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xEva's fasting log - 3 weeks in spring

fasting fasting log ketosis

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#1 xEva

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Posted 30 April 2013 - 02:41 PM


New fast, new thread. My previous fast was here xEva's fasting log - 8 days - repair and renew.

Today is DAY 3

weight 60 kg = 132 lbs (-3 lbs), blood glucose 65 mg/dL = 3.6 mMol/L , ketonuria 15

So far so good. Went for a walk in the morning and it was hard climbing uphill.

Yesterday I lost more weight than usual for an early day. I started this fast a week ago, on Monday, got into ketosis on the morning of Thu (4th day!), but then broke the fast late at night of the same day. On Fri and Sat I had a low-carb break and began again on Sunday. Now I suspect that I have not lost the induction earned a week ago and that's why it took me only 36h to return to ketosis this time (which made me very happy :)).

After the morning walk took Bs, BBCA, taurine, NAC and ubiquinol. The Bs are liquid and tasted very sweet, which upped my strength substantially.


yesterday DAY 2

weight 135 lbs, BG 77 = 4.3, ketones 5

Drank a liter of Polish mineral water. Took half a B complex and abx in the morning.
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#2 theconomist

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Posted 30 April 2013 - 03:10 PM

Good luck with your new fast. I'm considering one post surgery (on the 16th) and maybe a short weekend one before it to help with some stomach issues I've been having.
I'll follow your log with great enthusiasm. How long will you fast for?

#3 platypus

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Posted 30 April 2013 - 03:30 PM

It would be interesting to see what the fasts are doing to your lean body-mass, i.e. how much muscle you're losing and whether you manage to regain it between the fasts.

#4 theconomist

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Posted 30 April 2013 - 04:17 PM

It would be interesting to see what the fasts are doing to your lean body-mass, i.e. how much muscle you're losing and whether you manage to regain it between the fasts.

From what I've seen in my body.
I don't think long term fasts (longer than 48 hours) are a good way to lose weight; first I lose almost as much muscle as fat. 2nd the weight is usually regained very quickly since once you go back to eating you're constantly hungry.
The sweet spot to lose just fat through fasting for me is a 36 hour fast every week.

#5 xEva

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Posted 30 April 2013 - 06:19 PM

How long will you fast for?


3 weeks :)


It would be interesting to see what the fasts are doing to your lean body-mass, i.e. how much muscle you're losing and whether you manage to regain it between the fasts.


Yes, but unfortunately I don't have that fancy scale that approximates all that. But I tell you what: there is a way to build muscles as if on steroids utilizing fasting. It's cause you'll use your own growth hormone. If I remember correctly, it reaches its height at about 48h fasting and then goes down a bit. But at ~48h it is ~10-fold the baseline. From this follows that working out after 24-36h and then eating several hours later, will allow the GH to do its magic. Not only that, because you workout hard in a fasted state in the morning and wait till the evening to finally eat, there is no postworkout pain whatsoever (you only feel the muscles, but there is no paralyzing pain). That's what I did by chance last time I fasted and then saw that my upper arms became noticeably bigger (just from that one time).

But muscles is not everything, especially for females. The true power is in tendons and tendons love ketosis. Of course, you guys just wanna be BIG, even though it's well past paleolithic times and brains mean so much more lol

Edited by xEva, 30 April 2013 - 06:22 PM.


#6 theconomist

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Posted 30 April 2013 - 07:14 PM

How long will you fast for?


3 weeks :)


It would be interesting to see what the fasts are doing to your lean body-mass, i.e. how much muscle you're losing and whether you manage to regain it between the fasts.


Yes, but unfortunately I don't have that fancy scale that approximates all that. But I tell you what: there is a way to build muscles as if on steroids utilizing fasting. It's cause you'll use your own growth hormone. If I remember correctly, it reaches its height at about 48h fasting and then goes down a bit. But at ~48h it is ~10-fold the baseline. From this follows that working out after 24-36h and then eating several hours later, will allow the GH to do its magic. Not only that, because you workout hard in a fasted state in the morning and wait till the evening to finally eat, there is no postworkout pain whatsoever (you only feel the muscles, but there is no paralyzing pain). That's what I did by chance last time I fasted and then saw that my upper arms became noticeably bigger (just from that one time).

But muscles is not everything, especially for females. The true power is in tendons and tendons love ketosis. Of course, you guys just wanna be BIG, even though it's well past paleolithic times and brains mean so much more lol


You should try to convince the girls at my university :p
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#7 xEva

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Posted 02 May 2013 - 03:40 AM

Yesterday late afternoon I was getting a terrible headache, due to cipro no doubt, and I had to brake the fast. Today I was pigging out and will return to it tomorrow. Will see how long it's gonna take to get to ketosis this time. So yeah, just as I thought, certain abx do not mix with fasting at all. But it's normal for me to go through a few humps like this before I finally do a long fast.

