41 replies to this topic

[chhof]

Hello,

do you think there is a molecule, some genomes or anything else that could reverse aging?
Not just stop aging, but going the whole lifeline backwards, maybe with some speed up?
Getting 50,40,30,20,10,...

So everything needs to reverse, skin, health, if you are going beyond 12 there would be a need for reverse puberty, getting milk teeth and so on.

If you are young enough (you reached your desired age, maybe 20, maybe 10, who knows) you could just don't use this substance and you would getting older again.

Would such a substance or something like that be possible?
Or would that be impossible? Is there research on that topic?

[SloMoSandy]

It's kind of possible to one of the jelly fish species, by their own natural mechanism. They mature and then "goes back" and mature again. They are considered "immortal species". Have no idea about humans (the "reversion" to THAt extent). As imho the difference between 20 and 60 yo isn't really big, contrary to 20 and 12..

[Luna]

Probably not one molecule...

[niner]

Certainly not a single molecule. The damage and changes that constitute aging are much too complicated for such an easy solution. With sufficient technology, it might be possible to return an adult to the status of a younger adult, but continuing the process beyond that point is a completely different problem. That would require a kind of "reverse development". The term "development" has a very specific meaning in biology; it is the process whereby an organism matures from zygote to adult. "Aging" is an accumulation of damage and other changes that occurs simultaneously with development, but continues to accrue after development stops. It is possible to slow or stop certain aspects of development, but not to reverse them at this time.

[Luna]

And I hoped to undevelop my huge feet and shoulders :P

[ggranger007]

In addition to what niner said about accumulated damage and aging, to actually reverse developmental stages like teeth growth, you would have to alter the signaling pathways that your body uses to express these regions in your genetic code. The WNT pathway is what triggers teeth growth in rats. It is extensive. Simply reversing the pathway probably would not do anything because the genes have already been expressed and your teeth have already grown - your body would need an enzyme to dissolve the calcium in your teeth, the genetic code written to tell it how to do this and something to trigger the whole process.

In a nutshell, our bodies are far more complicated than administering a single drug. As far as slowing or stopping aging, the probability of this seems much more realistic.

[chhof]

Thank you for your answers.
It seems that that reverse aging is much more complicated than I thought. So the answer is in nano technology / nano bots. This way you could exchange every needed cell. So we need to stop or slow down aging to be alive when the nano bots are ready

[Forever21]

Thank you for your answers.
It seems that that reverse aging is much more complicated than I thought. So the answer is in nano technology / nano bots. This way you could exchange every needed cell. So we need to stop or slow down aging to be alive when the nano bots are ready

or cloning, organ transplant (brain) to a new body, mind scanning and upload, robotics, etc. We have organ transplant right now, also building human organs in labs. It might be sooner to expect we can 'create' / clone a full human body to transplant to brain of Larry King.

[celegans]

We are able to take differentiated cells (eg fibroblasts) and turn them back into primitive stem cells by introducing 3-4 important genes (with a virus). These stem cells can then be signaled to become almost any cell type using the proper transcription factors. So in theory I think it would be possible. You could take a sample of self-cells and induce them to become pluripotent stem cells and then grow up a large number of them in the lab. Then use this population to derive sub-populations of tissue specific stem cells such as bone, liver, kidney, vessel etc. You would have to verify at each stage that the cells were "pure" and had now mutations. low cost full genome sequencing would help here. The hard part would be implanting all these cells back into the body in the correct place. Kinda like rebuilding an old car while it is moving down the road by replacing most of the key parts.

If you could stop aging at say age 20 it likely be much easier than trying to revert an older person to age 20.

If there was some way, at every cell replication from conception, to check to make sure DNA (including mitochondrial DNA) was copied exactly (including no telomere loss) then I think many problems of aging would be solved. Our checking mechanisms are quite good but they aren't perfect. If a master pure copy could be checked at every cell division a "digital" copy of the DNA could be made.

