• Log in with Facebook Log in with Twitter Log In with Google      Sign In    
  • Create Account
  LongeCity
              Advocacy & Research for Unlimited Lifespans

Photo
* * * * * 2 votes

The Absolute Oils 101 Thread

olive oil macadamia oil hazelnut oil polyunsaturated monounsaturated saturated safflower canola almond

  • Please log in to reply
82 replies to this topic

#1 bernard

  • Guest
  • 355 posts
  • 3
  • Location:United States

Posted 15 February 2013 - 08:16 AM


Hello,
Don't you think it'd be nice to have an official guideline thread to dietary fats ? Yesterday I checked up one of the local 'healthy living' stores and man, was I overwhelmed by the enormous variety of oils. Let me mention some of them for clarity's sake:

- Coconut Butter/Coconut Oil Extra Virgin/Coconut & Olive Oil Mix
- Avocado Oil
- Sunflower Oil + Frying Butter Mix (Bio of course)
- Peanut Oil (not butter)
- Olive Oil Extra Virgin (obviously)
- Ozone-enriched 17 oils mix
- Hemp Oil/Hemp Butter
- Argan Oil/Baked Argan Oil
- Safflower Oil
- Sesame Oil/Baked Sesame Oil
- Baked/Fresh Pumpkinseed Oil
- Hazelnut Oil
- Walnut Oil
- Canola Oil
- Camelina Oil
- Basil Oil
- Flaxseed Oil
- Soybean Oil Refined/Non-Refined
- Milkthistle Oil Refined/Non-Refined
- Wheat germ Oil
- Palm Oil/Red Palm Oil/Palm Kernel Oil
- Ghee Butter
- Almond Oil
- Grapeseed Oil
- Macadamia Oil
- Poppy seed Oil

And then you have the High-Lignan/High-Oleic/High-Linoleic etc. variations. Omega 3:Omega 6 ratio, Polyunsaturated : Monounsaturated : Saturated Fats: Trans-Fats ratio. Differentiated, Undifferentiated fats. MCTs, DGs, Caprylic/Capric content. Smoking point threshold. RBD, Non-RBD. These were the ones I was able to come up with without even understanding oil. I can only imagine how oils look like from a biochemist's POV. Now think about that regular average Joe entering one of those stores. They probably think they are all good.

It gets really complicates when you involve cooking and the way heating affects oils. For example some claim polyunsaturated oils should never be used for cooking since this will result in the synthesis of some harmful chemical called 4-HNE. Some say refined oils are bad for you, other say refined oils have a higher smoking point threshold so they are good for cooking. Some say saturated fats are bad for insulin sensitivity and exert a negative partioning effect on the body. This is a good example:

Substituting dietary saturated fat with polyunsaturated fat changes abdominal fat distribution and improves insulin sensitivity

But then you are reminded of the fact that you should only use saturated fats for cooking such as coconut oil. And you have to choose. Should I go with "better for cooking" or should I go with "better insulin sensitivity".

Then you think. Hmm... Maybe I'll just settle for monounsaturated fats and get the best of both. Erm.. no you won't:

Substituting dietary saturated for monounsaturated fat impairs insulin sensitivity in healthy men and women: The KANWU study

So at this point I'm really puzzled. I really think it will be very beneficial to establish a fat protocol. What to use and when. Should I go with saturated fats and supplement with cat's claw for that miraculous enzyme it contains that's able to convert saturated fats to unsaturated ? Should we cook with miniscule amounts of saturated coconut oil and use polyunsaturated fats for all non-cooked meals ? If yes then how much polyunsaturated fat and from what sources ? Should we kick monounsaturated out of the window or are there hidden benefits to it ? I propose a nice and lengthy discussion.

