2352 replies to this topic

[SenBen]

Thank you very much Kelvin!

 

You really helped me.

 

Just one more question and I will not bother you again:

 

On Fission (day 1) - 1 gram Nicotinamide 

Do I have to take also 1g of Ribose or 1 gram Nicotinamide is enough?

 

Thank you!

 

[Kelvin]

Thank you very much Kelvin!

 

You really helped me.

 

Just one more question and I will not bother you again:

 

On Fission (day 1) - 1 gram Nicotinamide 

Do I have to take also 1g of Ribose or 1 gram Nicotinamide is enough?

 

Thank you!

 

That's easy:  Save your time and money and skip the ribose.  

 

You don't need it for the protocol.

Edited by Kelvin, 30 April 2025 - 12:10 AM.

[SenBen]

Thank you Kelvin!

[SenBen]

Could anyone please tell me if

Nicotinamide is the some as Niacinamide?

 

I need Nicotinamide for Mito protocol.

 

 

Thank you!

[stephen_b]

Could anyone please tell me if

Nicotinamide is the some as Niacinamide?

 

I need Nicotinamide for Mito protocol.

 

 

Thank you!

 

Yes it is.

 

Nicotinamide and niacinamide are two names for the same compound, a form of vitamin B3. They are chemically identical and have the same functions. Niacinamide is more commonly used in the skincare industry, while nicotinamide is the scientific name, often used in research and supplements. 

(google)

[SenBen]

Thank you!

[Alessandro]

Now is there KL-1333, the first-in-class for NAD+.

The only one able to rescue people with primary mitochodrial diseases.

[ekaitz]

Remember to alternate between NMN and Nicotinamide for fission on SEPARATE days because although NMN causes fission in most of the body it causes fusion in the brain, while nicotinamide/NAM causes fission in the brain.  If you take nicotinamide at the same time as NMN they cancel each other out for no brain benefit.

 

So do this

 

Fission (day 1) - 1 gram Nicotinamide 

Fusion (day 2) - (AAKG is not necessary on fusion day if taking 1 gram of AKG - I use Double wood brand AKG)

Fission (day 3) - 1 gram NMN

Fusion (day 4) - normal fusion stack

Fission (day 5) - 1 gram Nicotinamide 

etc, etc

 

Yes you can take TMG.

I usually take 2 grams TMG every 3- 4 mito cycles to restore methyl stores that are depleted by NMN and NAM.

 

Is it ok to use NR instead NMN for the same benefit? Same amount, 1gram?

 

Also, shouldn't PQQ be added on fusion days along with the AKG?
 

Edited by ekaitz, 31 August 2025 - 11:10 PM.

[Kelvin]

Is it ok to use NR instead NMN for the same benefit? Same amount, 1gram?

 

Also, shouldn't PQQ be added on fusion days along with the AKG?
 

 

 

Nicotinamide and NMN appear to have different effects.

 

Both I and others have noticed greater muscle tone when using NMN for fission relative to nicotinamide.  NMN also has other benefits that nicotinamide does not such as improving insulin sensitivity in diabetics and prediabetics.

 

Since they have different affects, they probably affect mitochondria differently and so I rotate them on fission days just to be sure I am affecting as much mitochondria as possible.

 

Dosage is 1 gram nicotinamide (since using more than that doesn't appear to improve results) and at least 750 mgs of NMN, sometimes 1 gram NMN.

 

For PQQ I don't think it is necessary to use it more than 1 every 4 fission cycles to eliminate stray epigenetically damaged mitochondria that escaped the fission protocol days that didn't use PQQ.  

 

I don't use it more because (based on Turnbuckle's description of mitochondrial latching) PQQ increases mitochondrial numbers and, since the C60 protocol works by affecting mitochondrial morphology, I don't want excessive PQQ use to potentially negatively affect the C60 protocol when I use it.

 

I forget the reason Turnbuckle used PQQ on fusion days, but I haven't noticed any improvement when using it on fusion.  So I just use PQQ on fission days, and this seems to work just fine.

Edited by Kelvin, 03 September 2025 - 08:47 PM.

