscientific hippies who have anti-pharma and anti-vax sentiments like yours. 

 

Or sometimes you find old retired dotard scientists turning anti-pharma, in their twilight years when their mental health is poor.

 

 

How much do you think it matters what a non-medical science student believes, who broad-strokes medical perspective disagreement as misinformation?

 

Given your other, prior noted rhetorical patterns in addition: not much. 

 

Given your rhetorical pattern (see the above quote box, for one, as well as what I detail in my prior response posts), the lack of belief should be more than returned if I were intellectually debased and defeated enough to break this down to asserted academic authority.

 

My prior statement stands in regard to my qualification, and it is all that you need to know. Go find another dog to lead by the nose with your endless nonsense. 

 

I was in the middle of carefully responding to your prior posted rebuttals that were in regard to my other posts (by digging through your cited studies that you didn't bother to do the same for), which you unecessarily again reiterated here.

 

But then I saw this and decided to go another route. You state that I'm equivalent to a dotard man and imply that my mental health is poor solely due to argument that contradicts your own? Not due to style of argument, but due to contradicting content (which you mischaracterize).

 

This should be a glaring, personal opportunity to reflect. How much value do you think your arguments have here, given this approach?

 

And I'm the one whose credentials are in question?

 

Enough is enough, friend. I tried to warn you away from this. Now, I'm leaning more toward pity.

 

I'm defintely not going to sit here and interact with someone with clear social issues that they cannot control. For the forum decorum, I'm ending it. Good luck with the beligerent crusade. 


Edited by Ames, 05 August 2021 - 04:07 AM.

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#250 Advocatus Diaboli

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Posted 05 August 2021 - 04:54 AM

Dr. Hip wrote:

 

"I'd rather have the pharma companies taking pro-active action to create a new vaccine now, rather than wait for the slow-to-respond WHO to tell us when to do it. We waste valuable time if we wait for the WHO. Kudos on the pharma companies, who did an astounding job creating these COVID vaccines in such a short timescale."

 

My esteemed Dr. Hip MD, PhD, NPD, BPD, I demand you include the following on your web pages:

 

Note: Patients are asked to consult a doctor.

 

 

Beast regards,

 

Your fiend, Doktor Advocatus Diaboli


Edited by Advocatus Diaboli, 05 August 2021 - 05:09 AM.

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#251 Daniel Cooper

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Posted 05 August 2021 - 11:32 AM

 
That I find hard to believe. Usually it is only the unscientific hippies who have anti-pharma and anti-vax sentiments like yours. 

 


These sorts of comments are swerving into ad hominem territory.  Attack the ideas, not the person.


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#252 Hip

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Posted 05 August 2021 - 02:52 PM

These sorts of comments are swerving into ad hominem territory.  Attack the ideas, not the person.

 

And this comment too. 

 

But I will try to avoid any further ad hominem territory comments.

 

 

 

 

 

Dr. Hip wrote:

 

"I'd rather have the pharma companies taking pro-active action to create a new vaccine now, rather than wait for the slow-to-respond WHO to tell us when to do it. We waste valuable time if we wait for the WHO. Kudos on the pharma companies, who did an astounding job creating these COVID vaccines in such a short timescale."

 

My esteemed Dr. Hip MD, PhD, NPD, BPD, I demand you include the following on your web pages:

 

I don't follow your meaning. How does my comment on the WHO relate to the amateur psychiatric diagnosis that you just attempted in the above quote? 


Edited by Hip, 05 August 2021 - 02:53 PM.

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#253 Hip

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Posted 05 August 2021 - 03:09 PM

How much do you think it matters what a non-medical science student believes, who broad-strokes medical perspective disagreement as misinformation?
 
Given your other, prior noted rhetorical patterns in addition: not much. 
 
Given your rhetorical pattern (see the above quote box, for one, as well as what I detail in my prior response posts), the lack of belief should be more than returned if I were intellectually debased and defeated enough to break this down to asserted academic authority.
 
