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Vitamin D...but why?

mct

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#1 experimenting

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Posted 11 May 2020 - 03:23 PM


My body basically...doesn’t work. And my lab tests are normal.

I have chronic fatigue, low sex drive, disorganized thoughts, brain fog, body comp issues, exercise recovery issues, you name it. And again, all labs are normal or close to. Can attach if needed.

Large doses of d3 nuke a large majority of my problems. I can “trust” my body again. My fragile emotional response vanishes, I become capable of normal interaction. My libido goes from entirely nonfunctional to low-normal. My back pain disappears to a large degree. Etc etc etc.

But...there are side effects. Vitamin K combats the hypercalcemia well, so in general I can get through the day on this stack and function well. But, I wonder what is wrong with me, and what is vitamin D in megadoses bandaging that something else would fix better?

I’ve tried almost everything. I’m curious if anyone has a similar experience to share.

After some experimentation I would note that form matters. D3 dissolved in coconut or MCT oil works for me, in normal oil it does not. Must be because these oils bypass first-pass metabolism, not sure what my intestines do but in the MCT oil i get these very strong nootropic effects.

I have tried:
All amino acids, nothing great here.
All other vitamins, only K is necessary, to complement D.
TRT briefly, raised libido a little, made me unnecessarily angry.
HGH promoters, MK677 produces some short term weird mania, not sustainable with severe side effects (IGF1 is normal).
Am at the point of trying LSD.

I would add I had a highly traumatic upbringing. Though I’m not sure whether that could cause brain fog.

My suspicion is some kind of cerebral inflammation but I have no idea. I’m a crazy rare case obviously, if anyone’s up for a challenge let me know. Can post lab work if needed, ive tested nearly everything, let me know.
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#2 experimenting

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Posted 11 May 2020 - 03:28 PM

Have a battery of lab work all of which was normal except for this, which was after 10k iu/d3, which I know fights autoimmune, so maybe there’s something there:

ANA TITER and PATTERN
NAME VAL REF. RANGE LAB
F ANA TITER 1 1:80 H <1:40 (titer) TBR
F ANA PATTERN 1 AC-1 A TBR
-
- A low level ANA titer may be present in pre-clinical
- autoimmune diseases and normal individuals.
-
- Nuclear, Homogeneous
-
- Homogeneous pattern is associated with systemic lupus
- erythematosus (SLE), drug-induced lupus and juvenile
- idiopathic arthritis.
-
- AC-1: Homogeneous
- International Consensus on ANA Patterns
- (https://doi.org/10.1515/cclm-2018-0052)
F ANA TITER 2 1:80 H <1:40 (titer) TBR
F ANA PATTERN 2 AC-2,4,5,29 A TBR
-
- A low level ANA titer may be present in pre-clinical
- autoimmune diseases and normal individuals.
-
- Nuclear, Speckled
-
- Speckled pattern is associated with mixed connective tissue
- disease (MCTD), systemic lupus erythematosus (SLE),
- Sjogren's syndrome, dermatomyositis, and systemic
- sclerosis/polymyositis overlap.
-
- AC-2, 4, 5, 29: Speckled
- International Consensus on ANA Patterns
- (https://doi.org/10.1515/cclm-2018-0052)
- Reference Range:
- <1:40 Negative
- 1:40-1:80 Low Antibody Level
- >1:80 Elevated Antibody Level
PERFORMING LAB: TBR, Quest Diagnostics
One Malcolm Avenue, Teterboro
NJ
07608 Lawrence Tsao, M.D.
I’d be willing to compensate anyone here for help.

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#3 experimenting

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Posted 11 May 2020 - 03:39 PM

Unrefreshing sleep kept me from attending class in college. Good test taker otherwise I would have flamed our. Dealt with huge amounts of chronic pain then, I remember almost being unable to sit up straight during finals once.

Now, D3 as I said gets me through the day, I’m still just so far from normal though. Still zero hedonic tone, etc.

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#4 experimenting

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Posted 11 May 2020 - 05:38 PM

Id be willing to compensate someone for help. My symptoms are lifelong and I just want to be “normal” for one day...

