44 replies to this topic

[stephen_b]

Ok,so..it doesn't need to be stirred around the clock exactly like they did in the rat study.

In Anthony's interview, the professor said that the reason they did that was to have a known quantity of dissolved C60 for the experiment. For his purposes, he would want to tie down as many independent variables as possible.

[motorcitykid]

I get it - simply shaking the fullerenes with the evoo will not reduce the quality of the final product, C60 evo. Thank you Stephen_b.

[SarahVaughter]

Olive oil quality is much more of a complex issue than I thought, even after reading "Extra Virginity - the sublime and scandalous world of olive oil" by Tom Mueller. I'm in Crete right now (we bought 300 l of prime Cretan oil to be sent to our Swedish C60oo production lab tomorrow) and people warned us not to purchase from the area around the village, because the olives have some kind of disease or worms (I did not understand the particulars). The olives more uphill in central Crete don't have that problem and the orchards look gorgeous, like a tropical rainforest so beautiful and pristine.

Then it gets more complicated: Some farmers are poor or lazy and let the olives fall off the tree instead of employing pickers. Such fallen olives often lie there for at a week, two weeks and they can get fungus because it is still often warm and it rains.

However, also gasoline-powered rotating brushes are not perfect, since I watched a harvester spill some gasoline over the olives as they lay on the nets he walked on.

The conclusion: If you are going to consume a lot of olive oil and you want to be certain that you get quality, you'd basically need to know what orchard the oil is coming from and how exactly the oil is harvested and processed.

I watched the olives getting pressed, and I noticed that there were quite a few leaves entering the grinding process. At least I spotted a few leaf-colored specks in the paste. Then again, recent research found very interesting compounds in olive leaves. It may even be that some of the health properties of olives are in fact due to the compounds in the leaves, which would mean you'd need a press that also lets some leaves through.

Then there is taste vs. acidity. The people here say that lower acidity = worse taste..

Edited by SarahVaughter, 06 January 2013 - 09:43 PM.

[motorcitykid]

Olive oil quality is much more of a complex issue than I thought, even after reading "Extra Virginity - the sublime and scandalous world of olive oil" by Tom Mueller. I'm in Crete right now (we bought 300 l of prime Cretan oil to be sent to our Swedish C60oo production lab tomorrow) and people warned us not to purchase from the area around the village, because the olives have some kind of disease or worms (I did not understand the particulars). The olives more uphill in central Crete don't have that problem and the orchards look gorgeous, like a tropical rainforest so beautiful and pristine.

Then it gets more complicated: Some farmers are poor or lazy and let the olives fall off the tree instead of employing pickers. Such fallen olives often lie there for at a week, two weeks and they can get fungus because it is still often warm and it rains.

However, also gasoline-powered rotating brushes are not perfect, since I watched a harvester spill some gasoline over the olives as they lay on the nets he walked on.

The conclusion: If you are going to consume a lot of olive oil and you want to be certain that you get quality, you'd basically need to know what orchard the oil is coming from and how exactly the oil is harvested and processed.

I watched the olives getting pressed, and I noticed that there were quite a few leaves entering the grinding process. At least I spotted a few leaf-colored specks in the paste. Then again, recent research found very interesting compounds in olive leaves. It may even be that some of the health properties of olives are in fact due to the compounds in the leaves, which would mean you'd need a press that also lets some leaves through.

Then there is taste vs. acidity. The people here say that lower acidity = worse taste..

Certainly, nothing's better than being able to witness the inner workings of the olive vineyards first hand. Wish I could do that. I live in NY so I have to rely on YELP lol and read reviews of those who've visited the various orchards.

Mcevoy evo is a very high quality California evo with a super high amount of polyphenols. I like the idea that their vineyard is open to the public for guided tours:
http://www.mcevoyran...-workshops.html

I'd like to think that the kind if irresponsible farming practices you described seeing in Crete doesn't happen as often on a ranch like Mcevoy. Of course accidents will happen, but picking up 2 week old olives off the ground?? Eeek.

With a solid reputaion to uphold and people coming through on a regular basis, I would hope there's less room for shady farming practices and shenanigans on the Mcevoy Ranch.

[hav]

Using the mortar to grind it into a more fine powder has solved the necessity of having to centrifuge or filter it -- unless you just want to, and have the equipment to do so. Any undissolved C60, if there is any, will settle to the bottom if you leave the bottle sitting undisturbed for a day or two. At the ratio above, I've had no undissolved C60 floating around in my bottles after a few weeks of just shaking it a few times each day. But I'll still toss away the bottom 1/4 inch of the olive oil in case there's any undissolved solids there. I get the same red-brown color as the vendor's bottles.

That was not exactly my experience. I found no visible settling after 2 weeks of magnetic stirring followed by 1 week of just letting the bottle sit in the dark. Centrifuging (4,000 rpm for 2 hours) left a noticeable sludge at the bottom of the tubes and subsequent filtering with a .22 um Autofil filter left quite a bit of material on the filter membrane. I doubt a coffee filter will remove much. I grind my coffee with a moderately fine setting of 8 on my Waring grinder and quite allot of material settles at the bottom of my left over coffee after a day.