[Garrick Peschke]

 

[Desperate]

Since cancer is a mitochondria disease could this work for my father?
I'm trying the old protocol with the niacinamide. Should the supps be dissolved in water? I'm unable to do so. Are the ingredients still bioavailable to the body? Thank you.

[Blueflash]

Since cancer is a mitochondria disease could this work for my father?
I'm trying the old protocol with the niacinamide. Should the supps be dissolved in water? I'm unable to do so. Are the ingredients still bioavailable to the body? Thank you.

 If I come down with cancer, it will be a dog dewormer I reach for called panacur C. (Fenbendazole) I have personally seen a before and after PET scan of someone my wife knew. His cancer doctor told him " I know it's not the chemo doing this"

Hope this helps. I wish you both the best

[lost69]

Since cancer is a mitochondria disease could this work for my father?
I'm trying the old protocol with the niacinamide. Should the supps be dissolved in water? I'm unable to do so. Are the ingredients still bioavailable to the body? Thank you.

 

also check all thomas seyfried studies "cancer as a metabolic and mitochondrial disease" this is what i would do, ketogenic diet or carnivore, a lot of fasting and glutamine blockers ((Fenbendazole)

 

the protocol on this page is ofr antiaging i dont think it helps with cancer too much  damage/too late for this protocol

 

 

 

[Blueflash]

Since cancer is a mitochondria disease could this work for my father?
I'm trying the old protocol with the niacinamide. Should the supps be dissolved in water? I'm unable to do so. Are the ingredients still bioavailable to the body? Thank you.

 

Also, reishi mushroom is something I'd be taking

[Kelvin]

Since cancer is a mitochondria disease could this work for my father?
I'm trying the old protocol with the niacinamide. Should the supps be dissolved in water? I'm unable to do so. Are the ingredients still bioavailable to the body? Thank you.

 

 

The development of cancer can be initiated by mitochondrial dysfunction.  However, restoring mitochondrial health might not be sufficient to treat cancer because there are so many complex pathways involved and much depends on the type of cancer and how advanced it is.

 

Also, I think Turnbuckle did not recommend the mito protocol for those with cancer since he said fission might help cancer proliferate faster.

 

I don't know anything at all about Fenbendazole.

 

If I had cancer, I would still follow a standard course of cancer treatment unless the prognosis were very poor.

 

If the prognosis was not poor, then I would take the following anti-cancer supplements in addition to taking the standard medical treatments (Keep in mind this is what I would take, I cannot promise any cancer patient the following would be successful for their situation) -

 

100 mgs Sulforaphane at least 3 times a week (taken with a spoonful of brown mustard to activate the sulforaphane). Thorne Research is the best product available.

 

300 mgs Tocotrienols at least 3 times a week (from a brand that does not have include any tocopherols, especially alpha-tocopherol because they interfere with tocotrienol abosrbition).   I use Swanson vitamin tocotrienols.

 

1 gram IP6 at least 3 times a week(Helps starve cancer cells of iron which they need at a higher rate than healthy cells)

 

300 mgs Resveratrol + 300 mgs of grapeseed extract at least twice a week.

 

250 mgs Pterostilbene at least twice a week.

 

1 gram Curcumin at least once a week.

 

1 gram Quercetin at least once a week.

 

1 gram Fisetin at least once a week.

 

I would try not to take everything on the same day, and spread them out, so I don't put too many supplements in my body at once.

Edited by Kelvin, 27 October 2025 - 07:12 PM.

[bullGenteel]

I agree with Kelvin. I saw this post when fasting. I think someone warned away from mitochondria optimization, I wasn't to motivatwd ro reply. Also wasn't taking any oxytocon boostingagents for a whikw, so perhaps not so outgoing as I coupd have been. I let my friend try mitochondria protocol, prior to the time I felt like stem cell protocol intervention had upped my IQ. I made some reversals in all my approaches, suddenly after I felt I could think more broadly and cohernetly on these subjects. I stopped the protocol for her and I did get her to take pretty much all the things Kelvin mentioned.