#5 experimenting

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Posted 12 May 2020 - 04:57 PM

Nobody huh

#6 experimenting

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Posted 14 May 2020 - 01:11 PM

Now I am even more confused. I tried Jarrow’s D3 and another D3 in coconut oil, got wildly different effects from the LEF d3.

LEF d3 and jarrow d3 have exactly the same ingredients but for the fact that the LEF product has a mix of MCT and olive oil, whereas the jarrow is just olive oil, and it looks like the LEF product has a tiny amount of rosemary extract.

I tried rosemary extract and nothing happened really.

To control for the MCT oil I tried this coconut oil version of d3, couldn’t replicate the effects I get with the LEF product.

In short, what the fuck is happening, can someone please please help?

#7 experimenting

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Posted 14 May 2020 - 08:39 PM

I’m at the point of giving up on my life (and yes I am seeing a psychiatrist but he doesn’t understand the concept of chronic fatigue).

#8 8bitmore

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Posted 15 May 2020 - 10:32 AM

I’m at the point of giving up on my life (and yes I am seeing a psychiatrist but he doesn’t understand the concept of chronic fatigue).

 

Well, I for one am happy that you are around - the point about D3 working better via MCT/Coconut oil is really good, it has made my experience with D3 substantially better which in turn is having positive knock-on effect in my life :). Would also say that you are relatively "well" so to speak in that you have had the faculties and, most importantly, -will- to track down a component that actually works for you (and pairing the D3 with K should offset the calcium issues, although lab tests ever so often is likely a good idea). Have you tried smaller doses of nicotine?

 

All best,



#9 experimenting

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Posted 15 May 2020 - 11:11 AM

Well, I for one am happy that you are around - the point about D3 working better via MCT/Coconut oil is really good, it has made my experience with D3 substantially better which in turn is having positive knock-on effect in my life :). Would also say that you are relatively "well" so to speak in that you have had the faculties and, most importantly, -will- to track down a component that actually works for you (and pairing the D3 with K should offset the calcium issues, although lab tests ever so often is likely a good idea). Have you tried smaller doses of nicotine?

All best,


I have the will-or had it-because I have felt “good” every now and then in life and would do anything to recapture that feeling. But I’m just not able to get there anymore, at least not consistently, and I’m just getting tired of it.

Indeed the vehicle for d3 makes or breaks it. Maybe in olive oil it breaks down into some metabolite that isn’t what we want. No idea. I also get different effects when I take d3 alone, versus d3 with k2 in the same dose, so this is something I need to find a way to work around also. Lots of nuances, no solutions, it’s literal hell.

Something is wrong with me, I basically cannot exercise at all or if I do I’ll get nothing from it, my body comp will never improve regardless of diet and I’ll always remain weak/feeble. D3 changed this equation significantly to the point that I’m at least functional. Also normalized a lot of my cognition. But I still have zero idea why.

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#10 RYAN474

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Posted 18 May 2020 - 02:17 AM

Have you tried a carnivore diet? This seems to help most people with fatigue and cognitive issues, including myself. Strict animal only diet---no herbs spices or plants of any kind. 

 

Consider trying ipamorelin (peptide) to improve GH and sleep. Mk-677 didn't work well for me but ipamorelin has been transformative for sleep. I thought I was sleeping well but this improved it and then my whole day, every day is better as a result. My Dr at Defy Medical was willing to prescribe it after he found my IGF-1 was suboptimal and ibutamoren didn't help much. 

 

If D3 helps, I wonder if sunlight would help even more to get the cascade of benefits from naturally produced D. I have a sperti vitamin D lamp that I use daily for 5-15 minutes. I also go to a tanning bed 1-2x/week normally. Getting D from the sun or tanning lamp equivalent seems to help significantly and I've kept up with it for almost 10 years. 

 

Consider CIRS (mold toxicity). Cholestyramine helped me some, but the other treatments for CIRS did not. 