#2 misterE

  • Guest
  • 1,034 posts
  • -81
  • Location:Texas
  • NO

Posted 16 February 2013 - 05:43 PM

In terms of heart-disease, the major doctors in this field (like Ornish, Esselstyn, Vogel, Fleming) urge people not to use oils. There have been many studies conducted showing negative effects of oils [1-2]. Oils are liquid fat, and too much fat (from any source) can overstuff your fat-cells and cause lipotoxicty, which then predisposes you to metabolic-syndrome and related diseases. Also oils are the most concentrated source of calories out of all foods at 120 calories per tablespoon! That’s half an ounce of fat per tablespoon! For someone trying to lower triglycerides and improve their sensitivity to insulin, consuming triglycerides (in the form of oils) isn’t going to help and is actually going to make it worse.



As Esselstyn says: NO OIL!




[1] Nutr Metab Cardiovasc Dis. 2007 Jan;17(1):50-7. Olive, soybean and palm oils intake have a similar acute detrimental effect over the endothelial function in healthy young subjects. Rueda-Clausen CF, Silva FA, Lindarte MA.



[2] J Am Coll Cardiol. 2000 Nov 1;36(5):1455-60. The postprandial effect of components of the Mediterranean diet on endothelial function. Vogel RA, Corretti MC, Plotnick GD.

Edited by misterE, 16 February 2013 - 05:47 PM.

  • dislike x 8
  • Dangerous, Irresponsible x 2
  • like x 1

sponsored ad

  • Advert
Click HERE to rent this advertising spot for NUTRITION to support LongeCity (this will replace the google ad above).

#3 bernard

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 355 posts
  • 3
  • Location:United States

Posted 16 February 2013 - 06:15 PM

I seriously hope you don't believe in this nonsense. Fats are the single most important macronutrient in the human body. 70% of your brain is comprised of fats, 50% of your heart is comprised of fats. All hormones are made out of fat.

As for these idiots that you've quoted, they remind of that sugar lunatic Lustig, who tried to prove that fructose is bad, based on some rat studies. These guys just wanna get some media attention. Don't be so naive. Fat is crucial and will always be crucial. In fact if you are trying to lose weight you will still need some fat in your diet for your thyroid to maintain function. Then comes the protein and the last place is for carbs.
  • like x 5
  • dislike x 3

#4 scottknl

  • Guest
  • 421 posts
  • 325
  • Location:Seattle

Posted 16 February 2013 - 10:33 PM

I seriously hope you don't believe in this nonsense. Fats are the single most important macronutrient in the human body. 70% of your brain is comprised of fats, 50% of your heart is comprised of fats. All hormones are made out of fat.

As for these idiots that you've quoted, they remind of that sugar lunatic Lustig, who tried to prove that fructose is bad, based on some rat studies. These guys just wanna get some media attention. Don't be so naive. Fat is crucial and will always be crucial. In fact if you are trying to lose weight you will still need some fat in your diet for your thyroid to maintain function. Then comes the protein and the last place is for carbs.

I kind of agree, except that I'd suggest that balance is the key. Here's what a panel of experts from NIH recommended:

What are current public health recommendations for omega-3 fatty acids?
In 2002, the Institute of Medicine at the National Academy of Sciences issued Adequate Intake (AI) levels for linolenic acid, the initial building block for all omega-3 fatty acids found in the body. For male teenagers and adult men, 1.6 grams per day were recommended, For female teenagers and adult women, the recommended amount was 1.1 grams per day. These guidelines do not seem as well-matched to the existing health research on omega-3 fatty acids as guidelines issued by the Workshop on the Essentially of and Recommended Dietary Intakes (RDI) for Omega-6 and Omega-3 Fatty Acids in 1999 sponsored by the National Institutes of Health (NIH). This panel of experts recommended that people consume at least 2% of their total daily calories as omega-3 fats. To meet this recommendation, a person consuming 2000 calories per day should eat sufficient omega-3-rich foods to provide at least 4 grams of omega-3 fatty acids.


I've aimed for 4:1 or lower ratio for Omega-6 : Omega-3 fatty acids and found that that works for me.
There are several successful studies in people who needed to lower their cholesterol levels and they've used a similar recommendations.

An RDA isn't established for dietary fat; however the acceptable macro nutrient distribution range for dietary fat for adults is 20 to 35 percent of your total daily calorie intake, according to the Institutes of Medicine.

