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Nicotinamide Riboside (NR/Niagen) personal experience thread

nicotinamide ribo nr niagen nad niagen sinclair hpn n(r) david sinclair basis

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#331 D Mason

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Posted 25 September 2014 - 04:22 PM

 

The only effect noted is a tendency for loose stools when at 1 gram or more which has limited dosing to <1 gram.  And virtually nothing has given me issues with loose stools before so I was surprised...but unhappy with this.

 

 

For the past couple of days, I've mixed HPN Niagen with water (and potato starch). That seems to do the trick!

Adding potato starch, because it tastes alkaline. My rudimentary hypothesis: the stool problems are due to the excipients, which cause irritation of the mucosal membrane of the bowel.

HPN Niagen is way less caustic than Thorne Research's NiaCel! But still unusable sublingually. As far as I can tell, others haven't had any issues with sublingual administration. Oddly.

Anyway.

It probably works just as well without potato starch, but thought I'd mention it, since it may make a difference -- regardless of how improbable.

Live Cell Research's Niagan doesn't include excipients. So, I've ordered some, to test my theory.

 

 

When I first started Niagen, I also got the loose stool.  It was so bad, I just stopped taking it for a week.  That was with HPN's Niagen.    I tried again a week later and it went away.   My second bottle was from LCR and I had no problems.  

 

I've heard some companies need lubricants to prevent their machines from clogging.  But if LCR can do it, they should be able to do it too. 
 



#332 Bryan_S

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Posted 25 September 2014 - 04:33 PM

Thanks APBT,

 

So if 2 capsules give you 250 mg of (NR) and that's "assumed" to be true at the moment and the combined weight of 2 capsules is 600 mg then the Wt of the (NR) is 41.66% of the capsules contents. Someone correct me if I'm mistaken?

 

Then it can be "assumed" we are looking at 58.34% filler or a little more than half. If we were to dissolve away the NR and dry the remaining contents we should have an exact figure.

 

I think we can at least say for now more than 1/2 of what we consume is the filler. This also by no way infers we aren't getting our intended dose.

 

Still not establishing what's causing the soft stool for some and as I mentioned that passed a long time ago for me and I'm not seeing this as a consistent experience.



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#333 Bryan_S

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Posted 25 September 2014 - 05:07 PM

 

 

When I first started Niagen, I also got the loose stool.  It was so bad, I just stopped taking it for a week.  That was with HPN's Niagen.    I tried again a week later and it went away.   My second bottle was from LCR and I had no problems.  

 

I've heard some companies need lubricants to prevent their machines from clogging.  But if LCR can do it, they should be able to do it too. 
 

 

 

D Mason, I'm still taking the HPN Niagen so I don't detect a correlation because I didn't switch to anyone else and I'm fine. We should look to see if this experience is across the board with all of the distributers. If not this may just be what everyone might experience if they obtained the product directly from ChromaDex.

 

I also look at the fact that many of us take more than the recommended dose and some of us are putting it under our tongue. Both of these are outside the box so to speak. One thing I can say is I now know why there is so much stuff remaining under my tongue when I take a dose this way. Guess I could just rinse whats left out of my mouth but I'm no longer bothered with a soft stool so why bother.

 

The only way I could see to establish what the cause is it to go off the product for an extended time and then resume by dissolving the NR out of the filler and consume only that. Like making a tea. Then if the soft stool returned you could say it was the (NR) if not you could assume it was the filler. However one person hardly creates a data point to determine this.


Edited by Bryan_S, 25 September 2014 - 05:09 PM.


#334 SMichelle28

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Posted 25 September 2014 - 06:25 PM


Nothing noted, no differences, over a year using 1-2 gram per day depending -- other than maybe the insomnia component later identified here.

I use other mitochondrial enhancers (C60, PQQ, others) so my mitochondrial tank may already be full as it were. I don't feel the hype though, but I believe in the science.


I 2nd this. I'm 57 but in excellent health with no health issues. Been using 500 mg to 1 gram of NR daily for 6 months with no positive effects noted. The only effect noted is a tendency for loose stools when at 1 gram or more which has limited dosing to <1 gram. And virtually nothing has given me issues with loose stools before so I was surprised...but unhappy with this. Currently, I've been dosing 375 mg bid (for total 750 mg daily) for the past 3 months. I spent over a $1000 on the first group buy so continue to dose on blind faith. I don't even notice the insomnia reported...if anything, I've felt more tired and need for sleep has increased....but this could be work related. I believe the few hyped positive reports are either placebo or clever marketing. Perhaps people with some health issues may benefit...I don't know. I can add that I have taken a gram or more daily of Resveratrol for the past 8 years, 3 mg C60/EVOO daily for more than 2 years, and 10 mg mitoQ for the past 6 weeks (now mitoQ, unlike NR, I could feel some increased mental energy and stamina) along with a variety of other common supplements I've used over the past 15 years, along with proper diet and exercise. C60/EVOO (besides creatine and resveratrol) has been the only supplements to obviously increase exercise tolerance....6 months of NR has had absolutely no impact on exercise...or anything else positive. But like everybody else....I'm living on hope and faith.

