766 replies to this topic

[dachshund]

Thanks Anthony, I truly appreciate your sincere effort to encourage consumer sales house "truth in disclosure" for their products with independent lab test data that reveals exactly the t-res content, solvent residues, heavy metal content & bacteria/mold test. I will look forward to seeing how your AACL test results compare to the test results that Vital Prime will be sending to customers like my self from Alkemist Laboratories on their product. Thank you for your companies sponsorship of sharing your competitive analysis with the public through this Forum. I am sure you will be receiving the Alkemist data from Vital Prime, if not I would be happy to post the analysis data I receive from Vital Prime.

[Anthony_Loera]

Not a problem...

If VPrime is good according to AACL I have no problem showing it here.
I assume it will be and I would ask that Vital's next test should be the Biomol SIRT1 test...

People love that one as well.

thanks
A

[sUper GeNius]

Not a problem...

If VPrime is good according to AACL I have no problem showing it here.
I assume it will be and I would ask that Vital's next test should be the Biomol SIRT1 test...

People love that one as well.

thanks
A

Why would you "ask" him that? Maybe he will do a different test. Maybe he'll perform absorption tests. Maybe he'll offer some other service. Let competition work this out. In fact, I ask members here. What test would you like to see?

[Anthony_Loera]

Not a problem...

If VPrime is good according to AACL I have no problem showing it here.
I assume it will be and I would ask that Vital's next test should be the Biomol SIRT1 test...

People love that one as well.

thanks
A

Why would you "ask" him that? Maybe he will do a different test. Maybe he'll perform absorption tests. Maybe he'll offer some other service. Let competition work this out. In fact, I ask members here. What test would you like to see?

Good point!

A

[Hedgehog]

If they did a synthetic process there would be residual solvents such as DCM and maybe a parts of left over metal catalyst such as Pd.

Only if they used a totally synthetic route from precursor chemicals, as described n Orchid's patent, or other synthetic routes. Such synthesis would be much more expensive than extraction from a common weed such as P. cuspidatum. If it were made by a genetically modified yeast or bacterium, in which the CoA pathway had been modified by a genetic insertion via a lentivirus to produce resveratrol as described in the literature and some patents, then ethanol or methanol would be sufficient as a solvent.

Very true in the US T-Res synthetic is about 2K/kg (GMP) in China you can get it for 200-400 bucks! I personally wouldn't take the synthetic stuff unless I tested it for heavy metals...

[niner]

If they did a synthetic process there would be residual solvents such as DCM and maybe a parts of left over metal catalyst such as Pd.

Only if they used a totally synthetic route from precursor chemicals, as described n Orchid's patent, or other synthetic routes. Such synthesis would be much more expensive than extraction from a common weed such as P. cuspidatum. If it were made by a genetically modified yeast or bacterium, in which the CoA pathway had been modified by a genetic insertion via a lentivirus to produce resveratrol as described in the literature and some patents, then ethanol or methanol would be sufficient as a solvent.

Very true in the US T-Res synthetic is about 2K/kg (GMP) in China you can get it for 200-400 bucks! I personally wouldn't take the synthetic stuff unless I tested it for heavy metals...

200 bucks a kg? Wow. I'm guessing that's microbial. Even in China, it's hard to see how they could do a full synthesis at that price. So for the price of my 200 grams that's now about gone, I could have bought over 3500 grams of this stuff. Certainly changes the picture. Heavy metal tests aren't that hard- How much could they cost? I think Paul's importer must have made a ton of money...

[Hedgehog]

If they did a synthetic process there would be residual solvents such as DCM and maybe a parts of left over metal catalyst such as Pd.

Only if they used a totally synthetic route from precursor chemicals, as described n Orchid's patent, or other synthetic routes. Such synthesis would be much more expensive than extraction from a common weed such as P. cuspidatum. If it were made by a genetically modified yeast or bacterium, in which the CoA pathway had been modified by a genetic insertion via a lentivirus to produce resveratrol as described in the literature and some patents, then ethanol or methanol would be sufficient as a solvent.

