579 replies to this topic

[Eva Victoria]

Hi,
Would it be possible that the sun can get to me through UVA, UVB and perhaps skin moles if I do the following:

Let’s say the sun is strong outside, I don’t want to go outside in the sun, but at the same time I would love to get som fresh air into my room. So what if I open the window in the parallell next to me. The two rooms would have a felles gang mellom seg. Then I would get the fresh air and the sun would not shine directly at me. If the sun would get to me here then it would have to go through the end of the room parallell next to me and then switch direction.

I painted this just for fun so that it would be easier to understand, even though I am really bad at paint:

The open spots signals that it's a opening.


Thanks in advance

If I understand you correctly, you would be in either room 1 or room 2. Unless there are uncovered windows in any of those rooms, the sun rays will not be able to reach you from the main room. Unless, of course there are mirrors in the room and in the entrance that will reflect the light.

[Mia K.]

Hi Eva,

Question for you - not sunscreen related!

Do you think this serum by Kiehl's is of actual benefit to the skin? I love the finish it gives, but I wonder if it's mostly just cosmetic. Thank you for your valued opinion.

Kiehl's "High-Potency Skin Firming Concentrate" ($56 USD 1.7 oz/50ml):

Ingredients:
Water, Glycerin, Cyclohexasiloxane, Glyceryl Polymethacrylate, Ethylhexyl Palmitate, Isohexadecane, Ammonium Polyacryloyldimethyl Taurate, Honey, Hydrogenated Polyisobutene, Cetearyl Ethylhexanoate, PEG-8, Tocopheryl Acetate, Panthenol, Propylene Glycol, PEG-100 Stearate, Glyceryl Stearate, Acrylates Copolymer, Hydrolyzed Rice Protein, Chlorphenesin, Methylparaben, Ruscus Aculeatus Root Extract, Caffeine, Isopropyl Myristate, Caprylic/Capric Triglyceride, Silica Dimethyl Silylate, Cholesterol, Soybean Protein, Adenosine, Propylparaben, Hydroxypalmitoyl Sphinganine, Fagus Sylvatica Bud Extract, Royal Jelly Extract, Grape Fruit Extract, Sodium Hyaluronate, Crithmum Maritimum Extract, Palmitoyl Oligopeptide

Best,
Mia

[Eva Victoria]

Hi Mia,

It is a classic emulsion emulsified with Arlacel 165 (PEG-100 Stearate, Glyceryl Stearate) and stabilized with carbomer. It certainly has enough emollients* and humectants as well! The firming ingredients Hydrolyzed Rice Protein, Soybean Protein, Adenosine along with Palmitoyl Oligopeptide.
(* unless Glyceryl Polymethacrylate, Palmitoyl Oligopeptide correspond to Sederma Biopeptide CL and they did not add additional Glyceryl Polymethacrylate. Then it has a lot of different emollients in a miniscule amount. If it is more like a light moisturizer then it can aid moisturizing the skin.)
Palmitoyl Oligopeptide has firming effect and has shown that it is to provide protection of collagen fibers against environmental aggressors. Crithmum Maritimum Extract can correspond to Aerolat Samphira that is said to creates a finer skin, decreases lines and wrinkles, and provides a homogenous and luminous complexion. It also has a positive effect on sebum regulation. Note that neither Palmitoyl Oligopeptide nor Aerolat Samphira is present in a greater amount.
It has Vitamin E, B5 and some Royal Jelly Extract for nourishment.
What I really miss is the presence of other anti-oxidants that are a must in today's products with the technology available. I think the nice finish of this formulation comes from the amount of silicone (Cyclohexasiloxane) it contains. This you can also have from far better serums.
The Even Better Serum (with stabilized Vitamin C: Ascorbyl Glucoside) or Turnaround Concentrate (with Lactobionic Acid) from Clinique are literally packed with skin-boosting anti-oxidants and cell communicating ingredients. The more expensive version of Even Better Serum is Idealist Even Skin Tone Illuminator that has a bit of TiO2 and Mica added as colourants and shine enhancers, and some additional anti-oxidants but is an identical product to the one from Clinique.
All these serums have plenty of silicone (even the emulsifying system are based on very good silicone-emulsifiers from Shin Etsu Japan) that provides a very pleasant finish. It is such a success among consumers that the Estee Lauder Companies have used the same serum base (silicone-emulsifier system from Shin Etsu and a polymer from Seppic) for all their new serums (Origins, Lab Series, Clinique for Men etc).

Hope it was of some help.
Kindest regards,
Eva

Hi Eva,

Question for you - not sunscreen related!

Do you think this serum by Kiehl's is of actual benefit to the skin? I love the finish it gives, but I wonder if it's mostly just cosmetic. Thank you for your valued opinion.

Kiehl's "High-Potency Skin Firming Concentrate" ($56 USD 1.7 oz/50ml):

Ingredients:
Water, Glycerin, Cyclohexasiloxane, Glyceryl Polymethacrylate, Ethylhexyl Palmitate, Isohexadecane, Ammonium Polyacryloyldimethyl Taurate, Honey, Hydrogenated Polyisobutene, Cetearyl Ethylhexanoate, PEG-8, Tocopheryl Acetate, Panthenol, Propylene Glycol, PEG-100 Stearate, Glyceryl Stearate, Acrylates Copolymer, Hydrolyzed Rice Protein, Chlorphenesin, Methylparaben, Ruscus Aculeatus Root Extract, Caffeine, Isopropyl Myristate, Caprylic/Capric Triglyceride, Silica Dimethyl Silylate, Cholesterol, Soybean Protein, Adenosine, Propylparaben, Hydroxypalmitoyl Sphinganine, Fagus Sylvatica Bud Extract, Royal Jelly Extract, Grape Fruit Extract, Sodium Hyaluronate, Crithmum Maritimum Extract, Palmitoyl Oligopeptide

Best,
Mia

[Mia K.]

HI Eva,

You are very helpful Thank you for the specific product recs you offer.

Are either of the Cliniques an all-I-need type of serum? One that I could wear every day under my s/s and be done with it? (I alternate taz and Retin-A at night. Currently no serum at night, but that could change if you were to so suggest). I have no pressing skin concerns; just want to protect, maintain & enhance my basically healthy (N/CO) complexion.

Another serum I was considering is MAC Prep + Prime Brightening Serum:

Ingredients: Water, Butylene Glycol, Glycerin, Ascorbyl Glucoside, Caffeine, Tocopherol, Sodium Hyaluronate, Squalane, Green Tea Leaf Extract, Gentian Root Extract, Tuberose Extract, Hydrolyzed Rice Bran Extract, Silk Powder, Tourmaline, Xanthan Gum, Caprylyl Glycol, Phenyl Trimethicone, Hexylene Glycol, Pentylene Glycol, Magnesium Chloride, Potassium Hydroxide, Acrylates/C10-30 Alkyl Acrylates Crosspolymer, Polyglyceryl-5 Oleate, Calcium Chloride, Sodium Sulfate, Potassium Nitrate, Citric Acid, Fragrance, Sodium Citrate, Phenoxyethanol, Potassium Sorbate, Chlorphenesin, Sodium Benzoate

Your thoughts/recommendations/suggestions are greatly appreciated, as always!

Best,
Mia

Hi Mia,

It is a classic emulsion emulsified with Arlacel 165 (PEG-100 Stearate, Glyceryl Stearate) and stabilized with carbomer. It certainly has enough emollients* and humectants as well! The firming ingredients Hydrolyzed Rice Protein, Soybean Protein, Adenosine along with Palmitoyl Oligopeptide.
(* unless Glyceryl Polymethacrylate, Palmitoyl Oligopeptide correspond to Sederma Biopeptide CL and they did not add additional Glyceryl Polymethacrylate. Then it has a lot of different emollients in a miniscule amount. If it is more like a light moisturizer then it can aid moisturizing the skin.)
Palmitoyl Oligopeptide has firming effect and has shown that it is to provide protection of collagen fibers against environmental aggressors. Crithmum Maritimum Extract can correspond to Aerolat Samphira that is said to creates a finer skin, decreases lines and wrinkles, and provides a homogenous and luminous complexion. It also has a positive effect on sebum regulation. Note that neither Palmitoyl Oligopeptide nor Aerolat Samphira is present in a greater amount.
It has Vitamin E, B5 and some Royal Jelly Extract for nourishment.
What I really miss is the presence of other anti-oxidants that are a must in today's products with the technology available. I think the nice finish of this formulation comes from the amount of silicone (Cyclohexasiloxane) it contains. This you can also have from far better serums.
The Even Better Serum (with stabilized Vitamin C: Ascorbyl Glucoside) or Turnaround Concentrate (with Lactobionic Acid) from Clinique are literally packed with skin-boosting anti-oxidants and cell communicating ingredients. The more expensive version of Even Better Serum is Idealist Even Skin Tone Illuminator that has a bit of TiO2 and Mica added as colourants and shine enhancers, and some additional anti-oxidants but is an identical product to the one from Clinique.
All these serums have plenty of silicone (even the emulsifying system are based on very good silicone-emulsifiers from Shin Etsu Japan) that provides a very pleasant finish. It is such a success among consumers that the Estee Lauder Companies have used the same serum base (silicone-emulsifier system from Shin Etsu and a polymer from Seppic) for all their new serums (Origins, Lab Series, Clinique for Men etc).