 

I am on TRT, Thyroid replacement (t3 only), narcolepsy and adhd medication (ritalin). I periodically also use nicotine gum although it does seem to affect sleep negatively so I use it sparingly. 

 

I have some autoimmune issues (Celiac, Presumed Hashimotos, Narcolepsy, and a number of autoimmune antibodies on a cyrex array 5 autoimmune panel). I'm sure some neuroinflammation from whatever is going on. All of the above items have helped me significantly. I could name dozens more but those are a start. Feel free to message me. 

 


Edited by RYAN474, 18 May 2020 - 02:23 AM.


#11 experimenting

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Posted 18 May 2020 - 03:55 PM

Have you tried a carnivore diet? This seems to help most people with fatigue and cognitive issues, including myself. Strict animal only diet---no herbs spices or plants of any kind.

Consider trying ipamorelin (peptide) to improve GH and sleep. Mk-677 didn't work well for me but ipamorelin has been transformative for sleep. I thought I was sleeping well but this improved it and then my whole day, every day is better as a result. My Dr at Defy Medical was willing to prescribe it after he found my IGF-1 was suboptimal and ibutamoren didn't help much.

If D3 helps, I wonder if sunlight would help even more to get the cascade of benefits from naturally produced D. I have a sperti vitamin D lamp that I use daily for 5-15 minutes. I also go to a tanning bed 1-2x/week normally. Getting D from the sun or tanning lamp equivalent seems to help significantly and I've kept up with it for almost 10 years.

Consider CIRS (mold toxicity). Cholestyramine helped me some, but the other treatments for CIRS did not.

I am on TRT, Thyroid replacement (t3 only), narcolepsy and adhd medication (ritalin). I periodically also use nicotine gum although it does seem to affect sleep negatively so I use it sparingly.

I have some autoimmune issues (Celiac, Presumed Hashimotos, Narcolepsy, and a number of autoimmune antibodies on a cyrex array 5 autoimmune panel). I'm sure some neuroinflammation from whatever is going on. All of the above items have helped me significantly. I could name dozens more but those are a start. Feel free to message me.


Hmm, I haven’t, I went the opposite direction and tried plant based with aggressive intermittent fasting. No real effects.

My IGF1 is normal.

The vitamin D mystery continues, I was unable to replicate the effects of the Life Extension product with its stated components. D3 in olive oil from jarrow and in MCT oil from another brand. Mixing and high dosing these just made me feel off, while the Life Extension product rights the ship.

I know I sound insane, but this is how I feel.

Need to try ipamorelin without cjc, the latter apparently exacerbated heart issues and made me feel very weird. I tried MK677 and felt decent but it had weird side effects.
That said, again, normal igf1...

I tried TRT, rapidly got my levels through 1700, and I didn’t really feel much better. More morning erections, but that was it. If anything super high testosterone made me feel a little “insane” my mind was “fluttering” if that makes sense.

From an entirely different angle I’m going to try direct supplementation with BH4. If I have issues in the methylation cycle this will immediately tell. I’m not hopeful though...

#12 experimenting

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Posted 20 May 2020 - 02:18 PM

Have you tried a carnivore diet? This seems to help most people with fatigue and cognitive issues, including myself. Strict animal only diet---no herbs spices or plants of any kind.

Consider trying ipamorelin (peptide) to improve GH and sleep. Mk-677 didn't work well for me but ipamorelin has been transformative for sleep. I thought I was sleeping well but this improved it and then my whole day, every day is better as a result. My Dr at Defy Medical was willing to prescribe it after he found my IGF-1 was suboptimal and ibutamoren didn't help much.

If D3 helps, I wonder if sunlight would help even more to get the cascade of benefits from naturally produced D. I have a sperti vitamin D lamp that I use daily for 5-15 minutes. I also go to a tanning bed 1-2x/week normally. Getting D from the sun or tanning lamp equivalent seems to help significantly and I've kept up with it for almost 10 years.

Consider CIRS (mold toxicity). Cholestyramine helped me some, but the other treatments for CIRS did not.

