LONGECITY

You can eliminate the lines from your nose to the sides of your mouth by using an injectable filler. The hyaluronic acid is a natural component of your skin. Look at it as skin supplementation.

Are injectables usable and advisable on the lower eyelids?

You can eliminate the lines from your nose to the sides of your mouth by using an injectable filler. The hyaluronic acid is a natural component of your skin. Look at it as skin supplementation.

Are injectables usable and advisable on the lower eyelids?

Yes. HA fillers can be injected in the tear trough to correct a hollow appearance. They´re also used directly under the eye brow to lift the upper lid. But go to an experienced Dr. If put to superficial HA can show through the skin with a bluish hue and they can also cause temporary lumps. But if used correctly they can really make a dramatic difference in the eye area.

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Fredrik,

Thx for your input!

By natural & organic ingredients, I mean something like jojoba oil, emu oil, rosehip oil, Manuka Honey etc.

I understand. Actually none of those natural and organic ingredients is recognized by the skin and they´re not a part of your skin. Often it doesn´t cause any problems but essential oils for example can be very irritating and people who works with them can develop contact dermatitis.

I prefer to use more natural ingredients that is already present in the skin like retinoids (retinoic acid but not tazarotene is a natural part of your skin), ascorbic acid, tocopherol, niacinamide etc. When those are covered I can then add more exotic stuff like topical green tea that is not part of the skin but can modulate signaling pathways that counteract the irritation from retinoids and possibly even prevent photoaging.

Are injectables usable and advisable on the lower eyelids?

Yes. HA fillers can be injected in the tear trough to correct a hollow appearance.

Hmm, that's not quite my problem. My lower eyelids are genetically a little puffy (think George Cluny). Smooth when passive, but when I smile, the puffy part tends to scrunch up like irregularly ruffled paper. I'm not talking about crow's feet, which don't bother me, rather the crosshatched appearance under the eye. Anything besides surgery possible for this issue?

Fredrik,

Thx for your input!

By natural & organic ingredients, I mean something like jojoba oil, emu oil, rosehip oil, Manuka Honey etc.

I understand. Actually none of those natural and organic ingredients is recognized by the skin and they´re not a part of your skin. Often it doesn´t cause any problems but essential oils for example can be very irritating and people who works with them can develop contact dermatitis.

Yes, not to mention those that can apparently be systemically absorbed and adversely affect hormonal pathways, such as tea tree oil.

Can retinoid users who do not adequately protect their skin from the sun experience sun aging effects in as little as one day? Like lines, dark circles under eyes, haggard look, etc?
Edited by TheFountain, 02 July 2009 - 07:42 AM.

i am currently using bioderma max fluid, mineral , and sensitive sunscreen alternatively. i work outside , so i typically apply sunscreen four times during the day. (8.30, 11.30, 14:30, 17:00)
i understand how the uv rays can damage my skin, however, i am still concerned potential adverse effects from all the chemicals in the sunscreen.
why don't you use a pure zinc oxide or physical sunscreen instead? except the texture might be intolerable, but people like me need to apply so much amount of these chemicals on my face everyday, .....
can someone give me some advices?
for the bioderma i am using, i see there'r some silicon type ingredients , however, when i apply the sunscreen, i don't quite feel any film sitting on top of my face, unlike some other products i used before, and i do feel the suncreen is absorbed..
chemical sunscreens are supposed to be formulated so that the ingredients should not be absorbed , am i correct?

(edited by Matthias: long full quote removed)
Edited by Matthias, 07 July 2009 - 01:04 AM.

You can eliminate the lines from your nose to the sides of your mouth by using an injectable filler. The hyaluronic acid is a natural component of your skin. Look at it as skin supplementation.

Are injectables usable and advisable on the lower eyelids?

Why is it when some people get the nasolabials injected it looks great
(Jennifer Connelly/JC) and for others it looks like their mouth is permanently
swollen (Mary McCormack/MM) ? Is it 'other' procedures or ?

JC had very deep lines there and now they are gone. I had to check the date
when watching a film of hers the other day because she looks so much younger
now. MM is difficult to look at from some angles on her show. The mouth area just
does not look natural at all compared to how she used to look. Its swollen looking.

I'm not trying to pick on actors here, just want to collect the correct info. The nasolabials
are one area I have not been able to affect with nutrition or topicals so I'm looking into
this now. But I don't want to change how my face looks, just fill in the lines there.

anyone get asked for a copy of their prescription when ordering trenitoin cream from alldaychemist.com??

thanks

Are injectables usable and advisable on the lower eyelids?