Very true in the US T-Res synthetic is about 2K/kg (GMP) in China you can get it for 200-400 bucks! I personally wouldn't take the synthetic stuff unless I tested it for heavy metals...

200 bucks a kg? Wow. I'm guessing that's microbial. Even in China, it's hard to see how they could do a full synthesis at that price. So for the price of my 200 grams that's now about gone, I could have bought over 3500 grams of this stuff. Certainly changes the picture. Heavy metal tests aren't that hard- How much could they cost? I think Paul's importer must have made a ton of money...

I wouldn't take any resveratrol for 200/kg.... At least not until I tested it...

Heavy metal tests aren't that hard- How much could they cost?

Well I think it is pretty expensive. The test would be ICP-MS There is a generic USP heavy metal test that scans for 60 common used metals. But if you know the synthesis steps you should be able to only pay for a one metal test.

The synthesis that could be done in the lab is a one flask two step synthesis with about 85% yield of trans-resveratrol. basically if you do large scale synthesis it could be very cheap but the testing the product for quality afterwords is expensive. So still probably better and safer to go herbal.

[maxwatt]

If they did a synthetic process there would be residual solvents such as DCM and maybe a parts of left over metal catalyst such as Pd.

Only if they used a totally synthetic route from precursor chemicals, as described n Orchid's patent, or other synthetic routes. Such synthesis would be much more expensive than extraction from a common weed such as P. cuspidatum. If it were made by a genetically modified yeast or bacterium, in which the CoA pathway had been modified by a genetic insertion via a lentivirus to produce resveratrol as described in the literature and some patents, then ethanol or methanol would be sufficient as a solvent.

Very true in the US T-Res synthetic is about 2K/kg (GMP) in China you can get it for 200-400 bucks! I personally wouldn't take the synthetic stuff unless I tested it for heavy metals...

200 bucks a kg? Wow. I'm guessing that's microbial. Even in China, it's hard to see how they could do a full synthesis at that price. So for the price of my 200 grams that's now about gone, I could have bought over 3500 grams of this stuff. Certainly changes the picture. Heavy metal tests aren't that hard- How much could they cost? I think Paul's importer must have made a ton of money...

I wouldn't take any resveratrol for 200/kg.... At least not until I tested it...

Heavy metal tests aren't that hard- How much could they cost?

Well I think it is pretty expensive. The test would be ICP-MS There is a generic USP heavy metal test that scans for 60 common used metals. But if you know the synthesis steps you should be able to only pay for a one metal test.

The synthesis that could be done in the lab is a one flask two step synthesis with about 85% yield of trans-resveratrol. basically if you do large scale synthesis it could be very cheap but the testing the product for quality afterwards is expensive. So still probably better and safer to go herbal.

Can you make acetylated trans-resveratrol? Better, acetylate the A ring hydroxyls and leave the B ring alone? It's water soluble, and maybe 9 times more potent than resveratrol, according to a patent application with Sinclair's name on it. Look in the 1000 mg resveratrol thread back in May of '07.

[Hedgehog]

If they did a synthetic process there would be residual solvents such as DCM and maybe a parts of left over metal catalyst such as Pd.

Only if they used a totally synthetic route from precursor chemicals, as described n Orchid's patent, or other synthetic routes. Such synthesis would be much more expensive than extraction from a common weed such as P. cuspidatum. If it were made by a genetically modified yeast or bacterium, in which the CoA pathway had been modified by a genetic insertion via a lentivirus to produce resveratrol as described in the literature and some patents, then ethanol or methanol would be sufficient as a solvent.

Very true in the US T-Res synthetic is about 2K/kg (GMP) in China you can get it for 200-400 bucks! I personally wouldn't take the synthetic stuff unless I tested it for heavy metals...

200 bucks a kg? Wow. I'm guessing that's microbial. Even in China, it's hard to see how they could do a full synthesis at that price. So for the price of my 200 grams that's now about gone, I could have bought over 3500 grams of this stuff. Certainly changes the picture. Heavy metal tests aren't that hard- How much could they cost? I think Paul's importer must have made a ton of money...

I wouldn't take any resveratrol for 200/kg.... At least not until I tested it...