I did try filtering before centrifuging, however, and found no detectable material at the bottom of the tubes. So I've dropped the centrifuging. I'm going to stick with the filtering until someone repeats the Baati study without it and proves it unnecessary. My thought is that it'll probably prove beneficial, if only because it removes any bacteria that might be in the oil.

I've also been grinding my c60 before mixing with a full-contact mortar and pestle. After an hour, rather than a day or two, I cannot see particles spinning around in the beaker. So it definitely makes dissolving easier. And there seems to be slightly less material on the filter membrane but still a substantial amount. Which is quite obvious if you wipe the membrane with a paper towel. This was true even when I pre-filtered the oil before mixing which indicated my post-mix filtering was catching undissolved c60. I'm sticking with the 2-week mix period anyway, however, just to make sure as much c60 dissolves as possible. I use 800 mg of c60 to a liter of oil.

Howard

Edited by hav, 07 January 2013 - 06:42 PM.

[motorcitykid]

Using the mortar to grind it into a more fine powder has solved the necessity of having to centrifuge or filter it -- unless you just want to, and have the equipment to do so. Any undissolved C60, if there is any, will settle to the bottom if you leave the bottle sitting undisturbed for a day or two. At the ratio above, I've had no undissolved C60 floating around in my bottles after a few weeks of just shaking it a few times each day. But I'll still toss away the bottom 1/4 inch of the olive oil in case there's any undissolved solids there. I get the same red-brown color as the vendor's bottles.

That was not exactly my experience. I found no visible settling after 2 weeks of magnetic stirring followed by 1 week of just letting the bottle sit in the dark. Centrifuging (4,000 rpm for 2 hours) left a noticeable sludge at the bottom of the tubes and subsequent filtering with a .22 um Autofil filter left quite a bit of material on the filter membrane. I doubt a coffee filter will remove much. I grind my coffee with a moderately fine setting of 8 on my Waring grinder and quite allot of material settles at the bottom of my left over coffee after a day.

I did try filtering before centrifuging, however, and found no detectable material at the bottom of the tubes. So I've dropped the centrifuging. I'm going to stick with the filtering until someone repeats the Baati study without it and proves it unnecessary. My thought is that it'll probably prove beneficial, if only because it removes any bacteria that might be in the oil.

I've also been grinding my c60 before mixing with a full-contact mortar and pestle. After an hour, rather than a day or two, I cannot see particles spinning around in the beaker. So it definitely makes dissolving easier. And there seems to be slightly less material on the filter membrane but still a substantial amount. Which is quite obvious if you wipe the membrane with a paper towel. This was true even when I pre-filtered the oil before mixing which indicated my post-mix filtering was catching undissolved c60. I'm sticking with the 2-week mix period anyway, however, just to make sure as much c60 dissolves as possible. I use 800 mg of c60 to a liter of oil.

Howard

Thanks for that Howard. I'm not sure why the whole process went rather smoothly for Trance. Yesterday I purchased a gram of carbon 60 fullerenes online, I was planning to follow his lead. Based on you're experience, I'm not so sure I should attempt to do this.

[trance]

Give it a try with a much smaller quantity of C60 and olive oil as a test trial run rather than committing a whole bottle of your best oil or all of your C60, and see how it turns out for you.

[motorcitykid]

Give it a try with a much smaller quantity of C60 and olive oil as a test trial run rather than committing a whole bottle of your best oil or all of your C60, and see how it turns out for you.

What fullerene/evo ratio do you suggest?

[niner]

Give it a try with a much smaller quantity of C60 and olive oil as a test trial run rather than committing a whole bottle of your best oil or all of your C60, and see how it turns out for you.

What fullerene/evo ratio do you suggest?

800mg /liter is a reasonable maximum, although I understand that it's possible to squeeze in a little more. A lot of people use less fullerene in order to make it more likely to dissolve. I used half a gram with 750ml, which is a convenient amount since that's a standard size that olive oil is sold in. That works out to 0.667mg/ml. Grinding or crushing the crystals of c60 made a huge difference in my experience. I didn't use magnetic stirring, filtration, or centrifugation. I guess you could call that the "paleo" approach. The solution is clear and is the right color. I wouldn't be surprised if filtration pulled out some solids, but I suspect that's true of just about all the foods I eat, so I'm not particularly worried about it.

[trance]

Give it a try with a much smaller quantity of C60 and olive oil as a test trial run rather than committing a whole bottle of your best oil or all of your C60, and see how it turns out for you.

What fullerene/evo ratio do you suggest?