Edit: The human physiology is VERY adept at maintaining homeostasis so no matter the science of NR, if NAD+ is already in sufficient quantities and not impeding the KREBS cycle, no amount of NR is going to improve upon healthy levels in healthy individuals. I believe C60/EVOO improves the ETC and NR is not going to add anything additional beyond that to healthy active individuals.

It seems like those who aren't experiencing much are taking other supplements that target similar functions in the body. I have seen a wide range of reactions from taking NR but I had no prior experience of regular supplementation before NR. I am also taking it with pterostilbene from Chromadex's Purenergy supplement, so that could be adding to the positive effects I am having. I am healthy but on the higher end of a normal healthy weight... I am observing fat loss and muscle gain... I did need an adjustment to my fat to muscle ratio. I figure if you are already very fit and muscular it may not make much of a change in that aspect. I think NR will probably be more useful and helpful to those that are more unhealthy!

#335 SMichelle28

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Posted 25 September 2014 - 06:51 PM



The only effect noted is a tendency for loose stools when at 1 gram or more which has limited dosing to <1 gram. And virtually nothing has given me issues with loose stools before so I was surprised...but unhappy with this.


For the past couple of days, I've mixed HPN Niagen with water (and potato starch). That seems to do the trick!

Adding potato starch, because it tastes alkaline. My rudimentary hypothesis: the stool problems are due to the excipients, which cause irritation of the mucosal membrane of the bowel.

HPN Niagen is way less caustic than Thorne Research's NiaCel! But still unusable sublingually. As far as I can tell, others haven't had any issues with sublingual administration. Oddly.

Anyway.

It probably works just as well without potato starch, but thought I'd mention it, since it may make a difference -- regardless of how improbable.

Live Cell Research's Niagan doesn't include excipients. So, I've ordered some, to test my theory.


Interesting conversation on fillers and soft stool. So from what I'm hearing different distributers are using different fillers or amounts, is this correct? From what I'm hearing in todays conversation this filler is an irritant to the mucus membranes. If this is the case are some distributers adding fillers after ChromaDex ships them their product for packaging? Where is the value add? Or is ChromaDex adding a filler before shipping to their distributers? What is the real Nicotinamide Riboside (NR) content to filler ratio from each of the distributers? How much (NR) am I getting in a 125 mg capsule?

These are important questions to me, these seem to be things you guys are implying.

I use the HPN product, I take it sublingually but agree it isn't ideally formulated to use this way. I empty one capsule under the tongue at a time and let the (NR) dissolve out of the filler without moving my tongue around very much. I then add another capsule before the last one has totally dissipated and so on. I've learned to avoid creating a big dry spot. I found when I did, moving my tongue around irritated that spot in my mouth like sand paper. Still done right a small area feels sensitive for a short while afterwards but goes away.

So what I want to know from this conversation, "are the distributers cutting the product?" If so by how much? Also what is this filler? "How mush active ingredient are we receiving?" I will say after my first month where if you've read my posts I had a hard time determining the affects until I stopped taking it, but what I haven't mentioned is when I restarted I resumed taking it sublingually because I'd read a post about it on Longecity, later someone posted this URL link. I felt I needed to increase (NR)'s activity and I have to say I feel more alert after taking it this way. In those early days I also experienced soft stool but it has since passed.

I didn't pay much attention to it but I have been experiencing loose stools as well. I probably didn't notice because I would have them sometimes before NR but it's much more frequent now than it used to be.

So I seem to be having more of a reaction to NR than a some and at a lower amount. You mentioned that it worked more effectively when you take it sublingually. The form of Niagen I have dissolves in the mouth before swallowing... I don't place it sublingually but since it dissolves in my mouth I might have some sublingual absorption unlike those who take it in pill form. I am going to start placing the tablet under my tongue now to see if I have any changes in my reaction to it.

#336 mikela

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Posted 25 September 2014 - 08:57 PM

Thanks APBT,

 

So if 2 capsules give you 250 mg of (NR) and that's "assumed" to be true at the moment and the combined weight of 2 capsules is 600 mg then the Wt of the (NR) is 41.66% of the capsules contents. Someone correct me if I'm mistaken?

 

Then it can be "assumed" we are looking at 58.34% filler or a little more than half. If we were to dissolve away the NR and dry the remaining contents we should have an exact figure.

 

I think we can at least say for now more than 1/2 of what we consume is the filler. This also by no way infers we aren't getting our intended dose.

 

Still not establishing what's causing the soft stool for some and as I mentioned that passed a long time ago for me and I'm not seeing this as a consistent experience.

