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Lactobacillus reuteri (ATCC PTA 6475) - Most potent thing ever?

reuteri anti aging testosterone health lactobacillus reuteri probiotics

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#361 Oakman

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Posted 09 June 2019 - 08:47 PM

Thanks for your reply, and especially your documentation of your fermentation technique. I just ordered Osfortis from the US, and will follow your guidelines - I have a lab thermostat at home back from when affordable sous-vide wasn't a thing, and am happy to put it (basically) to its intended use. I make natto and occasionally sauerkraut too, fermenting is addictive, and smelly.

 

I'm a physiotherapist and I commute daily on a cycle. your data is interesting. my resting HR is higher than it should be, I'll be sure to get base measurements. though I don't think I'll be able to provide proper HRV data. it's n=1 anyway, but we'll see.

I wish there'd be an easy metric for gum heath, and I really could do with some improvement - though my lower incisor gap is always lightly inflamed, I'll try to take a foto to document a possible improvement.

 

Any change in your sleep patterns?

 

Fermenting is addictive. I think of how to ferment a lot. Maybe co L reuteri and beer fermentation is a thing :) ?

To get your proper daily HRV data use HRV4Training & smartphone. Their website has good info. It's not a perfect science, but is useful with practice.

Gum health metrics - all inflammation, so bleeding while flossing or scrapping and/or deeper periodontal pockets - are trouble. Daily floss both physically and using a water jet after a brushing, and scraping of gumline troublespots. Minimize wiping out oral biome with toothpastes and mouthwashes. Try to inoculate the right bacteria in your mouth.

 

No noticeable change, just the same 7-9 hours, interrupted only by nature's call, coyotes howling, or emergency vehicle sirens.


Edited by Oakman, 09 June 2019 - 09:10 PM.


#362 Oakman

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Posted 12 June 2019 - 12:42 AM

I''d also like to share three recent fails and two successes with making this yogurt, in case others have experienced something similar and wondered if it was just them. Last week I had three failures in a row, and by failures I mean the yogurt totally separated into curds on top and whey, almost half and half. I'd experimenting with some additives to enhance the process and it appears they worked differently and more strongly than I had wanted!

 

Very soon in the ferment, within the 1st 6 hrs (I didn't watch), there was an aggressive separation and rising of the curds, pushing against the jar cover, even overflowing into the water bath. Pretty much what ta5 showed in his post here, except it was all 8 of my jars, all at the same time. The first time I threw it all out, but the 2nd & 3rd time I strained the curds, which I'll call cheese from now on, and saved it. Wonder of wonder, the cheese was excellent!! I put some in a serving cup, added some jam, and what an excellent dish! It was a mix of the texture of farmers cheese and fine curd cottage cheese. I'm eating it still and hoping it has the good bacteria in it.

 

So I recouped, went back to basics and my original recipe and bought some more Gastrus tablets, 2% Lactaid milk, and siggis yogurt. It's been fermenting now for 26 hrs and it looks perfect again, like the yogurt it is supposed to be, and as it was initially. I guess simple is better, unless you want to make cheese!!

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#363 aribadabar

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Posted 13 June 2019 - 01:36 AM

 Here are my latest results from "bacterial cooking" :-D

 

No syneresis (thanks, ta5) this time after 15hrs;)

 

The most surprising result was from Gastrus whey sitting at room temps for a couple of months now judging by the texture. Granted, it is not as firm as coming from a real starter but from whey only I can't complain.

Biogaia Protectis and Jamieson BB-12 performed as expected with slightly more whey on top than usual.

The fridge-stored Gastrus whey seems in worse shape than the room temp one if the result is any guide.

The store-bought yoghurt is midly disappointing too - expected firmer consistency.

 

All 5 jars were prepared with 2% Natrel cow's milk at 100F and placed in pre-warmed oven at 110F or so, which was turned off and closed shut and let magic happen for 15 hrs.

 

Attached File  Starters.jpg   205.27KB   0 downloadsAttached File  results.jpg   136.72KB   0 downloads

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Edited by aribadabar, 13 June 2019 - 01:53 AM.