[Gern]

Certainly not a single molecule. The damage and changes that constitute aging are much too complicated for such an easy solution. With sufficient technology, it might be possible to return an adult to the status of a younger adult, but continuing the process beyond that point is a completely different problem. That would require a kind of "reverse development". The term "development" has a very specific meaning in biology; it is the process whereby an organism matures from zygote to adult. "Aging" is an accumulation of damage and other changes that occurs simultaneously with development, but continues to accrue after development stops. It is possible to slow or stop certain aspects of development, but not to reverse them at this time.

In general I see what you mean. But, I'm curious: why assume that the mechanisms that causes specific changes to occur in the human body as it develops from birth to adulthood aren't also responsible for the changes we call "old age?"

[niner]

Certainly not a single molecule. The damage and changes that constitute aging are much too complicated for such an easy solution. With sufficient technology, it might be possible to return an adult to the status of a younger adult, but continuing the process beyond that point is a completely different problem. That would require a kind of "reverse development". The term "development" has a very specific meaning in biology; it is the process whereby an organism matures from zygote to adult. "Aging" is an accumulation of damage and other changes that occurs simultaneously with development, but continues to accrue after development stops. It is possible to slow or stop certain aspects of development, but not to reverse them at this time.

In general I see what you mean. But, I'm curious: why assume that the mechanisms that causes specific changes to occur in the human body as it develops from birth to adulthood aren't also responsible for the changes we call "old age?"

Aging and development are mostly different, but some changes that we usually think of as characteristics of old age are indeed caused by what you might call development gone awry. Testosterone and DHT are involved in maturation, but they can also lead to changes in skin and hair that might be considered marks of aging. Part of the appearance of an "old" face is due to facial bones that continue to grow, albeit slowly. Maybe this is development that just doesn't get sufficiently shut off, or maybe it's something different; I don't know. The bulk of aging, however, is different than development.

[bacopa]

So how come Aubrey and the whole Manhattan Beach Project idea is betting on age reversal, and like in 30 years? If it's that hard, then how come these "experts" think it can be done? Not saying their right, I just am no scientist.

[niner]

So how come Aubrey and the whole Manhattan Beach Project idea is betting on age reversal, and like in 30 years? If it's that hard, then how come these "experts" think it can be done? Not saying their right, I just am no scientist.

They might not be spelling it out, but I'm sure they don't mean reverting people back to childhood. I suspect they are being overly enthusiastic, but then that's their job. Thirty years is the canonical time for all fantastic future developments...

[chris w]

So how come Aubrey and the whole Manhattan Beach Project idea is betting on age reversal, and like in 30 years? If it's that hard, then how come these "experts" think it can be done? Not saying their right, I just am no scientist.

They might not be spelling it out, but I'm sure they don't mean reverting people back to childhood. I suspect they are being overly enthusiastic, but then that's their job. Thirty years is the canonical time for all fantastic future developments...

Bob Freitas on the margin of Nanomedicine mentioned about what he called dechronification, which is supposed to be able to do precisely that. I thought it was kind of an overkill - because what sane benefits would that actually bring us afterall ? "Simply" repairing damage is what I would be content with.

[Solarclimax]

It's like a self fulfilling prophecy. If enough people believe something will happen in 30 years or less then it will.

[chris w]

Well, enough of the right ones for sure. Single Bill Gates deciding he would want to help bring about the Singularity in the next three decades has more of an influence on it happening eventually than all of our Facebook friends' willpower combined. Massess are overrated.

[niner]

Bob Freitas on the margin of Nanomedicine mentioned about what he called dechronification, which is supposed to be able to do precisely that. I thought it was kind of an overkill - because what sane benefits would that actually bring us afterall ? "Simply" repairing damage is what I would be content with.

Ha ha... Well, it would be beneficial to be smaller in size; that would make a lot of things easier. It wouldn't be so great unless everyone did it, though. If Freitas is talking about the reversal of development, I suspect he doesn't really know what he's up against. That sounds like the guy who wants to convert Jupiter into a giant computer. Ok, maybe a little less wacky than that.