 

It might be worthwhile to mention this in the vendor's thread and see what they say.



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#337 niner

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Posted 26 September 2014 - 01:37 AM

I think we can at least say for now more than 1/2 of what we consume is the filler. This also by no way infers we aren't getting our intended dose.

 

Still not establishing what's causing the soft stool for some and as I mentioned that passed a long time ago for me and I'm not seeing this as a consistent experience.

 

The fillers they're using are nothing out of the ordinary, so those of use who take other supplements have been getting them for a long time.  I've never had any sort of bad reaction to fillers that I'm aware of.  It's unusual, but not unheard of for people to have issues with the various substances that fall under the "filler" category.  I think that if a lot of people are reporting soft stools from NR, it's probably the NR and not something else in the mix.  For a single-component supplement from a decent manufacturer, you are pretty likely to be getting the labeled amount of compound, or close to it. 


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#338 Bryan_S

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Posted 26 September 2014 - 05:25 PM

Thanks niner, I'm working on getting a definitive answer on this filler topic from ChromaDex directly. I'm pretty satisfied there is nothing out of the ordinary here and we did learn a few things. I'm also convinced there is nothing wrong with the product or the ingredients. It may be true that some people are sensitive to the (NR) but as I mentioned I only experienced the soft stool once and that could have been unrelated. So for me this has come full circle but I'll pass on anything else I learn as soon as I get it.


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#339 1thoughtMaze1

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Posted 27 September 2014 - 04:55 AM

I don't know why nobody is talking about mitotrans. Guess it's the price. They are shipping domestically now.

#340 The_Next_LX

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Posted 27 September 2014 - 12:35 PM

I don't know why nobody is talking about mitotrans. Guess it's the price. They are shipping domestically now.

 

 

 

Well, what is the price? I still can't see where in the Biotiva site where you can buy it--they also mention you can pre-register to buy it, but where??

 

I emailed the link to the site to friend mentioning the above. When I later asked what he thought about it, he said, oh, he had bought some at my recommendation--(??)--and when I asked further, it turned out he had actually bought TransMax,  Biotiva's version of resveratrol. 

 

If anyone can enlighten me. thank you!

 

http://www.biotivia....ans-naturalnews

  MitoTrans-box2.png



#341 niner

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Posted 27 September 2014 - 02:26 PM

 

I don't know why nobody is talking about mitotrans. Guess it's the price. They are shipping domestically now.

 

 

Well, what is the price? I still can't see where in the Biotiva site where you can buy it--they also mention you can pre-register to buy it, but where??

 

I emailed the link to the site to friend mentioning the above. When I later asked what he thought about it, he said, oh, he had bought some at my recommendation--(??)--and when I asked further, it turned out he had actually bought TransMax,  Biotiva's version of resveratrol. 

 

If anyone can enlighten me. thank you!

 

Maybe no one is talking about mitotrans because the company is famous for deceptive advertising, they haven't specified what it even IS, (I highly doubt that it's "NAD+") and they don't even appear to be selling it yet, since the link they provide for more information leads to their resveratrol product.  If they actually are selling it, and it is in fact NR, then it's a commodity product that everyone gets from the same manufacturer, Chromadex.  As such, selection really boils down to dollars per gram and the reputation of the company selling it.  It doesn't sound like these guys win on either of those fronts.


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#342 Bryan_S

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Posted 27 September 2014 - 06:55 PM

 

 

I don't know why nobody is talking about mitotrans. Guess it's the price. They are shipping domestically now.

 

 

Well, what is the price? I still can't see where in the Biotiva site where you can buy it--they also mention you can pre-register to buy it, but where??

 

I emailed the link to the site to friend mentioning the above. When I later asked what he thought about it, he said, oh, he had bought some at my recommendation--(??)--and when I asked further, it turned out he had actually bought TransMax,  Biotiva's version of resveratrol. 

 

If anyone can enlighten me. thank you!

 

Maybe no one is talking about mitotrans because the company is famous for deceptive advertising, they haven't specified what it even IS, (I highly doubt that it's "NAD+") and they don't even appear to be selling it yet, since the link they provide for more information leads to their resveratrol product.  If they actually are selling it, and it is in fact NR, then it's a commodity product that everyone gets from the same manufacturer, Chromadex.  As such, selection really boils down to dollars per gram and the reputation of the company selling it.  It doesn't sound like these guys win on either of those fronts.

 

 

 

The way I understand it (please correct me if I'm wrong guys) if a distributed product contains Nicotinamide Riboside its going to contain the brand name "Niagen" in its labeling. ChromaDex holds the product trade mark rights for this ingredient name. I count 4 licensed distributers to market the "Niagen" ingredient brand. Healthy Directions, 5LINX, Thorne Research and High Performance Nutrition (HPN). This information was obtained through searching the SEC Edger filings and the ChromaDex Press releases See URL links.

