1034 replies to this topic

[old_school]

 

 

 

 

Or they are just anomalies and because it at a point seems to resemble a face morons who need something to want to prove an invisible non existent being will grasp any chance to try to support their nonsense beliefs and claims with any crazy crap they can find

It is so easy to recognize the faces in those photographs that even a child could do it.

Only a childlike mind would then attribute it as a spirit of god ....


Just as faces can been recognised in tree trunks or piles of leaves or any other number of patterns that happen in a physical world does not make them spiritual or god like.

 

 

The face of the spirit is not the Spirit of God. It is probably a human spirit. And he/she is in a chariot of God which is the living work of the Holy Spirit. The orb itself is the chariot, not the spirit within.
 

 

and your proof is………….

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Many people have reported seeing deceased relatives. Also, there are many reports of people seeing Jesus and angels.
 

 

 

 

Also aliens.  Mass sightings of UFOs.

 

And chupacabra.  Nessie.  Mermaids.

 

Demons.  Black magic.  Voodoo miracles.  Chakras.  Mothman (not the movie).

 

Krishna.  Shiva.  Jinn.  Muhammad.

 

Blah blah blah...

 

 

You think Christians are the only ones that see stuff?

 

That's cute.

 

 

So what is your point?  The things you listed are not all the same.  Atheists don't see some things and that makes them....?
 

 

That makes them sane and not gullible 

 

 

It is foolish not to believe in God and His Son Jesus Christ.
 

 

It is foolish to believe anything you post 

 

 

Ignorance is no excuse.

 

Slanderous lying troll.

[The Brain]

Own the ridicule Old Fool, it's yours for a reason

You bring shame to yourself and dirty any sense of credibilty god belief may have built up

[shadowhawk]

Well since the Mockers and others think they have evidence of what an orb is I thought we could address what proof is.  Instead they they as usual go for the ad hominam attacks. 

[shifter]

Slanderous lying troll.

I'm the troll?? I thought there is a lot of negativity in this thread and some people might get a chuckle.

You have just proved yourself a bad Christian. Your comment was judgemental and designed to hurt my feelings. Jesus would be very sad at this. I also request evidence that I'm lying. I would think that would make a bad kite if attempted and you disagree?

You know what? I'll be the better man. I forgive you. Its what a good Christian does. How about you?

Edited by shifter, 13 July 2015 - 07:34 PM.

[The Brain]

I forgive me for being a mocker


Lol

[shadowhawk]

Since you admit to being a mocker, if your apology is sincere you will be forgiven.  If not, then I am not God as we all know.

[Dakman]

So I can rape babies as long as I sincerely apologize then 

[Duchykins]

So I can rape babies as long as I sincerely apologize then 

 

You can kill them too, and then be saved later.

 

 

 

Or...

________

 

Christians tell me children go straight to heaven when they die, no matter what.  Isn't that interesting?

 

Christians also tend to believe that this mortal life is vastly inferior to the afterlife in heaven, which is maximum peace and joy forever.

 

Some Christians don't believe in hell, but many still do, and they like to believe that child killers go straight to hell when they die.  That sucks.

 

BUT there is something special about self-sacrifice.  Self-sacrifice tends to be pleasing to the Christian god, which Christians claim their god rewards with going to heaven.  Altruism is one of the highest virtues.

 

SO

 

Let's say some Christian gets it into his head that this mortal life is inferior to the next immortal one, with all kinds of suffering and risks and who knows what, including many chances for children to grow up and make mistakes that could get them sent to hell.  So this guy, who loves children so much and wants the very best for them, kills them so they can skip all the nastiness and risk and go straight to God in heaven which is the absolutely best place to be.  

 

He kills the children knowing that he taking a huge risk at getting himself condemned to hell for eternity, which is quite a long time to be suffering.  But he considers this willing sacrifice of one person to be worth getting all these children to heaven.  Eternal punishment; is there a greater sacrifice to be made by anyone?  This would be the most altruistic act any person could do.

 

______

 

Why don't more Christians do this?  Because their social mammalian instincts override this level of depravity that is theoretically well within the bounds of Christian doctrine.  Because they're a little bit more moral than their religion, in spite of their religion.  Because they don't really believe most of what they preach.  

