32 replies to this topic

[BigJohn]

Hi everyone,

I was wondering if any of you actually physically "feel" any of the nootropics or racetams when you take it. I can "feel" a heightened sense of alertness depending on how much sleep I get, as for memory effects I notice subtle changes but nothing extraordinary. I am now considering taking stronger experimental nootropics such as coluracetam, unifiram, or sunifram because I am not seeing radical improvements for the amount of money I am spending on these nootropics. I stay away from noopept because of the reported sexual side effects that I have read on these forums associated with noopept. My current stack is as follows:

Morning Stack:

Piracetam- 1000 mg
Oxiracetam- 800 mg
Sulbutiamine- 200 mg
Aniracetam- 500 mg
Vinpocetine- 20mg
CDP Choline- 250 mg
Choline Bitartrate- 800 mg

Afternoon Stack

Piracetam- 1000 mg
Oxiracetam- 800 mg
CDP Choline- 250 mg
Aniracetam- 500 mg
Choline Bitartrate- 600 mg
Vinpocetine- 20 mg
Sulbutiatmine- 200 mg
Rhodiola Rosea- 400 mg

[moleface]

I feel mine, though they're definitely subtle. I think that has a lot to do with why so many people claim to be nonresponders to racetams - they're looking for something far more overt than these drugs provide. I believe that if someone's in tune with their body and mind, they'll be far more likely to notice these effects vs someone who's looking for a substance to beat them over the brain with a pronounced "buzz".

For me the sensory effects are the most noticeable aspect of these drugs - colors are more vivid and music sounds more lush. Video games (especially gorgeous stylized ones like the Bioshock series) look like I'm dipping into a hallucinatory neon dream world. Everyday life looks like it's had its color levels slightly tweaked with digital postprocessing. It's really beautiful.

I'm hoping that a year long run on nootropics will somehow "train" my brain to see the world this way all the time. If not, I'm hesitant to ever stop taking racetams. I did the same thing with marijuana in the past - originally i was obsessively infatuated with MJ's music enhancing effects and I never wanted to stop smoking and risk lose that heightened appreciation for sound. But after smoking regularly for a few years, I decided to go completely sober but I actually still retained that deeper three dimensional appreciation for music. It makes me suspect that this bright vivid way of looking at the world that's brought out by racetams might be within my power to achieve on my own if I realign my mode of thought in a certain way.

Haha - it's clear from my post that adrafinil and racetams are making me slightly manic. There's nothing wrong with that though, as long as I don't act self destructive or start getting delusions about being the messiah or something.

Edited by moleface, 13 March 2013 - 11:44 PM.

[Inoxia]

I'm on day 10 of noopept. It's definitely the nootropic with the most apparent effect i ever tryed.

No sexual side effects so far, maybe the opposite lol. Definitely it doesn't do nothing to testosterone. I don't have that high of a T level to begin with, so i would definitely feel if it suddenly decreased. That's not the case, believe me. What i believe it's that someone here had some sexual problems and attribuited it to noopept, then all the other people were caught in placebo. This is the only place that mention sexual problem with noopept. There isn't any study that mention that side effect. The sexual side we're reported to fade after 2 days off noopept, so it's not a big deal aniway, try it before deciding it's not for you, it's like 15 dollars for 250 day supply on ebay.

Blood Pressure could be a concern. I'm actually measuring mine nine times a day to see if there are complications, but so far so good.

All in all if you want something you can feel definitely try it. If you take it, take it orally (not sublingually) like it was meant to be taken, and don't excede the 30 mg/day. I bet you wouldn't feel any side effect if you take it like this.

Cheers

Edited by Inoxia, 14 March 2013 - 01:15 PM.

[BigJohn]

moleface, very nice quality post. I notice very subtle effects but for the price I am starting to wonder if the effects are even worth it. I do not really notice extremely significant memory effects other than remembering my dreams every night (at least I know it is doing something). I am a little reluctant to try the more experimental nootropics such as coluracetam, sunifiram, unifiram and all those because of the lack of information out there on these compounds (although I assume they are safe). I am just looking for a noticable apparent improvement in memory. I have been considering using adrafinal, but I am wary because of the strain it puts on your kidneys. How do tyou find the adrafinil works in conjunction with the racetams? What is your current stack?

