4 replies to this topic

[Rhcan09]

I've been trying to narrow down an ideal nootropic stack, largely based on bmud's "10 months of research condensed" post.

Unfortunately, the stack I used today actually made me feel, what I would have to describe as "depressed".

It was very pronounced, and I almost immediately recognized that it was a side effect of today's nootropic stack. I have no history of depression, I don't struggle with it, I never feel like this normally, my life is good, etc etc etc. But today, I almost had difficulty making eye contact with people. It was a really uncomfortable feeling.

So a couple areas I'd like to seek feedback on:

1) I remember it mentioned in passing on this forum, that there was something called the "Choline Blues". I don't know if that was an individual member's personally coined phrase, or an actual phenomina. Regardless, is it possible that TOO MUCH choline can trigger depressive feelings?

2) Someone has also mentioned in passing that young people shouldn't be taking an Acetylcholinesterase Inhibitor (I take Hupperzine) along with a choline source (I take CDP Choline). Is that good advice, and thus should I stop taking both?

3) Is it possible that Sulbutiamine or Pyritinol could be the culprit? They are relatively new additions to my stack.

Thank you for all the input in advance! I'm attaching today's stack below:

Edited by Rhcan09, 05 March 2010 - 06:14 AM.

[Rhcan09]

To clarify, "young" = late 20s

[LIB]

Yes choline can be depressive to some people.

[brain]

Yes choline can be depressive to some people.

yeah, try dropping the Hup A. If you still notice the depression, drop the CDP choline. Its possible that you're one of the people who don't need additional choline supplementation, like myself. If you do still need a choline source, I'm under the impression that DMAE is less depressive than the other sources, so you might try that. I'd recommend starting with 50mg/day, then potentially working your way up to 100. If you still notice the depression, I would discontinue all choline sources before you risk initiating long-term problems. One more thing. Rather than discontinuing all choline supplementation, you might try adding in either an herbal antidepressant or a reversible MAOI. I've had excellent results with a combination of Rhodiola and Piracetam. I've also heard someone else call these two "best friends".

[Rhcan09]

I dropped the Hupperzine and the Sulbutiamine today, and so far, so good - no mood abnormalities - everything seems fine.

Is there any practical difference between supplementing choline, and using a cholinesterase inhibitor?

I understand the mechanical difference. Essentially supplementing introduces more choline into your system, while inhibiting cholinesterase slows your body's reduction of the choline you already have (correct?). However, in practical terms, if I was going to either supplement with CDP or inhibit cholinesterase with Hupperzine, would there be any reason to choose one approach over the other?

Rationally, it would seem that supplementing Choline is a safer route, because it's one less natural process I'd be interfering with.