Heavy metal tests aren't that hard- How much could they cost?

Well I think it is pretty expensive. The test would be ICP-MS There is a generic USP heavy metal test that scans for 60 common used metals. But if you know the synthesis steps you should be able to only pay for a one metal test.

The synthesis that could be done in the lab is a one flask two step synthesis with about 85% yield of trans-resveratrol. basically if you do large scale synthesis it could be very cheap but the testing the product for quality afterwards is expensive. So still probably better and safer to go herbal.

Can you make acetylated trans-resveratrol? Better, acetylate the A ring hydroxyls and leave the B ring alone? It's water soluble, and maybe 9 times more potent than resveratrol, according to a patent application with Sinclair's name on it. Look in the 1000 mg resveratrol thread back in May of '07.

I dunno here is the schema. If you start off with a different A ring group you could probably add one more step to achieve want you want. It would take some thinking.....

Attached Files

•  resveratrol_schema.gif   7.45KB   24 downloads

[missminni]

I decided to delete this post lest it offends somebody.

I find your deletion offensive.

[inawe]

A Japanese group claims that RSV is genotoxic. They further claim that they can solve this problem by methylation:

Chem Res Toxicol. 2008 Jan 5 [Epub ahead of print]
Effect of Methyl Substitution on the Antioxidative Property and Genotoxicity of Resveratrol.Fukuhara K, Nakanishi I, Matsuoka A, Matsumura T, Honda S, Hayashi M, Ozawa T, Miyata N, Saito S, Ikota N, Okuda H.
Division of Organic Chemistry, National Institute of Health Sciences, Setagaya-ku, Tokyo 158-8501, Redox Regulation Research Group, Research Center for Radiation Safety, National Institute of Radiological Sciences, Inage-ku, Chiba 263-8555, Graduate School of Engineering, Osaka University, SORST, Japan Science and Technology Agency, Suita, Osaka 565-0871, Division of Medical Devices, National Institute of Health Sciences, Setagaya-ku, 158-8501 Tokyo, Faculty of Science, Tokyo University of Science, Shinjuku-ku, Tokyo 162-8601, Department of Cancer Research, Toyama Institute of Health, 17-1 Nakataikouyama, Kosugi-machi, Imizu-gun, Toyama 939-0363, New Industry Creation Hatchery Center, Yokohama College of Pharmacy, Tozuka-ku, Yokohama, Kanagama 245-0066, and Graduate School of Pharmaceutical Sciences, Nagoya City University, Mizuho-ku, Nagoya, Aichi 467-8603, Japan fukuhara@nihs.go.jp.

Resveratrol ( trans-3,4',5-trihydroxystilbene) is a natural phytoalexin with various biological activities including inhibition of lipid peroxidation and free radical scavenging properties. In addition to its beneficial effects, resveratrol also has significant genotoxicity that leads to a high frequency of chromosome aberration together with micronucleus and sister chromatid exchanges. To enhance the radical scavenging activities and to reduce the genotoxicity of resveratrol, we designed 4'-methyl resveratrol analogues where a methyl group was introduced at the ortho position relative to the 4'-hydroxy group, which is responsible for both antioxidative activities and genotoxicity of resveratrol. These synthesized methyl analogues of resveratrol showed increased antioxidative activities against galvinoxyl radical as an oxyl radical species. Furthermore, the methyl analogues also surprisingly showed reduced in vitro genotoxicities, suggesting that methyl substitution may improve resveratrol efficacy.

PMID: 18177016 [PubMed - as supplied by publisher]

[bixbyte]

Vita Prime Lab's 99% Resveratrol:

I bought 200 grams of 99% RSV from VP Labs came with a 99.12% COA included.
Stuff is caked and was never fine mesh processed.
$63 for 100 grams or $650 for a Kilo?
I do not know why they charge less for 100 grams.
Spoke to owners Wife today.
She told me they sold 1,000 grams so far.
Their stuff is pure but crude.

I have to run the ultrasonic cleaner for a good 3 minutes to dissolve.
Looks exactly like the 50% red RSV but it is off white and tastes like real strong Res.