Hope it was of some help.
Kindest regards,
Eva

[Eva Victoria]

Hi Mia,

I would recommend either Clinique Even Better or EL Idealist Skin Illuminating Serum during the day and Retin-A alone at night (and moisturizer if needed). Clinique Turnoraund Serum will be too much together with Retin-A.
Both Clinique Even Better and EL Idealist Skin Illuminating Serum have Ascorbyl Glucoside (I would estimate 1-2%) and an all-in -one serum. They also have a better consistency, more creamy but light feel on the skin than the one that Mac has. (Mac is another EL brand BTW). In humid/warm climate you can even wear any of them directly under your sunscreen without the additional moisturizer.

(I found a serum from Roc Multi Correxion Skin Renewing Serum, that also contain Ascorbyl Glucoside for half the price of Clinique. The structure is an overall poorer version of the EL Co. developed ones. It also has only added minerals and no other anti-oxidants.)

PS: You can also make a Vitamin C - L-Ascorbic Acid- containing serum on your own with a few ingredients obtained from the pharmacy).

Hope it helps.

Kindest regards,
Eva

Ingredients for Roc Multi Correxion Skin Renewing Serum

Water, Cyclopentasiloxane, Glycerin, Tetrahydroxypropyl Ethylenediamine, Dimethicone Crosspolymer, Dimethicone, Ammonium Acryloyldimethyltaurate/VP Copolymer, Nylon-12, Ascorbyl Glucoside, Retinol, Tocopherol, PEG- 12 Dimethicone, Copper Gluconate, Magnesium Aspartate, Zinc Gluconate, Titanium Dioxide, Citric Acid, Phenoxyethanol, Pentylene Glycol, Butylene Glycol, Laureth-23, Bisabolol, Laureth-4, Methylparaben, Propylparaben, Ethylparaben, Polyacrylamide, Sodium Hydroxide, Disodium EDTA, BHT, C13-14 Isoparaffin, Polysorbate-20, Hydroxyphenyl Propamidobenzoic Acid, Ascorbic Acid (Vitamin C), Laureth-7, Mica, Fragrance

Ingredients for Clinique Even Better Serum

Water, Dimethicone, Isododecane, Cyclopentasiloxane, Polysilicone-11, Butylene Glycol, Ascorbyl Glucoside, PEG-10 Dimethicone, Turmeric Root Extract, Rice Bran Extract, Grapefruit Peel Extract, Barley Extract, Wheat Germ Extract, Birch Bark Extract, Cucumber Fruit Extract, Dimethoxytolyl Propylresorcinol, Scutellaria Baicalensis Root Extract, Mulberry Root Extract, Trametes Versicolor Extract, Saccharomyces Lysate Extract, Yeast Extract, PEG-6, Tromethamine, Salicylic Acid, Polysorbate 20, Cholesterol, Isohexadecane, Propylene Glycol Dicaprate, Sunflower Seedcake, Caffeine, Tocopheryl Acetate, Acetyl Glucosamine, Simethicone, Glycyrrhetinic Acid, Polysorbate 80, Sodium Hyaluronate, Di-C12-18 Alkyl Dimonium Chloride, Sodium RNA, Squalane, Sodium Sulfite, Sodium Metabisulfite, Caprylyl Glycol, Hexylene Glycol, Ammonium Acryloyldimethyltaurate VP/Copolymer, Acrylamide/Sodium Acryloyldimethyltaurate Copolymer, Disodium EDTA, Phenoxyethanol, Yellow 6, Yellow 5

Ingredients for EL Idealist Skin Illuminating Serum

Water, Dimethicone, Isododecane, Cyclopentasiloxane, Polysilicone-11, Butylene Glycol, Ascorbyl Glucoside, PEG-10 Dimethicone, Gentiana Lutea (Gentian) Root Extract, Oryza Sativa (Rice) Bran Extract, Hydrolyzed Rice Bran Extract, Curcuma Longa (Turmeric) Root Extract, Citrus Grandis (Grapefruit) Peel Extract, Triticum Vulgare (Wheat) Germ Extract, Cucumis Sativus (Cucumber) Fruit Extract, Scutellaria Baicalensis Root Extract, Morus Bombycis (Mulberry) Root Extract, Trametes Versicolor Extract, Hordeum Vulgare (Barley) Extract, Salicylic Acid, Caffeine, Cholesterol, Acetyl Glucosamine, Squalane, Yeast Extract, Helianthus Annuus (Sunflower) Seedcake, Isohexadecane, PEG-6, Dimethoxytolyl Propylresorcinol, Tocopheryl Acetate, Propylene Glycol Dicaprate, Polysorbate 20, Glycyrrhetinic Acid, Polysorbate 80, Sodium Hyaluronate, Sodium Sulfite, Sodium Metabisulfite, Acrylamide/Sodium Acryloyldimethyltaurate Copolymer, Ammonium Acryloyldimethyltaurate/VP Copolymer, Caprylyl Glycol, Hexylene Glycol, Potassium Sorbate, Di-C12-18 Alkyl Dimonium Chloride, Fragrance, Tromethamine, Tin Oxide, Sodium Hydroxide, Disodium EDTA, BHT, Phenoxyethanol, Linalool, Limonene, Mica, Titanium Dioxide, Bismuth Oxychloride, Carmine

HI Eva,

You are very helpful Thank you for the specific product recs you offer.

Are either of the Cliniques an all-I-need type of serum? One that I could wear every day under my s/s and be done with it? (I alternate taz and Retin-A at night. Currently no serum at night, but that could change if you were to so suggest). I have no pressing skin concerns; just want to protect, maintain & enhance my basically healthy (N/CO) complexion.

Another serum I was considering is MAC Prep + Prime Brightening Serum:

Ingredients: Water, Butylene Glycol, Glycerin, Ascorbyl Glucoside, Caffeine, Tocopherol, Sodium Hyaluronate, Squalane, Green Tea Leaf Extract, Gentian Root Extract, Tuberose Extract, Hydrolyzed Rice Bran Extract, Silk Powder, Tourmaline, Xanthan Gum, Caprylyl Glycol, Phenyl Trimethicone, Hexylene Glycol, Pentylene Glycol, Magnesium Chloride, Potassium Hydroxide, Acrylates/C10-30 Alkyl Acrylates Crosspolymer, Polyglyceryl-5 Oleate, Calcium Chloride, Sodium Sulfate, Potassium Nitrate, Citric Acid, Fragrance, Sodium Citrate, Phenoxyethanol, Potassium Sorbate, Chlorphenesin, Sodium Benzoate

Your thoughts/recommendations/suggestions are greatly appreciated, as always!