My prior statement stands in regard to my qualification, and it is all that you need to know. Go find another dog to lead by the nose with your endless nonsense. 
 
I was in the middle of carefully responding to your prior posted rebuttals that were in regard to my other posts (by digging through your cited studies that you didn't bother to do the same for), which you unecessarily again reiterated here.
 
But then I saw this and decided to go another route. You state that I'm equivalent to a dotard man and imply that my mental health is poor solely due to argument that contradicts your own? Not due to style of argument, but due to contradicting content (which you mischaracterize).
 
This should be a glaring, personal opportunity to reflect. How much value do you think your arguments have here, given this approach?
 
And I'm the one whose credentials are in question?
 
Enough is enough, friend. I tried to warn you away from this. Now, I'm leaning more toward pity.
 
I'm defintely not going to sit here and interact with someone with clear social issues that they cannot control. For the forum decorum, I'm ending it. Good luck with the beligerent crusade.

 
Ames, in the last 24 hours or so, you simultaneously started a strong criticism of my comments in no less than four different threads, including this one. Prior to that I don't remember much interaction with you.
 
So it seems that you have just as much a bee in your bonnet about pro-vaxxers as I have with anti-vaxxers, otherwise you would not have started such a campaign. I think we just need to agree to disagree; I will accept that you have a different opinion to mine.
 
We are not the only people in the world who are clashing on this issue: all over the Internet, you see fierce battles between the pro- and anti-vaxxers, between the pro- and anti-maskers, and between those for and against lockdowns. So nothing unusual about it.
 
I have no issue with people's personal decisions about whether or not to get a COVID shot. So I am not arguing on an individual basis, but rather against the misinformation that is posted about vaccines (and the pandemic in general), and the cult-religion brainwashing techniques used by the organized anti-vax organizations.
 
I someone does not want to take the vaccine, then don't take it. It is not necessary to post misinformation just to support a decision not to take it. The misinformation on this forum is not too outlandish, but elsewhere I have seen all sorts of stupid conspiracy theories propagating, like the idea that the vaccine places a microchip in your body.

 

 

 

I don't really see the logic in anti-vaxxer activists anyway. If you believe there is a danger involved with taking the vaccine, and so do not want to take it yourself, preferring other people to take the risk, then why would you want to discourage others from taking it? 

 

If you are just looking at what benefits you, then it would be in your interests to encourage others to take the vaccine, while avoiding it yourself, in order to bring the pandemic under control (which benefits everyone). 

 

But anyway, I am exhausted discussing this subject, so time for a break, I think.


Edited by Hip, 05 August 2021 - 03:14 PM.

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#254 geo12the

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Posted 05 August 2021 - 03:19 PM

Just an observation: Since I started following longecity.org I noticed the departure of several posters who had interesting contributions. I think that is sad and I know in at least a couple of those cases the people left because they were tired of the squabbling and politics and posting extreme political dogma as scientific fact.  I suggest everyone try and tone down the politics (including posting from overt political sites masquerading as science), personal attacks, piling on posters, and dogma (Yes Yes I know I am sometimes guilty too), do some due diligence and question their own dogma once in a while. None of us are infallible! Let's stop the personal attacks and get back to meaningful discussions.      


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#255 Ames

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Posted 05 August 2021 - 04:20 PM

 
Ames, in the last 24 hours or so, you simultaneously started a strong criticism of my comments in no less than four different threads, including this one. Prior to that I don't remember much interaction with you.
 
So it seems that you have just as much a bee in your bonnet about pro-vaxxers as I have with anti-vaxxers, otherwise you would not have started such a campaign. I think we just need to agree to disagree; I will accept that you have a different opinion to mine.
 
We are not the only people in the world who are clashing on this issue: all over the Internet, you see fierce battles between the pro- and anti-vaxxers, between the pro- and anti-maskers, and between those for and against lockdowns. So nothing unusual about it.
 