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#364 holdorfold

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Posted 20 June 2019 - 09:58 AM

I had the weirdest experience with the yoghurt. I made it with coconut milk and gelatin and sugar , sterilized everything well, fermented for well over 24h (closer to 48 probably).
Eating the yogurt made me SO INCREDIBLY TIRED! All day, I was living in a fog. Couldn’t do anything. I didn’t realize it was the yogurt at first, and it just kept getting worse. After 3 or 4 days I tossed the yogurt and the tiredness went away.
So this is second negative experience from people in this thread. Any suggestions what would be the mechanism of my symptoms? I’ve made yoghurt with same technique before with no problem.
This makes me question - do we know how good is their quality control? Are we sure we are getting what’s listed on the box?
Not related to gastrus, but there was a study on other probiotics showing huge discrepancies between label and contents.
I also once sent a yogurt from a different probiotic to a lab, and results showed 50% being unlisted bacteria.

 

 

I had a similar affect when I was experimenting, just not as pronounced. I put it down to increased oxytocin which is something known to promote sleep. It made me feel lazy, tired, but with a kind of warm fuzzy feeling accompanying it.

 

I knew the strain was working on some level because of that oxytocin like response response combined with heavier feeling testicles after a couple of days. Also, sometimes I would go into sneezing fits after taking the yogurt and the strain is known to increase histamine, so there's that correlation as well.



#365 Nate-2004

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Posted 23 June 2019 - 03:25 PM

When I first saw all this I jumped the gun a bit, motivated by my desire to increase oxytocin, which, genetically and experientially I'm apparently a bit low on. Might explain my failures with dating and social difficulties through life altogether. So I was motivated to make this yogurt, bought a sous vide pod and a container for a water bath with a lid, BioGaia, inulin, Ultra Pasteurized organic whole milk and went to town. First batch was quite yogurty, though likely because I didn't use any additives it was not nearly as thick as the whole milk Chobani yogurt I usually eat.  I combine yogurt with my bean dip recipe, full of prebiotic fiber and resistant starches. 

 

I have yet to discover whether using the previous batch to make more is going to work or help to prevent me from having to buy $29 worth of BioGaia every 3 batches but we'll see.  I'm going by the basic recipe and 36 hour fermentation time. 


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#366 Colorow

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Posted 23 June 2019 - 05:23 PM

Nate, I just finished a batch and am reminded that for me, second generation is the most creamy and delicious.  I use the basic recipe (1/2 gallon ultra pasteurized half and half, 4 tablespoons inulin,  starter, Anova sous vide, 36 hours at 100F, uncapped mason jars).

 

I don't drive my self crazy being sterile on each batch except the batch to generate the starter.  

 

For that batch I boil my mason jars, whisk, tongs, measuring spoon and let everything cool before using as sterile technique as I can to mix and start the yogurt.  I then freeze ice cubes of the resulting kinda curdy yogurt and whey and use these as my starter.

 

The yogurt made with the starter is fabulous.  Very thick and creamy.  No separation. Not sure about health results but I am in this for the long term. 

 

My theory is that I am minimizing contamination for the starter and as I never go further than second generation I am staying very close to the Gastrus organisms.   I get around 12 batches from each starter.  I think I could use less starter and still get good results but I have not tried.  

 

I dont know how to get the inulin sterile and my better looking yogurt results have been when I pulverized the Gastrus tablets in a nutrabullet (vs crushed in packet and pushed out in a more sterile manner).  Advice welcomed on how to get this part of my process more sterile if even necessary.

 

I make yogurt 1-2 times a week and each batch is identical to the last, takes me 5 minutes to set up.   Advice appreciated if anyone thinks I am deluding myself and I need to just keep with 1st generation each time.  But as Nate pointed out, that costs$$ and the yogurt is not as good as what I make second generation.

 

 


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#367 shp5

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Posted 24 June 2019 - 06:36 PM

Received Biogaia Osfortis 6475, at a very reasonable extra cost and delay.

 

The first batch is fermenting, minimalistic, Saint-Exupéry would be proud: 1 litre UHT milk container with screw top, content of one capsule thrown in, lid losely closed, fermented 36h at 37°C. Yields basically buttermilk with a pleasant sour taste. Am going to ferment it a bit longer to see what happens.



#368 JPowers

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Posted 24 June 2019 - 08:01 PM

Received Biogaia Osfortis 6475, at a very reasonable extra cost and delay.