  Serial Number Reg. Number Word Mark Check Status Live/Dead 1 86032568 4470982 TSDR LIVE 2 85932490 4606519 NIAGEN TSDR LIVE
 

These companies were announced as ingredient suppliers and we may see more to come. 

 

Now I won't disparage any other brands out there but there are 2 not mentioned in any corporate press release that have relabeled the "Niagen" product ingredient under their own companies and they "may" have hidden license agreements with ChromaDex or under one of the big 4 distributers. But until I can confirm them with the corporate office I'll leave them off the list for now. However it's my understanding and I could be wrong if you resell the ChromaDex product ingredient from one of the aforementioned main distributers you can not legally relabel the product as a new brand when you resell it. That labeling must remain in tact from the original licensed supplier. If you as a reseller create another "Niagen" formulation or brand label to sell the "Niagen" ingredient that would be something you would have to have approved from the ChromaDex main office.

 

They don't seem to be handing these agreements out willy-nilly and they all seem to include volume expectations so the hurdle to market the "Niagen" ingredient seems to be very high. Now I am not privy to the corporate license agreement but I suppose a distributer may be able to empower someone in their supply chain to do this but at this point I've not seen an example of any distributer with this broad power.

 

5LINX is the one ingredient distributer/marketing company I know the least about.

 

So I'm going to go out on a limb here and say MitoTrans is an unrelated product or we'd have seen some reference back to the "Niagen" ingredient branding which is under control of ChromaDex.

 

This is the ChromaDex supply chain as I understand it, and there may be some smaller retail outlets not mentioned. The one consistent fact is there are 4 main "Niagen" brands and each reseller under them sells their product offering with the parent distributers label in tact:

 

09/11/14 Healthy Directions

 

01/01/14 5LINX

 

07/08/13 Thorne Research and Thorne Research

Natural Partners, Inc.

Earth Turns LLC

Natural Healthy Concepts

PureFormulas Inc

Covenant Health Products

 

06/25/13 High Performance Nutrition (HPN)

Swanson Health Products

Tiger Fitness Inc.

Synergistic Nutrition 

Amazon

SmartHealthPlace

Cycle-Breakers

ProHealth

Muscle Research

drugstore.com, inc

 

At this point it appears as though if the product contains a unique company label and uses the "Niagen" ingredient, its through a ChromaDex license agreement and those developments are publicly announced and well known. From the aforementioned I don't think MitoTrans is part of the "Niagen" ingredient supply chain.

 

Hope this helps.


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#343 aribadabar

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Posted 27 September 2014 - 07:50 PM

So where Live Cell Research fits into this structure? I can't find a news release by Chromadex having an agreement with them yet they market a NR product under the Niagen name?



#344 The_Next_LX

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Posted 27 September 2014 - 08:00 PM

Here's an article I haven't seen before (although others might have):

 

 

http://modernliferev...esearch-review/

 

 

mlsmall.png
 
 

 

    Niagen: My Experience After One Month

 

 

I have a secret.

I recently wrote about Nicotinamide Riboside.

But I omitted the fact that I have been taking Niagen for over a month now.

It would have been irresponsible to mention it in that article. When major research scientists find a substance that is celebrated as the fountain of youth, it is easy to be skeptical. But it is just as easy to get overly excited.

It’s easy to confuse the signals from your body with the signals from your hopes.

Given the strange and confusing results I had, it was important I didn’t share them in the previous article.

I wanted you to form your own opinion, given the facts available about Nicotinamide Riboside, without being influenced by my mind-blowing experience. Perhaps even try NR yourself.

If you haven’t read the previous article I wrote about Nicotinamide Riboside, check it out. Because there are spoilers ahead.

About Niagen

Nicotinamide Riboside (NR or Niagen) is thought to be the most effective NAD+ precursor to support mitochondrial health. Niagen is found in some foods, but in small amounts.  A publicly traded company called ChromaDex (CDCX) has patented a hugely innovative process for the bulk manufacture of Nicotinamide Riboside. They manufacture NR in its raw form under the trademark, Niagen.

Supplement companies are able to purchase the raw material from ChromaDex and license the name, Niagen, so they can encapsulate the raw material and market it as they wish.

What differentiates retail versions of Niagen is how they’re handled at the time of encapsulation.

Some companies add fillers and preservatives. Some companies don’t. Some use vegetarian capsules. Some don’t. Some use third party testing for purity and some don’t.

Live Cell Research Niagen

I started using Live Cell Research Niagen because I purchased from the company before.

Live Cell Research also makes a nootropic stack called Cerastim that I take every day and am very happy with. Their Niagen has no additives or stabilizers such as magnesium stearate, an animal bi-product. Their capsules are vegetable cellulose.

Live Cell Research also uses independent labs for third-party testing.