For reverstatrol I had her take like 10's of mg( maybe 30mg) that you mix in your mouth with like .5mg of copper. You take it constantly every few hours. Based off Questforlife's theory that low dose of these substances do not upregulate sirt1 and can clean up fragmented DNA floating freely with the potential to matastatize, if it contains any mutated DNA content.

It could be placebo, but I felt about the same degree of bump up to my wellbeing from this reversatrol protocol, as I did from brain aggregates dissolvong protocol, aka turnbuckle's alzhimers protocol. I would have a lot of DNA fragments floating in my extracellular space un my brain from damaged neurons from a brain injury.

If you research cancer, which I gave up on after a couple stabs at it. Way too frustrating, how as other state all the way cancer can adapt, it's near impossible to wrap your head around. I may return to it later. But tumors have mitochondria they rely on for energy so most of these protocols, you'd almost want to do the opposite if you have cancer or are at high risk, I'd imagine but Im no expert. I beleive this is the main cancer fighting factor involved in metformin that it causes mitochondria dysfunction, if I am not mistaken.

I did find it interesting, if I recall clearly enough. Glutamine both increased within tumors and within mitochondria may be beneficial to fight cancer, however increasing it in the extracellular space is pro cancer. I may have that backwards, don't quote me. I don't feel like delvong into the reaearch at moment. Even, perhaps at different stages glutamine my be anti/pro cancer. Perhaps.it is mentionwd a couple poats up abour a synthesized vwrsion of glutamine that can enter cells. But likely not avialble to public. Or the other user mentioned anit-glutamine agent.

I think to keep it simple you want to take substances that are anit-tumergenic, if that is the term, as opposed to avoiding anti-cancer. I had my friend take other substances too in some modified alzhimers protocol to treat a milder brain injury. Any anti-cancer element is pro cancer to those at risk or who sadly may have cancer, as many members have stated on this forum. If you don't have cancer than mitochondria dysfunction can lead to cancer as kelvin said, but after cancer mitochondria are useful to it.

I have a bad memory, but I believe even stem cells mutated or not can be used by cancer. I don't recall or know for sure but likely you don't want to mobilize stem cells. But the immune system plays a big role to fight cancer, which chemo may destroy. Thia is why Longo advocates using fasting and the refeeding stage to mobilize stem cells to rebuild up a dampened immune system. Though I read that the lining of the colon turns over cells so fast that if you ingest carcinogenic agents the strm cells could promote colon cancer for those at risk.

I skimmed the chapter of Dr. Peter Atillia's chapter on cancer in his book. He states thst the most compelling research uses lab synthesized antibodies that match the specific cancer to allow t-cells to fight cancer. Also, to bolster quesrforlife's work using the statistics this book covers saying that cancer has improced survival rates, if it is caught early enough. However once it matastizes, the survival rates are as bleak as they have ever been. Also, Quest highlights that chemo destroying cancer cells, likely quickens matastatizing the cancer by freeing damaged cells with the mutant DNA fragments than to traverse the body.

[bullGenteel]

I couldn-t edit my last post but was thinking after I posted, opps can't think about two things at once. Metformin is also a Keto mimicking diet thru blocking glucose, if that's how it works similar to glucosamine, to give it extra anti-cancer effects, in addition ot mitochondria dysregulation.

[bullGenteel]

So I got like a few hours sleep at most last night. So, I decided to trial Ginseng and 20-25g of Creatine. Just since I had an easy going day today. I wanted to check the sleep-deprived optimized functioning potential of the combo. I have tried 20g creatine and it makes a huge difference for me when aleep deprived.

Anyways I read through the whole thread of questforlife's telomere extending thread. I really am upset with myself for mixing in senyiotics with one of his protocols a few mpnths back. I know I really set myself back a lot in my recovery. I read it back to front to back or middle to back to front. After reading the first section, I kinda see what I was going for in my first fateful go at his protocol. It really seemed to help me. Keep in mind I kinda cringe at reading my comments. In my defense I only feel half way functioning with Ginkgo, or agmatine or high dose creatine to function which I cant take when I do these treatments. I also have experimenting by just So I got like a few hours sleep at most last night. So, I decided to trial Ginseng and 20-25g of Creatine. Just since I had an easy going day today. I wanted to check the sleep-deprived optimized functioning potential of the combo. I have tried 20g creatine and it makes a huge difference for me when aleep deprived.