It's like a self fulfilling prophecy. If enough people believe something will happen in 30 years or less then it will.

Not if it's impossible or the science just isn't there yet. There's a long history of failed prognostications; are you saying that they didn't come to pass because enough people just didn't believe? Seems like a lot of people have been expecting the Second Coming, and they're still waiting.

[TAfundraiser]

seems to me that prevention is once again the best option here. we know a lot about the pieces which cause damage, so doing whatever is necessary to prevent or at the very least limit exposure to these damaging agents would be a good start.

follow that up with proper nutrition, supplementation, stress reduction, less drinking/smoking, correct amounts of sleep, enhancing immunity, and implementing the whole host of new anti-aging nutriceuticals such as resveratrol, telomerase activators, etc. should keep people looking and feeling pretty good for quite a long time.

[churchill]

So how come Aubrey and the whole Manhattan Beach Project idea is betting on age reversal, and like in 30 years? If it's that hard, then how come these "experts" think it can be done? Not saying their right, I just am no scientist.

Just because something is hard does not it mean it cannot be done. There definitely won't be a pill to cure aging, at the early stages it will require multiple treatments as aging is a multi factorial disease.

Part of the reason that they have the belief that it can be done is that they believe a lot of the basic research has been done in how to stop aging in the body, and that now it is really a question of getting the money to do it. At the moment unfortunately there is a lot of money going into aging related diseases rather than the root cause.

[Solarclimax]

It's like a self fulfilling prophecy. If enough people believe something will happen in 30 years or less then it will.

Not if it's impossible or the science just isn't there yet. There's a long history of failed prognostications; are you saying that they didn't come to pass because enough people just didn't believe? Seems like a lot of people have been expecting the Second Coming, and they're still waiting.

It's not impossible, science is near in theory, but has 30 years to get its act together in order to satisfy that particular estimate. Lifespans of thousands of years plus are achievable. No doubt in my mind. Mathematical thinking can be weak sometimes. Take Tesla as a good example, the greatest genius of all time.
I think part of the trouble is that too many people expect and not enough actually do something about it.

Edited by Solarclimax, 30 September 2010 - 12:24 AM.

[Gern]

So how come Aubrey and the whole Manhattan Beach Project idea is betting on age reversal, and like in 30 years? If it's that hard, then how come these "experts" think it can be done? Not saying their right, I just am no scientist.

... At the moment unfortunately there is a lot of money going into aging related diseases rather than the root cause.

If you take a long view of medical research this is a particularly interesting proposition. We spend a fortune researching diseases to which everyone will eventually succumb if we don't solve the basic problem of aging. We are essentially focused on a solution that only postpones age related disease rather than prevents them. From an economic perspective it cannot solve the problem of increasing health care costs due to age related diseases. In fact it probably makes it worse by adding more costly treatments, often employed after a persons productive years, that eek out a hand full more years until you get another age related disease, as everyone eventually will. Focus on everyone having the same health as a 20 year old for drastically more years and you will do far more to solving the problem of rising health care costs and have a more productive and therefore more prosperous society.

[churchill]

So how come Aubrey and the whole Manhattan Beach Project idea is betting on age reversal, and like in 30 years? If it's that hard, then how come these "experts" think it can be done? Not saying their right, I just am no scientist.

... At the moment unfortunately there is a lot of money going into aging related diseases rather than the root cause.

If you take a long view of medical research this is a particularly interesting proposition. We spend a fortune researching diseases to which everyone will eventually succumb if we don't solve the basic problem of aging. We are essentially focused on a solution that only postpones age related disease rather than prevents them. From an economic perspective it cannot solve the problem of increasing health care costs due to age related diseases. In fact it probably makes it worse by adding more costly treatments, often employed after a persons productive years, that eek out a hand full more years until you get another age related disease, as everyone eventually will. Focus on everyone having the same health as a 20 year old for drastically more years and you will do far more to solving the problem of rising health care costs and have a more productive and therefore more prosperous society.

Fully agree, now how do we convince the general public?