The final factor of course is price. Live Cell Research offers a deal on three bottles that comes out to $39 a bottle. There’s a thread on longecity.org putting together a group buy, but the price is only a few bucks cheaper, requires a purchase of six bottles and is taking a while for the deal to come together.

So I went with the the Live Cell Research deal.

My Experience with Niagen

I started taking Live Cell Research Niagen just over a month ago. I was taking 250mg upon waking, as directed.

For the first four days, I didn’t notice anything.

So I decided to up the dose. I went from 250mg in the morning to 250mg in the morning and 250mg before bed. 500mg a day total.

That first night, I had a little trouble falling asleep, but nothing major.

The next day, I woke up naturally. It was 6am. That’s weird, I thought. I had only gotten 6 hours of sleep but I felt fine. I jumped out of bed and into the shower. I’m not a morning person but I occasionally wake up early feeling good, so didn’t think twice about it.

The following day, the same thing happened.

That evening I fell asleep just fine. And the next morning, I woke up early feeling great again.

I sat in bed thinking about how nice it felt to wake up early feeling refreshed. I had vivid memories of a strange dream involving a hotel with endless corridors and it was like I went from having this intense dream to drifting out of it and into my bed. It was like the dream was just a memory, not a jarring ordeal struggling to pull me back in. It was like at the end of Inception when Leo drifts out of the dreamscape and is peacefully sitting in first class.

It reminded me of something else other than Inception. It reminded me of what it was like to wake up as a small child. To wake up naturally and full of energy. To jump out of bed and dart to the den to watch cartoons.

That’s when I began to wonder if Niagen was working. I was extremely skeptical. I had no reason to believe this was the type of supplement that you either feel is working or you don’t. As opposed to caffeine or bacopa extract. And if you did read my previous article about Nicotinamide Riboside, you know I was initially skeptical about human dosing. (The reason I upped the dose to 500mg/day in the first place.)

So I decided to call my friend, Kevin, a pretty serious weightlifting enthusiast, who I knew was also taking Niagen. I didn’t want to bias him with my experience so I casually asked him what he thought of Niagen. He said that his recovery time from the gym had improved. I asked him if he noticed anything else. He said that he was needing less sleep and having vivid dreams that were easy to remember. Then I asked him how long it took for that to start happening. He said it started immediately after he upped his dose to 500mg.

Wow.

That freaked me out.

I continued taking Niagen for a week and experienced those amazing mornings every single day.

So then I decided it was time to test this.

I decided to go off of Niagen for a week.

By the next morning, the effect was gone. I woke up groggy and foggy, feeling like I was still half dreaming. After a week of bliss, this felt horrible.

I continued this way for the week and within a few days, I just got used to waking up groggy as the status quo.

After a week, I started taking Niagen again. By the next day, it was back to waking up rested like a baby. I’ve been taking Niagen ever since and I highly recommend it.

You can learn more about Niagen on the Live Cell Research Website.



#345 The_Next_LX

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Posted 27 September 2014 - 08:11 PM

And this (by the same author/same blog)

 

 

http://modernliferev...nti-aging-scam/

 

 

Standard dosing for retail nicotinamide riboside, marketed under the names Niagen, N® and a few others, is typically 250mg a day.

 

In fact, some people are so obsessed with mega-dosing NR that there’s a thread on longecity.org dedicated to nicotinamide riboside group buy.

 

So the question becomes, can nicotinamide riboside be effective at available doses?

 

It turns out, the answer is possibly yes.

 

When I first wrote this article, I made a common mistake when extrapolating dosing from animals to humans. My calculation was based only on a body mass conversion.

 

A source contacted me, citing a paper by Reagan-Shaw, et al. titled, Dose translation from animal to human studies revisited.

 

According to the paper:

"The animal dose should not be extrapolated to a human equivalent dose (HED) by a simple conversion based on body weight, as was reported. For the more appropriate conversion of drug doses from animal studies to human studies, we suggest using the body surface area (BSA) normalization method. BSA correlates well across several mammalian species with several parameters of biology, including oxygen utilization, caloric expenditure, basal metabolism, blood volume, circulating plasma proteins, and renal function."

BSA.png

 

Using this methodology and the formula for BSA translation, a more accurate dose translation from rats to 150 pound human roughly yields a daily dose around 2200mg. This is considerably closer to the currently available retail options and a source tells me that a current human study has subjects on doses nearing that number and that we will know a lot more about accurate dosing and efficacy the near future.

 

Hmmm--2200mg--that's doable!



#346 midas

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Posted 27 September 2014 - 08:22 PM

So where Live Cell Research fits into this structure? I can't find a news release by Chromadex having an agreement with them yet they market a NR product under the Niagen name?