Inoxia, nice reply as well, I might raise my dosage of noopept as well I just did not want to risk any sexual side effects. Do you notice huge memory improvements off of it?

[Inoxia]

Well, i was going to write a post with my experience in one or two weeks to summarize the effect i felt from the noopept, and to gather more subjective data with firther experimentation, but as off now i noticed:

- Mood improvement. It changed the way i approach things and situations. I feel more social and i find i tolerate stress better.
- Better dream vividness and recall.
- Sometimes i remember fragments or entire dreams out of the blue lot of hours after wake up (never happened to me so must be the noo)

Actually im unemployed so i can't really say how much it improve functioning during stresfull work situations or long study sessions, but i suppose the memory improvement it's here. You see, i think i done lot of harm to my brain with polydrug use in my early teens. I do a lot of stupid disattention mistakes, like for example putting pasta in the fridge without thinking, or i can't recall names of people for the life of me first time i know them. Nootropic use surely ameliorated the situation. Now, in the cambridge brain sciences test on the web i scored 61% in short therm memory, 1% in reasoning ability, and 7% in verbal intelligence, where the lower number is better, if you're unfamiliar with the test. I can't recall exactly what the result were six months ago when i wasn't using noots, but they definitely are improved 10-15% in all areas.

Also, those i wrote are the 3 most visible improvements noopept alone made, but keep in my mind i fell overall a lot more benefits that i cant exactly pinpoint to a precise drug.

My stack currently is:

8-10 mg Noopept x 2 (morning and afternoon)
500-750 mg Aniracetam (afternoon)
Citicoline 250 mg 1 or 2x depending if im feeling an headache or not (yeah, noopept it's the only racetam that caused me headaches.. i see i have a pretty different experience with it than the average user of the forum here)
500-750 mg of ALCAR everytime i take citicoline
Caffeine when i need it

on workout days:

L-Taurine, Glucuronolactone, B-Alanine, L-Aspartic Acid, L-Tyrosine, DMAE Bitartrate, Caffeine Anhydrous, L-Theanine, Creatine, Citrulline, Carnitine-L-Tartrate, Glycobol and Agmatine (dont know exact dosages, it's a proprietary blend).

So yeah, i definitely feel an improvement but keep in mind i take a lot of other things besides noopept. Hope this help, stay tuned for a more in depth review that i will post in the near future here in the forum.

Cheers

Edited by Inoxia, 15 March 2013 - 09:18 AM.

[moleface]

moleface, very nice quality post. I notice very subtle effects but for the price I am starting to wonder if the effects are even worth it. I do not really notice extremely significant memory effects other than remembering my dreams every night (at least I know it is doing something). I am a little reluctant to try the more experimental nootropics such as coluracetam, sunifiram, unifiram and all those because of the lack of information out there on these compounds (although I assume they are safe). I am just looking for a noticable apparent improvement in memory. I have been considering using adrafinal, but I am wary because of the strain it puts on your kidneys. How do tyou find the adrafinil works in conjunction with the racetams? What is your current stack?

I take 5g of piracetam 2x a day, along with 50mg of noopept and 2g of aniracetam once daily.

I'm probably going to change that to 1g of aniracetam and 25 mg of noopept 2x a day. That way I'll be taking two doses of all three nootropics.

I started low with piracetam and found that the threshold for noticeable effects was around 3g for me, but upping it to 5g has a far more pronounced nootropic effect for me.