Best,
Mia

Hi Mia,

It is a classic emulsion emulsified with Arlacel 165 (PEG-100 Stearate, Glyceryl Stearate) and stabilized with carbomer. It certainly has enough emollients* and humectants as well! The firming ingredients Hydrolyzed Rice Protein, Soybean Protein, Adenosine along with Palmitoyl Oligopeptide.
(* unless Glyceryl Polymethacrylate, Palmitoyl Oligopeptide correspond to Sederma Biopeptide CL and they did not add additional Glyceryl Polymethacrylate. Then it has a lot of different emollients in a miniscule amount. If it is more like a light moisturizer then it can aid moisturizing the skin.)
Palmitoyl Oligopeptide has firming effect and has shown that it is to provide protection of collagen fibers against environmental aggressors. Crithmum Maritimum Extract can correspond to Aerolat Samphira that is said to creates a finer skin, decreases lines and wrinkles, and provides a homogenous and luminous complexion. It also has a positive effect on sebum regulation. Note that neither Palmitoyl Oligopeptide nor Aerolat Samphira is present in a greater amount.
It has Vitamin E, B5 and some Royal Jelly Extract for nourishment.
What I really miss is the presence of other anti-oxidants that are a must in today's products with the technology available. I think the nice finish of this formulation comes from the amount of silicone (Cyclohexasiloxane) it contains. This you can also have from far better serums.
The Even Better Serum (with stabilized Vitamin C: Ascorbyl Glucoside) or Turnaround Concentrate (with Lactobionic Acid) from Clinique are literally packed with skin-boosting anti-oxidants and cell communicating ingredients. The more expensive version of Even Better Serum is Idealist Even Skin Tone Illuminator that has a bit of TiO2 and Mica added as colourants and shine enhancers, and some additional anti-oxidants but is an identical product to the one from Clinique.
All these serums have plenty of silicone (even the emulsifying system are based on very good silicone-emulsifiers from Shin Etsu Japan) that provides a very pleasant finish. It is such a success among consumers that the Estee Lauder Companies have used the same serum base (silicone-emulsifier system from Shin Etsu and a polymer from Seppic) for all their new serums (Origins, Lab Series, Clinique for Men etc).

Hope it was of some help.
Kindest regards,
Eva

[Mia K.]

Hi again Eva, thanks for taking the time to respond.

Interesting that you should mention vit. c serum. The other serum I use (alternately with the "Firming" by Kiehl's) is a 10.5% l-ascorbic acid product, also by Kiehl's:

Kiehl's Line-Preventing Concentrate Ingredients: Propylene Glycol, Cyclopentasiloxane, Ascorbic Acid, Glycerin, Cetyl Peg/Ppg-10/1 Dimethicone, Dimethicone Crosspolymer, Lauroyl Lysine, Acrylates Copolymer, Adenosine

Does the Even Better with its ascorbic glucoside replace this, or am I better off continuing to use both?

Also, I see that Clinique has another (discontinued but still available) Even Better Tone Corrector serum, with much the same ingredients (to my eye) as the Clinical Spot Corrector to which you linked. I am assuming you specifically recommend the latter, yes?

Even Better Tone Corrector: Water, Dimethicone, Isododecane, Cyclopentasiloxane, Polysilicone-11, Butylene Glycol, Yeast Extract, Ascorbyl Glucoside, Barley Extract, Birch Bark Extract, Cucumber Fruit Extract, Scutellaria Baicalensis Root Extract, Mulberry Root Extract, Trametes Versicolor Extract, Sunflower Seedcake, Saccharomyces Lysate Extract, Turmeric Root Extract, Rice Bran Extract, Grapefruit Peel Extract, Wheat Germ Extract, Peg-6, Peg-10 Dimethicone, Cholesterol, Salicylic Acid, Polysorbate 20, Isohexadecane, Propylene Glycol Dicaprate, Caffeine, Sodium Rna, Acetyl Glucosamine, Simethicone, Tromethamine, Caprylyl Glycol, Glycyrrhetinic Acid, Polysorbate 80, Di-C12-18 Alkyl Dimonium Chloride, Sodium Hyaluronate, Tocopheryl Acetate, Squalane, Sodium Sulfite, Sodium Metabisulfite, Hexylene Glycol, Ammonium Acryloyldimethyltaurate/Vp Copolymer, Acrylamide/Sodium Acryloyldimethyltaurate Copolymer, Sodium Salicylate, Disodium Edta, Phenoxyethanol, Yellow 5, Yellow 6

Even Better Spot Corrector: Water, Dimethicone, Isododecane, Cyclopentasiloxane, Polysilicone-11, Butylene Glycol, Ascorbyl Glucoside, PEG-10 Dimethicone, Turmeric Root Extract, Rice Bran Extract, Grapefruit Peel Extract, Barley Extract, Wheat Germ Extract, Birch Bark Extract, Cucumber Fruit Extract, Dimethoxytolyl Propylresorcinol, Scutellaria Baicalensis Root Extract, Mulberry Root Extract, Trametes Versicolor Extract, Saccharomyces Lysate Extract, Yeast Extract, PEG-6, Tromethamine, Salicylic Acid, Polysorbate 20, Cholesterol, Isohexadecane, Propylene Glycol Dicaprate, Sunflower Seedcake, Caffeine, Tocopheryl Acetate, Acetyl Glucosamine, Simethicone, Glycyrrhetinic Acid, Polysorbate 80, Sodium Hyaluronate, Di-C12-18 Alkyl Dimonium Chloride, Sodium RNA, Squalane, Sodium Sulfite, Sodium Metabisulfite, Caprylyl Glycol, Hexylene Glycol, Ammonium Acryloyldimethyltaurate VP/Copolymer, Acrylamide/Sodium Acryloyldimethyltaurate Copolymer, Disodium EDTA, Phenoxyethanol, Yellow 6, Yellow 5

I look forward to reading your recommendations, TIA!

Best,
Mia

Hi Mia,

I would recommend either Clinique Even Better or EL Idealist Skin Illuminating Serum during the day and Retin-A alone at night (and moisturizer if needed). Clinique Turnoraund Serum will be too much together with Retin-A.
Both Clinique Even Better and EL Idealist Skin Illuminating Serum have Ascorbyl Glucoside (I would estimate 1-2%) and an all-in -one serum. They also have a better consistency, more creamy but light feel on the skin than the one that Mac has. (Mac is another EL brand BTW). In humid/warm climate you can even wear any of them directly under your sunscreen without the additional moisturizer.

(I found a serum from Roc Multi Correxion Skin Renewing Serum, that also contain Ascorbyl Glucoside for half the price of Clinique. The structure is an overall poorer version of the EL Co. developed ones. It also has only added minerals and no other anti-oxidants.)

PS: You can also make a Vitamin C - L-Ascorbic Acid- containing serum on your own with a few ingredients obtained from the pharmacy).

Hope it helps.

Kindest regards,
Eva

(Edit for spelling)

Edited by Mia K., 23 August 2012 - 01:53 PM.

[Eva Victoria]

Hi Mia,

I did recommend the latter because it is lighter on the skin, it is a better formulation.
Ascorbyl glucoide is a stabilized form of Ascorbyl Acid with excellent results, though nothing can really replace Ascorbic Acid.

It is really a pity that Kiehl's Line-Preventing Concentrate does not contain more anti-oxidants and other beneficial ingredients. Although it is worth to mention that the formulation makes AA stable for a longer period of time.

Kindest regards,
Eva

Hi again Eva, thanks for taking the time to respond.

Interesting that you should mention vit. c serum. The other serum I use (alternately with the "Firming" by Kiehl's) is a 10.5% l-ascorbic acid product, also by Kiehl's:

Kiehl's Line-Preventing Concentrate Ingredients: Propylene Glycol, Cyclopentasiloxane, Ascorbic Acid, Glycerin, Cetyl Peg/Ppg-10/1 Dimethicone, Dimethicone Crosspolymer, Lauroyl Lysine, Acrylates Copolymer, Adenosine

Does the Even Better with its ascorbic glucoside replace this, or am I better off continuing to use both?

Also, I see that Clinique has another (discontinued but still available) Even Better Tone Corrector serum, with much the same ingredients (to my eye) as the Clinical Spot Corrector to which you linked. I am assuming you specifically recommend the latter, yes?