[Marios Kyriazis]

The term 'Reversing aging' in antiaging circles is taken to mean reversing the damage caused by aging, i.e.curing or ameliorating chronic degenerative disease. It does not mean to actually and literally reverse the age of the individual and make them young in chronological terms. This is impossible, as any student of physics knows.

[Major12]

Some gripping reading in hear, has really got me thinking. Could possibly be a bad thing at the same time if we could find out how to reverse aging!

[stevenreno]

Hello,

do you think there is a molecule, some genomes or anything else that could reverse aging?
Not just stop aging, but going the whole lifeline backwards, maybe with some speed up?
Getting 50,40,30,20,10,...

So everything needs to reverse, skin, health, if you are going beyond 12 there would be a need for reverse puberty, getting milk teeth and so on.

If you are young enough (you reached your desired age, maybe 20, maybe 10, who knows) you could just don't use this substance and you would getting older again.

Would such a substance or something like that be possible?
Or would that be impossible? Is there research on that topic?

Yes, actually many substances are involved such as NAD+ syntheses by several ways, antioxidants, Exercise for GH release, and other hormone replacement. see my profile for more info

Edited by stevenreno, 03 November 2010 - 07:30 AM.

[stevenreno]

The term 'Reversing aging' in antiaging circles is taken to mean reversing the damage caused by aging, i.e.curing or ameliorating chronic degenerative disease. It does not mean to actually and literally reverse the age of the individual and make them young in chronological terms. This is impossible, as any student of physics knows.

No, it is not impossible! its all about NAD+ syntheses by several ways, antioxidants, Exercise for GH release, and other hormone replacement. Its very easy! (see my profile for more info)I have taken off 20 to 25 years via what I call my process. Steve

Edited by stevenreno, 03 November 2010 - 07:27 AM.

[stevenreno]

Some gripping reading in hear, has really got me thinking. Could possibly be a bad thing at the same time if we could find out how to reverse aging!

There is side effect especially along the NAD+ syntheses via the tryptophan-NAD pathway the enzymes that break down by 7 enzymes are very undesirable
but other pathways seem to be benifical. I have taken off about 20 to 25 years via somthing I call my process. see my profile for more info: Steve

[JLL]

Some gripping reading in hear, has really got me thinking. Could possibly be a bad thing at the same time if we could find out how to reverse aging!

There is side effect especially along the NAD+ syntheses via the tryptophan-NAD pathway the enzymes that break down by 7 enzymes are very undesirable
but other pathways seem to be benifical. I have taken off about 20 to 25 years via somthing I call my process. see my profile for more info: Steve

The pictures in your facebook profile are pretty impressive, and I don't think all the positive changes (e.g. your facial skin) are simply due to cutting calories. However, to say that you have undone the internal aging damage of the last 20-25 years is an exaggeration.

When your hair grows back without any topicals, I'll be even more impressed.

[stevenreno]

Some gripping reading in hear, has really got me thinking. Could possibly be a bad thing at the same time if we could find out how to reverse aging!

There is side effect especially along the NAD+ syntheses via the tryptophan-NAD pathway the enzymes that break down by 7 enzymes are very undesirable
but other pathways seem to be benifical. I have taken off about 20 to 25 years via somthing I call my process. see my profile for more info: Steve

The pictures in your facebook profile are pretty impressive, and I don't think all the positive changes (e.g. your facial skin) are simply due to cutting calories. However, to say that you have undone the internal aging damage of the last 20-25 years is an exaggeration.

When your hair grows back without any topicals, I'll be even more impressed.

Thanks for your helpful review, I need as much input as I can get at this point, I have 3 factors against me,I have been HIV for 14 years, On Toxic HIV MEDS for 13 years, and I smoak 1-1/2 packs a day. I Also I have not put a topical on hair for over 6 months now. It was every month when I was 40! Thanks! Steve

[1101]

Yes, 1 molecule:

Telomerase reverse transcriptase

It will not make you go through puberty again or regrow milk teeth but it will keep your cells from getting old.