 

http://livecellresea.../niagen/faq.php

"Identified by Dr. Anthony A. Sauve of Weill Cornell Medical College, Niagen is manufactured by Chromadex, a publicly traded company. Live Cell Research buys Niagen™ directly from Chromadex"



#347 aribadabar

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Posted 27 September 2014 - 08:31 PM

Prompted by Bryan_S's research above I dived in the press releases that Chromadex posted on their website. The one from June 3 doesn't sound good for us long-term IMO:
 

 

 

Frank Jaksch, CEO and Founder of ChromaDex, stated, "The acquisition of these additional Dartmouth patent rights allows for ChromaDex to commercialize NR as a drug.  Together with our existing patent portfolio pertaining to NR, we believe our ownership of these new patent rights creates a significant and meaningful barrier to entry for would-be competitors in the entire NAD+ precursor market." 

 

Available only by Rx on the horizon and price going up even more?


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#348 aribadabar

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Posted 27 September 2014 - 08:36 PM

 

So where Live Cell Research fits into this structure? I can't find a news release by Chromadex having an agreement with them yet they market a NR product under the Niagen name?

 

http://livecellresea.../niagen/faq.php

"Identified by Dr. Anthony A. Sauve of Weill Cornell Medical College, Niagen is manufactured by Chromadex, a publicly traded company. Live Cell Research buys Niagen™ directly from Chromadex"

 

I want to see ChromaDex acknowledging this (like it did for 5LINX, HPN , Healthy Directions and Thorne) not the other way around.

 

That being said, Doctor's Best is also missing from the PRs. I guess Doctor's Best and LCR are small customers compared to the previous 4.


Edited by aribadabar, 27 September 2014 - 09:09 PM.


#349 Bryan_S

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Posted 27 September 2014 - 08:43 PM

Prompted by Bryan_S's research above I dived in the press releases that Chromadex posted on their website. The one from June 3 doesn't sound good for us long-term IMO:
 

 

 

Frank Jaksch, CEO and Founder of ChromaDex, stated, "The acquisition of these additional Dartmouth patent rights allows for ChromaDex to commercialize NR as a drug.  Together with our existing patent portfolio pertaining to NR, we believe our ownership of these new patent rights creates a significant and meaningful barrier to entry for would-be competitors in the entire NAD+ precursor market." 

 

Available only by Rx on the horizon and price going up even more?

 

I wouldn't raise the alarmist flag yet. They are building a huge distribution chain as I mentioned. You don't suddenly cut supply, restrict and take a different path without massive lawsuits. No this is a barrier to competition on so many levels but not for the Niagen ingredient in the nutritional market.


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#350 midas

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Posted 27 September 2014 - 08:57 PM

 

 

So where Live Cell Research fits into this structure? I can't find a news release by Chromadex having an agreement with them yet they market a NR product under the Niagen name?

 

http://livecellresea.../niagen/faq.php

"Identified by Dr. Anthony A. Sauve of Weill Cornell Medical College, Niagen is manufactured by Chromadex, a publicly traded company. Live Cell Research buys Niagen™ directly from Chromadex"

 

I want to see ChromaDex acknowledging this (like it did for 5LINX, HPN , Healthy Directions and Thorne) not the other way around.

 

 

Maybe you should throw them an e-mail?

 

Another company they seem to be dealing with is Doctors Best and I am sure their will be more. I seem to remember another one in Germany who's name escapes me right now.



#351 midas

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Posted 27 September 2014 - 09:05 PM

 

Prompted by Bryan_S's research above I dived in the press releases that Chromadex posted on their website. The one from June 3 doesn't sound good for us long-term IMO:
 

 

 

Frank Jaksch, CEO and Founder of ChromaDex, stated, "The acquisition of these additional Dartmouth patent rights allows for ChromaDex to commercialize NR as a drug.  Together with our existing patent portfolio pertaining to NR, we believe our ownership of these new patent rights creates a significant and meaningful barrier to entry for would-be competitors in the entire NAD+ precursor market." 

 

Available only by Rx on the horizon and price going up even more?

 

I wouldn't raise the alarmist flag yet. They are building a huge distribution chain as I mentioned. You don't suddenly cut supply, restrict and take a different path without massive lawsuits. No this is a barrier to competition on so many levels but not for the Niagen ingredient in the nutritional market.

 

 

Reading between the lines of a couple things that To Age Or Not To Age has posted. I think their is something else on its way from either Sinclair or Guarante in the near future which will be an NAD+ precursor........That's the way I have read it anyway.

Chromadex can own Niagen but I cant see that they can own either nocotinamide riboside or other precursors to NAD+



#352 APBT

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Posted 27 September 2014 - 09:10 PM

While it is useful and important to vet and discuss vendors, I’d ask that discussion about NR/NIAGEN vendors be hashed out in a separate dedicated thread, so as to not dilute the topic thread; Nicotinamide Riboside (NR/NIAGEN) personal experience.  Thanks. 