I have no issue with people's personal decisions about whether or not to get a COVID shot. So I am not arguing on an individual basis, but rather against the misinformation that is posted about vaccines (and the pandemic in general), and the cult-religion brainwashing techniques used by the organized anti-vax organizations.
 
I someone does not want to take the vaccine, then don't take it. It is not necessary to post misinformation just to support a decision not to take it. The misinformation on this forum is not too outlandish, but elsewhere I have seen all sorts of stupid conspiracy theories propagating, like the idea that the vaccine places a microchip in your body.

 

 

 

I don't really see the logic in anti-vaxxer activists anyway. If you believe there is a danger involved with taking the vaccine, and so do not want to take it yourself, preferring other people to take the risk, then why would you want to discourage others from taking it? 

 

If you are just looking at what benefits you, then it would be in your interests to encourage others to take the vaccine, while avoiding it yourself, in order to bring the pandemic under control (which benefits everyone). 

 

But anyway, I am exhausted discussing this subject, so time for a break, I think.

 

You should have taken my prior cue and left it at "agree to disagree". I would have assumed that your prior statements were enough. What else is there to say or get out that hasn't been said?

 

Arguing merits and demerits is what this forum is for. I commented on your threads because I saw your arguments as flawed, but sometimes irrationally hostile / propagandistic in tone and nature.

 

Though I tried to argue using counterpoints as much as possible. When warranted that is. Because, as detailed below, you often aren't arguing points but instead being hostile. 

 

If I recall, the first thing that I responded to from you was a post that compared unvaxed people to the walking dead that you would have to "destroy the brain" of. Here it is

 

Now's the time to watch a few zombie apocalypse movies, to get some tips on how to handle the masses of infected people who will be roaming the streets, soon to be dead! Remember the classic spoof zombie movie "Shaun of the Dead", where authorities advised to "remove the head or destroy the brain"! 

 

 

Conceptually I find that to be flawed: aside from its vulgarity and scapegoating effect. Joking or no. Even so, I responded in a jocular manner. Falsely assuming it was an uncommon approach, in tone, for you.

 

On a forum, you posted a hostile comment that you should not have. It is indicative of your general approach here, as well as not being appropriate for a discussion board (not a bullying board). Given its inappriate nature, such comments are begging for comment. They should be commented on.

 

Responses to such nonsense do not constitute a "bee in my bonnet" in regard to your defended topic. Only in your approach to expressing your thoughts and feelings on it, or the specific content that does not necessarily extend to all of the topic content in favor of your position. This seems to be an issue of yours, in comprehending how your flaws are not innately tied to the validity of the subject matter that you defend. This leads to your flawed perception that a percieved attack on your expression of opinion is an attack on science.

 

Neither do my opinions innately indicate a flawed emotional wrapper surrounding them, nor does a single opinion or argument imply a personal "anti-vaccine" absolutism. Either you are choosing to argue like a juvenile, you don't know that you are. The first is deceptive, and the second means that you have a major personal issue.

 

Again, arguing with you doesn't constitute "misinformation".  It doesn't constitute a "bee in my bonnet" about vaccinations. It only constitutes an issue with your arguments in regard to them. Also, vacinations were not all that was discussed. 

 

Assuming no malice or intent to decieve, you have consistent difficulty with the concept of discussion level critique (citing it as sourced from misinformation, or some other flaw of your critic) as well as with expressing your opinions without attacking people. 

 

That's always going to be a problem here, and I can see that you can't see it. See the adjacent fact that you prior conceptualized your communication issues here as a problem that lies with Longecity members, and not with yourself.

 

You cap your last word with more perspective (argument as last word). Its frustration will no doubt fuel more of the same type of posts, here, in the future.

 

I think that a break is a good idea.


Edited by Ames, 05 August 2021 - 04:36 PM.

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#256 pamojja

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Posted 05 August 2021 - 04:30 PM

Let's stop the personal attacks and get back to meaningful discussions.