 

The first batch is fermenting, minimalistic, Saint-Exupéry would be proud: 1 litre UHT milk container with screw top, content of one capsule thrown in, lid losely closed, fermented 36h at 37°C. Yields basically buttermilk with a pleasant sour taste. Am going to ferment it a bit longer to see what happens.

 

When this was first released recently and was only available on Everidis' website, I held off because the shipping was too expensive. I called BioGaia and was told it would be sold through Amazon, and I just ordered a bottle from them with free shipping the other day and it arrived within two. I plan to make yogurt soon, but you're the only person that I know of who has done this. The capsules have a much higher bacteria count than the previous Gastrus tablets, so I'm not sure how many capsules to use. One capsule of the Osfortis doesn't sound like a lot, but should have more bacteria than an entire package of Gastrus, correct?

 

I don't think fermenting longer than 36 hours will help. Subsequent batches should get thicker and thicker. Just eat/drink what you have and save a bit for the next batch. You might want to use a prebiotic, or glucose/dextrose, as others have mentioned.



#369 shp5

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Posted 24 June 2019 - 09:04 PM

I don't think fermenting longer than 36 hours will help. Subsequent batches should get thicker and thicker. Just eat/drink what you have and save a bit for the next batch. You might want to use a prebiotic, or glucose/dextrose, as others have mentioned.

 

 

 

early adopters pay premium, that's a cast iron rule.

 

both 1L packs of milk I inoculated did good, I used one capsule per litre. I still don't see how starch would be superior to glucose except to improve texture, but will try them both against each other.

 

All these guides seem very haphazard to me anyway, and at the same time the more plausible DIY MRS agar route is overcomplicated. In the end, we want a product rich in 6475, no? will it grow better with synergistic bacteria, will it be crowded out, will a 3rd generation batch from a multi-strain or contaminated mother even contain some 6475? It's all unknown.

 

probably gonna stick to the (glucose) milk with an osfortis capsule until someone has some good answers.


Edited by shp5, 24 June 2019 - 09:36 PM.

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#370 Nate-2004

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Posted 25 June 2019 - 11:26 PM

Nate, I just finished a batch and am reminded that for me, second generation is the most creamy and delicious.  I use the basic recipe (1/2 gallon ultra pasteurized half and half, 4 tablespoons inulin,  starter, Anova sous vide, 36 hours at 100F, uncapped mason jars).

 

I don't drive my self crazy being sterile on each batch except the batch to generate the starter.  

 

For that batch I boil my mason jars, whisk, tongs, measuring spoon and let everything cool before using as sterile technique as I can to mix and start the yogurt.  I then freeze ice cubes of the resulting kinda curdy yogurt and whey and use these as my starter.

 

The yogurt made with the starter is fabulous.  Very thick and creamy.  No separation. Not sure about health results but I am in this for the long term. 

 

My theory is that I am minimizing contamination for the starter and as I never go further than second generation I am staying very close to the Gastrus organisms.   I get around 12 batches from each starter.  I think I could use less starter and still get good results but I have not tried.  

 

I dont know how to get the inulin sterile and my better looking yogurt results have been when I pulverized the Gastrus tablets in a nutrabullet (vs crushed in packet and pushed out in a more sterile manner).  Advice welcomed on how to get this part of my process more sterile if even necessary.

 

I make yogurt 1-2 times a week and each batch is identical to the last, takes me 5 minutes to set up.   Advice appreciated if anyone thinks I am deluding myself and I need to just keep with 1st generation each time.  But as Nate pointed out, that costs$$ and the yogurt is not as good as what I make second generation.

 

You are right, my second generation is much thicker and tastes a little better for some reason. Also, I didn't use a new "sterile" jar I used the same 32 oz mason jar with some remaining yogurt, just poured everything on top and mixed it with a spoon. I only used 5 tabs crushed and mixed with the same amount of inulin this batch. I also stuck with 36 hours and will probably experiment with shorter times in the future but for now I'll stick with the basics. I haven't used sugar, just inulin. I'm betting the third generation might be even thicker. I gather that's because the population is much larger.

 

I would really like to get it tested in a lab at some point in the near future to find out if it's all the same bacteria found in the tabs and just what the CFU is. Any ideas on how I'd get this done?


Edited by Nate-2004, 25 June 2019 - 11:27 PM.


