Short version: Take choline with ALCAR. Help me figure out if it's worth adding lecithin, chelated calcium, DMAE and vitamin B to this combo. Caffiene and suger destroy choline. Signs that you have taken too much choline are sore muscles and depression. Signs you aren’t taking enough include impaired cognition and problems with memory (including brain fog); headache, fatigue, insomnia, poor ability of the kidneys to concentrate urine. The right amount of choline increases the number of dopamine receptors and your memory (This is discussed in more detail in the uridine thread). Some people get a fishy smell on choline; eat more yogurt and fiber if this happens. Take choline in the morning, as you want low choline levels while sleeping.
Long version: I’ll start with a broad overview, taken from the “Encyclopedia of mind enhancing foods, drugs, and nutritional substances”, ISBN: 0786408537
“Choline, classified as a B vitamin, is a precursor to acetylcholine, an important neurotransmitter that aids memory, learning, and mental alertness, and is necessary in maintaining cell membrane fluidity. It works with inosi-tol to emulsify fats and cholesterol, and seems to have a synergistic effect with nootropic drugs... There are at least three different forms of choline — choline bitartrate, choline chloride, and phosphatidylcholine (or pure lecithin) — all of which may enhance memory, though phosphatidylcholine is a necessary component of every cell membrane in the body and is believed to have the best memory-boosting effect.
Food Sources: Very little free choline is found in foods, most of what we get being in the form of lecithin: beans, Brazil nuts, brewer's yeast, cabbage, cauliflower, cheese, dandelion flowers, egg yolks, fenugreek, fish, liver, meat, peanuts, peas, poppyseeds, seed oils, soybeans, green leafy vegetables, and wheat germ. Soybean oil is the best source, containing 2 percent lecithin and supplying both essential fatty acids (Omega-3 [9 percent] andOmega-6 [57 percent]), unlike most other oils, which only supply Omega-6.
Effects: Reportedly improves memory in healthy people. One study found that MIT students showed a greater ability to recall a list of words after taking 3 grams a day; in fact, an improved memory can usually result after only a few days of taking choline or lecithin. Though Alzheimer's patients suffer from a deficiency of acetylcholine in the brain, attempts to reverse the symptoms (loss of memory, judgment, and orientation, for example) with supplements of phosphatidylcholine or choline have proved disappointing. Both have been shown to be effective treatments for bipolar disorder (manic- depression) in those individuals who have shown little or no improvement with standard drugs such as lithium... phosphatidylcholine with unsaturated fatty acids may also play an anti-aging role by keeping cell membranes fluid, as a decrease in phosphatidylcholine and an increase in cholesterol as a consequence of aging makes these membranes more rigid. It is this same imbalance of the two that creates gallstones, and it is believed that supplementation may prevent such stones from forming, though this has yet to be proven.
Precautions: Choline should not be taken by those who are manic-depressive, as it may worsen the depression (even those who aren't manic-depressive may experience depression if taking doses in the range of 20 grams a day), nor should it be taken by those with Parkinson's disease, epilepsy, or those taking prescription anticholinergic drugs. Those with gastric ulcers or a history of ulcers should only take choline under a doctor's orders.
Certain forms of choline, such as choline bitartrate and choline chloride can cause a fishy body odor and diarrhea, especially if more than 16 grams a day are taken. The body odor and diarrhea are often the result of intestinal bacteria breaking down the choline into trimethylamine (though liver disease may also be a cause), and may be prevented by eating yogurt, eating a high-fiber diet, or drinking acidophilus milk. Other overdose symptoms include nausea, vomiting, and dizziness. Choline can also cause muscle tension, a stiff neck, headaches, restlessness, insomnia, and gastric cramps.
Very high doses of choline over an extended period of time may produce a vitamin B-6 deficiency.
There is no known toxicity level for choline.
Choline and lecithin can be destroyed by alcohol, estrogen, food processing, refined flour, refined sugar, sulfa drugs, and water. Consuming large amounts of caffeine (coffee, tea, soft drinks) can deplete the amount of inos-itol in the body.
Choline may interact with antide-pressant drugs and morphine.