Anyways I read through the whole thread of questforlife's telomere extending thread. I really am upset with myself for mixing in senyiotics with one of his protocols a few mpnths back. I know I really set myself back a lot in my recovery. I read it back to front to back or middle to back to front. After reading the first section, I kinda see what I was going for in my first fateful go at his protocol. It really seemed to help me. Keep in mind I kinda cringe at reading my comments. In my defense I only feel half way functioning with Ginkgo, or agmatine or high dose creatine to function which I cant take when I do these treatments. I also have experimenting by just getting by with less crutches. Ginseng may give greatest degree of cognitive boost, but its not an everyday supplement.

Anyways, I do see what I was thinking with his protocol. I may try it again. I wonder if his cancer protocol he mentioned could be similar to what I was implementing myself. It sounds simple now his anti-cancer protocol. But I wouldn't know if it only works in vitro, or if it doesn't pan out in the real world. Perhaps, partly Stemming from the fact, in some cases, how it has been reported on how much fraud goes on in research. I guess quest posted 2 papers and explained them a bit. But I understood that the upregulation of sirt4 arrests cell proliferation to allow DNA damage to be repaired. This effect is also harnessed to allow cells to be returned to a pluripotent state with roc and loc inhibitors. The papers stated that by combining sirt4 and glutamine it can inhibit the synthesis of glutamine from glutamate intracellularly in the TCA cycle to arrest tumor growth. I believe Quest may have preferred AKG to be used for glutamine deficiency. Since the second stage of his protocol was proliferating redifferentiated cells. But glutamine in its basic form combined with sirt4 could be anticancer. I don't know the applicability in real world.

Here is a link to the paper Q4L shared:


Sirt4: The Glutamine Gatekeeper



"...glutamine is converted into glutamate by glutaminase (GLS) and then into α-ketoglutarate (αKG) by either glutamate dehydrogenase (GDH) or, less prominently, by transamination-coupled reactions."

"...shown  that SIRT4 ADP-ribosylates and inhibits GDH (Haigis et al., 2006), and based on this, they reasoned that SIRT4 might be involved in the inhibition of glutamine uptake and anaplerosis triggered by DNA damage"

In the same paper, It mentions that tumors can still use serine to replenish the tca cycle by fostering the synthesis of glutamine from akg. But in breast cancer it states that a PHGDH inhibitor can block this transference as well. A natural PHGDH inhibitor is Withaferin A (aswagandha, ksm-66?) That was the one of a few natural based inhibitors that jumped out at me since it is pretty common.


"...breast cancers present a particular type of glutamine-dependent anaplerosis characterized by elevated levels of the gene encoding phosphoglycerate dehydrogenase (PHGDH) "

"The relevance of this pathway for cancer does not reside in the synthesis of serine but on the fact that its transamination step is coupled to the conversion of glutamate into αKG."

I remember serine can lower homocysteine, which may be beneficial to many, in spite of its pro cancer properties. Perhaps aswagands could be paired with it too.

I don't know if it would be this simple but I vaguely remembered Quest stated his protocol could be seen at as be helpful with cancer as I interpreted it. Reservatrol does upregulate sirt4, atleast it was originally thought it can. Im willing to try combining reservstrol and copper with his progenitor cell redifferntiating protocol. I got good results I felt, till I stupidly restocked my pure resvatrol with a formula with GSE. I was pretty well just confabulating my whole business in my stab at his protocol.


Anyways, I do see what I was thinking with his protocol. I may try it again. I wonder if his cancer protocol he mentionid could be similar to what I was implementing myself. It sounds simple now his anti-cancer protocol. But I wouldn't know if it only works in vitro, or if it doesn't pan out in the real world. Perhaps, partly Stemming from the fact, in some cases, how it has been reported on how much fraud goes on in research. I guess quest posted 2 papers and explained them a bit. But I understood that the upregulation of sirt4 arrests cell proliferation to allow DNA damage to be repaired. This effect is also harnessed to allow cells to be returned to a pluripotent state with roc and loc inhibitors. The papers stated that by combining sirt4 and glutamine it can inhibit the synthesis of glutamine from glutamate intracellularly in the TCA cycle to arrest tumor growth. I believe Quest may have preferred AKG to be used for glutamine deficiency. Since the second stage of his protocol was proliferating redifferentiated cells. But glutamine in its basic form combined with sirt4 could be anticancer. I don't know the applicability in real world.