I find that the adrafinil perfectly complements the other nootropics. Everything together feels like some sort of semi-miraculous anti-"ADHD" medication, at least from my experience. I have SEVERE attention deficit issues caused by an anxiety disorder stemming from PTSD, and normally I can't even watch television shows or read books without my mind involuntarily going in a hundred different directions at once and "playing" over whatever I'm trying to pay attention to. I'm an intelligent and very literate person, but I read at a snail's pace as the result of my anxiety. Within a few days of adding adrafinil to my stack, I read 1/3 of a novel at about a page a minute, which is rare for me. I'm quite sure it wasn't placebo, since I didn't expect any sort of added focus from the adrafinil at that point. I'd been taking it for the better part of a week and I'd only noticed a spike in energy, so that's all I was expecting the drug to provide. Then I was at school and suddenly found myself able to read a novel for the first time in more than half a decade.

Anyway - what you get out of the racetams is probably dependent on your own mindset and how in tune you are with your own mind and body. I used to be unable to discern the effects of subtle drugs, but a few years ago I had a major paradigm shift and now I'm able to clearly identify the psychoactive effects of even minor herbs like valerian or chamomile. If you aren't able to do that, you might find yourself disappointed with the racetams. Trust me though - they DO work. It might just take some time to get a handle on the experience provided by the drugs.

I've given this advice countless times on here, but to repeat myself yet again - try just taking the nootropics and then forgetting about them. Don't think about them at all, don't look for effects, don't fixate on whether or not you think you "feel" something. Just take it daily for awhile, and then look back in retrospect and try to identify ways that your mindset and cognitive performance differed from a normal week.

Edited by moleface, 16 March 2013 - 06:47 PM.

[BigJohn]

thanks for the advice!

[valkyr]

don't fixate on whether or not you think you "feel" something. Just take it daily for awhile, and then look back in retrospect and try to identify ways that your mindset and cognitive performance differed from a normal week.

That was spot on. People seem to forget that a nootropic is not supposed to make you high. Prerequisites for intelligence are mental equilibrium and balance, not some euphoric hyped-up state that many seem to be looking for as proof that their stack is 'working'. Also, the more pronounced the effect, the more unsustainable it is likely to be since the body will fight its way back to homeostasis. Bigger effects may also mean less balance - e.g. higher performance in some tasks offset by lower performance in others. So, in this sense, less may be more.

I used to doubt, for example, that Acetyl L-Carnitine did anything useful. However, after taking it on and off for a couple of months I noticed that when I was on it I would get things done and be much more active, whereas off it I would be rather lethargic and lazy. It was a clear improvement, but one that you would not have noticed by looking at how you felt after taking it.

It also has a lot to do with expectations. We're not gonna get an NZT-48 anytime soon and there are many limitations to what you can safely do with chemicals, especially when aiming for sustainability of effects.

Edited by valkyr, 17 March 2013 - 09:31 PM.

[lifeisabeach]

I cant say I "feel" them, however my mind is just constantly more spot-on. I am quicker to respond to answers clearly, my vocabulary is more adept, I think more outwardly, and I can recall more of recent topics studied. It's great to apply it socially, and I think thats where I pick up on it mostly. I can't point my finger to any one stack however, because I take multiple nootroptics and a few other types of enhancers (EPA, cholines, lions mane, and cerebral vasodilators) so all together, they make me feel young and less foggy!

[BigJohn]

Excellent advice valkyr. I read so many posts about people actually physically feeling their nootropics and I have not seen any radical changes in my memory or anything like that. It may have something to do with me being 20 and being close to peak mental performance but I will continue to pay attention to my body and monitor what changes I see. I do not think I'l be experimenting with those "unknown" nootropics that I listed at the top of the post because I am uncertain about their safety.

lifeisabeach, I do notice that I am quicker to respond in social situations as well!

[krsna]

I get noopept-high every day. I actually suffer cravings when I try to skip a day, physical cravings like for chocolate cake or caffeine. After pouring the mushroomy goodness under my tongue I am instantly wafted with a rush of blood to the brain, which feels almost euphoric.

[valkyr]

I do notice that I am quicker to respond in social situations as well!