#371 Oakman

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Posted 26 June 2019 - 12:58 AM

Now Ostofortis is listed on Amazon, It listing is a bit of a mystery,

 

BioGaia Osfortis, Women's Probiotic for Strong Bones, GI Wellness, Hormone and Immune Balance, Contains L. reuteri 6475

 

Why is it "Women's Probiotic", and what "Hormone and Immune Balance" are they talking about?


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#372 granmasutensil

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Posted 26 June 2019 - 06:35 AM

Any thoughts on these two articles? They talk about reuteri traveling outside the gut to other organs in the body, kidney, spleen causing inflammation and possibly auto immune disorders. Also that digestive resistant starch inhibits reuteri growth. So maybe it should be avoided here? They are likely talking about a different strain of reuteri, and other bacteria have been noted of doing the same thing. So perhaps it's leaky gut causing an issue of gut bacteria getting to places where they shouldn't be causing issues. 

 

https://www.cell.com...12?showall=true

 

https://www.scienced...81220111821.htm


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#373 TerryFirmer

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Posted 26 June 2019 - 07:22 AM

As I mentioned before, the only major effect I noticed with Gastrus yoghurt was the elimination of itchy areas of skin on my lower legs which had plagued me for years - presumably some kind of eczema. I recently went abroad and had no access to the yoghurt for over two weeks. The skin problem immediately came back with a vengeance.

 

Whilst abroad I bought some Protectis tabs (strain 17938). I didn't take the tabs, but as soon as I got home I started making yoghurt with them. The skin problem was gone after little more than a week. Could be a placebo effect, but none of the other potions or lotions I've tried over the years has had such a dramatic impact.

 

Is eczema usually a leaky gut issue? Anyone else have any good results with either Gastrus or Protectis?



#374 mike20g

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Posted 26 June 2019 - 02:22 PM

My plan is to use previous yogurt batches to create new batches and have caps/tablets for a backup only. This approach saves money, but even bigger motivation is much better taste. For this reason I cancelled my order for Ostofortis, because I learned from online description that a 60 cap Ostofortis bottle has to be used within 60 days since the day bottle was opened. Gastrus will remain my choice of a backup for now.

 

Has anyone tried producing yogurt without heating milk first? If heating is unnecessary that would be a big time saver. I will try unheated milk next time after I come home from vacation and report back.

 

 

 

 



#375 Oakman

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Posted 26 June 2019 - 03:27 PM

My plan is to use previous yogurt batches to create new batches and have caps/tablets for a backup only. This approach saves money, but even bigger motivation is much better taste. For this reason I cancelled my order for Ostofortis, because I learned from online description that a 60 cap Ostofortis bottle has to be used within 60 days since the day bottle was opened. Gastrus will remain my choice of a backup for now.

 

Has anyone tried producing yogurt without heating milk first? If heating is unnecessary that would be a big time saver. I will try unheated milk next time after I come home from vacation and report back.

Except for the last time, prior ~10 times, I've never heated milk, rather used UHT milk. Seems can use past yogurt batches for new starter, but ideally, for best results, make a fresh starter and save (freeze or store) it and use it as a source for future batches. Rinse and repeat when you run out of that starter batch. Something about bacteria losing vitality and/or long ferments degrade vitality. Google 24 hr yogurt problems for various people's thoughts on it.



#376 mike20g

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Posted 26 June 2019 - 04:48 PM

Thank you, Oakman! I will try unheated milk next time. Did not know about the vitality impact from subsequent batches - I was hoping bacteria would enjoy living in my yogurt. Curious if freezing has a negative impact on reuteri. 


Edited by mike20g, 26 June 2019 - 04:49 PM.


#377 Oakman

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Posted 26 June 2019 - 10:27 PM

Thank you, Oakman! I will try unheated milk next time. Did not know about the vitality impact from subsequent batches - I was hoping bacteria would enjoy living in my yogurt. Curious if freezing has a negative impact on reuteri. 

Here's the reference I left out,  https://www.cultures...ng-time-yogurt/ the looks to be what we are dealing with. Yogurt is fascinating stuff.



#378 holdorfold

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Posted 27 June 2019 - 09:48 AM

For this reason I cancelled my order for Ostofortis, because I learned from online description that a 60 cap Ostofortis bottle has to be used within 60 days since the day bottle was opened. Gastrus will remain my choice of a backup for now.