Read more: http://www.livestron.../#ixzz2L6NkTVhP


AHA recommends "Limit saturated fat intake to less than 7 percent of total daily calories;" which is not too far from my own limit of 10 g per day.

It's just kind of hard to translate it into what to eat without a little help. That's where cron-o-meter comes into play. Just plug in the foods & weights, and read off the resulting fatty acids, saturated fats and total fat consumption. Adjust dietary composition as necessary to meet the above limits.

Over consumption of fats is dangerous and increases heart and stroke risk.

As for the issue of how and what to cook with, well it's pretty complex and the advice is really contrary. I boil most of my food and consume the liquid water used to boil, so only a little nutrition is lost.

**Re reading my post I thought I should comment that these recommendations from different sources need to be cherry picked to get the best recommendations from each source. If you follow an ADA recommended diet it doesn't really work out well for everyone. Same for RDI or NIH panel recommendations. If it was easy, there wouldn't be so many experts ;)

Edited by scottknl, 16 February 2013 - 10:42 PM.

  • like x 2

#5 zorba990

  • Guest
  • 1,516 posts
  • 252

Posted 16 February 2013 - 10:59 PM

Adding a good amount of high phenol olive oil to my diet has improved my health and lowered my bodyfat. Not too surprised as the c60 study certainly showed dietary fat can be a positive (even with an animal that has difficulty with processing fat)
  • like x 2

#6 bernard

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 355 posts
  • 3
  • Location:United States

Posted 16 February 2013 - 11:58 PM

Yeah of course. Overconsumption of fats is a definite no-no. But that's true for everything I guess.
@scottknl:
You might wanna make your omega-3s dominant. It will help keep C-Reactive Protein levels at bay.

#7 sthira

  • Guest
  • 2,001 posts
  • 405

Posted 17 February 2013 - 12:29 AM

Hello,
Don't you think it'd be nice to have an official guideline thread to dietary fats ? Yesterday I checked up one of the local 'healthy living' stores and man, was I overwhelmed by the enormous variety of oils.


Thanks for the thread, it's a good idea. Based on study of fraudulent activities and false labeling from olive oil producers, I just assume stores are selling oily lies and cheats. Without regulation, who knows what's in those bottles? Until the oils makers prove themselves to be truthful, I'm not buying them. I'll stick to eating whole fatty foods -- nuts, avocados, and only the olive oils sold by reputable dealers who provide objective, third-party test analysis numbers to back their evoo claims. Once bitten twice shy.

#8 niner

  • Guest
  • 16,276 posts
  • 2,000
  • Location:Philadelphia

Posted 17 February 2013 - 01:24 AM

Then you think. Hmm... Maybe I'll just settle for monounsaturated fats and get the best of both. Erm.. no you won't:

Substituting dietary saturated for monounsaturated fat impairs insulin sensitivity in healthy men and women: The KANWU study

Should we kick monounsaturated out of the window or are there hidden benefits to it ?


I think you interpreted that title incorrectly. Substituting SAFA for (not with) MUFA is bad. The paper found that all biomarkers were better on the MUFA diet than the SAFA diet. So it looks like MUFA is a win (at least compared to SAFA. The epidemiology on olive oil agrees with this. (olive oil is mostly MUFA) The olive oil epidemiology says that at least within the 0-30ml/day range they considered, the more olive oil you consume, the longer you are likely to live. I'm not sure what the anti-fats & oils docs would have to say about this, but they may be considering a population with CVD, while the epidemiology was from a population that had mostly eaten olive oil for a long time, and were less likely to have CVD.
  • like x 1

#9 misterE

  • Guest
  • 1,034 posts
  • -81
  • Location:Texas
  • NO

Posted 17 February 2013 - 03:30 AM

Here is Caldwell Esselstyn M.D.

He, along with Dean Ornish and Richard Fleming have demonstrated reversal of atherosclerosis. Here he is urging people to avoid oils, due to their atherosclerotic effects:

Edited by misterE, 17 February 2013 - 03:34 AM.