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#353 to age or not to age

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Posted 28 September 2014 - 12:11 AM

This is a response to midas.

I don't sell any of these products.  My coming excerpts will be featuring scientists like Cynthia Kenyon, Brian Kennedy

and others. But; I can say this with strong certainty:

1- MIT's Guarente has teamed up with Elysium Health and serious compounds will be made available to the

public soon,  FDA approval will not be required though ongoing testing is happening.

 

2- SInclair andthe GSK gang is testing something imminently in humans (and FDA thing I believe) with 

inflammation as the point of attack, and we are talking months.

 

3- My guess is the Chromadex is legit, though the stock is being scammed.  Sinclair personally isn't thrilled

that Chromadex uses him to push niagen, so this whole patent/branding game is  part of the reason why I have

begun a series in this area (among others).  I doubt Sinclair  will go after chromadex because he and others

have their eye on the very big game.

 

Anyway that's my 2 cents, I'm just a film director.


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#354 midas

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Posted 28 September 2014 - 12:46 AM

This is a response to midas.

I don't sell any of these products.  My coming excerpts will be featuring scientists like Cynthia Kenyon, Brian Kennedy

and others. But; I can say this with strong certainty:

1- MIT's Guarente has teamed up with Elysium Health and serious compounds will be made available to the

public soon,  FDA approval will not be required though ongoing testing is happening.

 

2- SInclair andthe GSK gang is testing something imminently in humans (and FDA thing I believe) with 

inflammation as the point of attack, and we are talking months.

 

3- My guess is the Chromadex is legit, though the stock is being scammed.  Sinclair personally isn't thrilled

that Chromadex uses him to push niagen, so this whole patent/branding game is  part of the reason why I have

begun a series in this area (among others).  I doubt Sinclair  will go after chromadex because he and others

have their eye on the very big game.

 

Anyway that's my 2 cents, I'm just a film director.

 

All good news, thanks for the response :)

 

I am not surprised that Sinclair is not impressed with Chromadex using him to push Niagen, after all, his research was on NMN and not NR. In my mind Chromadex were just jumping on his band wagon.

 

I will, as usual, be looking forward to your future input, its always very interesting.

Again, thanks for taking the time to answer my post.



#355 M-K

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Posted 28 September 2014 - 02:30 AM

This is a response to midas.
I don't sell any of these products. My coming excerpts will be featuring scientists like Cynthia Kenyon, Brian Kennedy
and others. But; I can say this with strong certainty:
1- MIT's Guarente has teamed up with Elysium Health and serious compounds will be made available to the
public soon, FDA approval will not be required thoug
h ongoing testing is happening.

2- SInclair andthe GSK gang is testing something imminently in humans (and FDA thing I believe) with
inflammation as the point of attack, and we are talking months.

3- My guess is the Chromadex is legit, though the stock is being scammed. Sinclair personally isn't thrilled
that Chromadex uses him to push niagen, so this whole patent/branding game is part of the reason why I have
begun a series in this area (among others). I doubt Sinclair will go after chromadex because he and others
have their eye on the very big game.

Anyway that's my 2 cents, I'm just a film director.


Perhaps you could explain how "their stock is being scammed."

#356 midas

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Posted 28 September 2014 - 02:35 AM

 

This is a response to midas.
I don't sell any of these products. My coming excerpts will be featuring scientists like Cynthia Kenyon, Brian Kennedy
and others. But; I can say this with strong certainty:
1- MIT's Guarente has teamed up with Elysium Health and serious compounds will be made available to the
public soon, FDA approval will not be required thoug
h ongoing testing is happening.

2- SInclair andthe GSK gang is testing something imminently in humans (and FDA thing I believe) with
inflammation as the point of attack, and we are talking months.

3- My guess is the Chromadex is legit, though the stock is being scammed. Sinclair personally isn't thrilled
that Chromadex uses him to push niagen, so this whole patent/branding game is part of the reason why I have
begun a series in this area (among others). I doubt Sinclair will go after chromadex because he and others
have their eye on the very big game.

Anyway that's my 2 cents, I'm just a film director.


Perhaps you could explain how "their stock is being scammed."

 

 

I'm guessing stock market hype, make as much as fast a possible before something better comes along...I suspect Chromadex know a more proven product backed by scientists and not market hype is about to kick their arse.
 



#357 M-K

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Posted 28 September 2014 - 04:31 AM


This is a response to midas.
I don't sell any of these products. My coming excerpts will be featuring scientists like Cynthia Kenyon, Brian Kennedy
and others. But; I can say this with strong certainty:
1- MIT's Guarente has teamed up with Elysium Health and serious compounds will be made available to the
public soon, FDA approval will not be required thoug
h ongoing testing is happening.

2- SInclair andthe GSK gang is testing something imminently in humans (and FDA thing I believe) with
inflammation as the point of attack, and we are talking months.