Even Better Tone Corrector: Water, Dimethicone, Isododecane, Cyclopentasiloxane, Polysilicone-11, Butylene Glycol, Yeast Extract, Ascorbyl Glucoside, Barley Extract, Birch Bark Extract, Cucumber Fruit Extract, Scutellaria Baicalensis Root Extract, Mulberry Root Extract, Trametes Versicolor Extract, Sunflower Seedcake, Saccharomyces Lysate Extract, Turmeric Root Extract, Rice Bran Extract, Grapefruit Peel Extract, Wheat Germ Extract, Peg-6, Peg-10 Dimethicone, Cholesterol, Salicylic Acid, Polysorbate 20, Isohexadecane, Propylene Glycol Dicaprate, Caffeine, Sodium Rna, Acetyl Glucosamine, Simethicone, Tromethamine, Caprylyl Glycol, Glycyrrhetinic Acid, Polysorbate 80, Di-C12-18 Alkyl Dimonium Chloride, Sodium Hyaluronate, Tocopheryl Acetate, Squalane, Sodium Sulfite, Sodium Metabisulfite, Hexylene Glycol, Ammonium Acryloyldimethyltaurate/Vp Copolymer, Acrylamide/Sodium Acryloyldimethyltaurate Copolymer, Sodium Salicylate, Disodium Edta, Phenoxyethanol, Yellow 5, Yellow 6

Even Better Spot Corrector: Water, Dimethicone, Isododecane, Cyclopentasiloxane, Polysilicone-11, Butylene Glycol, Ascorbyl Glucoside, PEG-10 Dimethicone, Turmeric Root Extract, Rice Bran Extract, Grapefruit Peel Extract, Barley Extract, Wheat Germ Extract, Birch Bark Extract, Cucumber Fruit Extract, Dimethoxytolyl Propylresorcinol, Scutellaria Baicalensis Root Extract, Mulberry Root Extract, Trametes Versicolor Extract, Saccharomyces Lysate Extract, Yeast Extract, PEG-6, Tromethamine, Salicylic Acid, Polysorbate 20, Cholesterol, Isohexadecane, Propylene Glycol Dicaprate, Sunflower Seedcake, Caffeine, Tocopheryl Acetate, Acetyl Glucosamine, Simethicone, Glycyrrhetinic Acid, Polysorbate 80, Sodium Hyaluronate, Di-C12-18 Alkyl Dimonium Chloride, Sodium RNA, Squalane, Sodium Sulfite, Sodium Metabisulfite, Caprylyl Glycol, Hexylene Glycol, Ammonium Acryloyldimethyltaurate VP/Copolymer, Acrylamide/Sodium Acryloyldimethyltaurate Copolymer, Disodium EDTA, Phenoxyethanol, Yellow 6, Yellow 5

I look forward to reading your recommendations, TIA!

Best,
Mia

Hi Mia,

I would recommend either Clinique Even Better or EL Idealist Skin Illuminating Serum during the day and Retin-A alone at night (and moisturizer if needed). Clinique Turnoraund Serum will be too much together with Retin-A.
Both Clinique Even Better and EL Idealist Skin Illuminating Serum have Ascorbyl Glucoside (I would estimate 1-2%) and an all-in -one serum. They also have a better consistency, more creamy but light feel on the skin than the one that Mac has. (Mac is another EL brand BTW). In humid/warm climate you can even wear any of them directly under your sunscreen without the additional moisturizer.

(I found a serum from Roc Multi Correxion Skin Renewing Serum, that also contain Ascorbyl Glucoside for half the price of Clinique. The structure is an overall poorer version of the EL Co. developed ones. It also has only added minerals and no other anti-oxidants.)

PS: You can also make a Vitamin C - L-Ascorbic Acid- containing serum on your own with a few ingredients obtained from the pharmacy).

Hope it helps.

Kindest regards,
Eva

(Edit for spelling)

[Vanity Fair]

Hi Eva,

How are you?
it's been a while, the summer is almost over so I can relax my sunscreen diet a bit

So now I have found a new obsession, DIY facecreams/serums.
I already asked you some questions about it before but just wanted to double check some things.
I have found a site that sells almost all the active ingredients you find in the most expensive face products on line but the choice is so vast that I really need your guidance.
They sell a base cream to which you can add your own choice of ingredients but I don't like the list of ingredients as it still contains a lot of chemicals I try to avoid these days.
However, they do also sell Sea Kelp Marine which according to the website you can use as a base.
I then would like to add Coenzyme 10, Ceramides, Carnosine and Argireline and Niacimide or is that too much?

If you have time maybe you could have a look at their list of actives and tell me what you think is a good combination.
www.activeformulas.com or www.skinactives.com

Is it a good idea to use the kelp as a base?

thanks very much
vanity

[Vanity Fair]

Hi eva,

For some reason the post was cut off.
Anyway, my question was whether you think that will be a good mix or if that's too much actives in one product?
I saw on their website also a anti-aging cream they sell that contains masses of actives:


Here is the ingredient list:
Distilled Water (Aqua), Jojoba (Simmondsia Chinensis) Seed Oil, Lactobacillus/Kelp Ferment Filtrate, Sorbitol, Butylene Glycol, Cetyl Alcohol, Glyceryl Stearate, PEG-100 Stearate, Stearyl Alcohol, Sesame (Sesamum indicum ) Seed Oil, Sweet Almond (Prunus amygdalus dulcis) Seed Oil, Avocado (Persea gratissima) Oil, Soy Isoflavones (from Non-GMO Glycine soja), Alpha Lipoic Acid, Hyaluronic Acid, Cocos Nucifera (Coconut) Fruit Juice (Endosperm), Cholesteryl Oleyl Carbonate, Cholesteryl Nonanoate, Cholesteryl Chloride, Collagen Hydrolyzate, Yeast Beta Glucan, Carnosine (L-), Carnitine (L-), Lecithin (from Non-GMO Soy), Ubiquinone (Coenzyme Q10), Resveratrol (from Polygonum cuspidatum), Pterostilbene (from Pterocarpus marsupium Bark Extract), Pomegranate (Punica granatum) Seed Oil, Tocotrienols, Tocopherol (Alpha-D-Tocopherol, Vitamin E), Astaxanthin, Lycopene, Xanthophyll (Lutein), Alpha Lipoic Acid [R-(+)-], Beta Carotene, Centella asiatica Extract, Niacinamide (Vitamin B3), Pyrus Malus (Apple) Pectin Extract, Epidermal Growth Factor (rh-Oligopeptide-1, EGF), Superoxide Dismutase (SOD), Catalase, Glutathione, Polysorbate 20, Citric Acid, Dimethicone, Carbomer, Triethanolamine, Diazolidinyl Urea, Phenoxyethanol, Methylparaben, Propylparaben.

What are your thoughts about this cream? Do you think it can work?
Does it contain DMAE? Something I would like to avoid.

And do you think kelp is ok as a base? Or if I would like to put some of the ingredients in a base oil, is that possible?

Lots of questions again and looking forward to hear from you

[Vanity Fair]

Eva, this is the link to the page that lists all the ingredients they sell, would you be so kind to to have a look when you have a moment and tell me what you think are ingredients that mix well together.
http://www.activefor...ngredients.html

Many many thanks, vf



       
 
 

[Vanity Fair]

INGREDIENTS: purified water, virgin organic shea butter (butyrospermun parkii), unrefined rosehip seed oil (rosa moschata), golden jojoba oil (simmondsia chinensis), peach kernel oil (prunus persica), emulsifying wax, aspen bark extract, vegetable glycerin, vitamin E oil (tocopherol).

Do you think I could use this cream and add Coenzyme 10, Carnosine, Ceramides, or other active ingredients or would they not react well with this cream?
I like this cream because it only contains natural ingredients although I haven't tried it in real life but just saw it on the internet.

Thanks Eva,
VF

[Eva Victoria]

INGREDIENTS: purified water, virgin organic shea butter (butyrospermun parkii), unrefined rosehip seed oil (rosa moschata), golden jojoba oil (simmondsia chinensis), peach kernel oil (prunus persica), emulsifying wax, aspen bark extract, vegetable glycerin, vitamin E oil (tocopherol).

Do you think I could use this cream and add Coenzyme 10, Carnosine, Ceramides, or other active ingredients or would they not react well with this cream?
I like this cream because it only contains natural ingredients although I haven't tried it in real life but just saw it on the internet.

Thanks Eva,
VF

This one is a far too oily product in my opinion.

Kelp is a good base although it will not be possible to add any oil soluble ingredients without using an emulsifier.
To emulsify Kelp is a difficult process and requires great knowledge of preparing emulsions.

The ingredients of the first creme seem to be decent, but again it is very important to have the right consistency and cosmetically elegant base for people to apply a product regularly. If you don't use a product regularly, it can have the most wonderful ingredients in the world, they will not do much for your skin.

[Mia K.]

Hi Eva,

You were right about the the texture/finish of the Even Better serum - just lovely, thanks!

Might this spf 30 s/s by Topix Citrix be good to layer over?

Active Ingredients: Octinoxate 7.5%, Zinc Oxide 7.0%.
Other Ingredients: Ascorbyl Glucosamine, Ascorbyl Palmitate, Ceresin, C12-15 Alkyl Benzoate, C13-14 Isoparaffin, Coenzyme Q10, Cyclomethicone, Diazolidinyl Urea, Green Tea Extract,Laureth-7, Laurylmethicone Copolyol, Methylparaben, Phospholipids, Polyacrylamide, Propylparaben, Purified Water, Retinyl Palmitate, Sodium Chloride, Superoxide Dismutase, Tocopheryl Acetate.

i ran a search here for this; think you haven't commented on it yet. I am so glad to read we might be able to purchase your s/s sometime!