  • dislike x 4
  • like x 1

#10 bernard

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 355 posts
  • 3
  • Location:United States

Posted 17 February 2013 - 11:22 AM

@niner:
OMG. I'm such an idiot. You are right.

@MisterE:
Again, you need to understand that not every logically-sounding thing is true. You cannot survive without oils. Try a diet for 180 days that contains less than 1g of fat per day and see what happens. You will be a trainwreck at the end. Every one who says "not even Olive Oil" is obviously looking for some media attention. Forget about this idiot, he's no leader in anything. Just another youtube "truth" revealer like the other idiot Dr.Lustig.
  • like x 2
  • dislike x 2

#11 nupi

  • Guest
  • 1,532 posts
  • 107
  • Location:Switzerland

Posted 17 February 2013 - 03:48 PM

Big believer in 80:20 (also when it comes to diet): Focus on NOT eating any of the nasty seed oils (the US is a particularly nasty place with all the safflower, corn and soybean crap, compared to dose, canola sounds almost healthy) and avoid all hydrogenated nastiness.

Instead, use EVOO and EVCO where you can stand the taste and the temperature is not excessively high and Macadamia nut oil (or refined non hydrogenated coconut oil or Avocado but that last one is ungodly expensive for some weird reason) when you need high temperature stability. If you want to do something where a tasteless oil is key (mayo or something weird like that), high oleic sunflower seems like a decent bet. Supplement with fish oil to increase Omega 3 and you are probably fine.

I don't see much reason to obsess over SAFA vs MUFA as long as you get the above basics right (and control your weight!).

#12 misterE

  • Guest
  • 1,034 posts
  • -81
  • Location:Texas
  • NO

Posted 17 February 2013 - 06:33 PM

Forget about this idiot, he's no leader in anything.



Actually, he is one of the researchers who has proven to reverse atherosclerosis. Something only a handful of men have been able to accomplish!

The only fats we need to eat are the omega-3 and omega-6 essential-fatty-acids (which are found in the perfect ratio in plant-foods). Saturated-fat and monounsaturated-fat are unessential. Oil is 100% fat, and guess where that fat goes: straight into storage [1-3].

Also in regards to oil intake: in 1909, before the obesity epidemic, Americans ate about 36 pounds (16.2 kilograms) of added oil/fat per year. In 2007, amidst the largest health crisis the world has ever seen, Americans were now eating an astounding 87 pounds (39.4 kilograms) of oils and fats[4]! That’s an increase of 143%! How can eating more oil help solve our most serious health problems, when we already eat way too much oil in the first place?


Posted Image




[1] Am J Clin Nutr. 2002 Oct;76(4):750-7. Adipose tissue biomarkers of fatty acid intake. Baylin A, Kabagambe EK, Siles X.

[2] Eur J Clin Nutr. 2005 Dec;59(12):1417-22. Evaluation of the odd fatty acids 15:0 and 17:0 in serum and adipose tissue as markers of intake of milk and dairy fat. Brevik A, Veierød MB, Drevon CA.

[3] Prog Lipid Res. 2008 Sep;47(5):348-80. Fatty acid composition of adipose tissue and blood in humans and its use as a biomarker of dietary intake. Hodson L, Skeaff CM, Fielding BA.

[4] Am J Clin Nutr. 2010 May;91(5):1530S-1536S. Trends in food availability, 1909-2007. Barnard ND.

Edited by misterE, 17 February 2013 - 06:35 PM.

  • dislike x 2

#13 bernard

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 355 posts
  • 3
  • Location:United States

Posted 17 February 2013 - 07:33 PM

Forget about this idiot, he's no leader in anything.



Actually, he is one of the researchers who has proven to reverse atherosclerosis. Something only a handful of men have been able to accomplish!

The only fats we need to eat are the omega-3 and omega-6 essential-fatty-acids (which are found in the perfect ratio in plant-foods). Saturated-fat and monounsaturated-fat are unessential. Oil is 100% fat, and guess where that fat goes: straight into storage [1-3].


