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Did I have a manic episode?

mania

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#1 Geovicsha

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Posted 30 May 2012 - 03:08 PM


TL;DR: Been taking some supplements/nootropics for studying and mild depression/social anxiety. Made me hypomanic. Drank a lot, took an MDMA pill and smoked weed and went crazy. Was this manic or just me having a good time and thinking too much about it?

Hey everyone. The past week or so I’ve been having the following:
L-Tyrosine 1g
L – Theanine 500mg
Piracetam 2.4g
Choline 1g
Rhodioa Rosea 500mg

The L-Tyrosine from last Wednesday to Saturday lifted me out of some cloudy mild-moderate melancholia and destroyed my social anxiety. But in going from feeling inferior I went to feeling superior: delusions of grandeur, a lot of study done, the motivation to study outweighing the anxiety to study, and a heightened and narcissistic appreciation for a lot of my thoughts. I’ve always endured a fair bit of narcissistic tendencies, but this can revolve into self-loathing and feeling the world is revolving around me (where a lot of my social anxiety stemmed from).

Anyway, Saturday night I felt so proud and accomplished from the amount of study I’ve done I decided to “let loose” on the Saturday night where my roommate was hosting her 22nd birthday. I haven’t drank in awhile (I’m 23) as I felt binge drinking on a weekend basis was killing the novelty. Anyway, after having the aforementioned supplements, I just felt so clear headed even after a few beers. I ended up having an MDMA pill (I seldom do, and the last few times it seems I’ve been fighting it), drank a lot more and just accepted everything: the guilty, the demon inside of me (Carl Jung esque). I always try to fight off thoughts but by fighting off the thoughts it just makes more anxiety! . I was so smooth with a girl (wonderful eye contact, touching, flirting, joking), but ultimately me being so spaced out and anxiety that she’ll say no (even though it was confirmed yes, so somewhat anxiety she’d say yes) nothing culminated.

At 5am on the Sunday morning, with the pill still kicking, I decided to smoke a bowl/cone of weed (I rarely smoke due to the anxiety it brings out but decided due to that euphoria to try it out). After that cone, and all the drinks, and the MDMA pill, I went into another world. The first time I had accepted everything since NYE 2008 (where I took my first MDMA pill). Certainly being at home may have been a key. I put on my iPod and Sgt Peppers Lonely Heart Club just made sense to put on, and each song felt like it was orchestrating my life. I started dancing in the backyard and all my thoughts were a stream of rainbow? I understood there was a crowd of people looking at me but it didn’t matter; nothing mattered. Life is but a dream, and the present moment is everything. It was what I wanted to do. If I want to do it, why shouldn’t I? I then danced in the kitchen and poured myself one glass of milk and one glass of coke and danced with them both, drinking them one at a time, as the white and black signified some yin and yang. I decided to dance in the park, and I’m lucky I didn’t get run over. I then realised that it was a bit weird I walked nearly a km down a busy road and decided to return home.

I then stared at the mirror, and it’s probably like 6.30am now, and I split my face in two and morphed it like this (I watched it earlier that day). It was uncanny. I was then talking to myself in the mirror and convinced myself that personalities indeed all exist within our head, much like the following quote by Carl Jung:

"Just as we tend to assume that the world is as we see it, we naively suppose that people are as we imagine them to be. In this latter case, unfortunately, there is no scientific test that would prove the discrepancy between perception and reality. Although the possibility of gross deception is infinitely greater here than in our perception of the physical world, we still go on naively projecting our own psychology into our fellow human beings. In this way everyone creates for himself a series of more or less imaginary relationships based essentially on projection."

I then went into my room and I was sure my poster was pulsating. Could the combination of MDMA and high strength marijuana (without any tolerance) do this? I concluded what would have been 2+ hours by watching a Pokemon episode (I felt it was appropaite at the time?)

Maybe it wasn’t full blown mania and I just got messed up? I was very depressed the Sunday and have been mildly recovering since.
I have been taking L-Tyrosine since and there are bouts where I am feeling like I am awesome. And my social anxiety diminishes and I just seem more assertive. But I don’t want to feel I am superior to anyone just as I don’t want to feel I am inferior to anyone; I am equal. We are all equal. I am as awesome as everyone else, but seems I become competitive and the only way to be awesome is to perceive one self as better than others.