I am on TRT, Thyroid replacement (t3 only), narcolepsy and adhd medication (ritalin). I periodically also use nicotine gum although it does seem to affect sleep negatively so I use it sparingly.

I have some autoimmune issues (Celiac, Presumed Hashimotos, Narcolepsy, and a number of autoimmune antibodies on a cyrex array 5 autoimmune panel). I'm sure some neuroinflammation from whatever is going on. All of the above items have helped me significantly. I could name dozens more but those are a start. Feel free to message me.


You still about!

I tried bh4, it did nothing for me, if anything it made me feel a bit worse really. So it’s not neurotransmitters.

Given that horrendous exercise recovery is a key part of my symptoms, as is chronic widespread stiffness/soreness, I’m moving back towards the growth hormone route.

MK677 was interesting, it was great initially, then caused some anxiety, bloating, weird set of effects.

I have IPA*CJC but it gives me a weird heart murmur which may be the CJC component so have ordered just IPA and we see how we go. I injected the combo last night and my heart felt terrible, but cognitively I feel decent so maybe the growth hormone route is something to go by. Not sure why one special blend of VitD also addresses my symptoms...bizarro world.

Anyone else got anything?

#13 gamesguru

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Posted 23 May 2020 - 06:44 PM

They're basically giving you a whole lot of vague possibilities that amount to feeling fatigue and depression.

 

One possible idea,

malabsorption (people who have undergone resection of the small intestine are at risk for this condition; diseases associated with vitamin D malabsorption include celiac sprue, short bowel syndrome[4] and cystic fibrosis[5])

 

Hard to say.  I'd just keep making lifestyle improvements til you know for sure



#14 experimenting

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Posted 23 May 2020 - 06:58 PM

They're basically giving you a whole lot of vague possibilities that amount to feeling fatigue and depression.

One possible idea,

Hard to say. I'd just keep making lifestyle improvements til you know for sure


Hmmm

Maybe I should try sublingual d3, I’ve ordered some let’s see

#15 experimenting

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Posted 25 May 2020 - 12:26 AM

They're basically giving you a whole lot of vague possibilities that amount to feeling fatigue and depression.

One possible idea,

Hard to say. I'd just keep making lifestyle improvements til you know for sure


Hey. Do you have any idea about why I would find one specific brand of d3 to work for me but no others? You saw I tried to replicate the effect via the listed constituent ingredients but it just wasn’t the same.

#16 experimenting

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Posted 25 May 2020 - 11:52 AM

They're basically giving you a whole lot of vague possibilities that amount to feeling fatigue and depression.

One possible idea,

Hard to say. I'd just keep making lifestyle improvements til you know for sure


Autoimmune? Maybe? Considering trying NAD or NMN as these are indicated here.

I did my experiment again, laid off all supplements last few days, then took LEF d3 last night, slow reduction of symptoms over the course of a few hours.

This doesn’t happen with Jarrow d3, which actually makes my joints feel worse (olive oil). D3 in MCT oil makes me feel odd, while coconut oil makes me feel sleepy. I am still at a massive loss as to what the hell is going on.

The going hypothesis is that d3 in olive oil gets metabolized to something not so good, but then why doesn’t MCT oil confer the greatest benefits? I’m also simply not sure what my condition is or how best to address it.

#17 gamesguru

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Posted 25 May 2020 - 12:24 PM

Yes it could be something autoimmune.  Best to have extensive bloodwork done with a doctor and go from there.

 

I'm not sure about different oils having an effect.  I also know the human body varies in responses, so it's best to stick with one thing for months before coming to any conclusion.  There is D3 available as powder mixed with calcium citrate from NOW supplements, so I would be curious the response of your body to a non-emulsified form :)



#18 experimenting

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Posted 25 May 2020 - 01:37 PM

Yes it could be something autoimmune. Best to have extensive bloodwork done with a doctor and go from there.

I'm not sure about different oils having an effect. I also know the human body varies in responses, so it's best to stick with one thing for months before coming to any conclusion. There is D3 available as powder mixed with calcium citrate from NOW supplements, so I would be curious the response of your body to a non-emulsified form :)


For me the responses are near-immediate, but I guess you can argue I am “used” to the LEF mix and not the others?