In my rather short experience with piracetam, this is probably the most pronounced effect. The jury's still out on intelligence, but as a social lubricant it works wonders! I noticed it today too. It was also unexpected, which lends more credence to the theory that it is not in any way placebo-related. It's not what I was looking for ... but serendipity is always welcomed

I get noopept-high every day.

I'm curios, what doses are you currently taking? And has this euphoric effect been sustainable? Have you been experiencing this for a long time?

I was thinking of trying noopept at some point, but I would rather avoid anything that causes addiction, even if it's the mild caffeine-like variety.

Edited by valkyr, 18 March 2013 - 11:46 AM.

[krsna]

50mg/day. Yes the euphoric effect has been from day 1 to present, some days more present than others. I've taken noopept for nearly two months.

I wouldn't worry about addiction, honestly, I'm a very addictive personality by nature, I don't think it's typical to get this way with this stuff. A certain form of psychological dependency however is probably normal with anything which provides immense benefits. If you can take something and suddenly you feel immensely better and function better then to stop taking it will feel very limiting and self-defeating, creating a form of dependency. I would say the psychological dependency is a far greater factor in my addiction than any sort of cravings I might feel, the cravings are just a sort of mechanism which has developed by my associating the taste/smell/ritual of the experience with the mild euphoric headrush I get and the overall positive feelings it gives me. All of this being said, quitting this would be easier than quitting caffeine, much easier.

[Jonathan Moy de Vitry]

Hi!

I'm a super-responder. Can feel the effects of many racetams, particularly aniracetam, minutes after I take them. Really, minutes...
And I'm definitely not taking large doses either (500mg in the case of aniracetam).

[krsna]

Hi!

I'm a super-responder. Can feel the effects of many racetams, particularly aniracetam, minutes after I take them. Really, minutes...
And I'm definitely not taking large doses either (500mg in the case of aniracetam).

are you taking choline with your racetams? there's so much conflicting information out there, i have an order of piracetam on the way to try for the first time but im hoping to avoid using a choline supplement. with noopept i never needed choline, but noopept seems a bit different than classic racetams so im not sure.

[BigJohn]

Hi!

I'm a super-responder. Can feel the effects of many racetams, particularly aniracetam, minutes after I take them. Really, minutes...
And I'm definitely not taking large doses either (500mg in the case of aniracetam).

are you taking choline with your racetams? there's so much conflicting information out there, i have an order of piracetam on the way to try for the first time but im hoping to avoid using a choline supplement. with noopept i never needed choline, but noopept seems a bit different than classic racetams so im not sure.

If you are taking a stack that is heavy on the racetams, than I would suggest taking choline because racetams deplete acteylcholine from your brain which is an essential neurotransmitter. If you are just taking piracetam I wouldn't worry about it because piracetam is pretty weak, but if you are mixing different higher potency racetams than yes, take your choline

[hswonline]

Cholines are definitely recommended when taking racetams.

Right now I (personally) am only taking Noopept, which does not require Choline like the others (though is often considered a racetam by some). I do not "feel" effects, but I'm certainly more alert and more productive than I was prior to taking it.

I will say though, I've been tempted to delve into more racetams once I'm finished my Noopept experiment.

- Crystal

[Guacamolium]

Pyritinol hits me like a shot of brain lasers. Quicker reaction times. Sharper colors, lines. Socially better.

There was one time a bought "vinpocetine" from 1fast400, and within minutes colors and lines were sharper, like REALLY more color contrast and line sharpness, it was weird. I then bought another bottle from them and from Source Naturals and never felt a thing from vinpocetine ever again.

I deduced, that it was Vincamine I was on, but I couldn't validate that because Vincamine manufacturing halted completely due to the success of vinpocetine. There was no Vincamine to be had....

[BigJohn]

Pyritinol hits me like a shot of brain lasers. Quicker reaction times. Sharper colors, lines. Socially better.

There was one time a bought "vinpocetine" from 1fast400, and within minutes colors and lines were sharper, like REALLY more color contrast and line sharpness, it was weird. I then bought another bottle from them and from Source Naturals and never felt a thing from vinpocetine ever again.