Best, Mia

[lucaasalberto]

Hey, Eva,

I have a question about tretinoin application. Every time I use a moisturizer before tretinoin, it seems that my skin starts peeling more than when I don't. Do you have any idea why my skin would react like that? I use a moisturizer before tretinoin cream to buffer it, because I have rosacea and otherwise, after a few days, it can be too much, but when I do buffer it with a moisturizer it looks drier, and peels the next day which doesn't happen when I apply the tretinoin cream to bare skin.
If it makes any difference, I'm using the CeraVe PM as my night-time moisturizer.

Thanks.

[Eva Victoria]

Hi Eva,

You were right about the the texture/finish of the Even Better serum - just lovely, thanks!

Might this spf 30 s/s by Topix Citrix be good to layer over?

Active Ingredients: Octinoxate 7.5%, Zinc Oxide 7.0%.
Other Ingredients: Ascorbyl Glucosamine, Ascorbyl Palmitate, Ceresin, C12-15 Alkyl Benzoate, C13-14 Isoparaffin, Coenzyme Q10, Cyclomethicone, Diazolidinyl Urea, Green Tea Extract,Laureth-7, Laurylmethicone Copolyol, Methylparaben, Phospholipids, Polyacrylamide, Propylparaben, Purified Water, Retinyl Palmitate, Sodium Chloride, Superoxide Dismutase, Tocopheryl Acetate.

i ran a search here for this; think you haven't commented on it yet. I am so glad to read we might be able to purchase your s/s sometime!

Best, Mia

Hi Mia,

Glad you like the Even Better Serum
I beleive the spf 30 s/s by Topix Citrix can be a good alternative. Although the amount of the ZnO is a bit low IMO.
If you liked the Even Better Serum, you would also like La Mer The SPF 30 Fluid (10% ZnO, 7.5% OMC) or my coming sunscreen fluid. (Just a thought )

[Eva Victoria]

Hey, Eva,

I have a question about tretinoin application. Every time I use a moisturizer before tretinoin, it seems that my skin starts peeling more than when I don't. Do you have any idea why my skin would react like that? I use a moisturizer before tretinoin cream to buffer it, because I have rosacea and otherwise, after a few days, it can be too much, but when I do buffer it with a moisturizer it looks drier, and peels the next day which doesn't happen when I apply the tretinoin cream to bare skin.
If it makes any difference, I'm using the CeraVe PM as my night-time moisturizer.

Thanks.

Hi Lucas Alberto,

If the moisturizer contains too much water, it can enhance the effect of Tretinoin. An alternative could be to buy a thicker (mineral oil/paraffin based) creme from the pharmacy (no fragrance) and dilute the Tretinoin containing creme with that.

[lucaasalberto]

Hey, Eva,

I have a question about tretinoin application. Every time I use a moisturizer before tretinoin, it seems that my skin starts peeling more than when I don't. Do you have any idea why my skin would react like that? I use a moisturizer before tretinoin cream to buffer it, because I have rosacea and otherwise, after a few days, it can be too much, but when I do buffer it with a moisturizer it looks drier, and peels the next day which doesn't happen when I apply the tretinoin cream to bare skin.
If it makes any difference, I'm using the CeraVe PM as my night-time moisturizer.

Thanks.

Hi Lucas Alberto,

If the moisturizer contains too much water, it can enhance the effect of Tretinoin. An alternative could be to buy a thicker (mineral oil/paraffin based) creme from the pharmacy (no fragrance) and dilute the Tretinoin containing creme with that.

Okay, thanks!
What's weird is that although it makes my skin drier the next day, it doesn't get irritated, raw/burn-looking after a few days, which does happen when I don't use a moisturizer before the tretinoin.
I guess I'll try using a petrolatum based one instead. Thanks again.

[Anais]

Hi Eva,

What are your thoughts about this europe sunscreen? I'm not sure if it has encapsulated avobenzone.

Ingredients:
Aqua. Octocrylene. Methylene bis-benzotriazolyl tetramethylbutylphenol. Ethylhexyl salicylate. Cyclopentasiloxane. Butyl methoxydibenzoylmetano. Diethylhexyl carbonate. Alcohol denat. Bis-PEG/PPG-16/16 PEG/PPG-16/16 dimethicone. Silica. Ceteareth-20. Bis-ethylhexyloxyphenol methoxyphenyl triazine. Dibutyl adipate. Niacinamide. Butylene glycol. Titanium dioxide. Polysorbate 80. Ethylhexyl methoxycinnamate. Aloe barbadensis gel. Caprylic capric triglyceride. BHT. Dimethicone. Polymethyl methacrylate. Isohexadecane. Triethylhexanoin. Aluminum stearate. Polyhydroxystearic acid. Alumina. Tocopheryl acetate. PEG-8. Tocopherol. Ascorbyl palmitate. Ascorbic acid. Citric acid. Disodium EDTA. Allantoin. Xanthan gum. Phenoxyethanol. Ethylhexylglycerin. Sodium acryloyldimethyl taurate copolymer. Isohexadecane. Polysorbate 80. Sorbitan oleate. Decyl polyglucoside. Propylene glycol. Lactic acid. Bisabolol. Superoxide dismutase. Pentylene glycol. Tromethamine. Potassium sorbate. Sodium benzoate. Camelia sinensis extract. Glycerin.


Thanks

Edited by Anais, 31 August 2012 - 07:04 PM.

[Mia K.]

Hi Eva,

Oh, yes! If (read: When) your s/s becomes available to us I'll certainly try it! (Although, I hope it won't co$t quite as much as the La Mer Fluid you so kindly recommend.)

Yrs,
Mia

Hi Mia,

Glad you like the Even Better Serum
I beleive the spf 30 s/s by Topix Citrix can be a good alternative. Although the amount of the ZnO is a bit low IMO.
If you liked the Even Better Serum, you would also like La Mer The SPF 30 Fluid (10% ZnO, 7.5% OMC) or my coming sunscreen fluid. (Just a thought )

Edited by Mia K., 31 August 2012 - 09:28 PM.

[Eva Victoria]

Hi Eva,

What are your thoughts about this europe sunscreen? I'm not sure if it has encapsulated avobenzone.

Ingredients:
Aqua. Octocrylene. Methylene bis-benzotriazolyl tetramethylbutylphenol. Ethylhexyl salicylate. Cyclopentasiloxane. Butyl methoxydibenzoylmetano. Diethylhexyl carbonate. Alcohol denat. Bis-PEG/PPG-16/16 PEG/PPG-16/16 dimethicone. Silica. Ceteareth-20. Bis-ethylhexyloxyphenol methoxyphenyl triazine. Dibutyl adipate. Niacinamide. Butylene glycol. Titanium dioxide. Polysorbate 80. Ethylhexyl methoxycinnamate. Aloe barbadensis gel. Caprylic capric triglyceride. BHT. Dimethicone. Polymethyl methacrylate. Isohexadecane. Triethylhexanoin. Aluminum stearate. Polyhydroxystearic acid. Alumina. Tocopheryl acetate. PEG-8. Tocopherol. Ascorbyl palmitate. Ascorbic acid. Citric acid. Disodium EDTA. Allantoin. Xanthan gum. Phenoxyethanol. Ethylhexylglycerin. Sodium acryloyldimethyl taurate copolymer. Isohexadecane. Polysorbate 80. Sorbitan oleate. Decyl polyglucoside. Propylene glycol. Lactic acid. Bisabolol. Superoxide dismutase. Pentylene glycol. Tromethamine. Potassium sorbate. Sodium benzoate. Camelia sinensis extract. Glycerin.


Thanks

Hi Anais,

It looks like a decent sunscreen, although it is a pity that alcohol is ranged so high on the ingredients list. The ingredients list is very familiar, which sunscreen is it?
E.

[Anais]

It is Sunlaude Mat 50+. It has a nice liquid texture and it's very mat when dries. I like it more than Bioderma, it's the best I've tried. But yes, I'm a little concerned with the alcohol because I have sensitive skin.

Thanks a lot

[Eva Victoria]

It is Sunlaude Mat 50+. It has a nice liquid texture and it's very mat when dries. I like it more than Bioderma, it's the best I've tried. But yes, I'm a little concerned with the alcohol because I have sensitive skin.

Thanks a lot

Thank you, Anais, for the brand of the sunscreen

[lucaasalberto]

Hi, Eva!