You definately can not cap their stuff and absorb it as it needs further processing but it can be taken
with miralax and ultrasonicated for at least 3 minutes.
Probably burn out my ultrasonic cleaner. Their RES is "Ruff" powder.

[edward]

snip...
You definately can not cap their stuff and absorb it as it needs further processing snip...

I disagree with this, just because it is "ruff" and the particle size needs to be further reduced doesn't mean you won't absorb it. Seriously, very rough 50% products or any herbal products that are standardized are absorbed, your digestive system is an amazing thing (it was evolved to do just this sort of thing).

edit: I'm ok with the "ruff"ness of it, I can work with it or even if I don't want to bother, just take more, its cheap enough. I am just waiting for the COA saying TRANS Resveratrol not just Resveratrol

Bix, did the COA you mentioned say Resveratrol or Trans Resveratrol. Do you mind posting it? I haven't my promised COA yet.

Edited by edward, 30 January 2008 - 09:44 PM.

[maxwatt]

snip...
You definately can not cap their stuff and absorb it as it needs further processing snip...

I disagree with this, just because it is "ruff" and the particle size needs to be further reduced doesn't mean you won't absorb it. Seriously, very rough 50% products or any herbal products that are standardized are absorbed, your digestive system is an amazing thing (it was evolved to do just this sort of thing).

edit: I'm ok with the "ruff"ness of it, I can work with it or even if I don't want to bother, just take more, its cheap enough. I am just waiting for the COA saying TRANS Resveratrol not just Resveratrol

Bix, did the COA you mentioned say Resveratrol or Trans Resveratrol. Do you mind posting it? I haven't my promised COA yet.

People are micronizing resveratrol to improve bioavailability. That this material wasn't properly dried to achieve a decent particle size, doesn't indicate a sophisticated operation. If you can't cap it, it must be pretty coarse indeed. The strong taste Bixbyte noted indicates some kind of solvent residue, or inadequate washing of the finished product. The off white color could indicate significant anthocyanins, perhaps left over from the plant it's made from.

It's almost certain to be trans-resveratrol with not more than a trace of cis. Only exposure to ultraviolet light, or a persistent pH of around 11 will give you any significant amount of cis-resveratrol.

The big questions I have: what's in it that gives it such a strong bitter flavor? Do you get major diarrhea when you take a large dose, say one gram? Two grams?

[Hedgehog]

Their RES is "Ruff" powder.

humm, does it have an chemical odor?

I wonder if it was purified and not dried properly???

I still haven’t gotten my shipment, I will do a quick OVI test and see if it has dicholoromethane, MeOH, EtOH, IPA, Isopropylacetate, ACN (all are common wash solvents)

If it has high levels of DCM or even detectable amounts I think somebody should send a sample out for ICP-MS for metal testing…

[Hedgehog]

snip...
You definately can not cap their stuff and absorb it as it needs further processing snip...

I disagree with this, just because it is "ruff" and the particle size needs to be further reduced doesn't mean you won't absorb it. Seriously, very rough 50% products or any herbal products that are standardized are absorbed, your digestive system is an amazing thing (it was evolved to do just this sort of thing).

edit: I'm ok with the "ruff"ness of it, I can work with it or even if I don't want to bother, just take more, its cheap enough. I am just waiting for the COA saying TRANS Resveratrol not just Resveratrol

Bix, did the COA you mentioned say Resveratrol or Trans Resveratrol. Do you mind posting it? I haven't my promised COA yet.

People are micronizing resveratrol to improve bioavailability. That this material wasn't properly dried to achieve a decent particle size, doesn't indicate a sophisticated operation. If you can't cap it, it must be pretty coarse indeed. The strong taste Bixbyte noted indicates some kind of solvent residue, or inadequate washing of the finished product. The off white color could indicate significant anthocyanins, perhaps left over from the plant it's made from.

It's almost certain to be trans-resveratrol with not more than a trace of cis. Only exposure to ultraviolet light, or a persistent pH of around 11 will give you any significant amount of cis-resveratrol.

The big questions I have: what's in it that gives it such a strong bitter flavor? Do you get major diarrhea when you take a large dose, say one gram? Two grams?