I deduced, that it was Vincamine I was on, but I couldn't validate that because Vincamine manufacturing halted completely due to the success of vinpocetine. There was no Vincamine to be had....

Hey I am considering pyritinol but I have heard some concerning things regarding its safety, can you attest to that?

[valkyr]

Apparently pyritinol causes some sort of immune reaction in some people. It's a bit over my head and I don't have the time to research it right now, but from what I understand it is: 1) a rare side effect 2) very noticeable if it happens, so you would know right away if you need to stop taking (no long term hidden damage). Here's a case study where it lead to pancreatitis (inflammation of the pancreas).

Edited by valkyr, 21 March 2013 - 06:59 AM.

[Mind]

I use caffeine (coffee and tea) and chocolate primarily. I do easily notice the effects.

[brainslugged]

Racetams are the only thing that I use daily, and I don't really feel a strong effect from them normally. When first starting them after breaks, I feel something that lasts for a month or so, and I notice the effects sometimes, but I don't feel like I am on something. It doesn't feel like if I take a lot of caffeine and feel significantly altered. In other words, it doesn't put me in a significantly altered state of consciousness other than piracetam for the first month or so.

Oxiracetam seems to have *some* feelable affects, notably in color perception, but it is very minor, and I can't say that I notice it daily.

Pseudoephedrine (in the form of Zyrtec-D) combined with piracetam is one that you can certainly feel, and I feel even more altered on it than I do on high doses of caffeine (which, to be clear, I have only taken a few times because it has a negative effect on me). It has a paradoxical anti-obsessive, pain relieving, and calming while stimulating effect on me with mild anti-anxiety effects and an almost insignificant effect on attention and motivation. It increases confidence slightly, and I seem to do better on tests while on it, and it almost completely reduces fatigue related to lack of sleep, with the only side effects being dry eyes and mouth. Strangely, I feel like it helps sleep quality, and I fall asleep quicker on it than off it. It is certainly drug-like. It sounds crazy that OTC medicine has such an effect, but when combined with piracetam, it truly turns into a drug. Tolerance also builds quickly (almost full tolerance to a single pill after a few weeks of 1 pill every 12 hrs, and return to baseline tolerance after about a week or sometimes more). There are only mild withdrawal effects which is sleeping for a long time after stopping (I normally sleep about 12-15 hrs on the first day that I stop taking it or if I forget to take it for a night). I am still trying to figure out my romance with it, as the tolerance is expensive and I figure it can't be too good for me to go to almost 500mg per day. If you could find a way to counter the tolerance, it would be the most "feel"y nootropic that there is.

Theanine is the only other nootropic that has had a definite effect on me, but it is weak.

I am trying out phenibut but it is a slow process of finding the right dosage since tolerance builds so quickly. So far, at the 500mg dose I took yesterday, I haven't felt significantly altered by it.

Also, I found that rosea has absolutely NO effect on me at all. Even though it is claimed to be great and stimulating, I feel absolutely nothing for it. I feel very little from sulbutiamine, and it is not a good, stimulant effect like what seems to be normal.

I've never felt anything at all from choline except when countering racetam tired feelings from overdose.

Edited by brainslug, 21 March 2013 - 10:00 PM.

[hswonline]

I stopped taking Noopept this week. It worked great for my focus, but (as I've read has happened for others as well) I think it prompted more anxiety in me than it should. Either that or I'm even more busy than I thought

When I feel the anxiety coming on. L-Theanine has been a huge asset, so I'm keeping that around. But I'm also thinking of trying out some Alpha GPC. I'm mainly trying to achieve more productivity both at work and home, better memory/concentration, etc. It's nice to be able to try out different supplements here at work and find out what works best for me.

[Jonathan Moy de Vitry]

Hi!

I'm a super-responder. Can feel the effects of many racetams, particularly aniracetam, minutes after I take them. Really, minutes...
And I'm definitely not taking large doses either (500mg in the case of aniracetam).

are you taking choline with your racetams? there's so much conflicting information out there, i have an order of piracetam on the way to try for the first time but im hoping to avoid using a choline supplement. with noopept i never needed choline, but noopept seems a bit different than classic racetams so im not sure.