In the same paper, It mentions that tumors can still use serine to replenish the tca cycle by fostering the synthesis of glutamine from akg. But in breast cancer it states that a PHGDH inhibitor can block this transference as well. A natural PHGDH inhibitor is Withaferin A (aswagandha, ksm-66?) That was the one of a few natural based inhibitors that jumped out at me since it is pretty common.

I remember serine can lower homocysteine, which may be beneficial to many, in spite of its pro cancer properties. Perhaps aswagands cpild be paired with it too.

I don't know if it would be this simple but I vaguely remembered Quest stated his protocol could be seen at as be helpful with cancer as I interpreted it. Reservatrol does upregulate sirt4, atleast it was originally thought it can. Im willing to try combining reservstrol and copper with his progenitor cell redifferntiating protocol. I got good results I felt, till I stupidly restocked my pure resvatrol with a formula with GSE. I was pretty well just confabulating my whole business in my stab at his protocol.

I think Questforlife has taken a lot different avenues in his thread. As he stated he's more interested in pushing the theoretical exploration of telemeres. Being young and healthy he may not need to test out his theories on himself, and understandably doesn't want others to experiment themselves.

I do a lot of wishfully thinking, so I still wonder if some.of hisntheories could be implemented safely.

Edited by bullGenteel, 30 October 2025 - 05:33 AM.

[lost69]

Hi, all, i have been missing for a long time since i had to address a large humeral osteonecrosis stage 1 and a completely ruptured subscapularis tendon, i could heal tendon simply by a carnivore diet plus prp injections (without the diet prp and supplements didn t work) and osteonecrosis has no symptoms now. it is getting smaller year after year while tendon is now perfect, only some scar tissue still visible on 2024 mri but insertion on bone is perfect

 

so i want to try mito protocols again especially to experiment before trying on my mother 82yo who's having atrial fibrillation, which is mainly correlated to mito damage, and try to reverse Afib or lower anti arrhythmia drug which blocks beta cells in the pancreas and makes a slow insulin response after meals. her glucose after a meal is low 110-114mg/dl on ketocarnivore diet, but it stays like that for more than 2 hrs and i really dont like this slow insulin response (no insulin resistance or other metabolic issues 99% it is the drug side effects)

 

i dont understand new turnbuckle protocols, linkedin posts are very brief and with new stuff i dont know like uplatching and downlatching...anyway i hope you can help me avoid mistakes

 

i started today by using 2g AAKG + 100mg PQQ and felt a lot of energy immediately. i take other supplements like magnesium, vitamina d, arginine, collagen, vit k2 mk4 and so on, not supplements used for fission, fusion and so on.

should i stop them on the days of these protocols to avoid intereference or just keep them many hours apart?

 

after increasing mito count by AAKG+PQQ can i go immediately to day 1 "nicotinamide 1g only" or "nicotinamide 1g+1g AAKG+20mg PQQ"  still good?

day 2 fusion 300mg DHM, 1g AAKG, and 20mg PQQ, are they all needed?

 

i have liposomal nmn now shall i take 1g or maybe 500mg liposomal will be ok?

 

thank you

 

Edited by lost69, 21 December 2025 - 03:51 PM.

[Kelvin]

I haven't tried the new latching mitochondrial protocol.  He says on Linkedin that the latching protocol (because of its large dose of PQQ) may increase the number of mitochondria over an extended period of time (hence your energy boost), therefore he does not recommend using it frequently since the energy boost should last a while without additional cycles.

 

For your mother, NMN improves insulin responses more than other NAD+ boosters.  She may want to try the older mito protocol but substitute NMN for Nicotinamide on fission days.

