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9-me-BC Regeneration of dopaminergic neurons?

dopamine parkinsons adhd nootropic anhedonia

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#61 nightlight

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 04:38 PM

Are You sure that certainly 9-me-BC is contained in cigarette smoke and coffee and that this is present in such quantities, to increase Neuroprotection against e.g Parkinson ?
Because there are various forms of beta carbolines

 

 

The neuro-protective effects of tobacco smoke against Parkinson's (and Alzheimer's) are among the few of its beneficial effects striking enough to be be reluctantly acknowledged even under the present pharma bought anti-tobacco (or generally, anti-substances not patented by the pharma) Lysenkoism of the western medicine. Whether it is 9-me-BC or some other beta carboline with similar neuro-protective effect (most likely a synergy of several), it's not what matters in practice to end users, especially considering that the present knowledge of the biochemistry of live organisms is a tip of a tip of the iceberg of what is really going on (despite common pretenses to the contrary).

 

As it is quite often the case with research sponsorship, it may well be that the 9-meBC specific focus is spawned by the reverse-engineering of the mechanisms behind protective effects of tobacco smoke and the resulting search for the patentable analogues of molecules discovered there.


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#62 Flex

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 06:19 PM

thanks



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#63 Metagene

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 10:11 PM

Forgot to post this one:

Beta-carbolines for use in the treatment of hearing loss and vertigo:

http://www.google.co...s/US20130028958
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#64 Cognizant

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Posted 24 August 2014 - 08:47 PM

Any further updates on this? It seems to me that this compound could be quite the panacea for certain people, depending on the method of action . 



#65 serp777

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Posted 24 August 2014 - 09:24 PM

also it smells/looks exactly like DMT, makes sense I guess.

 

So can you put it in a crack pipe and smoke it lol? 



#66 Metagene

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Posted 27 August 2014 - 03:29 PM

Any further updates on this? It seems to me that this compound could be quite the panacea for certain people, depending on the method of action . 

 

I want to confer with golden1 to compare notes but here's the run down.

 

Minimal improvement in Cambridge scores as anticipated.

 

Not too keen on 9-me-BC as a stimulant but I didn't care for selegiline much either. 

 

I drank a fair amount of wine about 6 hours after my last 20mg dose without any discernible impairment. My weight fluctuates between 130-145 pounds so 2 glasses on a empty stomach is usually enough to get a little buzzed. The same trick didn't work so well the next day but the effects of the wine seemed to come on slower.

 

Since Monday I've started using 10mg memantine with 30mg of Adderall and only experienced minor "brain fog". (That term might be an overstatement)  Other than that I feel absolutely fantastic. I heard horror stories about memantine causing debilitating brain fog for weeks or months but none of that here. I can't say if this is from 9-me-BC use or just me at the moment. 

 

It appears Teamtlr will eventually have 9-me-BC in stock. I don't use them personally, just FYI.


Edited by Metagene, 27 August 2014 - 03:38 PM.

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#67 golden1

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Posted 27 August 2014 - 04:06 PM

^ I have to try it out again when I am not taking anything else.  On the plus side, I can say that I did not get Parkinson's or any negative effects.



#68 intension

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Posted 10 September 2014 - 05:27 PM

I just want to through my few cents in here. I have been an avid nootropic user for a long time. I also was very hard on my body and brain in my youth (hard drugs). So naturally I have always wanted to 'repair' some of the damage that was done. Unfortunately most nootropics have dissappointed in this aspect. In order to function I have had to rely on adderall for years now. I was taking 50mg a day 2 months ago... 

 

There are a couple of exceptions. Since starting coluracetam I have noticed a few long term benefits I haven't experienced with any other racetam. Then I started nsi-189. It has been a mixed bag. Initially I was hyper emotional like ive heard others mention. It also seems to make me kind of sleepy or work against my adderall.

 

Then I tried 9-mbc. All I can say is Holy Crap! The benefits are so wide ranged and far sweeping I'm really not sure where to start. I have been taking it for about 2-3 weeks.

 

#1) I now take 20mg of adderall a day. And damn does it work well. I went from 50 to 20 in 1 week. and that was after I had to drive for 21 hours straight. Usually my tolerance skyrockets after all-nighters.  I've never reduced my dose that drastically.  I take 30mg 9-mbc along with my nsi-189(20-30mg)  2x/day. Memantine never came close to this kind of reduction in tolerance.  