I've seen you recommend the Obagi Sun Shield SPF 50 as a good sunscreen available in the US. Since I was looking for a zinc based sunscreen I thought I'd give it a try. I have been using it and it just has a great finish, even more matte than my previous sunscreen (Tinosorb M+S based), which I really enjoyed. It also doesn't leave much of white cast, quite unnoticeable, although I can see the difference with and without the sunscreen.
But I was wondering how it does on UVA protection. I ran a simulation on the BASF Sunscreen Simulator (how do I know if I should use the zinc oil-phase or water-phase?) and it doesn't do very well. I'm aware that it's just an estimate, but still, when I ran a simulation for the sunscreen I was using before, it did better, both in the PPD scale and critical wavelength.
So I guess I wanted to know your opinion about this sunscreen's UVA protection, and how it would compare to a Tinosorb based one.

Also, what do you think about the Glycolix Elite SPF 30? Here is the ingredients list:

Zinc Oxide 17.0%. Purified Water, C12-15 Alkyl Benzoate, Cyclomethicone, Laurylmethicone Copolyol, C13-14 Isoparaffin, Polyacrylamide, Ceresin, Dimethicone, Green Tea Extract, Phospholipids, Ascorbyl Palmitate, Tocopheryl Acetate, Retinyl Palmitate, Coenzyme Q-10, Ascorbyl Glucosamine, Superoxide Dismutase, Laureth-7, Sodium Chloride, Methylparaben, Propylparaben, Diazolidinyl Urea.

Thank you!

[Eva Victoria]

Hi Lucas Alberto,

The BASF simulator will give you a lower value for ZnO based sunscreens than for Tinosorb ones. (BASF distributes Tinosorb filters).
Tinosorb S and M (also AVO) will give a higher PPD value (at 370 nm) per percent of active than ZnO would. But ZnO is inherently photo-stable and it will protect also at 400 nm (this will not happen with Tinosorb S nor with AVO; but Tinosorb M will protect also at 400 nm).
The other positive side of ZnO is that it is extremely gentle for the skin and even babies can use it. It has anti-inflammatory and disinfectant properties beside its protection in the whole UVR range (protects fully against both UVB and UVA rays). There is another notable benefit of ZnO. It has an equal filtering mechanism in the UVB and the UVA spectrum, rather like shade has. It is a perfect sunscreen active for everyday use. (Although particle size is crucial for the equal protection.)

In the Obagi susncreen ZnO is added to the oil-phase (so is in the Glycolix Elite SPF 30).

I think Glycolix Elite SPF 30 might be a very good option for everyday use. It has high enough ZnO content although achieving SPF 30 with only 17% ZnO alone means that the particle size is smaller, hence it has lower UVA protection. I would guess UVA/PPD 10.
I think this sunscreen has a very pleasant consistency since it is Si/W and the high amount of ZnO will also contribute to a matte finish. The only objection I have is the use of two anti-oxidants: Ascorbyl Palmitate and Retinyl Palmitate. Ascorbyl Palmitate is an oil soluble form of Vitamin C and has not been proven to have any effect on the skin. It is more an anti-oxidant to preserve product quality (much like BHT or BHA). But Retinyl Palmitate is shown to have carcinogenic effect in the presence of UVR. There is also a petition to the FDA to ban it from sunscreens.
The product should have some humectants for moisturizing of the skin and for microbiological preservationof the product. It would also perform better with another form of Vitamin C (MAP or SAP or Ascorbyl Glucoside) with the addition of more anti-oxidants and cell-communicating ingredients.
There are the so called "second generation anti-oxidants" that, in my opinion, today's product should also include for more fortified protection against environmental damage (included sun-damage). (But again, it all comes down to profit margins and not to offering ethically correct products to the consumers.)

Please let me know what you think of the Glycolix Elite SPF 30 sunscreen when you have had a chance to try it?
Eva

Hi, Eva!

I've seen you recommend the Obagi Sun Shield SPF 50 as a good sunscreen available in the US. Since I was looking for a zinc based sunscreen I thought I'd give it a try. I have been using it and it just has a great finish, even more matte than my previous sunscreen (Tinosorb M+S based), which I really enjoyed. It also doesn't leave much of white cast, quite unnoticeable, although I can see the difference with and without the sunscreen.
But I was wondering how it does on UVA protection. I ran a simulation on the BASF Sunscreen Simulator (how do I know if I should use the zinc oil-phase or water-phase?) and it doesn't do very well. I'm aware that it's just an estimate, but still, when I ran a simulation for the sunscreen I was using before, it did better, both in the PPD scale and critical wavelength.
So I guess I wanted to know your opinion about this sunscreen's UVA protection, and how it would compare to a Tinosorb based one.

Also, what do you think about the Glycolix Elite SPF 30? Here is the ingredients list:

Zinc Oxide 17.0%. Purified Water, C12-15 Alkyl Benzoate, Cyclomethicone, Laurylmethicone Copolyol, C13-14 Isoparaffin, Polyacrylamide, Ceresin, Dimethicone, Green Tea Extract, Phospholipids, Ascorbyl Palmitate, Tocopheryl Acetate, Retinyl Palmitate, Coenzyme Q-10, Ascorbyl Glucosamine, Superoxide Dismutase, Laureth-7, Sodium Chloride, Methylparaben, Propylparaben, Diazolidinyl Urea.

Thank you!

[lucaasalberto]

Hi,

Thanks for the reply!
I thought there might be some conflict of interested with the BASF simulator. So I shouldn't be worried that the graphs and everything looks better for the Tinosorb filters?

Considering that the Obagi sunscreen also has octinoxate for UVB protection, would you say that the zinc oxide it uses has greater UVA protection than the Glycolix one, that only uses zinc for both UVB and UVA protection?
Besides particle size, is the particle's "shape" also important? Do you know anything about the zinc oxide Obagi uses?

Thanks again, and I will let you know about the Glycolix Elite SPF 30.
Lucas.

Hi Lucas Alberto,

The BASF simulator will give you a lower value for ZnO based sunscreens than for Tinosorb ones. (BASF distributes Tinosorb filters).
Tinosorb S and M (also AVO) will give a higher PPD value (at 370 nm) per percent of active than ZnO would. But ZnO is inherently photo-stable and it will protect also at 400 nm (this will not happen with Tinosorb S nor with AVO; but Tinosorb M will protect also at 400 nm).
The other positive side of ZnO is that it is extremely gentle for the skin and even babies can use it. It has anti-inflammatory and disinfectant properties beside its protection in the whole UVR range (protects fully against both UVB and UVA rays). There is another notable benefit of ZnO. It has an equal filtering mechanism in the UVB and the UVA spectrum, rather like shade has. It is a perfect sunscreen active for everyday use. (Although particle size is crucial for the equal protection.)

In the Obagi susncreen ZnO is added to the oil-phase (so is in the Glycolix Elite SPF 30).

I think Glycolix Elite SPF 30 might be a very good option for everyday use. It has high enough ZnO content although achieving SPF 30 with only 17% ZnO alone means that the particle size is smaller, hence it has lower UVA protection. I would guess UVA/PPD 10.
I think this sunscreen has a very pleasant consistency since it is Si/W and the high amount of ZnO will also contribute to a matte finish. The only objection I have is the use of two anti-oxidants: Ascorbyl Palmitate and Retinyl Palmitate. Ascorbyl Palmitate is an oil soluble form of Vitamin C and has not been proven to have any effect on the skin. It is more an anti-oxidant to preserve product quality (much like BHT or BHA). But Retinyl Palmitate is shown to have carcinogenic effect in the presence of UVR. There is also a petition to the FDA to ban it from sunscreens.
The product should have some humectants for moisturizing of the skin and for microbiological preservationof the product. It would also perform better with another form of Vitamin C (MAP or SAP or Ascorbyl Glucoside) with the addition of more anti-oxidants and cell-communicating ingredients.
There are the so called "second generation anti-oxidants" that, in my opinion, today's product should also include for more fortified protection against environmental damage (included sun-damage). (But again, it all comes down to profit margins and not to offering ethically correct products to the consumers.)

Please let me know what you think of the Glycolix Elite SPF 30 sunscreen when you have had a chance to try it?
Eva

Hi, Eva!