 

Since you have osteocarcinoma, and Turnbuckle didn't recommend the previous Fission-Fusion mito protocol for those with cancer because fission might increase cancer growth, did you ever try the mito protocol (or C60 protocol) and did it reduce, increase, or have no effect on the cancer?

 

Edited by Kelvin, 24 December 2025 - 05:43 PM.

[Advocatus Diaboli]

No mention of "cancer" was made in post 2329.

[lost69]

I haven't tried the new latching mitochondrial protocol.  He says on Linkedin that the latching protocol (because of its large dose of PQQ) may increase the number of mitochondria over an extended period of time (hence your energy boost), therefore he does not recommend using it frequently since the energy boost should last a while without additional cycles.

 

For your mother, NMN improves insulin responses more than other NAD+ boosters.  She may want to try the older mito protocol but substitute NMN for Nicotinamide on fission days.

 

Since you have osteocarcinoma, and Turnbuckle didn't recommend the previous Fission-Fusion mito protocol for those with cancer because fission might increase cancer growth, did you ever try the mito protocol (or C60 protocol) and did it reduce, increase, or have no effect on the cancer?

 

thanks i'll check the older protocol

 

no i dont have osteocarcinoma but osteonecrosis which is death of bone tissue due to lack of blood flow in that area during a trauma (in my case also due to a drug that weakens bones), that is impossible to stop or repair at my age but i could stop it and reverse some of the damage.

maybe i will try stemcells too later this year if the area is stil big on mri

 

i used gdf11 in the past which gave me a lot of real immediate results, about 8-9 years epigenetic age reversal, vocal range increased like in my 30 that allowed me to easily sing most difficult heavy metal/rock songs in impossible ranges for men and women and easily use also whistle range with a lot of power, less grey hair and many many other stuff like swimming butterfly for 3 hrs feeling no tiredness but the vocal range was such an immediate thing which is absolutely impossible in those high notes as you age

 

i also tried turnbuckle protocols, both mito and stemcells but i felt little to no effect compared to gdf11 and epigenetic age worsened to about 4 years younger

 

than i had the trauma on my shoulder and i stopped all protocols to be safe on the bones and tried everything to reverse bone edema, bone osteonecrosis and tendons ruptures (no surgery)

 

i'd like to try gdf11 and klotho in the future when osteonecrosis is completely reversed especially to be able to sing like that again

Edited by lost69, 24 December 2025 - 08:49 PM.

[bullGenteel]