It appears to me that there is a very serious gap in your knowledge on what fat actually is. To compare omega-3 to unsaturated fat in terms of their essence is like to compare glutamine and protein and come up with protein to be non-essential. You really have no idea what you are talking about do you ?

#14 misterE

  • Guest
  • 1,034 posts
  • -81
  • Location:Texas
  • NO

Posted 17 February 2013 - 08:19 PM

It appears to me that there is a very serious gap in your knowledge on what fat actually is. To compare omega-3 to unsaturated fat in terms of their essence is like to compare glutamine and protein and come up with protein to be non-essential. You really have no idea what you are talking about do you ?


What exactly don't you understand?

Polyunsaturated-fat is essential (you must have it to survive and function properly). Saturated and monounsaturated-fat is unessential (your body makes all it needs on its own).

The only fat we need is omega-3 and omega-6 (both of which are polyunsaturated) in a ratio of 1:4. You can get the essential-fatty-acids from grains, beans, vegetables, and flaxseeds (in their correct amounts and ratios).

Too much unessential fat (animal-fat, margarine and vegetable-oil) causes lipotoxicity, insulin-resistance and inflammation.
  • like x 2
  • dislike x 2

#15 bernard

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 355 posts
  • 3
  • Location:United States

Posted 17 February 2013 - 08:32 PM

It appears to me that there is a very serious gap in your knowledge on what fat actually is. To compare omega-3 to unsaturated fat in terms of their essence is like to compare glutamine and protein and come up with protein to be non-essential. You really have no idea what you are talking about do you ?


What exactly don't you understand?

Polyunsaturated-fat is essential (you must have it to survive and function properly). Saturated and monounsaturated-fat is unessential (your body makes all it needs on its own).

The only fat we need is omega-3 and omega-6 (both of which are polyunsaturated) in a ratio of 1:4. You can get the essential-fatty-acids from grains, beans, vegetables, and flaxseeds (in their correct amounts and ratios).

Too much unessential fat (animal-fat, margarine and vegetable-oil) causes lipotoxicity, insulin-resistance and inflammation.


Lol. That's like the lamest explanation I've ever read on this forum. First it was no oils & fat because dr. Frankenstein said so. Now it's some oils and fat, but only polyunsaturated, however from beans and grains. I urge you to show me one plant be it bean or grain that contains polyunsaturated fats alone without any monounsaturated fats. Because as far as I remember, last you said and I quote "Not even olive oil" which is obviously a good source of monounsaturated fats.

P.S.
If that is you on your profile picture you should really include some fats in your diet. Lol get it ?

Edited by Tatsumaru, 17 February 2013 - 08:35 PM.

  • dislike x 2

#16 zorba990

  • Guest
  • 1,516 posts
  • 252

Posted 17 February 2013 - 08:43 PM

Ornish doesn't look healthy to me. Anyway here is a rebuttal
http://www.awlr.org/...imes-op-ed.html
  • dislike x 1
  • like x 1

#17 misterE

  • Guest
  • 1,034 posts
  • -81
  • Location:Texas
  • NO

Posted 18 February 2013 - 12:36 AM

One thing we can agree on... Ornish looks a lot better than (the late) Atkins!
Posted Image
Posted Image
  • dislike x 2

#18 niner

  • Guest
  • 16,276 posts
  • 2,000
  • Location:Philadelphia

Posted 18 February 2013 - 03:52 AM

One thing we can agree on... Ornish looks a lot better than (the late) Atkins!


You aren't proposing that a low fat diet dyes your hair brown, are you? Or that a low fat diet reverses photodamage? Atkins has gray hair and photodamaged skin. Ornish looks like he colors his hair, and hasn't seen quite the level of sun that Atkins has. Are they the same age in these pictures? I don't think you can come to any conclusions regarding the health-promoting effects of either diet from these pictures along.
  • like x 3
  • dislike x 1

#19 scottknl

  • Guest
  • 421 posts
  • 325
  • Location:Seattle

Posted 18 February 2013 - 08:26 PM

Yeah of course. Over consumption of fats is a definite no-no. But that's true for everything I guess.
@scottknl:
You might wanna make your omega-3s dominant. It will help keep C-Reactive Protein levels at bay.