 

#2) I noticed an immediate improvement of general coordination. I have always been clumsy to the extreme, probably due to my attention span. Suddenly I was able to multitask with my hands without thinking about it. By about day 3 my tremor disappeared. I have noticed much more 'body awareness' lately. When I close my eyes I no longer feel unstable. When I sing I can feel the vibration and can sense when I am on key(very rarely lol). I get tingles and goose bumps when I listen to music or see something cool. These things are all new to me. I am kind of shocked at the improvement

 

#3) Mood. Damn man. I have been dismally anhedonic, depressed, anxious and exhausted for most of my adult life. Satiety... I suddenly felt full somehow, or satisfied. My craving for nicotine and other substances has faded to background noise. Now I dont feel 100% better just by taking this stuff. I can still have a really shitty day. But I do feel REAL potential for a wider range of emotion. I feel at times like Im a teenager again and everything seems new or novel. I now have the option to feel like shit or focus on something positive instead. Before It didn't seem to matter... 

 

I am pretty sure there is a strong synergy between the 9-mbc and the nsi-189. I skipped the nsi for a few days and it was possibly a bit less intense, but its hard to say for sure.  

 

On a weird note, I tried giving the 9-mbc to my mom who has no problems with addiction and doesnt take stimulants. I thought it would make her feel great. For some reason she didn't seem to notice much aside from increased sweating. I gave her pretty high doses too(150mg a day for 3 days). But to be honest she never seems to notice supplements I give her. My brother who has a similar history as mine had a nearly identical response. We will both be taking this stuff for the forseeable future, if finances allow.

 

I do feel I should mention I ordered my products from tht.co, as others have mentioned that they ordered from them. I have to agree with the previous poster that tht.co has gone all out on packaging and presentation of product. Not to mention their price on nsi-189 was 1/3rd of what people were charging on ebay, and it was the phosphate! The completely glass light proof bottle and packaging alone are impressive.  

 

I have made several orders now and what really stands out is the consistency of the product. I have been ordering nootropic powders for a long time. Even the companies I trust seem to have varying product colors, density, moisture content etc. Each bottle usually looks a little different. With tht it has all been exactly identical. When I was nearly out of 9-mbc I ordered pretty late and decided to ask in the notes if they could please expedite my order(this is at midnight on a sunday). My order was picked up by usps at 6:30 am monday morning and was in my hands by wednesday at noon. Pretty damn legit considering I am not a big spender.

 

Oh and on my last order they even sent me a free bottle of a product that I had asked them some questions about.  Thought that was a very personal touch. 

 

I will definately update if anything changes, but thus far this is one of the few nootropics that hasn't pooped out on me and has provided real sustained benefits. Every day really feels a little better than the last. I hope it lasts!

 


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#69 gnappi

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Posted 10 September 2014 - 10:18 PM

I also bought 9-mbc from THTco but I still haven't  received it. Reading your comments I'm even more excited !!!  :)


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#70 Flex

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Posted 10 September 2014 - 10:35 PM

I´m really interrested in Your results.

Please keep me updated.



#71 Introspecta

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 08:47 AM

For some reason this drug and its reports remind me of No Fap(If your familiar). In many cases for people this is what happens  after beating it to porn continously daily it basically screws up your dopamine receptors and when you stop you suddenly start feeling alive, getting goosebumps to good music. Have Passion. Dopamine is a powerful thing. This drug seems promising. I'm sure there is always a downside. What happens when you stop taking it?

 

Have you tried to stop taking it. Is the regeneration of dopiminergic neurons permanent?

 

I plan to sample this compound for the reason that I have used longterm Phenibut for 3 years daily which acts as a dopamine agonist and am prescribed suboxone which is a partial opiate and has an effect on Dopamine. Longeterm Suboxone has led to feelings of apathy, lack of motivation etc.

 

Could this possibly be a drug to help one get offf opiates?


Edited by Introspecta, 11 September 2014 - 08:54 AM.

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#72 Edogawa Rampo

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 11:15 AM

So Tht sells real stuff? Nsi 189? i am sorry for question here.

Edited by Edogawa Rampo, 11 September 2014 - 11:17 AM.


#73 Flex

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 04:05 PM

In the case that You dont get an answer:

Ask the Australians^^

No really, there were a few from Australians and other who looked for a reputable source i.e. tolerant PWAIN world33

 

So You could ask e.g. here:

http://www.longecity...-sources/page-5

 

In regards of the reputability of tht.co, I dont know. But they´ve posted at least analysis results of NSI-189 on their webpage.

Wu han Heng da ( or something like that) seems reputable.

Tolerant has made a independent analysis to check their quality

See the bill in the NSI thread on page 87:

http://www.longecity...-87#entry685492

I guess some pages prior to this, You would find the analysis


Edited by Flex, 11 September 2014 - 04:06 PM.