I take choline only when I get the headache, every few days or so. In the beginning had been taking bitartrate with every dose of racetams and would often get brain fog.

[rc897]

I feel them, currently taking:

Aniracetam 750mg X2 day
Sulbutiamine 400-700mg day

Sometimes choline 250mg if I am getting a headache and sometimes I take focus formula with the above, which I really like. The Sulbut is tricky to get the right dosage too much and I am edgy- agitated.

I get a kind of light pressure in my head, and sometimes I get a transformative effect quite quickly (30-45min) after I take ana or the focus form.
It definitely feels like I took something- mind you I am quite sensitive to drugs (don't do pot anymore or other stuff) and can feel melatonin come on.

The other day when I took the above I ended up writing a 3400 word formal board proposal in a couple hours which surprised me.

The other thing you have to take into account is a lot of people here seem to be taking anti-D's or have depression, mental illness, unemployed, etc- which will skew a normalized feed back. I have no issues like that.


(I do think its good that people with problems are exploring alternatives and doing the right thing by helping themselves but they should disclose that they are on XYZ or have XZY problem- especially when they are commenting on different nootropics, etc)

[adiosameobas]

When I first took Piracetam, I took a rather large dose, I noticed low bass frequencies were much "heavier". That was my initial reaction. I had also read a great deal in depth about what I should be expecting, as far as effects from the various nootropics I was ingesting--so it is hard to tell whether or not I was 'feeling' true effects, or placebo. I will say however, that since I have started in various experimentation's with nootropics both of the supplemental and pharmaceutical variety, my concentration, organizational skills, and motivation have increased dramatically. Like has been stated, I was looking for a 'high' when i started but settled for a light dusting of intrigue in my everyday life.

Edited by adiosameobas, 27 April 2013 - 09:46 PM.

[helluva nootro]

Without trying to wander of the topic. Its a shame your not getting any high or rush from your stack, it looks like you have quite a good setup and obviously it is costing you a fair amount. I must ask is this the only stack you have tried? Have you tried many other nootropics or does your stack include all you are familiar with.... I also would second what some of the other users said, I have taken noopept on and off for quite a while and have even gone as high as mega dosing with a few hundred mg and removed choline supplementation to see the results.. Many people think noopept is like piracetam but much stronger, I find its completely different in effect. Piracetam seems to give more drive and tunnel vision focus where as noopept I feel more able to multi task and verbal fluency can improve especially when tired or un-interested in a topic, it just seems to wake you up a little. Do you take your stack for the sole purpose of self improvement? or is it for attempting to treat any conditions? all of this is important

[nuc]

I feel my jaw tightening when i hit big doses or multiple doses of noopept, oxi and cdp choline. If i add modafinil to the mix, i feel like completely wired. But check this out... At doses of 3-4g cdp choline, 60-100mg noopept, 1200-1600mg oxiracetam and 100mg modafinil my heart rate was 50 bpm and my blood pressure was like 128/78. I feel like i'm on some sort of crack cocaine, but my body is telling me different. Wierd isn't it? The other things that are quite amazing is that i don't feel like smoking, vaporizing anything at all. In fact if i do, it ruins the stack and makes me feel like i got caught in the rain. I also seem to want to eat only healthy stuff, there are times i'm cycling a month off the stuff and i just feel like getting high and playing games all day, not study, make excuses for myself and eat tons of junk food knowing it's all bad to me, but as soon as i'm on this stack i feel like i'm back to normal, like how i was brought up as an obedient child in the family making his parents proud always studying and getting good grades. lol.... Racetams reset me back to myself without all the bad habbits, evil intents and influences i picked up from other people. You "feel" me?

[BigJohn]

Interesting post nuc

[nuc]

You have plenty of racetams in your stack, try noopept on it's own and you'll see the difference between your stack and just noopept.