Thanks, Tatsumaru. I had them tested last week and hsCRP was 0.14 which is pretty good AFAIK.

Too much Omega-3 fats can also cause problems like bleeding on the brain, nose bleeds etc. Moderation is definitely in order. I find whenever I have more than 4 g of n3 fatty acids per day for several days I get nose bleeds. I'm sure the response is different for different people, but I'd hate to have a hemorrhagic stroke as the first symptom. :|o

@niner: I have to agree that they're different ages. Ornish is 60 this year and Atkins died at 72. But one can clearly see that Atkins is in the overweight category as are many of the high protein advocates a couple of years after they write their books. There's no way around the extra growth hormone from the high protein diet.

One might compare T. Colin Campbell to Atkins. They're about 3 years apart in age:
Posted Image

Edited by scottknl, 18 February 2013 - 08:56 PM.

  • like x 1
  • dislike x 1

#20 zorba990

  • Guest
  • 1,516 posts
  • 252

Posted 19 February 2013 - 03:24 AM

http://www.saturdaye...depression.html
is not surprising. I imagine long term gallbladder and liver issues on extremely low fat ts as well.
  • dislike x 1
  • like x 1

#21 misterE

  • Guest
  • 1,034 posts
  • -81
  • Location:Texas
  • NO

Posted 19 February 2013 - 04:08 AM

--Also when Atkins died, long time critic and infamous cardiologist Doctor Richard Fleming obtained Atkins' medical records after his death, he then gave the records to the Physicians Committee for Responsible Medicine (PCRM) who later (controversially) published the reports in the media, in attempts to warn people of the dangers of low-carb diets. The reports showed that Atkins was obese and had severe cardiovascular-disease, which is no surprise considering the man ate calorie-dense atherosclerotic fats his entire life.

http://www.nytimes.c...ssue-alive.html




Below is Caldwell Esselstyn, 3 years younger than Atkins. He eats whole-grains, beans, vegetables, fruits and flaxseeds.
Posted Image

Edited by misterE, 19 February 2013 - 04:17 AM.

  • dislike x 2

#22 HaloTeK

  • Guest
  • 254 posts
  • 7
  • Location:chicago

Posted 19 February 2013 - 04:49 AM

I think most of us are in agreement that if you are going to add a little bit of fat, adding some olive oil is going to be better than red palm oil/butter. Here's the thing, my APOE 3/3 status basically says I will have larger cholesterol molecules on a diet that has a little bit of monounsaturated fat in it vs a super high carb diet. If you have an APOE 4 you still might wanna keep fats low.

Mister E, maybe you are right that the best absolute longevity "might" be had without any added oils. Seriously though, who the fu*$% is going to live like that. I sure don't want the dry skin that a super low fat diet brings. Also, I like the satiety of consuming a little bit of fat.

Edited by HaloTeK, 19 February 2013 - 04:55 AM.

  • dislike x 1
  • like x 1

#23 misterE

  • Guest
  • 1,034 posts
  • -81
  • Location:Texas
  • NO

Posted 19 February 2013 - 05:23 AM

Mister E, maybe you are right that the best absolute longevity "might" be had without any added oils.



I'm against oils because oils are processed-foods (foods not found in nature). People extract all the fat out of plants, leaving behind all the fiber, vitamins, minerals and phytonutrients needed to properly metabolize that oil. If people want to eat a little bit of fat and store some calories away for later... I would suggest getting that fat from whole-foods like flaxseeds, nuts, avocadoes and olives, not oils.

Edited by misterE, 19 February 2013 - 05:25 AM.

  • dislike x 2
  • like x 1

#24 bernard

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 355 posts
  • 3
  • Location:United States

Posted 19 February 2013 - 10:19 AM

Mister E, maybe you are right that the best absolute longevity "might" be had without any added oils.