I've seen you recommend the Obagi Sun Shield SPF 50 as a good sunscreen available in the US. Since I was looking for a zinc based sunscreen I thought I'd give it a try. I have been using it and it just has a great finish, even more matte than my previous sunscreen (Tinosorb M+S based), which I really enjoyed. It also doesn't leave much of white cast, quite unnoticeable, although I can see the difference with and without the sunscreen.
But I was wondering how it does on UVA protection. I ran a simulation on the BASF Sunscreen Simulator (how do I know if I should use the zinc oil-phase or water-phase?) and it doesn't do very well. I'm aware that it's just an estimate, but still, when I ran a simulation for the sunscreen I was using before, it did better, both in the PPD scale and critical wavelength.
So I guess I wanted to know your opinion about this sunscreen's UVA protection, and how it would compare to a Tinosorb based one.

Also, what do you think about the Glycolix Elite SPF 30? Here is the ingredients list:

Zinc Oxide 17.0%. Purified Water, C12-15 Alkyl Benzoate, Cyclomethicone, Laurylmethicone Copolyol, C13-14 Isoparaffin, Polyacrylamide, Ceresin, Dimethicone, Green Tea Extract, Phospholipids, Ascorbyl Palmitate, Tocopheryl Acetate, Retinyl Palmitate, Coenzyme Q-10, Ascorbyl Glucosamine, Superoxide Dismutase, Laureth-7, Sodium Chloride, Methylparaben, Propylparaben, Diazolidinyl Urea.

Thank you!

[Eva Victoria]

Hi,

Greater UVB protection will mean that the sunscreen is UVB-biased. It is impossible to say anything about the particle size of any pigments that a producer uses unless they disclose it or the product is tested in the lab. There are also other factors will influence the protection of a sunscreen like the dispersion of the pigment(s) in a product.

Hi,

Thanks for the reply!
I thought there might be some conflict of interested with the BASF simulator. So I shouldn't be worried that the graphs and everything looks better for the Tinosorb filters?

Considering that the Obagi sunscreen also has octinoxate for UVB protection, would you say that the zinc oxide it uses has greater UVA protection than the Glycolix one, that only uses zinc for both UVB and UVA protection?
Besides particle size, is the particle's "shape" also important? Do you know anything about the zinc oxide Obagi uses?

Thanks again, and I will let you know about the Glycolix Elite SPF 30.
Lucas.

Hi Lucas Alberto,

The BASF simulator will give you a lower value for ZnO based sunscreens than for Tinosorb ones. (BASF distributes Tinosorb filters).
Tinosorb S and M (also AVO) will give a higher PPD value (at 370 nm) per percent of active than ZnO would. But ZnO is inherently photo-stable and it will protect also at 400 nm (this will not happen with Tinosorb S nor with AVO; but Tinosorb M will protect also at 400 nm).
The other positive side of ZnO is that it is extremely gentle for the skin and even babies can use it. It has anti-inflammatory and disinfectant properties beside its protection in the whole UVR range (protects fully against both UVB and UVA rays). There is another notable benefit of ZnO. It has an equal filtering mechanism in the UVB and the UVA spectrum, rather like shade has. It is a perfect sunscreen active for everyday use. (Although particle size is crucial for the equal protection.)

In the Obagi susncreen ZnO is added to the oil-phase (so is in the Glycolix Elite SPF 30).

I think Glycolix Elite SPF 30 might be a very good option for everyday use. It has high enough ZnO content although achieving SPF 30 with only 17% ZnO alone means that the particle size is smaller, hence it has lower UVA protection. I would guess UVA/PPD 10.
I think this sunscreen has a very pleasant consistency since it is Si/W and the high amount of ZnO will also contribute to a matte finish. The only objection I have is the use of two anti-oxidants: Ascorbyl Palmitate and Retinyl Palmitate. Ascorbyl Palmitate is an oil soluble form of Vitamin C and has not been proven to have any effect on the skin. It is more an anti-oxidant to preserve product quality (much like BHT or BHA). But Retinyl Palmitate is shown to have carcinogenic effect in the presence of UVR. There is also a petition to the FDA to ban it from sunscreens.
The product should have some humectants for moisturizing of the skin and for microbiological preservationof the product. It would also perform better with another form of Vitamin C (MAP or SAP or Ascorbyl Glucoside) with the addition of more anti-oxidants and cell-communicating ingredients.
There are the so called "second generation anti-oxidants" that, in my opinion, today's product should also include for more fortified protection against environmental damage (included sun-damage). (But again, it all comes down to profit margins and not to offering ethically correct products to the consumers.)

Please let me know what you think of the Glycolix Elite SPF 30 sunscreen when you have had a chance to try it?
Eva

Hi, Eva!

I've seen you recommend the Obagi Sun Shield SPF 50 as a good sunscreen available in the US. Since I was looking for a zinc based sunscreen I thought I'd give it a try. I have been using it and it just has a great finish, even more matte than my previous sunscreen (Tinosorb M+S based), which I really enjoyed. It also doesn't leave much of white cast, quite unnoticeable, although I can see the difference with and without the sunscreen.
But I was wondering how it does on UVA protection. I ran a simulation on the BASF Sunscreen Simulator (how do I know if I should use the zinc oil-phase or water-phase?) and it doesn't do very well. I'm aware that it's just an estimate, but still, when I ran a simulation for the sunscreen I was using before, it did better, both in the PPD scale and critical wavelength.
So I guess I wanted to know your opinion about this sunscreen's UVA protection, and how it would compare to a Tinosorb based one.

Also, what do you think about the Glycolix Elite SPF 30? Here is the ingredients list:

Zinc Oxide 17.0%. Purified Water, C12-15 Alkyl Benzoate, Cyclomethicone, Laurylmethicone Copolyol, C13-14 Isoparaffin, Polyacrylamide, Ceresin, Dimethicone, Green Tea Extract, Phospholipids, Ascorbyl Palmitate, Tocopheryl Acetate, Retinyl Palmitate, Coenzyme Q-10, Ascorbyl Glucosamine, Superoxide Dismutase, Laureth-7, Sodium Chloride, Methylparaben, Propylparaben, Diazolidinyl Urea.

Thank you!

[elforn01]

Hi Eva,

I'm so glad I found this forum - it's amazing (and much of that is due to you)!

I'm a 24 year old fair (blonde haired/blue eyed) university student in sunny Western Australia. As a result I find it very difficult to avoid the sun. My questions stem from that fact.


1. Sun Protective Clothing

In another forum topic you posted an amazing article which I've attached below.

In it they found a UPF 13 fabric was superior to a UPF 6 fabric for preventing loss of skin elasticity from sun exposure. They noted the results couldn't be generalised because there is no guarantee that the superior protection afforded by the UPF 13 fabric was due to the higher UPF as opposed to the particular wavelength profiles of the spectrum of UV light that it blocked. An additional conflating factor for SPF rated clothing makes chosing protective clothing mote difficult because SPF ratings do not incorporate UVA.

I'm quite keen to get a couple of high UPF/SPF shawls and gloves to wear whilst walking between classes. How can I tell if they will protect from UVA? Should I ask what fabric treatments they use? (I was specifically looking at sunsibility.co.uk)


2. Long-wear body sunscreen

I'm currently using the Chanel Essential UV for my face, but it's too expensive to use on legs etc. I'm looking for an inexpensive sunscreen, available in Australia or online. I want to apply two coats in the morning and not reapply during the day (I have to move quickly from class to class). It needn't be waterproof, and I don't mind greasy or cast-forming, but would rather it not rub off onto clothes etc too easily.


3. Retinol and Moisturisers

I've just bought the Clinique Even Better Skin Tone Corrector which you recommended for use with retinols (which I hope to start soon). You said to apply only the retinol at night, with only a moisturiser on top if needed. I have dry skin, what moisturiser should I use that won't react? Would it be OK to use the same Clinique serum over the top? I read somewhere that Vitamin C shouldn't be applied at the same time as high dose retinol products because it is drying. I read somewhere else that Vitamin C products shouldn't be used in the morning because of sunlight oxidation. This has left me confused about when to use the Clinique serum (I believe you said use it before sunscreen and wait for it to be absorbed).


4. Retinol and glycolic/AHA cleansers

I may just be paranoid, but is there anything I have to look out for in my cleansers when using retinol? I ordinarily have sensitive skin, so stick to very simple formulations with very few active ingredients. I read somewhere that AHAs shouldn't be applied at the same time as retinol, but would using it to cleanse in the morning be too much as well?


5. Scars and Stretch Marks, and bodily usage of retinol

I read somewhere on here that retinol improves texture. Would it be appropriate to use it on my decolletage for acne scarring and stretch marks? What about reversing other bodily UV damage, such as hands and forearms - could retinol be used there? I understand I'd have to be very careful with sun exposure.


Thanks so much for any thoughts or input you may have. I'm sorry I'm so clueless.