3- My guess is the Chromadex is legit, though the stock is being scammed. Sinclair personally isn't thrilled
that Chromadex uses him to push niagen, so this whole patent/branding game is part of the reason why I have
begun a series in this area (among others). I doubt Sinclair will go after chromadex because he and others
have their eye on the very big game.

Anyway that's my 2 cents, I'm just a film director.

Perhaps you could explain how "their stock is being scammed."

I'm guessing stock market hype, make as much as fast a possible before something better comes along...I suspect Chromadex know a more proven product backed by scientists and not market hype is about to kick their arse.

Frankly, the animosity toward Chromadex surprises me. Yes, they may be charging as much as the market will bear, but I'm grateful to them for taking a little-known substance out of the laboratory and making it available for me to buy. I follow their press releases, and haven't seen any claims from them unwarranted by published research. They are aggressively seeking investors, but that doesn't strike me as unreasonable in a marketplace of behemoths. I hate to think what GSK will charge for their offering.

We're off topic, so I'll let it go at that.

#358 midas

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Posted 28 September 2014 - 01:21 PM

 

 

 

This is a response to midas.
I don't sell any of these products. My coming excerpts will be featuring scientists like Cynthia Kenyon, Brian Kennedy
and others. But; I can say this with strong certainty:
1- MIT's Guarente has teamed up with Elysium Health and serious compounds will be made available to the
public soon, FDA approval will not be required thoug
h ongoing testing is happening.

2- SInclair andthe GSK gang is testing something imminently in humans (and FDA thing I believe) with
inflammation as the point of attack, and we are talking months.

3- My guess is the Chromadex is legit, though the stock is being scammed. Sinclair personally isn't thrilled
that Chromadex uses him to push niagen, so this whole patent/branding game is part of the reason why I have
begun a series in this area (among others). I doubt Sinclair will go after chromadex because he and others
have their eye on the very big game.

Anyway that's my 2 cents, I'm just a film director.

Perhaps you could explain how "their stock is being scammed."

I'm guessing stock market hype, make as much as fast a possible before something better comes along...I suspect Chromadex know a more proven product backed by scientists and not market hype is about to kick their arse.

Frankly, the animosity toward Chromadex surprises me. Yes, they may be charging as much as the market will bear, but I'm grateful to them for taking a little-known substance out of the laboratory and making it available for me to buy. I follow their press releases, and haven't seen any claims from them unwarranted by published research. They are aggressively seeking investors, but that doesn't strike me as unreasonable in a marketplace of behemoths. I hate to think what GSK will charge for their offering.

We're off topic, so I'll let it go at that.

 

As you say this is off topic, but just to clear things up as to my opinion of Chromadex.

My problem with them is simple, they were selling a product for $18 then on the strength of a researchers hard work which was published (Sinclair) they bump the price up to $47 for the same product. Not only that but they are using his research to hype and sell Niagen (NR) (nicotinamide riboside) which is actually not the compound used in the Sinclair research.....(NMN) (nicotinamide mononucleotide).

Personally I think that is just plain wrong on a three of different levels, from a customer point of view, I also think it is wrong for them to use someone else's highly respected name to hype and more than double the price of what they are selling. And finally to use that same persons name to bump up the stock price.

 

Just my opinion but there you go.

 


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#359 Kevnzworld

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Posted 28 September 2014 - 06:54 PM

Off topic I know but I want to comment.
Chromadex paid for the patent rights to market and sell NR. They are not making unsubstantiated or inflated claims.
They have every right to use, or quote published public research. David Sinclair doesn't own the results of his published research. They aren't using his name to " hype " their product. He chose to publish it and put it in the public domain. We all use and quote published research to substantiate our opinions, Chromadex has the same right. If they made claims without quoting research like David Sinclairs, that would then be hype and fraud.
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#360 SMichelle28

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Posted 28 September 2014 - 07:55 PM

Off topic I know but I want to comment.
Chromadex paid for the patent rights to market and sell NR. They are not making unsubstantiated or inflated claims.
They have every right to use, or quote published public research. David Sinclair doesn't own the results of his published research. They aren't using his name to " hype " their product. He chose to publish it and put it in the public domain. We all use and quote published research to substantiate our opinions, Chromadex has the same right. If they made claims without quoting research like David Sinclairs, that would then be hype and fraud.


I completely agree with your opinion on the matter. Sure, Sinclair used NMN and not NR but we cannot ignore that they are still very related to one another. Sinclair's research shows what happens when the body raises it's NAD levels which is also the action of NR... Chromadex is also quoting the studies that did use NR so it's not just Sinclair's research. I do think that it is too expensive but that just how marketing works. If it were a drug that does what NR does, I believe it would be even more expensive and less attainable to most people. Even if you don't like the politics around it we can't deny the effect of NR and as far as I know it's still yet to be determined if NMN can even be used by dietary means.
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