 

60 pills and 60 days expiry, sounds a bit too perfect a match. Most likely a marketing ploy to ensure the user takes 2 caps a day for 10 billion CFU instead of 1 cap a day for 5 billion CFU, since I'm sure most people would be happy with 5 billion CFU per day and re-ordering every 120 days. But that would mean less money for Biogaia so that's probably one of the main reasons they put that 60 day notice on. 

In any case, perhaps if you refrigerate the bottle that would help?


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#379 shp5

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Posted 27 June 2019 - 10:00 PM

My bottle resides in the fridge, and I let it sit at room temperature before opening to avoid condensated moisture. If freezing is no problem for the bacteria, keeping a first gen mother for example in an ice cube tray/plastic bag would be a good strategy to reduce cost and share with friends.

Second batch with UHT and sterilised milk is now incubating. Added 15g of dextrose per litre.Am thinking about buying yeast extract for the next one.

This thing is really increasing my milk consumption, makes me wonder about the effects of that alone.

Edited by shp5, 27 June 2019 - 10:05 PM.

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#380 fntms

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Posted 28 June 2019 - 04:36 AM

Thank you, Oakman! I will try unheated milk next time. Did not know about the vitality impact from subsequent batches - I was hoping bacteria would enjoy living in my yogurt. Curious if freezing has a negative impact on reuteri.


I'm not sure why the bacteria would lose vitality batch after batch.
There was an article recently in the NY Times (I think) about an Indian family running the same yoghurt culture for 20+ years batch after batch.
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#381 shp5

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Posted 29 June 2019 - 08:09 PM

been having problems with my second batch. all had 15g dextrose in it. 

using sterilized milk (packs with years of shelf life) seems to be the way to go. microfiltrated milk with 2 weeks shelf life developed a very funny taste, threw it out.

I tried to reduce the inoculation dose to a half cap in sterilized milk, fermentation was slow and hasn't reached a satisfactory level after 36h.

did a mixed-strain pack with bifidum BB12 and acidophilus LA5 added from another probiotic, that one fared really good, nice thick acidic buttermilk. how much 6475 is in there? no clue.

 

next batch will include inoculation with a first gen 6475 mother. have a vage gut feeling that 37° might not be optimal, will try to find some pointers.

 

I think I feel a slight fuzzy warm feeling after consuming 150ml of 6475 buttermilk, but honestly that might be placebo. 

 

 


Edited by shp5, 29 June 2019 - 08:13 PM.


#382 sdxl

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Posted 30 June 2019 - 04:37 PM

early adopters pay premium, that's a cast iron rule.

 

both 1L packs of milk I inoculated did good, I used one capsule per litre. I still don't see how starch would be superior to glucose except to improve texture, but will try them both against each other.

 

All these guides seem very haphazard to me anyway, and at the same time the more plausible DIY MRS agar route is overcomplicated. In the end, we want a product rich in 6475, no? will it grow better with synergistic bacteria, will it be crowded out, will a 3rd generation batch from a multi-strain or contaminated mother even contain some 6475? It's all unknown.

 

probably gonna stick to the (glucose) milk with an osfortis capsule until someone has some good answers.

 

It isn't an agar, it's a broth or medium. Don't call it agar, agars are solid and contain agar. MRS, which was developed almost 60 years ago, is still the standard medium used today for lactobacilli. Why wouldn't you want to use a proven medium to culture these bacteria? Or at least a medium close to it. Defined media are far more complicated than what I am doing.

 

Making my own medium gives me flexibility. I can modify it for all sorts of experiments. I can omit certain ingredients, like citrate that stimulates the growth of DSM 17938 when culturing Gastrus. I can make the medium free from all major allergens. It's also cost effective, because a single tablet per liter is sufficient. It also gives me more visual information compared to milk as medium, like seeing the increase in turbidity and whether the Gastrus tablets dissolve. And yes, they do dissolve.  

 

To ensure consistent results when growing it with other bacteria in milk you should inoculate your cultures separately for each batch. Streptococcus thermophilus is a species that comes up a lot in milk fermentation studies and may help. You can get suitable cultures from Chr. Hansen and DuPont. 