Why is it when some people get the nasolabials injected it looks great
(Jennifer Connelly/JC) and for others it looks like their mouth is permanently
swollen (Mary McCormack/MM) ? Is it 'other' procedures or ?

JC had very deep lines there and now they are gone. I had to check the date
when watching a film of hers the other day because she looks so much younger
now. MM is difficult to look at from some angles on her show. The mouth area just
does not look natural at all compared to how she used to look. Its swollen looking.

I'm not trying to pick on actors here, just want to collect the correct info. The nasolabials
are one area I have not been able to affect with nutrition or topicals so I'm looking into
this now. But I don't want to change how my face looks, just fill in the lines there.

Have you used a tretinoin formula for the nasolabial folds? How old are you, what percentage of tretinoin have you attempted to use? What is your BMI?

anyone get asked for a copy of their prescription when ordering trenitoin cream from alldaychemist.com??

thanks

\
Nope....never heard it ever happen....go for it!!!!!

Good to know I don't need a prescription. Thanks for the reply.

Now can anyone tell me how many tubes of the Tazarotene .05%, tretinoin .025% and tretinoin .05% I need for a 3 month supply? Shipping for a single tube is around US$21 so I'd like to order in bulk.

Thanks again.

Good to know I don't need a prescription. Thanks for the reply.

Now can anyone tell me how many tubes of the Tazarotene .05%, tretinoin .025% and tretinoin .05% I need for a 3 month supply? Shipping for a single tube is around US$21 so I'd like to order in bulk.

Thanks again.

Yes buy in bulk to help offset shipping. Many do that. Just get at least 6 tubes and you'll be good for longer than 3 months.

Yes buy in bulk to help offset shipping. Many do that. Just get at least 6 tubes and you'll be good for longer than 3 months.

Wow how much do you use? I go through one 20 G tube in 2 months, which means 6 would last me at least a year.

Wow how much do you use? I go through one 20 G tube in 2 months, which means 6 would last me at least a year.

Like I said, over 3 months. I use it on my hands and arms as well.
Edited by immortali457, 17 July 2009 - 12:43 AM.

Like I said, over 3 months. I use it on my hands and arms as well.

How much do you use on your hands and arms? 3-4 times the amount you use on your face?

How much do you use on your hands and arms? 3-4 times the amount you use on your face?

Maybe 2-3 times more. I forgot to mention I'm using it on my scalp (I shave my head). I'm seeing some hair re-growth after a few months of this.

Maybe 2-3 times more. I forgot to mention I'm using it on my scalp (I shave my head). I'm seeing some hair re-growth after a few months of this.

A retinoid? FWIW, JLL on his blog has reported that topical retinol slightly helped to grow hair. I'm not sure if there are any trials testing it for this purpose, though.
Edited by kismet, 17 July 2009 - 06:49 PM.

Like I said, over 3 months. I use it on my hands and arms as well.

That site is cheap enough so I don't mind a few extras.

I currently use benzyol peroxide for keeping my skin clear of pimples, it's the only 'product' I use on my face besides moisturizer. I'm wondering if trenitonin or the taxorac cream have any anti-acne properties? I would like to keep my skin care regimen as simple as posible, so if I could drop the benzoyl peroxide I would be very happy.

Great thread. Very informative.

Thanks to Fredrik and everyone.

BTW Fredrik have you every considered taking collagen supplements? I'm talking about this stuff NeoCell Super Collagen+C™ Type I & III

That site is cheap enough so I don't mind a few extras.

I currently use benzyol peroxide for keeping my skin clear of pimples, it's the only 'product' I use on my face besides moisturizer. I'm wondering if trenitonin or the taxorac cream have any anti-acne properties? I would like to keep my skin care regimen as simple as posible, so if I could drop the benzoyl peroxide I would be very happy.

Great thread. Very informative.

Thanks to Fredrik and everyone.

BTW Fredrik have you every considered taking collagen supplements? I'm talking about this stuff NeoCell Super Collagen+C™ Type I & III

Do a google search on tretinoin and acne. Acne was the main pupose of tretinoin 25+ years ago and works well today.

Perfect!

Last thing, is it safe to put tretinoin and tazarotene on the upper/lower eye lids and is it even necessary?

Thanks again.

Like I said, over 3 months. I use it on my hands and arms as well.

In 3 months you go through 20 grams?!?!?!? Wow. I use about 20 grams every two weeks and I only use it on my face.

In 3 months you go through 20 grams?!?!?!? Wow. I use about 20 grams every two weeks and I only use it on my face.