You beat me to it by 3min! LOL

Any other solvents I should test for?

[bixbyte]

I disagree with this, just because it is "ruff" and the particle size needs to be further reduced doesn't mean you won't absorb it. Seriously, very rough 50% products or any herbal products that are standardized are absorbed, your digestive system is an amazing thing (it was evolved to do just this sort of thing).

edit: I'm ok with the "ruff"ness of it, I can work with it or even if I don't want to bother, just take more, its cheap enough. I am just waiting for the COA saying TRANS Resveratrol not just Resveratrol

Bix, did the COA you mentioned say Resveratrol or Trans Resveratrol. Do you mind posting it? I haven't my promised COA yet.

COA uploaded:

 VITA.jpg   41.26KB   30 downloads

[bixbyte]

Any other solvents I should test for?

% Trans Res?
Emodin?
Moisture?
Ash?
Solvents?
Excipients?
Solvent Residues?
Heavy Metals?
Lead?
Mercury?
Arsenic?
Cadmium?
Organic Phosphates?
Pesticides?
Residues?
Microbiological Content?
Iron?

Edited by bixbyte, 30 January 2008 - 10:30 PM.

[edward]

People are micronizing resveratrol to improve bioavailability. That this material wasn't properly dried to achieve a decent particle size, doesn't indicate a sophisticated operation. If you can't cap it, it must be pretty coarse indeed. The strong taste Bixbyte noted indicates some kind of solvent residue, or inadequate washing of the finished product. The off white color could indicate significant anthocyanins, perhaps left over from the plant it's made from.

It's almost certain to be trans-resveratrol with not more than a trace of cis. Only exposure to ultraviolet light, or a persistent pH of around 11 will give you any significant amount of cis-resveratrol.

The big questions I have: what's in it that gives it such a strong bitter flavor? Do you get major diarrhea when you take a large dose, say one gram? Two grams?

The particle size is not that bad. I can get most of it, as is, to disperse with PEG in warm water and a simple hand blender(my previous method using Mega Res). As to capping it, I think Bix was just saying taking as is might not have great absorption. I could cap it just fine if I wanted to (its much finer than some of the powders I have capped before, I just think anything I take in gram quantities is a waste of time to cap.

I have taken 1 gram at a time and have had no diarrhea (still taking my 400 mg of 50% per day also, so you can add in Emodin from that and any potential Miralax issues and no diarrhea)

[edward]

As far as testing. Test if for anything that you can cost effectively test fort that would be logically in there. For me the biggies are heavy metals, solvent residues, actual Trans-Res vs. Cis-Res and biologicals.

The taste is strong but not as strong as 98%, and not bitter at all, (in my opinion it tastes somewhere between the 99% and 98% I have bought, maybe I bought some in the past that had other "stuff" in it, I don't know) but the type of taste is like the taste of 98% as in it doesn't taste chemically more like residual plant matter. But all this is speculation until we get more lab results. The COA you posted is not what I was expecting however. I was looking for something that stated clearly 99.whatever Trans-Resveratrol.

Edited by edward, 30 January 2008 - 11:48 PM.

[maxwatt]

snip...
You definately can not cap their stuff and absorb it as it needs further processing snip...

I disagree with this, just because it is "ruff" and the particle size needs to be further reduced doesn't mean you won't absorb it. Seriously, very rough 50% products or any herbal products that are standardized are absorbed, your digestive system is an amazing thing (it was evolved to do just this sort of thing).

edit: I'm ok with the "ruff"ness of it, I can work with it or even if I don't want to bother, just take more, its cheap enough. I am just waiting for the COA saying TRANS Resveratrol not just Resveratrol

Bix, did the COA you mentioned say Resveratrol or Trans Resveratrol. Do you mind posting it? I haven't my promised COA yet.

People are micronizing resveratrol to improve bioavailability. That this material wasn't properly dried to achieve a decent particle size, doesn't indicate a sophisticated operation. If you can't cap it, it must be pretty coarse indeed. The strong taste Bixbyte noted indicates some kind of solvent residue, or inadequate washing of the finished product. The off white color could indicate significant anthocyanins, perhaps left over from the plant it's made from.

