I noticed a craving for (apple cider) vinegar - is it bad to take any calories whatsoever?
Disregarding social/work constraints, do you have a preference of a long fast over multiple shorter equal total length ones in terms of benefit/cost?
The danger of vinegar or calories in any form is that
a taste will reawaken the appetite and this will sabotage the fast. But I remember once using successfully liquid ALCAR, which tasted pretty sweet, even though it had not glucose but other sugars. I took a swig of it when I was getting a headache in the evening of the second day, and it helped me to get over the hurdle within minutes.
Vinegar has acetic acid, which goes well with ketosis. But I think that craving sour tastes like vinegar or sauerkraut juice may be symptoms of ammonia buildup due to bacteria in the intestine. Vinegar/sauerkraut juice neutralizes ammonia and keeps a lid on that type of bacteria. Washing them buggers out works even better; it curbs the cravings and improves how you feel.
According to some people I have talked to, and interviewed, like Paul Wakfer, it only takes 16 hours of fasting to upregulate autophagy. Wakfer's routine was to fast for 20 hours each day, then eat all of his necessary calories over the course of a 4 hour period.
I'd like to know based on what studies he came to this conclusion (I suspect rodents and if so, I don't buy it). And autophagy in what tissues/organs? Even within the same body, it's not the same throughout the board.
If you are going for ketosis and autophagy, then it would take a little longer. However, I wonder about doing exercise to deplete glycogen as an option to bring on ketosis quicker.
I also wondered about that so I experimented with various methods trying to expedite the transition to ketosis. It did not work for me.
Once I went wildly active on the first 2 days of the fast. I ran and jumped and danced and rollerbladed and whatnot. But ketosis still did not start until the morning of the 3rd day. Maybe I should have ran a marathon, but I have always been a sprinter. I did ran out of muscle glycogen though. So that morning I woke up clearheaded, but almost unable to move. I barely dragged myself into the living room, sliding my feet on the floor, as if skiing, because I could not lift my legs. I moved slowly, just like a sloth, and could barely talk. Never again!
I also toyed with drinking MCT oil in the first 2 days. And while I could feel and taste them ketones, this is not the same as the ketotic state, which comes with significant hormonal
global changes. When it starts, the image I get is of a bell tolling over a village, the weather changes, different winds blow, people stop and look up at the sky and then hurry home. Starvation ketosis is very different from the fed state and it comes when liver decides that its glycogen is running low.
I think that for
novices, especially men, their liver tends to hold out until the last glycogen drop --well, almost-- because, if you don't mind me anthropomorphizing, it sort of does not believe that you actually are going to fast. Why should it? It has not happened in decades. It has always been enough for the glucose level to drop low enough -- and the host invariably grabs something to eat. My first time, especially the night of the second day, was the most difficult thing I've ever done as far as fasting is concerned. The good news is that you need to do it only once. It gets much easier quickly with practice.
I already eat a ketogenic diet and I've been measuring blood ketones. They are always .4 mmol in the morning and go up to ~2 in the evening, after my meal (whether I've worked or not).
My urine ketone results went to trace levels long ago so I stopped measuring. Urine strips measure acetoacetate while blood ketones measure Beta-hydroxybutyrate. Two things happen when you're in ketosis long term. The kidneys lessen excretion of them while the muscle cells start converting acetoacetate into beta-hydroxybutyrate.
That's very interesting dynamics of beta-hydroxybutyrate during a day. And I vaguely recall now that by day 17, which is the average for reaching a new point of homeostasis, urine ketones disappear, even though it is not always universally true (individual variations). I will dig out that study later on, cause for now I'd like to limit my sitting time.
Everything that happens on a ketogenic diet, happens quicker on a fast. The stages and general dynamics are the same, even though they are less pronounced on a diet.
I don't quite agree with the quote from the book that "there is nothing magical in having circulating ketones above 0.5 mMol/L level". For example, autophagy is greatly stimulated in the presence of ketones, the higher the better. The other thing is, according to the 1970s studies, ketones penetrate into the brain easier when their level reaches 3 mMol/L and at higher level still, one completely adapts to starvation. That's a very interesting state, when most loose ~100 g of weight per day. Then people marvel at how little energy it takes to supply what seems at times like abundant energy (in healthy people and within a reasonable timeframe, of course). I am interested in exploring those states.
Edited by xEva, 12 March 2013 - 12:02 PM.