That's not what I said. Re-read my posts.
Edited by immortali457, 19 July 2009 - 03:15 AM.

Perfect!

Last thing, is it safe to put tretinoin and tazarotene on the upper/lower eye lids and is it even necessary?

Thanks again.

Ask yourself: is your eyelid covered with skin including an elastin rich and elastase-sensitive dermis and could it show wrinkling in the future? (consider the fact that retinoids are used to treat skin when answering the question)

Is it safe? Not according to the package insert. Is it safe according to my personal experience and our current knowledge of retinoid use and safety? Yes, most probably.
Edited by kismet, 21 July 2009 - 05:21 PM.

Ask yourself: is your eyelid covered with skin including an elastin rich and elastase-sensitive dermis and could it show wrinkling in the future? (consider the fact that retinoids are used to treat skin when answering the question)

Is it safe? Not according to the package insert. Is it safe according to my personal experience and our current knowledge of retinoid use and safety? Yes, most probably.

Got it. Thanks.

Very interesting thread, thank you all for the discussion.

Questions - hoping for comments:

(1) I have been concerned about my Vitamin C serum - currently applying L-Ascorbic acid made in a 15% serum with distilled water, applied immediately and only at night - to prevent oxidation.

I have not purchased the Skinceuticals product out of concerns regarding the price and the fact that the shelf life of the product when purchased, is basically unknown.. therefore...

I am interested in a stable and more effective solution - so I have considered adding tetrahexyldecyl ascorbate to rice bran oil which contains naturally occuring Vitamin E and Ferulic Acid - given the challenges of ferulic acid solubility.

Thoughts?

Thank you. VL

Kismet,

Regarding your comment here:

<<I've read the literature and can tell you that the absorption of topical retinoids is abysmal >>

If topical retinoids are not readily absorbed into the skin, how is that they are effective?

This is not a trick question, lol. I have been reading (as I shared with you on the other thread) comments from other skin researchers claiming that we are better served by insuring these topicals are driven further into the skin via devices such as the dermaroller, ultrasound, microcurrent, etc.

VL

...... I´m on my third jar of Relastin and I hope the studies they´re carrying out now will indeed show that the elastin it produces is functional. But until then it´s a chance we´re taking with this cream. It could be that it´s just working as a good moisturizer. Just want you to know that......

Hi Fredrik,

I have just bought Relastin & would like to incorporate it into my pm regime.

Because I am usually in a hurry in the morning, so that I cannot wait 20 minutes after cleansing & then put Vit C serum on my face and then wait another 20 minutes to apply sunscreen. I just apply sunscreen after cleansing.

In the evening, I'd like to use Relastin & Taz on alternate night.

Can I apply Vit C serum before Relastin? I worry that Relastin contains zinc and it will make Vit C serum oxidized. Can "wait time", say 60 minutes after applying Vit C serum, solve the oxidization issue?

If topical retinoids are not readily absorbed into the skin, how is that they are effective?

They are definitely not absorbed well into the bloodstream. All the studies measure vitamin A derivatives in the blood stream to gauge systemic effects (after all the only way for the retinoids to show off-target effects is to be re-distributed via the bloodstream). I'm sure they are absorbed into the dermis and you get good local exposure (though, it could be better still), but they'd need to move into the bloodstream from the dermis to cause side-effects in other organs and only minuscle amounts of retinoids make it into the bloodstream. And yes, indeed, when improving penetration and absorption, you have to be careful not to increase systemic absorption (disproportionately).
Edited by kismet, 30 July 2009 - 02:32 PM.

...... I´m on my third jar of Relastin and I hope the studies they´re carrying out now will indeed show that the elastin it produces is functional. But until then it´s a chance we´re taking with this cream. It could be that it´s just working as a good moisturizer. Just want you to know that......

Hi Fredrik,

I have just bought Relastin & would like to incorporate it into my pm regime.

Because I am usually in a hurry in the morning, so that I cannot wait 20 minutes after cleansing & then put Vit C serum on my face and then wait another 20 minutes to apply sunscreen. I just apply sunscreen after cleansing.

In the evening, I'd like to use Relastin & Taz on alternate night.

Can I apply Vit C serum before Relastin? I worry that Relastin contains zinc and it will make Vit C serum oxidized. Can "wait time", say 60 minutes after applying Vit C serum, solve the oxidization issue?

You dont have to wait any time after cleansing in the morning to apply a C serum if your cleanser has a neutral or lower PH level. About 5.5 PH or lower