Now since the start of this pandemic - 1 and half years ago - some members overindulged in personal attacks and ad-hominems throughout, instead of honest scintific debate.

Everone critically inquiring has been downplayed with condescending lables, like 'anti-vaxxer', 'conspiracy theorist', 'right wing' or suffering from 'schizotypy'. With too little effort from those to seriously dicuss the topics on their own merits honestly.

I don't think such grave unethical behavour for more than a year to be merely a slip, and therefore not overcome that easily.
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#257 geo12the

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Posted 05 August 2021 - 05:48 PM

Everone critically inquiring has been downplayed with condescending lables, like 'anti-vaxxer', 'conspiracy theorist', 'right wing' or suffering from 'schizotypy'. With too little effort from those to seriously dicuss the topics on their own merits honestly.


The attacks go both ways

Edited by geo12the, 05 August 2021 - 05:49 PM.

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#258 kurt9

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Posted 06 August 2021 - 02:40 PM

Longecity forum is a DIY life extension community. Rather than endless ranting and raving over politics, perhaps we should be coming up with our own treatment protocols for undoing damage caused by the covid-19 vaccines. FLCCC has developed several protocols for the covid-19 virus itself.

 

Home | FLCCC | Front Line COVID-19 Critical Care Alliance (covid19criticalcare.com)

 

It is sensible to do the same for the vaccines as well.


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#259 Gal220

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Posted 06 August 2021 - 03:24 PM

Longecity forum is a DIY life extension community. Rather than endless ranting and raving over politics, perhaps we should be coming up with our own treatment protocols for undoing damage caused by the covid-19 vaccines. FLCCC has developed several protocols for the covid-19 virus itself.

 

Home | FLCCC | Front Line COVID-19 Critical Care Alliance (covid19criticalcare.com)

 

It is sensible to do the same for the vaccines as well.

No doubt, I think a blood cleanser like Neprinol or Serracor would stop most of the injuries, but its just a guess.  The health agencies should be finding out

 

They nearly cut their vax supply in half by restricting AZ to over 55 instead of coming up with an adjunct.

 

I havent seen any vax injury data out of Japan, I would think it much less with their natto consumption.


Edited by Gal220, 06 August 2021 - 03:27 PM.

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#260 Gal220

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Posted 06 August 2021 - 05:44 PM

Some data on Moderna adverse events leaked.  Information that should be public, disgraceful.

 

https://alexberenson...ome-actual-news


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#261 Gal220

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Posted 06 August 2021 - 06:04 PM

Spike protein in 50% of monocytes 9 months after vaccination - LINK

 

Dr Bruce Patterson has a treatment - Video

Treatment protocol - LINK


Edited by Gal220, 06 August 2021 - 06:19 PM.


#262 Heisok

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Posted 06 August 2021 - 06:20 PM

Gal220, would you mind giving a summary of the treatment? It will allow us to judge whether to watch the whole thing.

 

Definitely take a lot of time to wade through a video which is 1 hour and 20 minutes long.

 

Thanks


Edited by Heisok, 06 August 2021 - 06:20 PM.


#263 Gal220

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Posted 06 August 2021 - 06:32 PM

Gal220, would you mind giving a summary of the treatment? It will allow us to judge whether to watch the whole thing.

 

Definitely take a lot of time to wade through a video which is 1 hour and 20 minutes long.

 

Thanks

 

The other link is what you really want to click.

 

but the video does give more explanation


Edited by Gal220, 06 August 2021 - 06:33 PM.

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#264 Mind

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Posted 06 August 2021 - 06:52 PM

Longecity forum is a DIY life extension community. Rather than endless ranting and raving over politics, perhaps we should be coming up with our own treatment protocols for undoing damage caused by the covid-19 vaccines. FLCCC has developed several protocols for the covid-19 virus itself.

 

Home | FLCCC | Front Line COVID-19 Critical Care Alliance (covid19criticalcare.com)

 

It is sensible to do the same for the vaccines as well.