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#383 Keizo

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Posted 01 July 2019 - 12:52 AM

When this was first released recently and was only available on Everidis' website, I held off because the shipping was too expensive. I called BioGaia and was told it would be sold through Amazon, and I just ordered a bottle from them with free shipping the other day and it arrived within two. I plan to make yogurt soon, but you're the only person that I know of who has done this. The capsules have a much higher bacteria count than the previous Gastrus tablets, so I'm not sure how many capsules to use. One capsule of the Osfortis doesn't sound like a lot, but should have more bacteria than an entire package of Gastrus, correct?

 

I don't think fermenting longer than 36 hours will help. Subsequent batches should get thicker and thicker. Just eat/drink what you have and save a bit for the next batch. You might want to use a prebiotic, or glucose/dextrose, as others have mentioned.

How do you know they have a higher bacteria content? I already stated this before but amount of viable bacteria at time of manufacture and ditto at time of expiration are different things. The gastrus tablets state at time of expiration (or "minimum of 200...."), which is something like 2 years after manufacture.  USA only product at the moment AFAIK. It might simply be the case that they chose to go by different ways of stating something not so different.

 

It also doesn't make much sense that they recommend 1 tablet of gastrus and 1-2 of Osfortis, if they have vastly different numbers of bacteria at time of use. Unless the other strain in Gastrus is vastly more potent, or whatever. Now I don't think it actually says "at time of manufacture" on osfortis, but the wording is totally different nevertheless from the gastrus packages I've seen.


Edited by Keizo, 01 July 2019 - 12:56 AM.

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#384 fntms

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Posted 02 July 2019 - 04:29 AM

been having problems with my second batch. all had 15g dextrose in it.
using sterilized milk (packs with years of shelf life) seems to be the way to go. microfiltrated milk with 2 weeks shelf life developed a very funny taste, threw it out.
I tried to reduce the inoculation dose to a half cap in sterilized milk, fermentation was slow and hasn't reached a satisfactory level after 36h.


So the uncooked uht milk method doesn't work it seems. I had the same experience and now always cook the uht milk for 5 10 minutes. When I forget the glucose/dextrose I get slower or weak fermentation. First batch is also weaker and slower than following batches (at least for gastrus yoghurt, just started the osfortis fermentation).

#385 shp5

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Posted 02 July 2019 - 06:35 AM

The bb-12 / LA-5 probiotic I used was so prolific it resulted, repeatedly,  in a thick acid product already after 12h, I guess they'd be fine with unsterilised milk. I can't seem to reproduce my first successful batch with 6475 though. I do wonder now how many CFUs are really in (my) osfortis, if it got damaged during transport, or if the medium just isn't right for 6475, and first batch got contaminated with other lactobacilli.


Edited by shp5, 02 July 2019 - 06:58 AM.


#386 ta5

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Posted 03 July 2019 - 01:31 AM

I made several batches of almond milk "yogurt", where the almond milk was made from almond milk concentrate.

Per cup it had:
 
Fat: 13.8g
Carbs: 5.2g (Sugars: 1.7g)
Protein: 6.0g
 
Some batches had added Whey Protein Isolate or Dextrose.
 
The only effect I noticed from the whey protein was that it seemed to result in less "whey" separation (syneresis). It's interesting that almond milk is not milk, but it still causes syneresis just the same.
 
The ones with no Dextrose smelled like horse manure. Not a strong smell. It was weak, but pretty vile. And, I ate them. I might not have eaten them if it was only one odd-ball batch. At first I was concerned that it was contaminated with yeast or something. But, they looked like the others. The texture was the same, not stringy. There was syneresis and the pH was lower (down to 5.3, which isn't very low - most yogurt is a point lower than that). They had plenty of starter. They were all heated to 180°F beforehand, like I always do. It tasted okay if I ignore the smell. It didn't really taste like anything. It didn't make me sick. So, I kept eating it. Maybe stupid.
 
The batches with Dextrose smelled and tasted much better. Still not much taste - mostly minus the bad smell. 
 
Why did this happen?
 
I wonder if this is simply what happens when the sugars are too low. Lacto bacteria turn sugar into lactic acid, and there wasn't enough sugar to do that to the level of normal yogurt. But, this doesn't fully explain it because the pH was about the same as the batches with Dextrose.
 
Whole milk has 12g per cup carbs and it's almost all sugars, mainly lactose. So, only 1.7g of sugar is extremely low compared to whole milk, and even those sugars might not be sugars that Reuteri would like. It's definitely not lactose. I don't know what it is. Maybe fructose? 
 