[shadowhawk]

So I can rape babies as long as I sincerely apologize then 

 

Christians believe God can forgive anyone who sincerely repents.  No, you cannot rape babies because you can repent. 
 

[shadowhawk]

 

So I can rape babies as long as I sincerely apologize then 

 

You can kill them too, and then be saved later.

 

 

 

Or...

________

 

Christians tell me children go straight to heaven when they die, no matter what.  Isn't that interesting?

 

Christians also tend to believe that this mortal life is vastly inferior to the afterlife in heaven, which is maximum peace and joy forever.

 

Some Christians don't believe in hell, but many still do, and they like to believe that child killers go straight to hell when they die.  That sucks.

 

BUT there is something special about self-sacrifice.  Self-sacrifice tends to be pleasing to the Christian god, which Christians claim their god rewards with going to heaven.  Altruism is one of the highest virtues.

 

SO

 

Let's say some Christian gets it into his head that this mortal life is inferior to the next immortal one, with all kinds of suffering and risks and who knows what, including many chances for children to grow up and make mistakes that could get them sent to hell.  So this guy, who loves children so much and wants the very best for them, kills them so they can skip all the nastiness and risk and go straight to God in heaven which is the absolutely best place to be.  

 

He kills the children knowing that he taking a huge risk at getting himself condemned to hell for eternity, which is quite a long time to be suffering.  But he considers this willing sacrifice of one person to be worth getting all these children to heaven.  Eternal punishment; is there a greater sacrifice to be made by anyone?  This would be the most altruistic act any person could do.

 

______

 

Why don't more Christians do this?  Because their social mammalian instincts override this level of depravity that is theoretically well within the bounds of Christian doctrine.  Because they're a little bit more moral than their religion, in spite of their religion.  Because they don't really believe most of what they preach.  

 

Made up straw men nonsense.

 

[The Brain]

So I can rape babies as long as I sincerely apologize then

Christians believe God can forgive anyone who sincerely repents. No, you cannot rape babies because you can repent.

If I can repent, surely I can rape babies...

[shadowhawk]

Go ahead and try it.  God will be able to see if you are a mocker.  Not everyone who says God, God will convince.

[Duchykins]

 

 

 

Christians believe God can forgive anyone who sincerely repents.  No, you cannot rape babies because you can repent. 
 

 

 

 

So you're saying violent criminals cannot be saved no matter what?

[Duchykins]

Made up straw men nonsense.

 

 

 

 

 

Okay, I'll accept that, if you can tell me which one of these premises is wrong:

 

1) children go to heaven if they die as children

 

2) Christians believe being with God in heaven is the maximally happiest, peaceful, joyful existence any person could have, far better than this mortal life

 

3) Child killers go to hell

 

4) Altruism, self-sacrifice, is a very high virtue in Christianity

[shadowhawk]

 

 

 

 

Christians believe God can forgive anyone who sincerely repents.  No, you cannot rape babies because you can repent. 
 

 

 

 

So you're saying violent criminals cannot be saved no matter what?

 

Trying to put words in my mouth.  God sees your heart and if true He will forgive.  On the other hand this is not some game.

[shadowhawk]

 

Made up straw men nonsense.

 

 

 

 

 

Okay, I'll accept that, if you can tell me which one of these premises is wrong:

 

1) children go to heaven if they die as children

 

2) Christians believe being with God in heaven is the maximally happiest, peaceful, joyful existence any person could have, far better than this mortal life

 

3) Child killers go to hell

 

4) Altruism, self-sacrifice, is a very high virtue in Christianity

 

You have left a lot out but all of them can be true

[Duchykins]

You have left a lot out but all of them can be true

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Okay, so what is missing from those premises that undermines that little hypothetical scenario I described?

Remember as I've said in other threads to you; merely asserting I'm wrong about something is insufficient.  You should be pointing to something specific, correcting it or filling in some of the missing information.

[Duchykins]

Again, what is missing from those premises that undermines the overall argument?  

 

Something in Christian doctrine that would make the hypothetical a straw man.

[shadowhawk]

It is your list and I said, though a lot of issues have been left out the statements can all be true.  What is unclear about that answer.  If you want to modify YOUR list, I will play along.