800mg /liter is a reasonable maximum, although I understand that it's possible to squeeze in a little more. A lot of people use less fullerene in order to make it more likely to dissolve. I used half a gram with 750ml, which is a convenient amount since that's a standard size that olive oil is sold in. That works out to 0.667mg/ml. Grinding or crushing the crystals of c60 made a huge difference in my experience. I didn't use magnetic stirring, filtration, or centrifugation. I guess you could call that the "paleo" approach. The solution is clear and is the right color. I wouldn't be surprised if filtration pulled out some solids, but I suspect that's true of just about all the foods I eat, so I'm not particularly worried about it.

Right ... I've used 0.5mg - 0.8mg (note the decimal points) of C60 per 1.0ml of olive oil, based on what everyone else here in the other C60 threads has experimented with solubility-wise.

For your 500ml bottles of McEvoy oil, after grinding/crushing the C60 beforehand, I've used both 250mg of C60, or 400mg of C60, and had no problems of dissolution based on eyesite inspection. You might test it with a 50ml sample of your oil first if you're worried about our method -- which would be 25mg or 40mg of C60 based on what concentration you want.

After a few weeks, when it's turned red-brown-whiskey colored, shake & pour a little bit into a clear glass test tube and hold it up to a bright light to look for any "floaters." Put a drop on your fingertip and rub between your thumb to see if you feel any grit. If so, go back to shaking your bottle(s) for a few more days, repeat.

[motorcitykid]

Give it a try with a much smaller quantity of C60 and olive oil as a test trial run rather than committing a whole bottle of your best oil or all of your C60, and see how it turns out for you.

What fullerene/evo ratio do you suggest?

I guess you could call that the "paleo" approach.

Yeah that's a good a way of looking at it. I'm gonna give it a test run with lower ratios and see how it works out.

[motorcitykid]

Give it a try with a much smaller quantity of C60 and olive oil as a test trial run rather than committing a whole bottle of your best oil or all of your C60, and see how it turns out for you.

What fullerene/evo ratio do you suggest?

800mg /liter is a reasonable maximum, although I understand that it's possible to squeeze in a little more. A lot of people use less fullerene in order to make it more likely to dissolve. I used half a gram with 750ml, which is a convenient amount since that's a standard size that olive oil is sold in. That works out to 0.667mg/ml. Grinding or crushing the crystals of c60 made a huge difference in my experience. I didn't use magnetic stirring, filtration, or centrifugation. I guess you could call that the "paleo" approach. The solution is clear and is the right color. I wouldn't be surprised if filtration pulled out some solids, but I suspect that's true of just about all the foods I eat, so I'm not particularly worried about it.

You might test it with a 50ml sample of your oil first if you're worried about our method -- which would be 25mg or 40mg of C60 based on what concentration you want.

I'm gonna try 40mg of C60 with a 50ml of oil. I should be getting the oil and carbon this week.



After a few weeks, when it's turned red-brown-whiskey colored, shake & pour a little bit into a clear glass test tube and hold it up to a bright light to look for any "floaters." Put a drop on your fingertip and rub between your thumb to see if you feel any grit. If so, go back to shaking your bottle(s) for a few more days.

The icing on the cake. Thanks!

[hav]

Thanks for that Howard. I'm not sure why the whole process went rather smoothly for Trance. Yesterday I purchased a gram of carbon 60 fullerenes online, I was planning to follow his lead. Based on you're experience, I'm not so sure I should attempt to do this.

I don't think our observations are that different. I've just demonstrated that just because I get no settling after additional crushing and magnetic stirring for 2 weeks, that it doesn't mean all the c60 is actually dissolved and not in suspension. That was predicted by others and attributed to Brownian motion of such small c60 particles. I imagine that the filtering I do isn't getting all the undissolved c60 particles out either. Just the bigger ones. And maybe the crushing step puts more undissolved material into the final mix than starting the mix process with larger grains of c60 that either dissolve or get filtered.

Howard

Edited by hav, 09 January 2013 - 03:21 PM.

[motorcitykid]

Thanks for that Howard. I'm not sure why the whole process went rather smoothly for Trance. Yesterday I purchased a gram of carbon 60 fullerenes online, I was planning to follow his lead. Based on you're experience, I'm not so sure I should attempt to do this.

And maybe the crushing step puts more undissolved material into the final mix than starting the mix process with larger grains of c60 that either dissolve or get filtered.

Howard

I see what you mean

[hardrain]

Im a nube here and cannot post any links yet, but months ago I read a doc that said the particle size is very important for benificial results. May of just been part of the pitch to prevent homebrewers, dont know. Supposetly the suspention your looking for is much, much smaller than the eye can see. Hence the centrifugation. I have found new magnetic stirrers online for like $80. bucks. I am aware of filters that go down to .2 micron but they are not metal or flat, and would probibly clog and waste product. A flat mesh filter could be back flushed and reinserted into olive oil for longer assimilation in the olive oil. The smallest metal screens I could find were 149 micron and werent actually a mesh screen, but made from a thin solid sheet of metal with holes put into it, if anyone cares.