Dosage: Phosphatidylcholine is more beneficial when consumed in foods that have polyunsaturated fatty acids (e.g., soybeans and soybean products, cauliflower, cabbage) than in foods that are high in saturated fatty acids (e.g., egg yolk, meat, and other animal products). The intake of phosphatidylcholine by the average American is 3.1 g/day, or 300 mg of choline; this is higher than that consumed by Europeans, but may still be too low, according to some. The RDAs of both have not been established, and much research needs to be done in this area. Recommended dosage is 2.5 to 3 g/day in three to four divided doses; other B vitamins, including 1 gram of B-5, should be taken with any form of choline or lecithin to help convert them to acetylcholine. Sheldon Saul Hendler, M D., Ph.D., states that up to 10 g/day of phosphatidylcholine or 1 g/day of choline can be taken without side effects. If taking lecithin, a supplement of chelated calcium should also be taken to keep a stable balance of phosphorus and calcium in the body. Dharma Singh Khalsa, M.D., also recommends taking DMAE with lecithin, despite the fact that it may be too stimulating for some people. Lecithin has a time-release effect, so it is only necessary to take it twice a day, though the dose may have to be larger, as most supplements only contain 10 to 20 percent phosphatidylcholine (look for supplements that contain at least 35 percent phosphatidylcholine).”
(Note:Phosphatidylserine (PS) is one of the four main phospho-lipids found in lecithin; the others are phosphatidylcholine (PC), phosphati-dylethanolamine (PE), and phosphatidylinositol (PI). )
Previous thread on choline increasing dopamine receptor density.
http://www.longecity...ptor-densities/
More info can be found in uridine discussion. A rather long discussion.
http://www.longecity...ne-uridine-dha/
Take choline in the morning. Low choline levels during sleep are important for long term memory consolidation.
http://www.longecity...-choline-supps/
(Personal note: When i took choline at night I remembered my dreams better.)
A quick overview of ALCAR, once again taken from the handy Encyclopedia:
“Effects: Chemically related to choline, ALCAR has many of the same effects. It acts as an anti-oxidant; increases the levels of choline acetyl-transferase in the brain; transports fats into the mitochondria, the part of the cell which creates energy; enhances communication between the brain's hemispheres; reduces triglyceride levels and removes ketones (fat waste products) from the blood; helps control hypoglycemia; alleviates angina attacks; and has been used in the treatment of diabetes, infertility, liver disease, and kidney disease. It may help fight cancer by boosting the effect of lymphocytes, white blood cells that serve the immune system. It also slows down the cell damage caused by age- related conditions and may accelerate the repair of damaged DNA in cells ravaged by free radicals. It may help protect the brain from the effects of aging by preventing the accumulation of lipofuscin in the brain. Studies have shown that doses of anywhere from 2000 to 3500 mg a day can slow the onset of Alzheimer's and mental deterioration, specifically memory, attention, language ability, alertness, motor activities, and spatial abilities, though it may take up to six months to begin to work. Long- chain acetylcar-nitines (LCACs) work counter to ALCAR, preventing the transportation of fats to the mitochondria and suppressing membrane enzymes.
It works synergistically with pho-phatidylserine.” (It seems pho-phatidylserine is the same thing as phosphatidylserine. Please let me know if this is wrong.)
We already know that Alcar and Choline work synergistically together; ALCAR contributes the Acetyl group to ACh, and choline adds 2nd half, so using both is synergistic. So how does PS fit into this? Is it a worthwhile addition, or a waste of our time?
There's been one study done so far, which showed that a combination of alpha-lipoic acid, acetyl-L-carnitine, glycerophosphocoline, docosahexaenoic acid, and phosphatidylserine reduces oxidative damage to murine brain and improves cognitive performance.
https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/19185780
Past discussions: http://www.longecity...ne-dha-complex/
Well, I’ve got to get to bed. I’m kinda busy tomorrow, but if no one else knows the answer I’ll try and figure it out on wednesday. I'm hoping to order something new by this weekend, and I'm considering lecithin, chelated calcium, DMAE and vitamin B, as they are all recommended.