I have tried the new uplatching protocol. Another poster mentioned using fumarate but I stuck with the original agents. I did add lactic acid on the first day of profligating mitochondria. I think there is benefits to it but I feel concerns over how strong if an acid it is. I also added in carnitine and agmatine in the uplatching part because I found a study saying it can inhibit glycolisis, which if I recall lactic acid can promote glycolisis to shorten enhancement of the krebs cycle. I also avoid citric acid just by fasting for 4 to 6 hours and take a second dose of agmatine and carnitine after a couple hours. I don't know if this helps but it seems to enhance the fusion a little, if it isnt placebo. I haven't tried Acetyl Carnitine in addition to canritine. I use to use Acetyl carntine with fusion agents a few times a week to maintain enhanced mitochondria state, based on advice somewhere in turnbuckles thread and another user's experiments. If I remember I found the one day of mitochondria proliferation and 3 days of down-latching combined with uplatching restored my status, after a bad expereinece wirh sneyiotics. I only took the pqq on the first day. I did find a forth day of uplatching made me feel a little less well off, so I will stick to 3 days. I just did 3 days this week but combined with the prior mentioned protocol.According to AI search Amoebas go thru binary fission to reproduce and it isn't known to have negative affects and plays a part in thier immortalty. I wonder if that is how mitochondria expand thier population and if it is something they, like amoebas can do indefinitely. I know others have posed similar concerns. I don't have any scientific background, so I just try to make my best guess.I was thinking I would reccomend you could do some research through Questforlife's long thread found here. I just try to wrap my head around concepts in a layman's terms. He would likely be able to weigh in on your situation and answer any questions. I guess unlike you, the stem cell protocol did help my injuries physical and a brain injury. I kinda plateaued in my recovery using stem cell protocol. I found my recovery was jump started again by following questforlife's protocol but then I made a mistake with senyitoics that arrested some early indications for enahnced healing. Currently I am doing another attempt at his protocol and I can feel more subjective improvements. I notice resuced fascia tissue on my previous fractured ankle. I think it will take more experimentation. I ama little skattershot in my approach to proliferate progentors and block differentiation which would have to be followed by promotion to differentiate. I think AKG can block differentiation and I also avoid neurogensis agents like growth hormone and oxytocin. It feels like intresting different benefits from both proliferation and differentiation. I feel subtle improvements or expect proliferate cells can reduce fascia and inflmmation. If not all in my head but the differentiation seems to really enhance myself cognitivly. Questforlife has just done a broad overview of the protocol. I think he mentioned along the lines of it could use some fine tuning. In addition to incorporating senyiotics into his protocol.I think it would be beneficial perhaps to start a thread on some of his protocols to work out details like was done on this thread. I imagine that having a full time career and life can hinder how much time on can invest in personal online research studies. Or perhaps like quest mentioned he just sticks to theoretical investigation to spur on the research into telomeres. I'd check that thread to research his protocol, since it is about reoreientating cells to progentor state which could aid recovery through proliferation of specialized cells. I imagine it might help with bone loss. It seem to be a complimentary approach in contrast to mobilizing stem cells if you have a lot of repairs needed.I know questforlife also did some more extensive experiments with igf11 so you could compare notes. I don't feel comfortable using injectables. I wouldn't trust myself to prepare safely and use needles. I have some mk-677 which might be useful and I'd feel safer using that, even if it not quite as effective. I am sure though that he didn't use igf11 with his progentor protocol.

Edited by bullGenteel, 25 December 2025 - 10:28 PM.

[Kelvin]

I misread that as osteocarcinoma.

 

For osteonecrosis, you shouldn't be using the mito protocol since fission accelerates the loss of damaged tissue.  For an injury it is better to wait for the site to heal so that the damaged cells can trigger stem cells to navigate to the site and repair the area.

 

For osteonecrosis, you would be better off taking the C60 protocol first to rebuild stem cell pools, then (a week or two later) take C60 by itself every day for at least a month to increase stem cell repair of the area.

 

 

Edited by Kelvin, 04 January 2026 - 09:19 PM.

[Kelvin]

I tried 6 cycles of my variation of the C60 stem cell protocol using a new supplier of C60 capsules (Carbon60 Olive Oil).  

 

This new brand worked much better than the other brand of C60 capsules I was using off of Amazon (PureC60 Olive Oil caps), and these new capsules do not leak.

 

It appears to work well because after just 4 cycles my skin was remarkably smoother and more youthful.  This was an improvement I did not notice to be nearly as dramatic as with the other brand.

 

Here is the link to the new product I am using (you will have to order directly from their site because it appears to not be available at Amazon) -

https://carbon60oliv...t/c60-capsules/

[Blueflash]

Thanks for the update, Kelvin. Do you or anyone else know, is this better than the SES Research product, and how many capsules do you take at a time?

[lost69]