I'm against oils because oils are processed-foods (foods not found in nature). People extract all the fat out of plants, leaving behind all the fiber, vitamins, minerals and phytonutrients needed to properly metabolize that oil. If people want to eat a little bit of fat and store some calories away for later... I would suggest getting that fat from whole-foods like flaxseeds, nuts, avocadoes and olives, not oils.


No cars since they are processed metal ? No violins since they are processed wood ? I don't get this stupid idea that we are "supposed" to do anything. We refine oils because you can't dress a salad with olives, and you can't add olives to pasta for the oily flavor. You can't scramble eggs with flaxseeds and you definitely can't dissolve OC60 in pumpkin seeds.
  • dislike x 1
  • like x 1

#25 RJ100

  • Guest
  • 153 posts
  • 22
  • Location:USA

Posted 19 February 2013 - 02:42 PM

Comparing photos of people doesn't strengthen anyone's argument. I work with a guy who eats fast food daily and you could put his picture up in wikipedia's health article.

I stay away from heavily processed food, too. I don't consume oils that are extracted with hexane, for example. However, I don't understand how eating an olive for it's fat content is different from cold pressing the fat out of it.
  • dislike x 1
  • like x 1

#26 misterE

  • Guest
  • 1,034 posts
  • -81
  • Location:Texas
  • NO

Posted 20 February 2013 - 11:25 PM

I don't understand how eating an olive for it's fat content is different from cold pressing the fat out of it.




Because the olive contains fiber, vitamins, minerals, and phytonutrients. Oils are the most calorie-dense food there is, over twice the concentration of calories than table-sugar! Pouring oil over pasta turns that meal from a low-fat to a high-fat meal instantly! Pouring oil on a salad turns a low-fat/low-calorie meal into a high-fat/high-calorie meal! Each time a person consumes oil they damage their endothelium, they increase triglycerides and they turn their blood into sludge, which decrease flow-mediated dilation.




Nutr Metab Cardiovasc Dis. 2007 Jan;17(1):50-7.

Olive, soybean and palm oils intake have a similar acute detrimental effect over the endothelial function in healthy young subjects.

Rueda-Clausen CF, Silva FA, Lindarte MA.


Abstract

BACKGROUND AND AIM:
Currently, more than 30% of the caloric intake in the Colombian population comes from vegetable oil consumption mainly by the ingestion of deep-fried foods. Recently, it has been reported that unsaturated fatty acid rich oils have a beneficial effect on the endothelial function. Nevertheless, it is well know that the deep-frying process alters the chemical composition of vegetable oils and can produce adverse effects in the endothelial function.

OBJECTIVE:
To evaluate the acute effect of the ingestion of large amounts of olive, soybean and palm oils, fresh and at two different deep-fry levels, on the glucose and lipid profiles and the endothelial function.

METHODS AND RESULTS:
Ten healthy young volunteers were included in the study. After performing a baseline evaluation of cardiovascular risk factors and drawing a fasting blood sample, subjects were exposed to a randomly assigned potato soup meal containing 60 mL of one of three different vegetable oils (olive, soybean and palm), either fresh or at one of two different deep-fry levels (10 and 20 fries, respectively). Flow-mediated vasodilation (FMD) was performed in fasting conditions and 3h after the intake of the oil rich meal. Furthermore, blood samples were taken at these stages for the lipid profiles and plasma glucose determinations. All the meals resulted in a similar acute endothelial impairment (FMD decrease of 32.1%, confidence interval [CI] 95%, 28.0-36.2) and postprandial increase in triglycerides (27.03%, CI 95%, 20.5-33.3), independently of the type of oil ingested (p=0.44) and regardless of its deep-fry level (p=0.62). No correlation was found between endothelial impairment and postprandial triglyceride increment (r=-0.22, p=0.09).

CONCLUSIONS:
No difference was found in the acute adverse effect of the ingestion of different vegetable oils on the endothelial function. All the vegetable oils, fresh and deep-fried, produced an increase in the triglyceride plasma levels in healthy subjects.

Edited by misterE, 20 February 2013 - 11:28 PM.