[Duchykins]

I don't need to modify it since you've acknowledged none of the premises are inherently wrong.

 

The scenario itself is immoral and we all are repulsed by it - BUT not because of anything that is in Christian doctrine.  

 

Christian doctrine provides the framework for coming to that conclusion instead of short-circuiting it.  It is a scenario that is theoretically possible within the bounds of your religion.

 

It's only incorrect or immoral if you factor in some source of secular morality, which you are already instinctively doing but aren't fully aware of (or maybe you are and you are just obstinately lying to save face).

Edited by Duchykins, 14 July 2015 - 11:40 PM.

[Duchykins]

Actually, there is another way that my hypothetical could be a straw man:   if you actually changed traditional Christian doctrine.

 

 

[shadowhawk]

I don't need to modify it since you've acknowledged none of the premises are inherently wrong.

 

The scenario itself is immoral and we all are repulsed by it - BUT not because of anything that is in Christian doctrine.  

 

Christian doctrine provides the framework for coming to that conclusion instead of short-circuiting it.  It is a scenario that is theoretically possible within the bounds of your religion.

 

It's only incorrect or immoral if you factor in some source of secular morality, which you are already instinctively doing but aren't fully aware of (or maybe you are and you are just obstinately lying to save face).

 

You are jumping to a lot of baseless conclusions.  Since we are talking about ethics and you have made the clam that all of the statements are immoral, upon what basis do you make that judgement.  Take secular morality what is it and what does it say?  You have called me a liar, so lets see.  Cheap talk.

[Duchykins]

 

 

 

You are jumping to a lot of baseless conclusions.  Since we are talking about ethics and you have made the clam that all of the statements are immoral, upon what basis do you make that judgement.  Take secular morality what is it and what does it say?  You have called me a liar, so lets see.  Cheap talk.

 

 

 

We're not finished.

 

You claimed that there is some vitally relevant teaching in Christianity that would unmake my argument about what is possible with traditional Christian doctrine.  

 

You're had ample time and opportunity to say what it is.  

 

Instead, you've dodged and dodged, and now want to try to change the subject so you're not under the microscope anymore.

 

I ask again, what did Christian teaching(s) did I leave out?

[shadowhawk]

 

 

 

 

You are jumping to a lot of baseless conclusions.  Since we are talking about ethics and you have made the clam that all of the statements are immoral, upon what basis do you make that judgement.  Take secular morality what is it and what does it say?  You have called me a liar, so lets see.  Cheap talk.

 

 

 

We're not finished.

 

You claimed that there is some vitally relevant teaching in Christianity that would unmake my argument about what is possible with traditional Christian doctrine.  

 

You're had ample time and opportunity to say what it is.  

 

Instead, you've dodged and dodged, and now want to try to change the subject so you're not under the microscope anymore.

 

I ask again, what did Christian teaching(s) did I leave out?

 

My response is this is baloney and you made it up just as you ignored my question about ethics and secular morality.   Come on, what game are you playing.  I had hoped for something more from you. Gobligoop!

 

[Dakman]

Go ahead and try it.  God will be able to see if you are a mocker.  Not everyone who says God, God will convince.

He's probably got his hands full dealing with all those followers and religious leaders raping babies and children

 

Sitting in the churches after a night of raping their children or thinking of raping them that night

 

Or looking at other members kids and thinking of raping them if they could figure a way to get them alone 

[Duchykins]

My response is this is baloney and you made it up just as you ignored my question about ethics and secular morality.   Come on, what game are you playing.  I had hoped for something more from you. Gobligoop!

 

 

 

 

 

No you said I was missing something, but you haven't identified what that is.  Surely it's a simple thing, is it not?  Tell me what teaching I've missed.  Stop ignoring my question.

[shadowhawk]

I am not ignoring your question about something that didn't happen.  I haven't any idea what you are talking about.  Reference the post.

[Duchykins]

Now you're just lying and playing games.  

 

It doesn't matter though.  My work here is done, anyone can read this thread and see you squirming.

[shadowhawk]

They can see you won't post your bogus source that does not exist.  Nice attempt to get out of it.  HO humm  what a drag.  Have a nice day

[The Brain]

How come everyone ends up saying the same things about you Shadowdork ?