#8 theconomist

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Posted 02 May 2013 - 10:36 AM

Yesterday late afternoon I was getting a terrible headache, due to cipro no doubt, and I had to brake the fast. Today I was pigging out and will return to it tomorrow. Will see how long it's gonna take to get to ketosis this time. So yeah, just as I thought, certain abx do not mix with fasting at all. But it's normal for me to go through a few humps like this before I finally do a long fast.

I like how you don't give up even after trying a few times; your schedule must be very flexible (or do you continue to try and function normally during your fasts? ( work, hobbies...)).
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#9 xEva

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Posted 10 May 2013 - 02:39 PM

My fast continues after an abx break. Today is Day 5.

I piked up an infection, on 2 occasions actually, about mid April and a week later, the second one was more serious, but I had barely any signs of it until I began fasting. Apparently, at least one of the bugs was of the kind that exploit autophagy for its own proliferation. Basically, there are 2 ways of dealing with it. One is to persevere despite the steady growth of unplesant symptoms, the most noticeable of which is really bad breath, and the other is to break the fast and deal wit it. I chose the second option. I took abx going into the fast and even the day ketosis started already (since it came much earlier than anticipated). Also I ran out of my usual abx and tried another one. It turned out that that particular abx did not mix at all with the ketotic state.

So I broke the fast, got the right kind of abx and took a course. Now I'm fasting without that aggravation, which is really more than just bad breath but also malaise that inevitably comes when the immune sys tries to contain a growing invasion. My breath is clean and all I have now is sour taste in the mouth. I know this taste will become very tiring by the end of the second week and it already gets annoying at times, but then I remind myself that it could be acrid taste in addition to really bad stench. But the best consolation is the knowledge that this sour taste is what makes the teeth their whitest and leads to clearance of whatever calculi buildup that could be there. This thought makes me actually like the taste. The smell is clean and fruity. And it has good associations for my brain which absolutely adores them ketones :)

Here is the report of the previous days:

DAY 1 Mon May 6
Did the saline purge and did not weigh myself.


DAY 2 Tue May 7
Weight 135 lbs = 61.2 kg
Blood Glucose 87 mg/dL = 4.8 mMol/L

was not hungry, except when smelling the cooking in the kitchen, and had a good energy level, even though I felt lazy and did not move much. Emptionally I was depressed. A part of me did not want to fast. Again?! Could not sleep the first night. But I persevered knowing that once ketosis starts I will be flying. Thankfully, the transition to the ketotic state took place at ~8PM on Day 2, which was later than the previous time but much sooner than usual for me. Actually that's about an average norm. My mood improved markedly and I slept very well and saw many engaging dreams.


DAY 3 Wed May 8
wt 133 (-2), BG 67 = 3.7, Ketonuria = 40

Had more energy than usual for the 3rd day, except for the brief weakness in the morning. Had no hunger except when smelling food cooking. Overall, I had a normal level of energy, even though I would not say that I was flying. It was a busy day. Felt very sleepy when I got home.


DAY 4 yesterday
07:00 ketones = 40, BG 59 = 3.3, forgot to weigh

went for a walk hoping that it would raise blood sugar. Tried to run, but could not really. It was cool, about 8C, but the air was not cold enough to revive me, which should have been at least 0C, preferably lower.

08:00 BG 59 = 3.3 <-- it did not bulge!

without cold winter air I basically turn in an average beginner faster; I drag my feet and want to take it easy. I spent most of the day in bed with the comp in the lap. All I could do was some easy reading. I did not feel like moving at all, but knew that I could do it if I had to. Thankfully I did not have any obligations for the day.

Overall, emotionally I felt fine but was fatigued physically and mentally. Firm knowledge that this is just a phase helped me to persevere. I suspected it was the early crise. It is much better when it happens during the night and you just sleep through it and wake up on the other side. Being awake has its own advantages though. I had the opportunity to watch the process.

16:00 BG 49 = 2.7

18:00 BG 47 = 2.6, ketonuria 80+

By this point I was feeling very discouraged so I bummed a cigarette and had a cup of black coffee (I know). Either this sin against the Nikolayev method --or maybe by then I was actually past the crise, since I was already moving and talking, which I could not do just a short while before-- , but my energy level and mood picked up enough for me to go for a walk in the woods. It was cool after the rain, and by the time the sun began to set, a delicious chill enveloped me. It felt so good! (see, cold is absolutely required when fasting)

21:00 BG 70 = 3.9, weight 130 lbs

At 8 PM I came home feeling pretty good. Hypomanic, in fact. And craving movement. At 9 PM I measured sugar and it was 70 mg/dL (!) So, it was indeed the crise. It lasted almost the whole day! It is so much better to sleep through at least part of it.