It's almost certain to be trans-resveratrol with not more than a trace of cis. Only exposure to ultraviolet light, or a persistent pH of around 11 will give you any significant amount of cis-resveratrol.

The big questions I have: what's in it that gives it such a strong bitter flavor? Do you get major diarrhea when you take a large dose, say one gram? Two grams?

You beat me to it by 3min! LOL

Any other solvents I should test for?

Ethanol, methanol, and EDTA are the only likely candidates I can think of. If the stuff is extracted with a large HPLC column, what are they likely to use as a medium?
I thought from BixByte's report there were some large crystaline lumps in there. Some 98% has an off taste and were decidedly yellowish or brownish, other samples I've seen were tasteless, or nearly so, and very white.


I'd have like to have seen tests for cadmium and especially mercury in the COA.

Maybe you can post digital pictures?

edited for speling and gramer

Edited by maxwatt, 31 January 2008 - 12:44 AM.

[edward]

The lumps seen are simply compressed powder (I transferred it from the compressed package it came in to an bulk nutrition tub)

Just looks like 99% powder to me, just not as white as my last batch.


speling and gramer perfect no need to edt

my camera is crap though

[maxwatt]

The lumps seen are simply compressed powder (I transferred it from the compressed package it came in to an bulk nutrition tub)

Just looks like 99% powder to me, just not as white as my last batch.


speling and gramer perfect no need to edt

my camera is crap though

Powder caking can indicate transfer of a hot or incompletely cooled powder to a cold container; the resulting moisture migration binds particles together and causes clumping and caking similar to that shown in the picture. Another cause can be improper operation of a flash drier, or poor handling or storage procedures. It is probably not a problem in regards to product purity, but such caking might somewhat inhibit absorption in the gut. If I had this material, I would macerate it while in a bag to break up as many lumps as possible to the greatest degree possible. Maybe put it under a mattress and sleep on it for a few nights. If dissolving it in ethanol or oil, this shouldn't be necessary.

I'm told much of the pure resveratrol produced in China is used in cosmetics in Europe and Asia, but material with this degree of caking is unacceptable for such purposes, as the manufacturing process demands a uniform powder with good flow characteristics, which this won't have. If this was a rejected lot, that could explain why the price is so low.

Edited to remove image, once in the thread is enough.]

Edited by maxwatt, 31 January 2008 - 01:57 AM.

[bixbyte]

Just looks like 99% powder to me, just not as white as my last batch.

The powder is not white, it is Gray (Grey) in color (colour)
Looks like there could be some metal oxides.
I have some next to yours and the difference in color is obvious.

Howz my speling?

[missminni]

[
I'm surprised to hear there is a discernible taste. The powder I have, which is 98.3% t-Res, has no taste at all,
is super fine, very white, dissolves with very little effort (gently swirling it around in a little milk will totally dissolve it)
and has no clumps at all. It's perfectly smooth.

Edited by missminni, 31 January 2008 - 02:50 AM.

[sUper GeNius]

[quote name='missminni' date='30-Jan 2008, 09:47 PM' post='221803']
[
I'm surprised to hear there is a discernible taste. The powder I have, which is 98.3% t-Res, has no taste at all,
is super fine, very white, dissolves with very little effort (gently swirling it around in a little milk will totally dissolve it)
and has no clumps at all. It's perfectly smooth.
[/quote

Mine is granular, dissolves in coffee, very sweet, like, like sugar!?? Hey, did I get ripped?









; )

[missminni]

Mine is granular, dissolves in coffee, very sweet, like, like sugar!?? Hey, did I get ripped

; )

LOL.
All kidding aside,
after seeing that picture,
I wouldn't take it until an independent lab analysis is done and then I still wouldn't. I don't think it's worth
the price considering what it looks like. It looks like old baking soda that's been in the frig too long.
I knew something wasn't right. Why in the world would you sell 100grams for less than the price
you would be pay per gram for a kilo? To get rid of it.
Is there a money back guarantee? I hope so.