But, what was really going on? And why did it smell like manure? There was growth and activity: the texture changed and pH changed, like the bacteria were doing their thing. I'm curious what the bacteria do instead when there's not enough sugar. I wonder if it's like a keto diet for bacteria and forces them to change their metabolism.

Edited by ta5, 03 July 2019 - 01:34 AM.

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#387 sdxl

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Posted 03 July 2019 - 02:02 PM



The bb-12 / LA-5 probiotic I used was so prolific it resulted, repeatedly,  in a thick acid product already after 12h, I guess they'd be fine with unsterilised milk. I can't seem to reproduce my first successful batch with 6475 though. I do wonder now how many CFUs are really in (my) osfortis, if it got damaged during transport, or if the medium just isn't right for 6475, and first batch got contaminated with other lactobacilli.

I recommend that you at least boil your medium to kill off any vegetative bacteria. Sterilization requires something like a pressure cooker. BB-12 and LA-5 are used in many probiotic dairy products, so I'm not surprised they grow well in milk.

 
BioGaia has warned that milk isn't a proper medium for their bacteria.

 

Is it possible to make yoghurt by adding BioGaia’s probiotic L. reuteri strains to milk?
 
It cannot be recommended to use BioGaia’s probiotic Lactobacillus reuteri strains for yoghurt production. The BioGaia L. reuteri strains are probiotic bacteria of human origin that thrives in the human GI tract and exerts its effect there. It does not produce the right compounds that turn milk into yoghurt. They do not multiply properly and do not give texture or flavor to the product when fermented in any type of food.
 
BioGaia cannot take responsibility for the safety of “yoghurt products” produced at home with our probiotic strains.

 

 

You can do a cell count on the capsules or let a lab do it for you. I would grow it in a more appropriate medium first to see if they grow better.

 

While not about any of BioGaia's strains, this study may give some insights on culturing reuteri in milk.

  • Informative x 1

#388 Oakman

  • Location:CO

Posted 03 July 2019 - 04:37 PM

 

I recommend that you at least boil your medium to kill off any vegetative bacteria. Sterilization requires something like a pressure cooker. BB-12 and LA-5 are used in many probiotic dairy products, so I'm not surprised they grow well in milk.

 
BioGaia has warned that milk isn't a proper medium for their bacteria.

 

 

You can do a cell count on the capsules or let a lab do it for you. I would grow it in a more appropriate medium first to see if they grow better.

 

While not about any of BioGaia's strains, this study may give some insights on culturing reuteri in milk.

 

Overall, that's fairly discouraging for yogurt production with L. reuteri. Perhaps the best we can expect is to choose some other beneficial bacteria for yogurt making, then add L reuteri to the final product before consuming. Unfortunately, that pretty much negates any benefits that might have come from the hoped for multiplicative effects of yogurt production.



#389 aribadabar

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Posted 04 July 2019 - 02:25 PM

Now Ostofortis is listed on Amazon, It listing is a bit of a mystery,

 

BioGaia Osfortis, Women's Probiotic for Strong Bones, GI Wellness, Hormone and Immune Balance, Contains L. reuteri 6475

 

Why is it "Women's Probiotic", and what "Hormone and Immune Balance" are they talking about?

 

 

I surmise they refer to these papers:

 

Bone health (osteoporosis is a predominantly women's issue which is hormonally-mediated):

https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/29926979

 

Immunomodulation:

https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/30452879

https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/24123819

https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/18425802



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#390 Ovidus

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Posted 06 July 2019 - 08:15 PM

Any thoughts on these two articles? They talk about reuteri traveling outside the gut to other organs in the body, kidney, spleen causing inflammation and possibly auto immune disorders. Also that digestive resistant starch inhibits reuteri growth. So maybe it should be avoided here? They are likely talking about a different strain of reuteri, and other bacteria have been noted of doing the same thing. So perhaps it's leaky gut causing an issue of gut bacteria getting to places where they shouldn't be causing issues. 

 

https://www.cell.com...12?showall=true

 

https://www.scienced...81220111821.htm

 

Anyone have any idea on this?

Everyone seems more concerned about the texture and taste of the resulting yogurt, but this is a serious concern.

 

Earlier in the thread I explained how I experienced inflammation from Reuteri yogurt.

 

Thanks all







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