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#74 Milkyway

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 05:55 PM

What is the human dosage?  Please keep me informed if this helps any.



#75 golden1

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 09:10 PM

the effect shouldn't be permanent, at least mostly not.

http://onlinelibrary...10.06725.x/full

 

" Withdrawal of 9-me-BC partially reverses the stimulation of THir neurons, but constant stimulation is achieved during chronic administration"

 

I did notice some of the same positives to a lesser extent, but like I said I was also taking NSI like the other person, so I can't reliably say it wasn't that.



#76 Milkyway

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 10:14 PM

In reference to intension's comment.  I also take NSI 189 and Coluracetam.  I get some relief from these, but much more is needed.  I didn't burn out my brain with hard drugs but I  do it with Prozac as a  teenager.  The long term effects  of taking Prozac have been worse depression, much worse anhedonia, and often times sheer apathy.  O well.  Anyway I guess I will try this combination too since you have had so much success with it.  I am a little unclear as to what forms of payment THT accepts, it doesn't seem to be paypal.  Also, what dosage of 9-me-BC are you taking?



#77 tjcbs

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Posted 13 September 2014 - 12:54 AM

I received mine two days ago. I've been taking a conservative 5mg/day sublingually.  It is active, IMO. Pleasant stimulation which fades into anxiety a few hours later. I am quite anxious by nature, so take that for what it is worth. 

 

Are you guys taking it orally or sublingually?

 

 


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#78 Aka Poe

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Posted 13 September 2014 - 06:47 PM

 

Golden 1 wrote: Posted 10 August 2014 - 10:02 PM

also it smells/looks exactly like DMT, makes sense I guess.

 

Actually, beta-carbolines are not related to DMT, which is a tryptamine. I think you are referring to Ayahuasca, which is a combination of beta-carbolines and DMT. The natural beta-cabolines are most commonly sourced  from either of two plants which contain either harmine, tetrahydraharmaline or hamaline or all three, which are next combined  with DMT to make it orally active, as DMT is normally destroyed in the gut so  won't pass the gut to the brain without first  temporarily  halting the guts process to break it down.  DMT is not a beta-carboline but a tryptamine and in Ayahuasca brews and instead typically comes from one of several other plants.  DMT also occurs in traces in the human brain, dozens and dozens of plants,  and a wide array of other creatures.  So the smell and appearance of 9 ME beta-carboline in comparison to DMT is likely a coincidence at most.

 

Beta-carbolines such as harmaline from Banisteriopsis caapi are  interesting medicines, can be effective anti-depressants. They  are significantly  sedative rather than stimulating in the way  people here state 9 ME BC is which is curious for a beta-carboline.  I am also wondering  if it is the  MAO inhibiting factor  of beta-carbolines that creates the antidepressant effect of harmine/harmaline? Harmaline and harmine  I believe are  also found in tobacco, and likely compound the effects of nicotine, synergize with it and some say the beta-carbolines also contribute to the addictiveness of cigarettes. Pure nicotine from e-cigs are probably easier to quit than nicotine with harmine brand tobacco cigarettes. One online vendor sells harmine without nicotine e-cigs for this reason, claims they can help one quit smoking. I'd give that a try if I were trying to quit.

 

Of the two, harmaline and harmine, harmaline can be more nauseating, more sedating, so harmine seems the cleaner, better one of the two as a potential anti-depressant. Both are MAO-I so can render oral DMT active.  Both can also cause serious health problems if you eat a lot of tyramine from olives, Herring, some cheeses and other foods. Any MAO_ can also cause life threatening serotonin symptoms if combined with SSRIs, with amphetamines and other drugs.  Reports of such occurances are rare though.

 

The beta-carbolines  are likely to have something to do with the days after anti-depressant afterglow that Ayahuasca users report. On it's own harmine in my experience is not in anyway a nootropic though, instead makes the mind dull, although mood is slightly increased.

 

I imagine 9 ME BC will render oral DMT to pass the gut to the brain, but since it is reportedly dopaminergic it could have effects unlike harmine/harmaline and could possibly be toxic in combination, have not yet heard of anyone combine the two.

 

Pharmacologists have developed other MAO-I drugs as antidepresssants, such as Nardil, Marplan, and Parnate but from many reports people give them up,   due to lethargy and malaise. I think harmine also has this negative.

 

 


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#79 Aka Poe

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Posted 13 September 2014 - 07:34 PM

I am unable to edit my post, I see a few typos. 