I lied at the start at the precise dosages: I’m going by teaspoon size as I haven’t bought a scale yet, so they are at best approximate. Maybe I should seize all supplements until I get a digital scale and try like 500mg of L-Tyrosine?

Finally, I am not endorsing the use of supplements alone to aid in any depression or social anxiety. Prior to that I have been meditating almost daily for the past 8 months, have a strong affinity for Buddhism (Alan Watts is my idol), and doing Dr Thomas Richards audio CBT series ‘Overcoming Social Anxiety’. It just seems with these supplements that the cognitive theories, as well as the meditation, seem things to make more sense.

Especially since enjoying Alan Watts, I’ve also found great interest in the psychonaut culture (Timothy Leary, Terrence McKenna, Ram Dass etc). Ego death is something that seems amazing, and at times it feels like I have experienced it, but ultimately there is something that is holding me back. Some of my friends that night took mushrooms – I’ve had many offers for mushrooms and LSD, but I have rejected them for I know that I’m not ready yet. Despite experiencing all these different perceptions of reality, and understanding the profoundness of them, I have accepted the only thing about psychedelics is that I don’t know.

I am learning to love myself, but I don’t want to think I’m better than anyone in the process.

#2 Geovicsha

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Posted 30 May 2012 - 03:17 PM

Ah, blasted Internet! Could a moderator please delete the previous two topics?

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#3 health_nutty

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Posted 31 May 2012 - 04:07 AM

It sounds like you were high.
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#4 NMDAstronaut

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Posted 31 May 2012 - 05:27 AM

It sounds like what you had is what is termed a substance induced psychotic episode. Basically, your dopamine was through the roof. This is what happens in both schizophrenia - (why they take meds that block dopamine receptors) and often to people who use coc, meth or other stims that shoot up dopamine . Be careful with that... seriously

#5 jadamgo

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 07:27 PM

I didn't clearly understand a part of your post. How long did this period of increased mood and self-confidence last? When did it start, when did it peak, when did it end (or is it continuing now)? And how much sleep have you been getting over the past few weeks?

These answers will differentiate between mere substance intoxication ("you were just high") and (hypo)mania with increased substance use.

#6 NMDAstronaut

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 05:33 AM

I didn't clearly understand a part of your post. How long did this period of increased mood and self-confidence last? When did it start, when did it peak, when did it end (or is it continuing now)? And how much sleep have you been getting over the past few weeks?

These answers will differentiate between mere substance intoxication ("you were just high") and (hypo)mania with increased substance use.


Well actually that all depends on what definition you are using of substance induced psychotic episode vs (hypo)mania

You see, according to the DSM, if the symptoms under consideration are due to the direct physiological effects of a substance this cannot be classified as a (hypo)manic episode

This is what is known as an exclusion criteria

nice use of the word "mere" though : )

#7 nupi

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 08:21 AM

Sounds like you were on a a pretty decent trip (these kind of experiences are why people take MDMA in the first place, no? [1]).

Quite aside the question of just how MDMA dangerous is by itself, mixing with a MAOI such as Rhodiola seems like a really bad idea ™.


[1] Never tried it, so no personal experiences to relate to, but sounds pretty much what you would have seen people doing on a big rave in the 90s/early00s (truly I am getting old :)

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#8 Raza

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Posted 25 June 2012 - 07:39 PM

It's been said but bears repeating: don't take MDMA with Rhodiola.

Other'n that, sounds like you just enjoyed a good high. Piracetam is known for enhancing MDMA, which combined with the extra dopamine supply may explain your improved reaction to it. 'Mania' kind of loses its meaning when you're taking stuff like that, since nobody expects you to organize and live out your life in the states induced by party drugs.

Your daily regimen looks fine, if a little high-dosed; you'll build rapid (mild) tolerance to serotonergics and dopaminergics like that. If you feel it takes you past every-day utility levels, consider lowering the doses on Tyrosine, Rhodiola and/or Theanine as your energy/anxiety levels permit. The euphoria/hypomania won't last with daily use, but their utility can be stretched if you take only what you need and increase doses gradually as resistance builds.

Edited by Raza, 25 June 2012 - 07:41 PM.






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