[edward]

Now now, first of all my camera is crap, I mean really bad. Second the original package was packed very tightly almost like a vacuum packed package, anything you pack that tightly and then transfer to another container is going to cake somewhat. Now I could have smoothed it all out for you all nice and pretty and got a high resolution camera instead of my camera phone. Anyways, it dissolves fine in oil, confirmed that tonight. PEG with a hand blender and warm water leaves some residual but not bad. I'm still not buying the whole milk protein thing so I'm not trying that (gave up on the whey idea). The only reason I care what others think is that I suspect that for this guy's business model to work (and for me to have a steady supply) he is going to need to sell truck loads of the stuff. Either that or he has simply gotten a one time shipment through connections and once its gone that will be it. Anyways, once another lab, or Hedgehog confirms things I will be more than happy.

[missminni]

Now now, first of all my camera is crap, I mean really bad. Second the original package was packed very tightly almost like a vacuum packed package, anything you pack that tightly and then transfer to another container is going to cake somewhat. Now I could have smoothed it all out for you all nice and pretty and got a high resolution camera instead of my camera phone. Anyways, it dissolves fine in oil, confirmed that tonight. PEG with a hand blender and warm water leaves some residual but not bad. I'm still not buying the whole milk protein thing so I'm not trying that (gave up on the whey idea). The only reason I care what others think is that I suspect that for this guy's business model to work (and for me to have a steady supply) he is going to need to sell truck loads of the stuff. Either that or he has simply gotten a one time shipment through connections and once its gone that will be it. Anyways, once another lab, or Hedgehog confirms things I will be more than happy.

I hope it tests out okay for your sake, I really do, and that the issue
is only cosmetic. It is a very different substance from what I've been getting, visually and
from bixbyte's description of the taste, color and texture. Maybe it wasn't good enough to
make grade A, and it's a mark down, like irregular sheets and towels. I buy irregular sheets
and towels all the time and am very pleased with them. I'm not sure what you mean about "buying the
whole milk protein thing", but I have been using it that way and having excellent results. It dissolves
very quickly in milk and actually makes the milk taste like cream.

[doronrapp]

missminni,

I could begin to pick a part your post but that wouldn't serve any purpose so I will leave it at this, if the COA turns out to be 99% Trans Resveratrol (free of heavy metals, fungus, mold etc.) then I don't care where it came from, how it got there or who its from, and at 2 grams a day, with 99% Trans Resveratrol that is 20mg per day of an unknown that if its not a heavy metal or a fungus then I don't see it having an impact on my health.

But will it keep on coming?

If I bought 99% resveratrol in 100 kilo lots at the current market price in China, I could almost break even selling it at $620/kg taking into account other necessary costs: reshipping to the customer, packaging, and testing. 98% is more cost effective, but even so the profit margin would be no more than 6 to 10%. This is not a good model for a start up. Add to the mix the uncertainty of future price; despite the rising value of the Chinese currency, resveratrol prices are dropping, new facilities have come on-line, and the new harvest in June will hugely increase supply. One could be stuck with a warehouse holding hundreds of kilos of resveratrol that cost almost $600/kilo, and the market price in China could then be half that much. Unless this stuff fell off the back of a truck, or is from some synthetic lab or bathtub using a bacterial culture somewhere, the marketing model makes little sense. I await the test results, and I expect they'll be good. If Vitalprime are not crazy like a fox, they won't last, or else they have uncovered a very inexpensive source indeed.

I agree with you 100%. It just doesn’t make sense, and when it doesn’t, then something is wrong. I don’t know if it was sold as a close-out deal which may end up at your local Dollar Store or a damaged product. I do know that prices don’t fall 50% in one day. We have seen gradual reduction in price within the last year and we adjusted our prices according. The price of 99% powder varies from around $550- $800 averaging around $650 per Kg. Add shipping, import tax, broker fees, packaging, Lab tests, and its beyond $800 (which does not include rent, electricity, employees etc.). I also don’t understand the logic of selling small quantity cheaper (per gram) than large quantity. In short, I don’t see this as a long term influence, unless they bought a huge quantity which any way will deteriorate with time.


Doron
M.R.

Edited by doronrapp, 31 January 2008 - 03:19 PM.