 

Just reading that tobacco contains  a few harmala alkaloids, but they are harman and norharmon, not harmaline and harmaline. I believe they are however quite similar in biological action and they are certainly very similar in chemical structure. On another forum which popped  up on the search engine, (I can post no links) someone wrote "I believe harman is MAO-a inhibitor and norharman is MAO-b inhibitor." 

 

Sorry that none of what I wrote  so far adds too much to our understanding of the biological action of 9 methyl beta-carboline.



#80 Flex

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Posted 13 September 2014 - 08:36 PM

Mao could be responsible but nurr1,DAT and so forth maybe also

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/17913302



#81 Introspecta

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Posted 13 September 2014 - 11:57 PM

70mgs 9-methyl b carboline was taken 3 hours after a total of 40mgs adderall was taken. I made a mistake when dosing but it seems no problems have come up yet. I honestly can't tell if its doing anything do to the adderall from today and the night before. This was a mini binge with 140mg adderall taken over 24 hour period. When I realized I miscalculated the capsule weight and took way more than I wanted I was worried. In all honesty it may be just because I was up the night before but 20 mins after ingestion I noticed the comedown smoothing out and feeling actually tired. I was expecting stimulation. Now 4 hours later I'm exhausted and cant pin point any effects aside from leftover stimulation from the adderall.

 

I learned this weekend that I can't take adderall. It completely ruined my plans and made me obssessed with porn. Of course my dosing was high but I had planned to go to a club and 40mgs had me tweeking and a little paranoid 3 hours after dosing. So didn't go to club. Stayed up all night. Called in to work missing overtime. Only postive was I cleaned.

 

I'll report back on 9 methyl when taking standalone. I'm curious if it will help the possible depression I may experience due to this mini binge.


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#82 Flex

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Posted 14 September 2014 - 12:29 AM

Stimulant/Dopamine binge can drive many things against the wall.

I was addicted to porn and to reward

It just jeopardized my daily life, before I got depressed..



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#83 golden1

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Posted 14 September 2014 - 04:31 AM

 

 

Golden 1 wrote: Posted 10 August 2014 - 10:02 PM

also it smells/looks exactly like DMT, makes sense I guess.

 

Actually, beta-carbolines are not related to DMT, which is a tryptamine. I think you are referring to Ayahuasca, which is a combination of beta-carbolines and DMT. The natural beta-cabolines are most commonly sourced  from either of two plants which contain either harmine, tetrahydraharmaline or hamaline or all three, which are next combined  with DMT to make it orally active, as DMT is normally destroyed in the gut so  won't pass the gut to the brain without first  temporarily  halting the guts process to break it down.  DMT is not a beta-carboline but a tryptamine and in Ayahuasca brews and instead typically comes from one of several other plants.  DMT also occurs in traces in the human brain, dozens and dozens of plants,  and a wide array of other creatures.  So the smell and appearance of 9 ME beta-carboline in comparison to DMT is likely a coincidence at most.

 

Beta-carbolines such as harmaline from Banisteriopsis caapi are  interesting medicines, can be effective anti-depressants. They  are significantly  sedative rather than stimulating in the way  people here state 9 ME BC is which is curious for a beta-carboline.  I am also wondering  if it is the  MAO inhibiting factor  of beta-carbolines that creates the antidepressant effect of harmine/harmaline? Harmaline and harmine  I believe are  also found in tobacco, and likely compound the effects of nicotine, synergize with it and some say the beta-carbolines also contribute to the addictiveness of cigarettes. Pure nicotine from e-cigs are probably easier to quit than nicotine with harmine brand tobacco cigarettes. One online vendor sells harmine without nicotine e-cigs for this reason, claims they can help one quit smoking. I'd give that a try if I were trying to quit.

 

Of the two, harmaline and harmine, harmaline can be more nauseating, more sedating, so harmine seems the cleaner, better one of the two as a potential anti-depressant. Both are MAO-I so can render oral DMT active.  Both can also cause serious health problems if you eat a lot of tyramine from olives, Herring, some cheeses and other foods. Any MAO_ can also cause life threatening serotonin symptoms if combined with SSRIs, with amphetamines and other drugs.  Reports of such occurances are rare though.

 

The beta-carbolines  are likely to have something to do with the days after anti-depressant afterglow that Ayahuasca users report. On it's own harmine in my experience is not in anyway a nootropic though, instead makes the mind dull, although mood is slightly increased.

 

I imagine 9 ME BC will render oral DMT to pass the gut to the brain, but since it is reportedly dopaminergic it could have effects unlike harmine/harmaline and could possibly be toxic in combination, have not yet heard of anyone combine the two.