  • dislike x 3

#27 misterE

  • Guest
  • 1,034 posts
  • -81
  • Location:Texas
  • NO

Posted 20 February 2013 - 11:30 PM


  • dislike x 1

#28 bernard

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 355 posts
  • 3
  • Location:United States

Posted 20 February 2013 - 11:47 PM

Can you please cut it out with the Lustig-like guys. Olive Oil is healthy there is no question about it. In fact the oldest ever living woman Jeanne Calment claimed she poured tons of olive oil on all her food. She died at 122. I bet some baldie like Klaper can't beat this with his fake "wannabe famous" theories.

Olive, soybean and palm oils intake have a similar acute detrimental effect over the endothelial function in healthy young subjects.


Erm LOL ? Did you even read your own study ? It's about using poly and monounsaturated oils for the purposes of deep-frying. Everybody knows not to use mono and polyunsaturated fats for cooking. This has nothing to do with whether oils are healthy or not...

Because the olive contains fiber, vitamins, minerals, and phytonutrients. Oils are the most calorie-dense food there is, over twice the concentration of calories than table-sugar!

Wrong #1: Olive Oil is a great source of alpha-tocopherol (vit.E). Olives DON'T contain any fiber. Less than 3g of fiber for 100g of olives.
Wrong #2: More calories than table sugar yet noone became diabetic out of consuming olive oil and way too much people did - out of table sugar. Are you really suggesting table sugar over olive oil just because it's too hard for you to count calories ? GIve me a break.

Edited by Tatsumaru, 20 February 2013 - 11:49 PM.


#29 niner

  • Guest
  • 16,276 posts
  • 2,000
  • Location:Philadelphia

Posted 21 February 2013 - 01:14 AM

Ten healthy young volunteers were included in the study. After performing a baseline evaluation of cardiovascular risk factors and drawing a fasting blood sample, subjects were exposed to a randomly assigned potato soup meal containing 60 mL of one of three different vegetable oils (olive, soybean and palm), either fresh or at one of two different deep-fry levels (10 and 20 fries, respectively). Flow-mediated vasodilation (FMD) was performed in fasting conditions and 3h after the intake of the oil rich meal. Furthermore, blood samples were taken at these stages for the lipid profiles and plasma glucose determinations. All the meals resulted in a similar acute endothelial impairment (FMD decrease of 32.1%, confidence interval [CI] 95%, 28.0-36.2) and postprandial increase in triglycerides (27.03%, CI 95%, 20.5-33.3), independently of the type of oil ingested (p=0.44) and regardless of its deep-fry level (p=0.62). No correlation was found between endothelial impairment and postprandial triglyceride increment (r=-0.22, p=0.09).


OK, but 60ml of oil is a lot. It is interesting that the fry level didn't matter. Too bad they didn't do a control meal without any oil, because as far as we know, the trigs and FMD might have shown a similar problem from the potato soup alone. I don't suppose we know if the olive oil was a good fresh high polyphenol version, versus some oxidized old garbage. Another thing that we don't know is whether or not these acute post-prandial numbers have any bearing on long term health, or if they are just a series of red herrings.
  • like x 4
  • dislike x 1

#30 RJ100

  • Guest
  • 153 posts
  • 22
  • Location:USA

Posted 21 February 2013 - 02:54 PM

Because the olive contains fiber, vitamins, minerals, and phytonutrients


I understand the importance of eating whole foods. I eat whole olives, too.

I consume EVOO because I enjoy the texture & flavor - not because I think it's "heart healthy". In addition to EVOO I use walnut and avocado oils, all in moderation. I understand that what I consider moderation might not be truly optimal, but I do so as a conscious choice, not in ignorance.

I watched the video and honestly I don't disagree with any of what Dr Klaper says. I would add that viewing food strictly as fuel doesn't work for me. A little bit of salt, sugar and fat can go a long way when it comes to bringing joy to the necessity of eating.





Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: olive oil, macadamia oil, hazelnut oil, polyunsaturated, monounsaturated, saturated, safflower, canola, almond

0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users