Best,

Elf

Attached Files

•  Garments_Protection.pdf   548.57KB   2 downloads

[wing767]

Hi Eva,

i have been using tretinoin for 8 months, starting gradually and now every evening, my husband says that my face has changed it color, it has a pink tint. Is it normal?

Eva,

i would like to ask your opinion about the compisition of the below serum( as it looks suspicious to me), is it ok ot be used after retinol? Thank you.
Aqua,pentylene glycol,persea gratissima (avocado_ oil, polyglyceryl-3 methylglucose distearate, simmondsia chinesis (jojoba ) seed oil, hydrogenated polyisobuten, dimethicone, cycopentasiloxane,dimethicone crosspolymer, isodecyl neopentonoate, dipentaerythrityl hexacaprlate/hexacaprate, caprylic/capric triglyceride,cetearyl alcohol, glyceryl stearate, PEG-40 hydrogenated castor oil, hydrolyzed soy flour, tocopheryl acetate, sodium polyacrylate, alcohol, lecithin, disodium rutinyl disulfate, hydroxyproline, sorbitol, magnesium ascorbyl phosphate, propylene glycol, camellia sinesis leaf extract, potassium cetyl phosphate, trideceth-6, PEG/PPG-18/18 dimethicone, disodium EDTA, tocopherol, ascorbyl palmitate, glyceryl oleate, citric acid, phenoxyethanol, methylparaben, osopropylparaben, isobutylparaben,butylparaben, propylparaben, mica, parfum, linalool, limonene, butylphenyl methypropional, alpha-isomethyl lonone, citronellol, geraniol, CI 77891

[Eva Victoria]

Hi Wing,

It is normal that the skin gets pinker due to more blood-flow, younger skin. If you look at children's skin you'll notice that their skin is also pinker and more luminous by nature.

The serum you sent the ingredients list for seems too oily to me and has very little antioxidants. In fact, as far as I can see, it is only Green Tea Extract and Vitamin E and Magnesium Ascorbyl Phosphate= Vitamin C).
You can certainly use it with retinol or tretinoin.

Hi Eva,

i have been using tretinoin for 8 months, starting gradually and now every evening, my husband says that my face has changed it color, it has a pink tint. Is it normal?

Eva,

i would like to ask your opinion about the compisition of the below serum( as it looks suspicious to me), is it ok ot be used after retinol? Thank you.
Aqua,pentylene glycol,persea gratissima (avocado_ oil, polyglyceryl-3 methylglucose distearate, simmondsia chinesis (jojoba ) seed oil, hydrogenated polyisobuten, dimethicone, cycopentasiloxane,dimethicone crosspolymer, isodecyl neopentonoate, dipentaerythrityl hexacaprlate/hexacaprate, caprylic/capric triglyceride,cetearyl alcohol, glyceryl stearate, PEG-40 hydrogenated castor oil, hydrolyzed soy flour, tocopheryl acetate, sodium polyacrylate, alcohol, lecithin, disodium rutinyl disulfate, hydroxyproline, sorbitol, magnesium ascorbyl phosphate, propylene glycol, camellia sinesis leaf extract, potassium cetyl phosphate, trideceth-6, PEG/PPG-18/18 dimethicone, disodium EDTA, tocopherol, ascorbyl palmitate, glyceryl oleate, citric acid, phenoxyethanol, methylparaben, osopropylparaben, isobutylparaben,butylparaben, propylparaben, mica, parfum, linalool, limonene, butylphenyl methypropional, alpha-isomethyl lonone, citronellol, geraniol, CI 77891

[Eva Victoria]

Hi Time Stamp,

Please read my answers in blue.
Hi Eva,

I'm so glad I found this forum - it's amazing (and much of that is due to you)!

I'm a 24 year old fair (blonde haired/blue eyed) university student in sunny Western Australia. As a result I find it very difficult to avoid the sun. My questions stem from that fact.


1. Sun Protective Clothing

In another forum topic you posted an amazing article which I've attached below.

In it they found a UPF 13 fabric was superior to a UPF 6 fabric for preventing loss of skin elasticity from sun exposure. They noted the results couldn't be generalised because there is no guarantee that the superior protection afforded by the UPF 13 fabric was due to the higher UPF as opposed to the particular wavelength profiles of the spectrum of UV light that it blocked. An additional conflating factor for SPF rated clothing makes chosing protective clothing mote difficult because SPF ratings do not incorporate UVA.

I'm quite keen to get a couple of high UPF/SPF shawls and gloves to wear whilst walking between classes. How can I tell if they will protect from UVA? Should I ask what fabric treatments they use? (I was specifically looking at sunsibility.co.uk)

I do not know much about sun-protective clothing, I'm afraid.

2. Long-wear body sunscreen

I'm currently using the Chanel Essential UV for my face, but it's too expensive to use on legs etc. I'm looking for an inexpensive sunscreen, available in Australia or online. I want to apply two coats in the morning and not reapply during the day (I have to move quickly from class to class). It needn't be waterproof, and I don't mind greasy or cast-forming, but would rather it not rub off onto clothes etc too easily.

Very tricky. If you want a good and reliable UVA protection, the sunscreen is due to be either sticky or (very) whitening that can miscolour clothes. The only sunscreen that comes to mind, that would absorb fast and leaving no trace is alcohol based spray sunscreens that usually have low UVA protection. Maybe a spray version from LRP Anthelios SPF 20 would be sufficient enough? (Since you don't spend unnecessary time in the sun.)


3. Retinol and Moisturisers

I've just bought the Clinique Even Better Skin Tone Corrector which you recommended for use with retinols (which I hope to start soon). You said to apply only the retinol at night, with only a moisturiser on top if needed. I have dry skin, what moisturiser should I use that won't react? Would it be OK to use the same Clinique serum over the top? I read somewhere that Vitamin C shouldn't be applied at the same time as high dose retinol products because it is drying. I read somewhere else that Vitamin C products shouldn't be used in the morning because of sunlight oxidation. This has left me confused about when to use the Clinique serum (I believe you said use it before sunscreen and wait for it to be absorbed).

First of all, I would definitely recommend to use a Vitamin C serum in the morning. It is an anti-oxidant in itself and a stable one esp. when combined with vit. E.
Since the Clinique version has Ascorbyl Glycoside (stabilized Ascorbic Acid) and the formulation needs to be PH 6.8 to ensure long term stability, it will mean that it can also be combined with products containing Tretinoin or Retinol at night.
This serum is not really drying since it is mostly composed of silicone elastomer.

A moisturizer that you can use after applying products containing Tretinoin or Retinol should be a neutral moisturizer that will sooth the skin but not really add to much "actives" additionally.
A simple moisturizer from the pharmacy can do the job. An O/W emulsion with classic emulsifiers like Glyceryl Stearate nd Stearic Acid with some oil (mineral oil (and Petrolatum) is a good alternative) added can do a wonderful job. Clinique's Dramatically Different Moisturizing Lotion can also be a good alternative with its higher PH and just enough oils (Sesam oil and Mineral oil and some Petrolatum) to have a pleasant soothing effect on the skin.


4. Retinol and glycolic/AHA cleansers

I may just be paranoid, but is there anything I have to look out for in my cleansers when using retinol? I ordinarily have sensitive skin, so stick to very simple formulations with very few active ingredients. I read somewhere that AHAs shouldn't be applied at the same time as retinol, but would using it to cleanse in the morning be too much as well?

I would definitely not recommend to apply AHAs with products containing Tretinoin or Retinol at the same time. Unless one needs to boost the effect of the latter.
Using AHAs in the morning may be better tolerated. But I still would not recommend it to use it at all as long as one uses any products containing Tretinoin or Retinol. It can be simply too much for the skin.
I think a simple cleanser (LRP Lipicar Syndet) will do a wonderful job while not irritate the skin additionally.

5. Scars and Stretch Marks, and bodily usage of retinol

I read somewhere on here that retinol improves texture. Would it be appropriate to use it on my decolletage for acne scarring and stretch marks? What about reversing other bodily UV damage, such as hands and forearms - could retinol be used there? I understand I'd have to be very careful with sun exposure.

Indeed products containing Tretinoin or Retinol can be great help for skin on other body parts. Again, one should be very careful with sun exposure and have patience since results can take longer time on the thicker skin that covers our body.

Hope I could be of some help! Good luck with your skin care!
Kindest regards,
Eva V.


Thanks so much for any thoughts or input you may have. I'm sorry I'm so clueless.

Best,

Elf