My understanding of the process is that the blood sugar drops as the level of ketones keeps rising. Finally, the brain does the massive switch to ketones. So the rise in blood glucose I saw at 9 PM was reflecting this fact. The blood levels = production - utilization. As the brain switches to ketones, the level of glucose rises due to its diminished uptake by the brain. Unfortunately I do not have blood ketone strips now, otherwise I would expect the blood level of beta-hydroxybutyrate to drop simultaneously with the rise of glucose. Indirectly though, this dynamic was shown by a lower level of ketonuria the next morning (ketonuria, while still present, ruffly reflects the blood level of ketones during the time while the urine was collecting, which takes several hours).


DAY 5
08:00 Wt 129 (-1), BG 58 = 3.2, K = ~60

It took me forever to type up this post, following which I felt pretty good. I thought that this would be reflected in a higher BG level, but it dropped instead. I guess this means that mybody is adapting to running on FAs and ketones. I feel like running, which I should hurry up before it warms up :)

10:30 BG 51 = 2.8
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#10 xEva

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Posted 15 June 2014 - 04:56 AM

Sorry about cutting it short. I lasted 12 days then. The main difficulty I experienced during that fast was that I entered a permanent state of euphoria, with boundless mental and physical energy, as a result of which I ended up doing something pretty stupid, which in turn caused me to break the fast. You know, mania. I realize that for most people this is hard to believe, but I attribute this particularly euphoric fast to the fact that it was about a month after a 8d fast, which is the classic of genre.

Edited by xEva, 15 June 2014 - 04:56 AM.


#11 Primal

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Posted 21 June 2014 - 12:27 AM

 I attribute this particularly euphoric fast to the fact that it was about a month after a 8d fast, which is the classic of genre.

 

Not sure what you mean, but how much B vits? do you take more B3 of some sort to boost NAD during your fasts?



#12 xEva

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Posted 22 June 2014 - 03:21 AM

Not sure what you mean, but how much B vits? do you take more B3 of some sort to boost NAD during your fasts?


During my fasts I sometimes take a little bit of a B complex and I make sure that the B3 form is niacinamide. I believe NAD is boosted naturally during a fast, in conjunction with whatever else needs to be boosted. In contrast, various fasting mimetics boost some things while neglecting others.


Regarding euphoria, for a long time I was planning to make a lengthy post about the main ketone, beta-hydroxybutyrate, and its similarity to gamma-hydroxybutyrate, or GBH, the drug of abuse but... I was so vexed about messing up this "perfect fast" that I did not want to do anything that would remind me of it.

What happened was that starting on day 5, I was high like a kite and full of energy. My step-brother was moving in and I helped, running up and down stairs with heavy loads. He was absolutely amazed when he heard that I had not eaten for 5 days. Sure, I was physically tired after all that, but 30-45 min rest while reclining with the laptop, was enough to regain my energy. This state of affairs lasted several days, me getting more and more high and cocky, until... I'd rather forget.

And so euphoria is a well-known phenomenon associated with fasting. That's how some people get hooked on it. Most beginners feel far from euphoric on their fasts, mainly, I believe, due to detox. That's why a consequent fast, not too long after the first one, is known to proceed much easier and even bring on a lasting euphoria, with correspondingly high levels of energy.

Found this hypothesis paper on pubmed: Low-carb diets, fasting and euphoria: Is there a link between ketosis and gamma-hydroxybutyrate (GHB)?

 

The most amazing aspect of this fast was that I was loosing the usual amount of weight. Where does all this energy come from? We know too little about our physiology.


Edited by xEva, 22 June 2014 - 03:23 AM.

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#13 Primal

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Posted 22 June 2014 - 03:52 AM

interesting story and paper. ive fasted only once, for 4 days, it wasnt great. will try again this summer. is there an article with importants tips for beginner, or you just stop eating? I suppose you dont like niacin during fast because it block fatty acids metabolism by binding to the GPR109A receptor? 
 

 gamma-hydroxybutyrate, or GBH,  My step-brother was moving in   me getting more and more high and cocky, until...
 

 

Edited by maxwatt, 15 July 2014 - 06:54 PM.


#14 xEva

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Posted 22 June 2014 - 06:47 AM

is there an article with importants tips for beginner, or you just stop eating? I suppose you dont like niacin during fast because it block fatty acids metabolism by binding to the GPR109A receptor?


There is no good article with tips. I've been toying with the idea of writing a book on fasting myself, the one I was looking for 7 years ago and could not find anywhere. If only I could find time for it, or an investor/publisher  :unsure: 

Re niacin, I'm not aware of the GPR109A receptor -- must be recent -? I go by a couple of old 1980s studies that showed that taking 100mg of niacin, in a fasted state, sequestered free fatty acids from bloodstream for several hours. I imagine, this should sabotage my fast by making me ravenously hungry, but I have not actually tried it.







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