By non-emulsified, you mean, dry? I have just bought that let’s see what happens.

Now, if VitD were a simple panacea, I wouldn’t be posting, I would just be popping pills and living life. But it isn’t. Any dose of d3>2000iu makes my bones and joints hurt, then I need to take a K mix to get rid of this side effect, but that has hormonal effects, so...

#19 experimenting

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Posted 25 May 2020 - 01:47 PM

This is what I have bought does this work?

21st Century D3 5000 IU Tablets, 360 Count https://www.amazon.c...i_Gl9YEbAZHBFZ5

#20 experimenting

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Posted 25 May 2020 - 02:04 PM

Yes it could be something autoimmune. Best to have extensive bloodwork done with a doctor and go from there.

I'm not sure about different oils having an effect. I also know the human body varies in responses, so it's best to stick with one thing for months before coming to any conclusion. There is D3 available as powder mixed with calcium citrate from NOW supplements, so I would be curious the response of your body to a non-emulsified form :)


I would also note that get maximal effect taking d3 on an EMPTY stomach which defies conventional wisdom.

So there’s something going on that I do not understand.

#21 StevesPetMacaque

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Posted 26 May 2020 - 04:46 PM

You might consider EMDR for trauma. It worked surprisingly well for me. The "structural" aspects of the brain's function are often overlooked here in favor of the neurochemical ones.

 

If you are taking high-dose vitamin D for an extended period, I believe vitamin A is necessary besides vitamin K. Magnesium and boron are alleged complementary factors as well. In general, single-micronutrient "solutions" only work in the short-to-medium term.



#22 experimenting

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Posted 26 May 2020 - 05:51 PM

You might consider EMDR for trauma. It worked surprisingly well for me. The "structural" aspects of the brain's function are often overlooked here in favor of the neurochemical ones.

If you are taking high-dose vitamin D for an extended period, I believe vitamin A is necessary besides vitamin K. Magnesium and boron are alleged complementary factors as well. In general, single-micronutrient "solutions" only work in the short-to-medium term.


Trauma is on the back burner for now-I need to get out of my constant brainfogged/fatigued state.

Vitamin A makes me feel horrible in any dose. I have no idea why.

And the issue with VitD is, for whatever reason I’m getting an “off-label” effect from the LEF product that isn’t replicable from any other brand. Why this is, I have no idea. I’ve now tested 4 different brands and styles (coconut, MCT, olive oil, dry) and none yield the exact therapeutic effect the LEF product does (the label says it’s a mix of olive and MCT oil). I guess in theory I should blend oils and see whether that works.

But also I suspect I’m inadvertently affecting a pathway I have no idea about.

My next thought is NMN/NAD for the autoimmune symptoms (back/joint pain) and chronic fatigue; let’s see how this goes. Should that fail I’m going to be in a real quandary, having found a compound that makes my life much better but not having any idea why, or how to optimize it.

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#23 experimenting

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Posted 28 May 2020 - 05:48 PM

So I got some therapeutic effects from Jarrow 1k iu (olive oil). Takes longer and doesn’t last as long-I do need to try the usual 5k dose however to test true equivalence.

I still have no idea what’s going on here.

Defective VDR maybe? I am +/- BSM and +/+ TAQ. If so, a VDR agonist would help-I have ordered resveratrol.

#24 experimenting

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Posted 29 May 2020 - 08:40 PM

Off that, did not work. As usual life Extension has done something special to differentiate their product. No idea what. And no idea what it’s doing to me to make things better.

#25 experimenting

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Posted Yesterday, 03:30 PM

One thought is that this specific delivery of vitamin D is flooding my brain with serotonin. Vitamin D is thought to behave like an SSRI
Should I give a simple SSRI (Prozac) a short term trial??

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#26 experimenting

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Posted Today, 01:02 AM

Guys, I’m kind of terrified. Does anyone have anything?





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