 

Thanks Kurt9

 

We do have a thread where positive rational solutions are discussed.


Now since the start of this pandemic - 1 and half years ago - some members overindulged in personal attacks and ad-hominems throughout, instead of honest scintific debate.

Everone critically inquiring has been downplayed with condescending lables, like 'anti-vaxxer', 'conspiracy theorist', 'right wing' or suffering from 'schizotypy'. With too little effort from those to seriously dicuss the topics on their own merits honestly.

I don't think such grave unethical behavour for more than a year to be merely a slip, and therefore not overcome that easily.

 

 

Don't forget "COVidiot" and many other worse slurs.


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#265 kurt9

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Posted 06 August 2021 - 07:11 PM

The damage mechanism of both the virus and the vaccines appears to be the spike protein itself. The first thing you want is any compound that will stop the spike protein that one could take the moment they leave the clinic after getting the shots. The second would be to inhibit the mRNA that is in the shots. I'm thinking some sort of Protease inhibitor. Yes, I know these can be harmful. But we're not taking these indefinitely like someone who is HIV-positive. We would only take it for a few days to a few weeks. Ideally, you want something that will inhibit the shots than be taken as soon as one is injected.


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#266 kurt9

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Posted 06 August 2021 - 07:16 PM

Better yet would be something you could take prior to getting the shots. This would allow one to satisfy any employer mandates while protecting one from the shots themselves.


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#267 Gal220

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Posted 07 August 2021 - 05:03 AM

Better yet would be something you could take prior to getting the shots. This would allow one to satisfy any employer mandates while protecting one from the shots themselves.

I would build up to the max dose of neprinol or serracor prior to the shot.

 

The problem is the spike is supposedly produced for 48 or hours continuously.  Want to make sure you are low sugar/carbs, 5k IU of D, beta glucans, and constant vit C to support your immune system wiping these things out.

 

More from Ryan Cole and Charles Hoffe on how the spike protein works.  Cole makes a good observation, where are the autopsies, got to look to find?

 

Dr. Ryan Cole (3:50 good place to start, guilty till proven innocent, 4:00 - spike circulates, 4:50 spike alone produces same symptoms as covid, 5:25 pictures of spike damage)

 

Dr Charles Hoffe - YouTube

 

 

I am skeptical of the notion that the injuries are permanent as Hoffe claims.  Natto, callogen, vitamin e, and C.  I would think this could be overcome with some protocol like Patterson did for Long Covid.



#268 Mind

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Posted 07 August 2021 - 12:13 PM

The Pfizer experimental gene therapy is not effective at stopping the spread of the COVID-19 virus.

 

Perhaps it is not even effective at preventing severe illness. Can anyone confirm these statements out of Israel?

 

 

 

"95% of the severe patients are vaccinated". "85-90% of the hospitalizations are in Fully vaccinated people." "We are opening more and more COVID wards." "The effectiveness of the vaccine is waning/fading out"

 

 


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#269 Qowpel

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Posted 07 August 2021 - 02:54 PM

Spike protein in 50% of monocytes 9 months after vaccination - LINK

 

Dr Bruce Patterson has a treatment - Video

Treatment protocol - LINK

Shouldnt this call for vitamin c supplementation consistently throughout the day since apparently C will help the body eat up the spike proteins?


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#270 Qowpel

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Posted 07 August 2021 - 03:08 PM

The damage mechanism of both the virus and the vaccines appears to be the spike protein itself. The first thing you want is any compound that will stop the spike protein that one could take the moment they leave the clinic after getting the shots. The second would be to inhibit the mRNA that is in the shots. I'm thinking some sort of Protease inhibitor. Yes, I know these can be harmful. But we're not taking these indefinitely like someone who is HIV-positive. We would only take it for a few days to a few weeks. Ideally, you want something that will inhibit the shots than be taken as soon as one is injected.

are there any natural mild protease inhibitors?


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