 

Pharmacologists have developed other MAO-I drugs as antidepresssants, such as Nardil, Marplan, and Parnate but from many reports people give them up,   due to lethargy and malaise. I think harmine also has this negative.

 

 

they are related the indole skeleton is right in betacarbolines


Edited by golden1, 14 September 2014 - 04:32 AM.


#84 chris106

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Posted 14 September 2014 - 03:09 PM

70mgs 9-methyl b carboline was taken 3 hours after a total of 40mgs adderall was taken. I made a mistake when dosing but it seems no problems have come up yet. I honestly can't tell if its doing anything do to the adderall from today and the night before. This was a mini binge with 140mg adderall taken over 24 hour period. When I realized I miscalculated the capsule weight and took way more than I wanted I was worried. In all honesty it may be just because I was up the night before but 20 mins after ingestion I noticed the comedown smoothing out and feeling actually tired. I was expecting stimulation. Now 4 hours later I'm exhausted and cant pin point any effects aside from leftover stimulation from the adderall.

 

I learned this weekend that I can't take adderall. It completely ruined my plans and made me obssessed with porn. Of course my dosing was high but I had planned to go to a club and 40mgs had me tweeking and a little paranoid 3 hours after dosing. So didn't go to club. Stayed up all night. Called in to work missing overtime. Only postive was I cleaned.

 

I'll report back on 9 methyl when taking standalone. I'm curious if it will help the possible depression I may experience due to this mini binge.

 

Ha! Reminds me of the "good old days" when I took MPH for the first time and abused the shit out of it.

It's probably for the better - would you have drunken alcohol on top of it, that could have fried some neurons. I'm afraid regular MPH and alcohol use did that for me a few years back. I have recovered by now, but still not quiet at 100%...

I would definetely cut back on the Adderall for the time being, and if possible even use 9-me-BC on it's own - there might be some nasty inteactions. I know it's easier said than done, but rather take it a little slower right now and be safe in the long run!

EDIT: I'll try 9-me-BC next month as well. (Trying one or two other things first) - then I can add another anecdotal report.
From what I've read, the few anecdotal reports that exist right now range from slightly dissapointed to glaring - no real negatives so far!


Edited by chris106, 14 September 2014 - 03:14 PM.


#85 Introspecta

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Posted 14 September 2014 - 09:32 PM

Does anyone know the half life of this? Is twice a day dosing necessary?

 

Day 2-50 mgs,30mgs

 

Woke up extremely tired and slightly depressed after sleeping roughly 12 hours due to being up all night the past night.

 Dosed 50mgs, experienced minor nausea for 20 mins which was unexpected. I had a completely empty stomach. Began noticing subtle mood improvements 1 hour later.Mood improved and energy. I actually started gettting slightly jittery for about 30 mins. I cleaned the bathroom and did some laundry. This is all before taking any caffiene. I then decided to try caffiene with some piracetam and its effects were almost non existant. I'm somewhat tolerant to caffiene though I had a 5 day break followed by 5 days on to reduce tolerance.

 

I took a second dose of 30mgs just to see if it would eliminate any of the fatigue I was experiencing later in the day and also for curiousity sake. It did seem to wake me up slightly though its hard to tell sometimes. You may be staring at a computer and start feeling tired but as soon as you talk a walk away from it and sit back down your fine.

 

I only bought a gram so plan on taking for 1-2 weeks alone with only morning caffiene. I'm hoping this chemical will eliminate some of the anhedonia I'm experiecing from past Phenibut addiction and the recent adderall binge which I'm not happy about. So far so good. Seemed to completely eliminate crash and boost mood considerably. Hopefully this isn't due to adderall still being in my system and it reactivating it. I was taking the 20mg IR so it could all be out by now.

 

 


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#86 meatsauce

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Posted 26 September 2014 - 03:38 AM

Has everybody been getting this from tht.co ?

#87 chris106

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Posted 26 September 2014 - 09:18 AM

Most likely. They are pretty much the only place you can get it from right now.



#88 Introspecta

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Posted 26 September 2014 - 08:39 PM

No more reports I see. Says something about the substance.

 

After continuing to take for 4 days later 30mgs I was not receiving any benefits and didn't want to risk any sort of withdrawal. It seemed to help with the adderall comedown but other than that did nothing. Anyone try this standalone without adderall? I was hoping for energy improvements.



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#89 medicineman

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Posted 26 September 2014 - 08:49 PM

I will be getting 3 grams tomorrow. I will dose daily, 50mgs, off on drinking days, until I'm out. Hope to get something good out of this.

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#90 Milkyway

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Posted 28 September 2014 - 03:24 AM

What is a good human dosage?  How many micrograms in a milligram or a gram?







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