I have tried the new uplatching protocol. Another poster mentioned using fumarate but I stuck with the original agents. I did add lactic acid on the first day of profligating mitochondria. I think there is benefits to it but I feel concerns over how strong if an acid it is. I also added in carnitine and agmatine in the uplatching part because I found a study saying it can inhibit glycolisis, which if I recall lactic acid can promote glycolisis to shorten enhancement of the krebs cycle. I also avoid citric acid just by fasting for 4 to 6 hours and take a second dose of agmatine and carnitine after a couple hours. I don't know if this helps but it seems to enhance the fusion a little, if it isnt placebo. I haven't tried Acetyl Carnitine in addition to canritine. I use to use Acetyl carntine with fusion agents a few times a week to maintain enhanced mitochondria state, based on advice somewhere in turnbuckles thread and another user's experiments. If I remember I found the one day of mitochondria proliferation and 3 days of down-latching combined with uplatching restored my status, after a bad expereinece wirh sneyiotics. I only took the pqq on the first day. I did find a forth day of uplatching made me feel a little less well off, so I will stick to 3 days. I just did 3 days this week but combined with the prior mentioned protocol.According to AI search Amoebas go thru binary fission to reproduce and it isn't known to have negative affects and plays a part in thier immortalty. I wonder if that is how mitochondria expand thier population and if it is something they, like amoebas can do indefinitely. I know others have posed similar concerns. I don't have any scientific background, so I just try to make my best guess.I was thinking I would reccomend you could do some research through Questforlife's long thread <a href="https://www.longecit...s/page-1">foundhere. </a> I just try to wrap my head around concepts in a layman's terms. He would likely be able to weigh in on your situation and answer any questions. I guess unlike you, the stem cell protocol did help my injuries physical and a brain injury. I kinda plateaued in my recovery using stem cell protocol. I found my recovery was jump started again by following questforlife's protocol but then I made a mistake with senyitoics that arrested some early indications for enahnced healing. Currently I am doing another attempt at his protocol and I can feel more subjective improvements. I notice resuced fascia tissue on my previous fractured ankle. I think it will take more experimentation. I ama little skattershot in my approach to proliferate progentors and block differentiation which would have to be followed by promotion to differentiate. I think AKG can block differentiation and I also avoid neurogensis agents like growth hormone and oxytocin. It feels like intresting different benefits from both proliferation and differentiation. I feel subtle improvements or expect proliferate cells can reduce fascia and inflmmation. If not all in my head but the differentiation seems to really enhance myself cognitivly. Questforlife has just done a broad overview of the protocol. I think he mentioned along the lines of it could use some fine tuning. In addition to incorporating senyiotics into his protocol.I think it would be beneficial perhaps to start a thread on some of his protocols to work out details like was done on this thread. I imagine that having a full time career and life can hinder how much time on can invest in personal online research studies. Or perhaps like quest mentioned he just sticks to theoretical investigation to spur on the research into telomeres. I'd check that thread to research his protocol, since it is about reoreientating cells to progentor state which could aid recovery through proliferation of specialized cells. I imagine it might help with bone loss. It seem to be a complimentary approach in contrast to mobilizing stem cells if you have a lot of repairs needed.I know questforlife also did some more extensive experiments with igf11 so you could compare notes. I don't feel comfortable using injectables. I wouldn't trust myself to prepare safely and use needles. I have some mk-677 which might be useful and I'd feel safer using that, even if it not quite as effective. I am sure though that he didn't use igf11 with his progentor protocol.

 

thank you for your detailed reply and will check old c60 stemcells protocol and keep mito as they are. i'll ask quest f there are news on that protocol, we had a lot of emails back then about gdf11 and stemcell protocol. gdf11 is definitely more potent but there are too much stuff we dont know yet, especially about keeping the dose as low as possible and still have the benefits

 

as regards senolytics i also had a bad experience, i tried protocols with high dose fisetin and other stuff then all small bruises and injuries from knees to feet took forever to heal and get easily infected because skin didn t close. i had a small bruise, not even blood just some minor damaged skin on the area between knee and foot, it got infected, it stayed small but it took almost 1 year to heal even when infection was cleared. senolytics are a big no for me. i recovered from this since i started carnivore and skin heals fast again even in those areas

Edited by lost69, 05 January 2026 - 01:57 PM.

[stephen_b]

REVERSING SARCOPENIA (new Turnbuckle post).

[joesixpack]

REVERSING SARCOPENIA (new Turnbuckle post).

 

I read it, does not say what he is using. I have been using creatine and resistance training for the past year. Works great.Gained 10 pounds of muscle. Workouts have gone from 30 minutes to an hour.

[Kelvin]

Thanks for the update, Kelvin. Do you or anyone else know, is this better than the SES Research product, and how many capsules do you take at a time?

 

I have never tried the SES product.  

 

I suppose one could try SES as well as my new source of C60 gelcaps and compare if there are any differences.

 

I take 6 gelcaps for 4.0 mgs of C60, although it would probably be fine to use 5 gelcaps for roughly 3.2 mgs of C60.